The Ford Barn

Shoebox · 06-04-2023, 03:08 PM

While removing the driveshaft from my '51 Tudor today, in preparation for the engine swap, I found what "seems" like excess slop in the pinion/ring gear dept. While I am NOT looking to add this to my current work list, I am wondering what good candidates there are for a future swap. I have read somewhere that certain year Mavericks are a bolt in, although sounding too good to be true, if so I'd like to know. I have not looked into availability of bearings, crush washers, etc. for the original either. Any comments most welcome. Thanks guys.

FlatheadTed · 06-04-2023, 03:45 PM

To reset the lash in the 51 is les of a job than going down the other rout .

Gene1949 · 06-04-2023, 05:57 PM

77 Granada. Broke left side and right-side axles. Seems other owners of the 49 model year had similar. The Grenada is a little wider but is a boltin. Even the 49 e-brake cables worked. Lot of ratios to choose from and everone sells kits for the 8"

Shoebox · 06-04-2023, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gene1949

77 Granada. Broke left side and right-side axles. Seems other owners of the 49 model year had similar. The Grenada is a little wider but is a boltin. Even the 49 e-brake cables worked. Lot of ratios to choose from and everone sells kits for the 8"

Thanks for the info Gene, that's the same year I've read for the Maverick, possibly same? The "little wider" I would need to know how much, I believe the '51 is 56.5 from wms (wheel mounting surface) to wms which is snug for factory rims and the 205/75 R15 tires I'm using as it is. Gotta ask, regarding the Bolt In,.... spring pads, same driveshaft? Thanks again.

Shoebox · 06-04-2023, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlatheadTed

To reset the lash in the 51 is les of a job than going down the other rout .

Thanks Ted, I'll break out the shop manual and read up.

TJ · 06-04-2023, 07:23 PM

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The Maverick rear is the narrowest of the 8 inch rears. The Grenada is a little wider but will work. Both will drop right in on your springs. No need to move the pads. I don't think the Grenada used the 8 inch rear. I believe they were all nine inch and some later Grenadas were the spicer type rear end. You can also use the 64-66 Mustang 8 inch rear which I think is the same width as the Maverick.

Gene1949 · 06-04-2023, 07:26 PM

I believe its 3/4" wider. Probibly wouldn't work with your tire wheel combo. I'm
running 205 60 14 on Lincoln Versaile wheels.
Can't tell you about driveline as I installed 4 speed same time. Perch centerline isn't off enough to make a difference.
There is a reason your old rear developed slop. Worn parts. Sure you can reset it but the initial problem is stil there. At the very least I would look at bearings and gears

paul2748 · 06-04-2023, 07:44 PM

Granada's did use the 8 inch rear as far as I know. My info says the rear is not a drop in as the spring perches are different. A nine inch from 57 -59 are next in line from the Maverick at 57.25. The 65-66 Mustang 8 inch is the same. Both may have the spring perches in the right location. 75 Mustang II is 57.00 inches, don't know about the perches.

The V8 Maverick is 56.50 inches. Don't know about the spring perches.

The 77-81 Granada/Monarch/Versaille rear ends are 58 inches

tubman · 06-04-2023, 07:51 PM

All I can add here is that I put a set of 2.75/75X15 tires on 5.5" later Ford wheels on the stock rear end on my '51 club coupe, and they barely fit, even after I took 1/4" off of the inside of the wheel wells (which I wil be paying to undo down the road)

.

51504bat · 06-05-2023, 08:12 AM

An 8.8 out of some Ford Rangers is the same WMS to WMS as a Maverick, 56.25 inches. But later Rangers were 2 inches wider. The Ranger rear ends might be easier to find than a Maverick and probably cheaper as well.

Shoebox · 06-05-2023, 06:44 PM

Thanks guys for all the info thus far. This car will be running a warmed over 276 cube flathead, fun but not a huge hp engine. I guess I'll see how available parts are for the original rear end first. I do know that while looking for a quality (not noisy) set of gears for a Ford 9" in another project last year,...... was not easy.

Flathead Fever · 06-05-2023, 08:43 PM

Your spider gears and side gears could be worn and making it feel like you have too much ring and pinion backlash. If you have a "lot" of play that is probably the problem instead on the ring and pinion. I replaced a lot of spider and side gear sets at work for that reason. They would make a big clunk when you first took off. They wear away faster than the ring and pinions do, at least they did on the phone company vehicles. We stocked them on the shelf because we went through so many of them. Before you panic look at those spiders and see how much play they have. You can get an idea of how worn the spider gears are by jacking one wheel off the ground and rotating it back and forth. There shouldn't be very much play.

I don't think you need a 9-inch for a 276 ci flathead. You will just be wasting horsepower turning the larger gears and extra weight. My first car was a '65 Mustang fastback with a 225 hp 289 and I did horrible, terrible things to that 8-inch rearend and never hurt it. Daily, 6000 rpm clutch dumps on it until I sent a valve through a piston. Ford decided the 225 hp 289 would use the 8-inch and the hipo 271 hp received the 9-inch. If you do decide to swap rear ends if you can find a bolt-in. 8-inch with something around a 3.50 gear I think you will be happy with it. My real ''66 Shelby GT-350 came with 3.89s that are a bit too low for driving around on the freeway. I had a Mustang with 3.50s and those were nice all around gears but that also depends on your tire diameter. Then if you replace the rearend you will need to have a new driveshaft made. It's probably better to repair the original rear end unless you're going vintage drag racing.

Shoebox · 06-06-2023, 09:58 AM

Fever,
Thanks for your thoughts and experiences. I was not at all considering a 9-inch for the '51, I was referring to my "other make shoebox" with a 454. Anyhow at the moment I'm not going to do anything with the rear end, and continue with the 6 cyl. to V8 w/ overdrive change over. I have heard varying accounts of how difficult it is to get parts for these diffs, any source recommendations would be welcome.

Don T · 06-06-2023, 06:34 PM

A bearing supply firm located seals and bearings for my 50 Meteor. This was strictly from comparing numbers and measuring the originals. You need to find a patient parts guy. I sourced a new NOS ring& pinion set from Colorado; a long way from Alberta. Looked hard and long for it. The only issue in using another diff is you are likely to end up with something like a 3:00 gear rather than the 4:10 (or close to) that you want with the OD.

06-04-2023, 03:08 PM	#1
Shoebox Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Holmen,Wisconsin Posts: 789	Suitable Shoebox Rear End Swap While removing the driveshaft from my '51 Tudor today, in preparation for the engine swap, I found what "seems" like excess slop in the pinion/ring gear dept. While I am NOT looking to add this to my current work list, I am wondering what good candidates there are for a future swap. I have read somewhere that certain year Mavericks are a bolt in, although sounding too good to be true, if so I'd like to know. I have not looked into availability of bearings, crush washers, etc. for the original either. Any comments most welcome. Thanks guys. __________________ I went, I saw, I bought the T shirt 51 Ford Deluxe Tudor 32 Ford roadster 39 Mercury Towncar

06-04-2023, 03:45 PM	#2
FlatheadTed Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Auckland Posts: 4,709	Re: Suitable Shoebox Rear End Swap To reset the lash in the 51 is les of a job than going down the other rout . __________________ http://www.flatheadted.com Flathead Ted brake Floaters ,

06-04-2023, 05:57 PM	#3
Gene1949 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Pahrump, NV Posts: 385	Re: Suitable Shoebox Rear End Swap 77 Granada. Broke left side and right-side axles. Seems other owners of the 49 model year had similar. The Grenada is a little wider but is a boltin. Even the 49 e-brake cables worked. Lot of ratios to choose from and everone sells kits for the 8"

06-04-2023, 07:23 PM	#6
TJ Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Napa,California Posts: 6,084	Re: Suitable Shoebox Rear End Swap Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) The Maverick rear is the narrowest of the 8 inch rears. The Grenada is a little wider but will work. Both will drop right in on your springs. No need to move the pads. I don't think the Grenada used the 8 inch rear. I believe they were all nine inch and some later Grenadas were the spicer type rear end. You can also use the 64-66 Mustang 8 inch rear which I think is the same width as the Maverick. Last edited by TJ; 06-05-2023 at 10:30 AM.

06-04-2023, 07:26 PM	#7
Gene1949 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Pahrump, NV Posts: 385	Re: Suitable Shoebox Rear End Swap I believe its 3/4" wider. Probibly wouldn't work with your tire wheel combo. I'm running 205 60 14 on Lincoln Versaile wheels. Can't tell you about driveline as I installed 4 speed same time. Perch centerline isn't off enough to make a difference. There is a reason your old rear developed slop. Worn parts. Sure you can reset it but the initial problem is stil there. At the very least I would look at bearings and gears

06-04-2023, 07:44 PM	#8
paul2748 Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Midland Park, NJ Posts: 4,008	Re: Suitable Shoebox Rear End Swap Granada's did use the 8 inch rear as far as I know. My info says the rear is not a drop in as the spring perches are different. A nine inch from 57 -59 are next in line from the Maverick at 57.25. The 65-66 Mustang 8 inch is the same. Both may have the spring perches in the right location. 75 Mustang II is 57.00 inches, don't know about the perches. The V8 Maverick is 56.50 inches. Don't know about the spring perches. The 77-81 Granada/Monarch/Versaille rear ends are 58 inches __________________ 48 Ford Conv 56 Tbird 54 Ford Victoria

06-04-2023, 07:51 PM	#9
tubman Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Minnesota, Florida Keys Posts: 10,431	Re: Suitable Shoebox Rear End Swap All I can add here is that I put a set of 2.75/75X15 tires on 5.5" later Ford wheels on the stock rear end on my '51 club coupe, and they barely fit, even after I took 1/4" off of the inside of the wheel wells (which I wil be paying to undo down the road).

06-05-2023, 08:12 AM	#10
51504bat Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: SoCal-Redlands Posts: 3,066	Re: Suitable Shoebox Rear End Swap An 8.8 out of some Ford Rangers is the same WMS to WMS as a Maverick, 56.25 inches. But later Rangers were 2 inches wider. The Ranger rear ends might be easier to find than a Maverick and probably cheaper as well. __________________ Making the simple complicated for over 30 years.

06-05-2023, 06:44 PM	#11
Shoebox Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Holmen,Wisconsin Posts: 789	Re: Suitable Shoebox Rear End Swap Thanks guys for all the info thus far. This car will be running a warmed over 276 cube flathead, fun but not a huge hp engine. I guess I'll see how available parts are for the original rear end first. I do know that while looking for a quality (not noisy) set of gears for a Ford 9" in another project last year,...... was not easy. __________________ I went, I saw, I bought the T shirt 51 Ford Deluxe Tudor 32 Ford roadster 39 Mercury Towncar

06-05-2023, 08:43 PM	#12
Flathead Fever Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Yucaipa, CA Posts: 1,106	Re: Suitable Shoebox Rear End Swap Your spider gears and side gears could be worn and making it feel like you have too much ring and pinion backlash. If you have a "lot" of play that is probably the problem instead on the ring and pinion. I replaced a lot of spider and side gear sets at work for that reason. They would make a big clunk when you first took off. They wear away faster than the ring and pinions do, at least they did on the phone company vehicles. We stocked them on the shelf because we went through so many of them. Before you panic look at those spiders and see how much play they have. You can get an idea of how worn the spider gears are by jacking one wheel off the ground and rotating it back and forth. There shouldn't be very much play. I don't think you need a 9-inch for a 276 ci flathead. You will just be wasting horsepower turning the larger gears and extra weight. My first car was a '65 Mustang fastback with a 225 hp 289 and I did horrible, terrible things to that 8-inch rearend and never hurt it. Daily, 6000 rpm clutch dumps on it until I sent a valve through a piston. Ford decided the 225 hp 289 would use the 8-inch and the hipo 271 hp received the 9-inch. If you do decide to swap rear ends if you can find a bolt-in. 8-inch with something around a 3.50 gear I think you will be happy with it. My real ''66 Shelby GT-350 came with 3.89s that are a bit too low for driving around on the freeway. I had a Mustang with 3.50s and those were nice all around gears but that also depends on your tire diameter. Then if you replace the rearend you will need to have a new driveshaft made. It's probably better to repair the original rear end unless you're going vintage drag racing. Last edited by Flathead Fever; 06-05-2023 at 08:50 PM.

06-06-2023, 09:58 AM	#13
Shoebox Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Holmen,Wisconsin Posts: 789	Re: Suitable Shoebox Rear End Swap Fever, Thanks for your thoughts and experiences. I was not at all considering a 9-inch for the '51, I was referring to my "other make shoebox" with a 454. Anyhow at the moment I'm not going to do anything with the rear end, and continue with the 6 cyl. to V8 w/ overdrive change over. I have heard varying accounts of how difficult it is to get parts for these diffs, any source recommendations would be welcome. __________________ I went, I saw, I bought the T shirt 51 Ford Deluxe Tudor 32 Ford roadster 39 Mercury Towncar

06-06-2023, 06:34 PM	#14
Don T Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Alberta Canada Posts: 94	Re: Suitable Shoebox Rear End Swap A bearing supply firm located seals and bearings for my 50 Meteor. This was strictly from comparing numbers and measuring the originals. You need to find a patient parts guy. I sourced a new NOS ring& pinion set from Colorado; a long way from Alberta. Looked hard and long for it. The only issue in using another diff is you are likely to end up with something like a 3:00 gear rather than the 4:10 (or close to) that you want with the OD.