I'm Outta Touch, I'm Outta Time

[MotownMachine]

So, I gave in a few weeks ago and bought my second 'A'. The car ran beautifully on my test drive, drove beautifully onto the trailer the next week, and just as well a couple of days later on a 5–6-mile drive up the road.

I grounded it for a couple of days to change the oil, grease the fittings, etc. After starting it from the oil change, however, it did not run well and had developed a tick once it had warmed up.

I messed around with adjustments and took it for a short drive and found it would not climb hills and would not go into 2nd gear without coughing and spluttering, so I limped it home in 1st.

I took apart the carb, which seems OK and retimed it and it ran a little better. Had it idling yesterday and it seems to fall in and out of smooth running. The carb will slurp in air, and the tick still remains once the engine warms a little. I have not been able to place the tick entirely, but it sounds loudest in front. Its rhythm is about double that of a clock but half that of the general engine rhythm.

Could it all be (hopefully) related? Could it be multiple problems?

As always, any help is appreciated!

[Jim/GA]

Could be a sticky valve. Try a compression test. If it is, try running some MMO in the fuel. Normal dose is 2 oz. in 5 gallons but it won't hurt anything to go above that for trying to unstick a valve.

You checked timing. Check point gap. Grease the cam a bit.

How fresh is the gas in it?

Is car wired up positive ground? If you know how, check the wiring of the coil polarity.

[Marshall V. Daut]

Ticking noise like that usually indicates a blown exhaust manifold gasket. This is irritating, but it won't affect the misfiring and coughing condition. Try a little 3-n-1 oil in the distributor, too. The bushings may be getting dry, which will cause a chirping sound.

As to the lack of power and misfiring, put a glove on your left hand and while the engine is running, cup your hand over the carb's intake throat to the point that the engine almost wants to die - but not quite. With your right hand, rev the engine up via the carb's throttle arm a number of times. Cup your hand during this procedure so that the carb is able to draw in just enough air to keep running, but is almost on the verge of dying. This causes greater suction inside the carb and if there is a small piece of junk caught in a jet, this extra pressure will draw it through. Really rev hard. The reason you are wearing a glove is because the carb might backfire and you want your hand protected from the flame. After revving the engine a few times, remove your left hand from the back of the carb and rev the engine up naturally. If it still stumbles, most likely a clogged jet was not at fault.

Since you don't know the full history of this car's restoration, a previous owner may not have properly cleaned out the gas tank. Rust, gunk and bits of old gas gauge cork float collect on the bottom of the tank and eventually find their way into the on/off valve, which is the lowest place on the gas tank (pre-late 1931). To check whether that on/off valve is clogged - which slows fuel flow to the carb under power demands, but not during idling - turn off the fuel, remove the gas cap, loosen the two fuel line brass fittings and disconnect the line at the carburetor. Revolve the fuel line 180 degrees so that it is standing up straight and keep it that way by tightening the brass fitting in the sediment bowl. ADDED: I forgot to mention that just before you blow into the fuel line, you must turn the gas back on so that the forced air will go back up into the tank. Because the fuel line is straight up, no fuel will run out. Now put the open end of the fuel line in your mouth and blow as hard as you can into the end of the fuel line. You should initially meet with resistance, but then there will be a loud "WHOOSH!" from inside the gas tank, followed by gurgling. Keep blowing a few times before putting everything back together again. Doing this blows the congealed gunk inside the on/off valve back into the fuel supply. The engine will run better now at speed and have its power back. Of course, until the gas tank is cleaned properly, this gunk will eventually collect in the on/off valve again. Keep the tank fairly full to disperse the gunk so that it can't concentrate in a lower fuel level.

If these suggestions don't help, the problem is most likely not fuel or carb related. Then concentrate on the electrical and ignition systems.
Marshall

[MotownMachine]

Originally Posted by Jim/GA

How fresh is the gas in it?

Is car wired up positive ground? If you know how, check the wiring of the coil polarity.

It had about 1/4 tank when I bought it. I put a fresh 1/2 tank in before the 5-6 mile drive a couple weeks ago.

I believe it is still positive ground 6 volt

[old ugly]

try changing the condenser, that is easy, you just never know.
but
the ticking and the run issues may or may not be related.
the ticking can be a few things lifters adjustment, sticky valve, exhaust leak somewhere who knows?
a compression test will determine if it is a valve issue.

i think if it ran good and suddenly didn't i would investigate ignition first.

[old ugly]

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there are a few easy things to do while checking, if ignition is suspected.
-test for power at the points (point arm) with a test light (12v test light will work if it is a conventional bulb)
-if you have power there, put the coil wire close to a ground (something metal), open and close the points manually with a screwdriver or the test light probe. watch for spark at the coil wire. if no spark, either the points are dirty, or the coil may be bad.
-if you can make it spark by doing that. check that the points are opening on the high lobe of the distributer cam. make sure that distributer cam is securely screw down tight.
-if all that is working properly the only thing left on the ignition is to make sure it is timed. that does not usually change but check it.
you need to eliminate one item at a time. once you have determined that the ignition system is working correctly then move on to fuel system.

[MotownMachine]

Originally Posted by Marshall V. Daut

Ticking noise like that usually indicates a blown exhaust manifold gasket.

That could be. Except for lightbulbs the only spare parts that came with the car were a new manifold gasket and clamp. So somebody might have known that was a repair on the way

The car seems to have good fuel flow and has a secondary modern filter on the fuel line, so I doubt it's that, but I will try that tactic for the carb

[MotownMachine]

Originally Posted by old ugly

try changing the condenser, that is easy, you just never know.
but
the ticking and the run issues may or may not be related.
the ticking can be a few things lifters adjustment, sticky valve, exhaust leak somewhere who knows?
a compression test will determine if it is a valve issue.

i think if it ran good and suddenly didn't i would investigate ignition first.

I did change the condenser, but that didn't change anything. Ran a compression test just a few minutes ago and compression is a little low, but equal at all four cylinders

[nkaminar]

The modern fuel filter in the line may be clogged. They also restrict the fuel flow. The Model A is gravity feed whereas a modern car has a fuel pump.

The secondary fuel filter is a bandaid and may have been put on there by the previous owner to fix gunk coming down the fuel pipe.

You should contact the previous owner. They may have a good suggestion on what to check.

[old ugly]

Originally Posted by MotownMachine

I did change the condenser, but that didn't change anything. Ran a compression test just a few minutes ago and compression is a little low, but equal at all four cylinders

now back to the fuel system and carb.
my brothers A did the same sort of thing and what it turnout to be was the float valve stuck shut.
you can check stuff like that. shut off the fuel, take the bottom 1/2 of the carb off. push the float up see if the needle sticks.
if you have someone to help you have them turn on the fuel, hold the float up, no fuel should run out. let the float drop and make sure when that float drops that fuel runs out. you may what a pan under it.

[Dick M]

Sounds like it could be starving for gas. The after market fuel filters are designed to run with a fuel pump for positive pressure. Take out the after market fuel filter and see how it runs. That is an easy first step...

[old ugly]

guys will build motorcycle tanks and put a non-vented gas caps on. a few miles down the road the bike would die of fuel starvation.
i can't imagine this is what is happening . just thinking out loud.

[ronn]

I agree with Dick. pull the gas valve under the dash and make sure all is clean- if not add a pencil filter.

[Gary WA]

Originally Posted by MotownMachine

That could be. Except for lightbulbs the only spare parts that came with the car were a new manifold gasket and clamp. So somebody might have known that was a repair on the way

The car seems to have good fuel flow and has a secondary modern filter on the fuel line, so I doubt it's that, but I will try that tactic for the carb

get rid of the secondary fuel filter!!!

[Gary WA]

Originally Posted by MotownMachine

So, I gave in a few weeks ago and bought my second 'A'. The car ran beautifully on my test drive, drove beautifully onto the trailer the next week, and just as well a couple of days later on a 5–6-mile drive up the road.

I grounded it for a couple of days to change the oil, grease the fittings, etc. After starting it from the oil change, however, it did not run well and had developed a tick once it had warmed up.

I messed around with adjustments and took it for a short drive and found it would not climb hills and would not go into 2nd gear without coughing and spluttering, so I limped it home in 1st.

I took apart the carb, which seems OK and retimed it and it ran a little better. Had it idling yesterday and it seems to fall in and out of smooth running. The carb will slurp in air, and the tick still remains once the engine warms a little. I have not been able to place the tick entirely, but it sounds loudest in front. Its rhythm is about double that of a clock but half that of the general engine rhythm.

Could it all be (hopefully) related? Could it be multiple problems?

As always, any help is appreciated!

you answered your own question! Messed around with adjustments!!

[Oldgearz]

I didn't read everything in the posts. Try taking gas cap off as venting may be bad causing a vacuum. Disconnect fuel line at carb and turn inside valve on. Should have full gas flow for at least 30 second test at the carb. If that is alright you probably eliminated a fuel problem.

[philosofriend]

Remove the drain plug under the carburetor (not the bolt that holds the carb together). Doing it this way also tests the float valve. Have a jar ready to catch the gas.

When your helper open the gas shutoff, gas should come out like a giant taking a piss. If it is like a gerbil you have a problem.

[MotownMachine]

Originally Posted by Gary WA

you answered your own question! Messed around with adjustments!!

My bad, should have written it that I did not mess around with the adjustments until AFTER the car stalled in the middle of the street

[nkaminar]

Philoso Friend has the right procedure. Use a big bucket so that you can make sure the flow is good for a reasonable amount of time. Do the test outdoors with a fire extinguisher handy.

[1crosscut]

Do you have a Model A friend nearby? If so see if you can temporarily borrow their distributor and carburetor and switch them out one at a time to see if you can rectify the problem. If one of them does then you know where the problem lies.