The Ford Barn

Big Shark · 01-11-2011, 09:52 PM

Anyone have success welding a hole in the side of a flathead? The hole is the size of a pencil eraser? Thanks Bruce

Ronnie · 01-11-2011, 10:19 PM

Drill and tap for 1/8" pipe plug if there is room.Why weld if you don't have to. Cast iron can be a real crap shoot unless done by a creditable welding shop get some quotes.Welding would be my last choice just my .02. What caused the hole?

Ronnie

1931 flamingo · 01-11-2011, 10:24 PM

J.B. Weld ?? Nothing to lose.
Paul in CT

19Fordy · 01-12-2011, 10:57 AM

Ronnie hit the nail on the head. When I installed 59AB heads on an 8BA block I used a pipe thread tap and then screwed in a pipe plug with non hardening Permatex so it was just below the deck surface . Then covered it with JB weld. That was 10 years ago and it's still holding. I think you could do the same.

FRANK PKNY · 01-12-2011, 12:07 PM

How about posting of photo of the problem area. How large exactly and what caused the hole. Never seen a small (bullet hole?) Don't weld if possible. Let's get more infomation first. JMHO Frank pkny

Karl Wolf · 01-12-2011, 12:40 PM

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My 2 cents...
Wonder why you have that hole- look for cracks around the hole, AND pressure test AND magnaflux the block befor going to other expence... I have a fair amount of respect for brazing on the outside of a block- if you do, try to get the whole block at least warm first... Karl

52merc · 01-12-2011, 02:02 PM

i agree with karl brazing is best but get the block area where you are going to braze warm first this will help

Frank The Plumber · 01-12-2011, 09:38 PM

Theres a special welding alloy rod for it but you only get one shot. Put a holler on the HAMB and see if any of those guys know a local that can show you a bit of his work.

perrysmith · 01-12-2011, 09:57 PM

As I recall my late ol-school father brazed even pressure vessels of cast iron. He could do pretty oxy-acteylene and stick welds, but he definately was not going for
looks when he brazed cast iron. I think also, that warm was an understatement...more like rosebud hot on the part to be welded.

burly · 01-13-2011, 11:19 AM

I recently drug out a 59L block I bought from a gent a few years ago. Upon closer inspection I've found a hairline crack on the back of the bellhousing just below the 59. I suspect it may have mounted it an engine stand at one time. Do I need to expect this to get worse? Any suggestions for repair? Thanks Guys

Jack E/NJ · 01-13-2011, 06:15 PM

Big Shark Bruce: I'd suggest rounding out the hole if need be. Then use either an appropriately-sized metal, plastic or rubber expansion plug.

Burly: Are you sure the hairline crack isn't just a surface casting imperfection? Can you see if it extends to the inside surface?

Jack E/NJ

Ol' Ron · 01-13-2011, 06:38 PM

I had a similar problem and just drilled it out for a 1/4" npt plug.

coilover · 01-13-2011, 07:52 PM

Always wondered how Ford welded the entire sides onto the 1937 V8 60 block. They were welded with one continuous bead around the entire perimeter and the weld was beautiful.

Big Shark · 01-16-2011, 03:31 PM

I tried a couple of things in the shop Saturday. I took a steam trap (its cast iron), and drilled a couple of holes in it to practice my welding. I tried spray-metal, certanium rod, and a castiron rod. The spray metal would just ball up. The certanium rod cracked when it cooled, The cast rod looked great. Until I pressure checked it. It leaked were the weld met the cast. I think I will try the brazing method. Ill let you guys know how it turs out. Bruce

Ronnie · 01-16-2011, 05:04 PM

The crap shoot syndrome now begins. You won't get same results with a block if the cast iron properties are different from your test piece.

Ronnie

FRANK PKNY · 01-16-2011, 05:17 PM

I braze a lot of cast iron printing press parts. Braze works well but you must heat up a large area. The entire block would be best, I know that is not practical. You can ruin the block very easly. I brazed a tractor block years ago. Getting things very hot is important. Yesterday I brazed a cast iron model T muffler end. It came out great. Engine blocks can be tuff , cracking when cool downing. That's why the entire block should be heated. I don't remember exactly what tempeture you need possibly someone else can jump in.

Kurt in NJ · 01-16-2011, 05:42 PM

Here is some reading on cast iron welding---
http://www.locknstitch.com/castironwelding.htm

it describes the problem you have and how to do it properly

Marv · 01-16-2011, 06:55 PM

I use nickle rod for most cast iron if i am using a stick welder. Marv

southfork · 01-16-2011, 08:15 PM

An old mechanic/welder near me used to weld up blocks with massive damage. He once showed me a block where he'd nickel-welded about six pieces of cast together that had been knocked out the side of the block in his pickup. It looked like a puzzle, but the engine didn't leak afterward. after seeing that, I asked him to weld the end of my Model T engine block where a 1 X 2 inch piece of water jacket had broken out due to freezing. That weld is pretty. He'd heat the block with a torch before using the nickel rod, and he'd skip around when doing the arc-welding.

Ken/Alabama · 01-16-2011, 10:37 PM

I had a block about 10 yrs ago that had a hole about 1/2" diameter on the drivers side just above the oil pan rail . The hole didnt show up until the block went through the cleaner . I layed the block on its side and braced it up so the hole was pointing straight down. I then mixed up a whole tube of J.B. weld and kept poking it into the hole then cut a piece of sheet copper and clamped it up overnight. That engine is in a friends 40 and has never leaked a drop after all these years and several thousand miles.

01-11-2011, 09:52 PM	#1
Big Shark Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Central Wisconsin Posts: 305	welding a block Anyone have success welding a hole in the side of a flathead? The hole is the size of a pencil eraser? Thanks Bruce

01-11-2011, 10:19 PM	#2
Ronnie Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Canada Where it snows Posts: 2,059	Re: welding a block Drill and tap for 1/8" pipe plug if there is room.Why weld if you don't have to. Cast iron can be a real crap shoot unless done by a creditable welding shop get some quotes.Welding would be my last choice just my .02. What caused the hole? Ronnie

01-11-2011, 10:24 PM	#3
1931 flamingo Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: new britain,ct 06052 Posts: 9,428	Re: welding a block J.B. Weld ?? Nothing to lose. Paul in CT

01-12-2011, 10:57 AM	#4
19Fordy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Coral Springs FL Posts: 11,916	Re: welding a block Ronnie hit the nail on the head. When I installed 59AB heads on an 8BA block I used a pipe thread tap and then screwed in a pipe plug with non hardening Permatex so it was just below the deck surface . Then covered it with JB weld. That was 10 years ago and it's still holding. I think you could do the same. Last edited by 19Fordy; 08-13-2011 at 06:49 AM.

01-12-2011, 12:07 PM	#5
FRANK PKNY Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: POUGHKEEPSIE NY 12601 Posts: 1,020	Re: welding a block How about posting of photo of the problem area. How large exactly and what caused the hole. Never seen a small (bullet hole?) Don't weld if possible. Let's get more infomation first. JMHO Frank pkny __________________ [email protected]

01-12-2011, 12:40 PM	#6
Karl Wolf Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mill Valley,Ca. Posts: 1,555	Re: welding a block Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) My 2 cents... Wonder why you have that hole- look for cracks around the hole, AND pressure test AND magnaflux the block befor going to other expence... I have a fair amount of respect for brazing on the outside of a block- if you do, try to get the whole block at least warm first... Karl

01-12-2011, 02:02 PM	#7
52merc Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: new zealand Posts: 1,054	Re: welding a block i agree with karl brazing is best but get the block area where you are going to braze warm first this will help

01-12-2011, 09:38 PM	#8
Frank The Plumber Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 693	Re: welding a block Theres a special welding alloy rod for it but you only get one shot. Put a holler on the HAMB and see if any of those guys know a local that can show you a bit of his work.

01-12-2011, 09:57 PM	#9
perrysmith Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 285	Re: welding a block As I recall my late ol-school father brazed even pressure vessels of cast iron. He could do pretty oxy-acteylene and stick welds, but he definately was not going for looks when he brazed cast iron. I think also, that warm was an understatement...more like rosebud hot on the part to be welded.

01-13-2011, 11:19 AM	#10
burly Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Bowling Green, Ky. Posts: 243	Re: welding a block I recently drug out a 59L block I bought from a gent a few years ago. Upon closer inspection I've found a hairline crack on the back of the bellhousing just below the 59. I suspect it may have mounted it an engine stand at one time. Do I need to expect this to get worse? Any suggestions for repair? Thanks Guys

01-13-2011, 06:15 PM	#11
Jack E/NJ Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 2,272	Re: welding a block Big Shark Bruce: I'd suggest rounding out the hole if need be. Then use either an appropriately-sized metal, plastic or rubber expansion plug. Burly: Are you sure the hairline crack isn't just a surface casting imperfection? Can you see if it extends to the inside surface? Jack E/NJ

01-13-2011, 06:38 PM	#12
Ol' Ron Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Chester Vt Posts: 8,985	Re: welding a block I had a similar problem and just drilled it out for a 1/4" npt plug.

01-13-2011, 07:52 PM	#13
coilover Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 33	Re: welding a block Always wondered how Ford welded the entire sides onto the 1937 V8 60 block. They were welded with one continuous bead around the entire perimeter and the weld was beautiful.

01-16-2011, 03:31 PM	#14
Big Shark Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Central Wisconsin Posts: 305	Re: welding a block I tried a couple of things in the shop Saturday. I took a steam trap (its cast iron), and drilled a couple of holes in it to practice my welding. I tried spray-metal, certanium rod, and a castiron rod. The spray metal would just ball up. The certanium rod cracked when it cooled, The cast rod looked great. Until I pressure checked it. It leaked were the weld met the cast. I think I will try the brazing method. Ill let you guys know how it turs out. Bruce

01-16-2011, 05:04 PM	#15
Ronnie Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Canada Where it snows Posts: 2,059	Re: welding a block The crap shoot syndrome now begins. You won't get same results with a block if the cast iron properties are different from your test piece. Ronnie

01-16-2011, 05:17 PM	#16
FRANK PKNY Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: POUGHKEEPSIE NY 12601 Posts: 1,020	Re: welding a block I braze a lot of cast iron printing press parts. Braze works well but you must heat up a large area. The entire block would be best, I know that is not practical. You can ruin the block very easly. I brazed a tractor block years ago. Getting things very hot is important. Yesterday I brazed a cast iron model T muffler end. It came out great. Engine blocks can be tuff , cracking when cool downing. That's why the entire block should be heated. I don't remember exactly what tempeture you need possibly someone else can jump in. __________________ [email protected]

01-16-2011, 05:42 PM	#17
Kurt in NJ Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: on the Littlefield Posts: 6,672	Re: welding a block Here is some reading on cast iron welding--- http://www.locknstitch.com/castironwelding.htm it describes the problem you have and how to do it properly

01-16-2011, 06:55 PM	#18
Marv Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 875	Re: welding a block I use nickle rod for most cast iron if i am using a stick welder. Marv

01-16-2011, 08:15 PM	#19
southfork Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Idaho Posts: 416	Re: welding a block An old mechanic/welder near me used to weld up blocks with massive damage. He once showed me a block where he'd nickel-welded about six pieces of cast together that had been knocked out the side of the block in his pickup. It looked like a puzzle, but the engine didn't leak afterward. after seeing that, I asked him to weld the end of my Model T engine block where a 1 X 2 inch piece of water jacket had broken out due to freezing. That weld is pretty. He'd heat the block with a torch before using the nickel rod, and he'd skip around when doing the arc-welding.

01-16-2011, 10:37 PM	#20
Ken/Alabama Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Alabama Posts: 3,455	Re: welding a block I had a block about 10 yrs ago that had a hole about 1/2" diameter on the drivers side just above the oil pan rail . The hole didnt show up until the block went through the cleaner . I layed the block on its side and braced it up so the hole was pointing straight down. I then mixed up a whole tube of J.B. weld and kept poking it into the hole then cut a piece of sheet copper and clamped it up overnight. That engine is in a friends 40 and has never leaked a drop after all these years and several thousand miles.