'51 crestline new to me

[farmertom]

hello shoebox barners,i have traded my '37 fordor for a '51 crestline that was totaly restored some years ago. i will take possesion in a coupl of days and i will have a bunch of questions now and down the road. as ive been reading posts made me think about some thins like spark plugs.ive been using autolite and it looks as though 216s will work..025-.030 gap?. i have been reading about 3speed OD trans. what is best position for normal driving ? od cable pushed all in to dash bracket? what ive read that pushed in all the way it will freewheel only below 28 mph.to enable engine braking. or is it better to have cable handle pulled all the way out for normal driving.? thanks, Tom.

[rotorwrench]

Pulling the OD cable locks out the overdrive actuator pawl and moves the sun gear to disengage the planetary gears. The early 1951 may still have an electrical lock out switch that opens the circuit between the governor and the relay to keep the operating solenoid from activating. Ford did away with this feature in 1951 so it may not have that switch. They felt it was redundant but I like having that switch just to save on electrical power above on speed of the governor which is around 25 MPH.

The most importance caution with the R10 overdrive is when you park the car on a hill. Either pull out the lock out cable or put the transmission in reverse gear. If the E-brake is a little loose, the car WILL roll down the hill. MY oldest brother found that out the hard way. He pulled a small grain cart into a local grain elevator to fill it with feed grain for his hogs. He disconnected the trailer to fill it and pulled the old 51 Mercury out the door. He shut it off and put it in gear but not in reverse. As he walked back into the elevator door, the old Merc rolled down the ramp of the grain elevator, across the street, and ran into a brand new car parked on the other side. My brother never made too many mistakes in his life so that was his worst. My Pop pulled the cable out and had the cable assembly removed from the dash and wired up underneath. That was the last time my brother ever used the overdrive on that car.

[farmertom]

Originally Posted by rotorwrench

Pulling the OD cable locks out the overdrive actuator pawl and moves the sun gear to disengage the planetary gears. The early 1951 may still have an electrical lock out switch that opens the circuit between the governor and the relay to keep the operating solenoid from activating. Ford did away with this feature in 1951 so it may not have that switch. They felt it was redundant but I like having that switch just to save on electrical power above on speed of the governor which is around 25 MPH.

The most importance caution with the R10 overdrive is when you park the car on a hill. Either pull out the lock out cable or put the transmission in reverse gear. If the E-brake is a little loose, the car WILL roll down the hill. MY oldest brother found that out the hard way. He pulled a small grain cart into a local grain elevator to fill it with feed grain for his hogs. He disconnected the trailer to fill it and pulled the old 51 Mercury out the door. He shut it off and put it in gear but not in reverse. As he walked back into the elevator door, the old Merc rolled down the ramp of the grain elevator, across the street, and ran into a brand new car parked on the other side. My brother never made too many mistakes in his life so that was his worst. My Pop pulled the cable out and had the cable assembly removed from the dash and wired up underneath. That was the last time my brother ever used the overdrive on that car.

thanks rororwrench,it does have a tiny chrome toggle switch that in down position of said switch lights a tiny light that iassume activates the opreating solenoid.does that switch only work when the cable handle is pushed all the way in therefore completing the desired actions to be in OD? so then to just be in normal 3 speed trans cable handle should be pulled all the way out? what i thought was wierd was the little toggle seemed to be on in down position,anyway thats when the little indicator lighted up. im ancious to get the car and all info that comes with. im sure it will answer most questions. this is gonna be a different duck tha my '37. Tom.

[mercman from oz]

1951 Ford Crestliner V8

[tubman]

I had a '51 Ford in high school with an overdrive, and there was no "tiny chrome switch". A toggle switch is usually added to simplify the operation of the overdrive or simply to eliminate some of the wiring and functionality. It sounds like your system has been "modified", so all bets are off on what does what and when. The stock system I am installing in my current '51 doesn't have a tiny switch either. It does have a relay, a kickdown switch and a factory wiring harness.

[farmertom]

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Originally Posted by mercman from oz

1951 Ford Crestliner V8

hey mercman,actually my '51 is a crestline victoria,has the 3 piece rear glass and no post. thanks for acnowlegement. Tom.

[farmertom]

Originally Posted by tubman

I had a '51 Ford in high school with an overdrive, and there was no "tiny chrome switch". A toggle switch is usually added to simplify the operation of the overdrive or simply to eliminate some of the wiring and functionality. It sounds like your system has been "modified", so all bets are off on what does what and when. The stock system I am installing in my current '51 doesn't have a tiny switch either. It does have a relay, a kickdown switch and a factory wiring harness.

Tubman,i could hear the solenoid click off and on with that toggle switch.maybe the toggle swich that seems to enable the solenoid was to replace the kickdown switch.not sure ive never had the oportunity to operate an OD trans. Tom.

[tubman]

One of the early flathead books had a chapter on how to make an overdrive functional with a minimum of parts using a toggle switch. It does what it's supposed to do (change the effective final drive ratio) but leaves the overdrive vulnerable to damage if used carelessly. I strongly suggest you run it locked out (handle out) until you can figure out exactly what was done with your set up. Just about everything you might need is readily available from various sources (the Studebaker guys have lot of components), and there is a ton of literature available. Once you become familiar with the overdrive and it's operation, you can set it up factory correct and it will be a joy to drive. It is almost as good as an automatic transmission around town if used right.

One question : Does you car have the overdrive relay mounted on the firewall? That's usually the hardest part to find and not having one can be the reason for the toggle switch.

[mercman from oz]

Tom, I believe that your new purchase is a 1951 Ford Victoria as per the above illustration.
When you said you had just purchased a Crestline, I presumed that you bought yourself a Crestliner.
The Ford Crestliner was only produced for two years, 1950 and 1951.
They were discontinued when the Victoria was introduced.
The first models that Ford attached the Crestline names to were the 1952 models.
Final year for the Crestline name was 1954, and it was replaced by Fairlane for the 1955 models.
Sorry for the misunderstanding. Mercman <><

[tubman]

I consider the '51 Victoria's to be the best looking of the "shoebox" Fords, even though it was a "stopgap" model, hastily put together to compete with Chevrolet's new Bel Aire hardtop. To most, it was a big step up from the rather dowdy Crestliners. They were just two door sedans with special trim available in a limited selection of two-tone colors, that icky Chartreuse or "Hawaiian Bronze" and Black with a black vinyl top. All in all, the Victoria was a real upgrade. You're lucky you have a Victoria.

I have always wanted one, ever since I had Fordor in high school. I looked for a long time, but never found the right car. When I did run across a real nice club coupe, I jumped all over it.

[GB SISSON]

I know very little about the shoebox fords, but I do believe that victoria with it's 3 piece rear glass and no post is a thing of beauty.

[sugarmaker]

Farmertom, Guys,
Congratulations on the new car! We now need some pictures!
Not a shoebox fan but the hardtop Vic could grow on a guy! The 51 Vic hubcaps are what is on our 66 F100. They are going to stay on there for a while. My dad and mom had a 51. This is a way that I can remember my dad.
Thanks for posting these nice pictures.
Regards,
Chris and Cheryl

[farmertom]

Originally Posted by tubman

One of the early flathead books had a chapter on how to make an overdrive functional with a minimum of parts using a toggle switch. It does what it's supposed to do (change the effective final drive ratio) but leaves the overdrive vulnerable to damage if used carelessly. I strongly suggest you run it locked out (handle out) until you can figure out exactly what was done with your set up. Just about everything you might need is readily available from various sources (the Studebaker guys have lot of components), and there is a ton of literature available. Once you become familiar with the overdrive and it's operation, you can set it up factory correct and it will be a joy to drive. It is almost as good as an automatic transmission around town if used right.

One question : Does you car have the overdrive relay mounted on the firewall? That's usually the hardest part to find and not having one can be the reason for the toggle switch.

Thanks tubman,really appreciate your advice. thats a good point about the OD relay.i will be getting the '51 and the '37 taken away tomorrow and start doing my cleaning,oil &filter change and other adjustments and reading over all build sheet receipts and manuals,especially the OD literature. Thank you again. Tom.

[farmertom]

Originally Posted by tubman

I consider the '51 Victoria's to be the best looking of the "shoebox" Fords, even though it was a "stopgap" model, hastily put together to compete with Chevrolet's new Bel Aire hardtop. To most, it was a big step up from the rather dowdy Crestliners. They were just two door sedans with special trim available in a limited selection of two-tone colors, that icky Chartreuse or "Hawaiian Bronze" and Black with a black vinyl top. All in all, the Victoria was a real upgrade. You're lucky you have a Victoria.

I have always wanted one, ever since I had Fordor in high school. I looked for a long time, but never found the right car. When I did run across a real nice club coupe, I jumped all over it.

Yes thanks,the vicky with the 3 piece rear glass is what drew me in. before i traded,i had looked online at lots '51s (my birth year) and Mercs,and like the no post hard top. Tom.

[farmertom]

Originally Posted by mercman from oz

Tom, I believe that your new purchase is a 1951 Ford Victoria as per the above illustration.
When you said you had just purchased a Crestline, I presumed that you bought yourself a Crestliner.
The Ford Crestliner was only produced for two years, 1950 and 1951.
They were discontinued when the Victoria was introduced.
The first models that Ford attached the Crestline names to were the 1952 models.
Final year for the Crestline name was 1954, and it was replaced by Fairlane for the 1955 models.
Sorry for the misunderstanding. Mercman <><

Mercman,no problem,some times i want to say crestliner i guess it comes off the tounge better.i havnt checked to see what production numbers were for the'51 crestline victoria. Tom.

[farmertom]

Originally Posted by GB SISSON

I know very little about the shoebox fords, but I do believe that victoria with it's 3 piece rear glass and no post is a thing of beauty.

thanks,GB,thats what got me.i was also looking at '51 mercs but the nice ones were to rich for my wallet. Tom.

[rotorwrench]

If you flip the switch with the car not moving and you hear the operating solenoid click, then that indicates the governor and relay may have been bypassed. The relay has the system fuse and be aware that the system draws a fair amount of current. Switches need to be able to handle the current flow or they may have reliability issues over time. The original system is fully automatic in all operating functions. The only manual thing is the lock out cable. The kick down switch performs two functions when you push the throttle pedal all the way down. It cuts out the ignition coil momentarily till the solenoid drops out and restores the ignition function. This is what allows the overdrive to drop so easily to the gear that the transmission is in, ie 2nd or 3rd gear. The governor is likely bypassed and may not even be installed since it isn't part of the circuit. Normally, it wouldn't even operate the solenoid unless the car was moving above the governor on speed around 25 mph. Be very careful how you switch the system on. As was mentioned, switching it on at the wrong time could do some damage. The car will not reverse with the system on and can put the balk ring gear plate out of position if a person tries to.

Don't forget to turn it off when you stop. Wait till the car is in 2nd gear and above 25 mph before turning it on. Download this link and it will give you the basics of operation.
https://www.oldwillysforum.com/forum...riveManual.pdf

[farmertom]

Originally Posted by rotorwrench

If you flip the switch with the car not moving and you hear the operating solenoid click, then that indicates the governor and relay may have been bypassed. The relay has the system fuse and be aware that the system draws a fair amount of current. Switches need to be able to handle the current flow or they may have reliability issues over time. The original system is fully automatic in all operating functions. The only manual thing is the lock out cable. The kick down switch performs two functions when you push the throttle pedal all the way down. It cuts out the ignition coil momentarily till the solenoid drops out and restores the ignition function. This is what allows the overdrive to drop so easily to the gear that the transmission is in, ie 2nd or 3rd gear. The governor is likely bypassed and may not even be installed since it isn't part of the circuit. Normally, it wouldn't even operate the solenoid unless the car was moving above the governor on speed around 25 mph. Be very careful how you switch the system on. As was mentioned, switching it on at the wrong time could do some damage. The car will not reverse with the system on and can put the balk ring gear plate out of position if a person tries to.

Don't forget to turn it off when you stop. Wait till the car is in 2nd gear and above 25 mph before turning it on. Download this link and it will give you the basics of operation.
https://www.oldwillysforum.com/forum...riveManual.pdf

Thanks rotorwrench,im taking your and others advice.so for now im going to have the OD cable pulled all the way out and make sure that toggle switch that i heard make the solenoid click on and off is off and the indicator light right next to OD cable is not illuminated. then i assume that the OD is totally locked out?i will be studying all literature before i do any more actions to cable or switch. sound safe to you.? thank you so much, Tom.

[Tom F OHIO]

Farmertom, what color is your new car??

[farmertom]

hey everone,a couple of you have asked for pics and i will ablidge when i can remember how to change my avatar. Tom