Cranks but no start

[53_mercLuke]

I have been having this issue for abit now and I have asked on here before. I can get the engine to crank but no start. I do not have spark at the plugs. I have new plugs, new wires, new cap, new rotor, new condenser, and new points set at .015". It's a 6 volt positive groumd on a 53 mercury with the flathead. I seem to loose power to the circuit breakers and fuses as soon as I hook the wire from the negative side of the start solenoid that runs through the ammeter to the 30 amp circuit breaker. If I unhool it I get my power to the ignition switch back. That wire needs to be hooked up in order for the car to crank though. Thanks for the help, it is my first time dealing with a system like this and have had it explained to me, I just still get confused because wiring is by no means my strong suit

[Binx]

Here's a diagram of a '53 with all bells and whistles. I don't see any fuses.

http://www.vanpeltsales.com/FH_web/F...ng1953merc.jpg

Lonnie

[Drbrown]

Binx's diagrams should help. I'm not specifically familiar with the '53s and not sure by your description, but it sounds like maybe a bad Ignition Switch or a wiring mix-up.

(1) The ignition switch is always actively linked to the battery via a shared bolted terminal at the Circuit Breaker. So when the switch is turned on, the coil gets connected to the battery and can fire the distributor and spark plugs, thus starting the engine.

(2) The starter will operate when you activate the starter side of the switch .... it grounds the starter solenoid allowing the starter motor to operate.

Both of these operations must occur simultaneously. The battery must always feed the shared terminal at the Circuit Breaker, the the ignition switch must connect to it there.

So it almost sounds like (1) the Ignition Switch is not performing those two required functions, OR (2) the wiring is not correct.

Here's a test of the switch: Using a test wire, by-pass the ignition switch from a battery feed directly to the coil. Hit the starter. If that works the switch is apparently defective.

[53_mercLuke]

Originally Posted by Binx

Here's a diagram of a '53 with all bells and whistles. I don't see any fuses.

http://www.vanpeltsales.com/FH_web/F...ng1953merc.jpg

Lonnie

This is one of the 3 wiring diagrams I have used, and it does have two 14 amp fuses and 3 circuit breakers. Not sure how I can wire it wrong if I have it wired exactly how it is in the diagram

[Jersey Devil]

Luke

Send me an e mail and will set up a call to try and give you some test points to diagnose the trouble.

[email protected]

Wait to hear,

Tom

[koates]

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Luke, Has your car had the original Mercury push button starter switch replaced with a more modern combination ignition KEY start switch ? Regards, Kevin.

[Paul Bennett]

Several things, Luke, not to dispair.
1. Initially one checks for spark at the spark ignition coil center wire, not at the spark plugs.
2. Your battery should be permanently connected to the ammeter (step 1). Verify this with a test light. If you don't have a test light, stop everything and get one (a necessity about the price of a hamburger)... become comfortable with it by connecting its long wire to ground, connect the battery and poke hither and yon and observe. Toss the voltmeter to your grandkids. For now anyway.
3. (step 2) Verify that the other side of the ammeter is be permanently connected to the ignition switch through the breaker assembly. Verify this using the test light.
4. When you turn on the key, test test light should indicate voltage at the ignition coil side wire.
5. Factoid correction to post 3 item 2 ... a '53 starter button has voltage permanently running to it. This voltage is applied to the starter solenoid when you press the center with your thumb. Note the center push part of YOUR start button should be black plastic. Pressing the button on a '53 Merc applies voltage (not ground) to the small connection of your starter solenoid. Earlier cars do apply ground and their push element is chrome (but not yours). Ask me how I know. No don't, I'm troubleshooting an intermittent pb on my '50 Merc (with a chrome button) as we speak.

Complete your assignment and report back for your next round of 'Let's get this thing on the road' once and forever. Carry on soldier.

Incidentally, you should be connecting and disconnecting power at the negative battery post not hooking wires here and there. Until you are running, disconnect the battery while not troubleshooting. Save the electrons.

[53_mercLuke]

Originally Posted by koates

Luke, Has your car had the original Mercury push button starter switch replaced with a more modern combination ignition KEY start switch ? Regards, Kevin.

Nope everything is original on this car as far as switches. The ammeter doesn't have connectors for wires on the back its just got a loop the wire runs through. So it goes from the battery side of the start solenoid to the ammeter loops and through to the breaker board under the dash. But as soon as I hook that up to where the diagram tells me I lose power to everything connected to the board

[53_mercLuke]

So this is what I got going, just for the ignition system and start button. Yes I know it's a mess but this is just for testing right now. The 12 gauge wire off the batter is the one that's suppose to run though the loop on the ammeter to the 30 amp circuit breaker. Then i have the ignition switch run to the - side of the coil and another wire to the 15 amp circuit breaker. The + side of the coil is hooked to the distributor. And the push button is hooked to the start solenoid and to the 15 amp circuit breaker that the switch is hooked to. And like I said before I have power to all the studs on the back of the ignition switch and to all the circuit breakers and fuses until I hook up that wire that goes through the ammeter loop to the breaker, but without it hooked up the engine won't crank.

[Bob C]

Originally Posted by 53_mercLuke

Nope everything is original on this car as far as switches. The ammeter doesn't have connectors for wires on the back its just got a loop the wire runs through. So it goes from the battery side of the start solenoid to the ammeter loops and through to the breaker board under the dash. But as soon as I hook that up to where the diagram tells me I lose power to everything connected to the board

So where is the board getting its power from when the wire to the battery side of the solenoid is disconnected?

Bob

[53_mercLuke]

Originally Posted by Bob C

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So where is the board getting its power from when the wire to the battery side of the solenoid is disconnected?

Bob

It's getting its power through the distributor since its positive ground, that's why I'm getting so confused and frustrated because I have never felt with a positive ground before and it doesn't make sense that the wire through the ammeter is hooked up to the battery side of the start solenoid since that's a - side, but that's the only way the start button works

[Bob C]

It's not getting power from the distributor, positive ground has nothing to do with it.
The only way you may see power at the distributor is if the points are open and the
ignition is on then you will see power on one side of the points, you will loose this when the points close. There is nothing mystical or magical about positive ground.

Bob

[53_mercLuke]

Well as soon as the battery is hooked up I can put a test light to the wire that's suppose to go from the distributor to the coil and then I have power, then when I hook it to the coil I have power on both sides of the coil, then when I hook up the ignition switch to the wire to the coil I have power to the coil post on the switch even when the key is on the floor of the car, and if I turn the key to the right I have power at all posts and at the circuit breakers. But then I hook up the ammeter wire from the battery side of the start solenoid to the circuit breaker and lose all power, then if I take the key out or turn it to the right I have power at only the coil post on the switch.

[53_mercLuke]

And if I hook up the battery and that's it I can put a test light to a spark plug in the head and the test light lights up.

[Bob C]

When you hook up your test light were do you have the alligator clip connected?

Bob

[53_mercLuke]

I have the alligator clip straight at the - battery terminal

[Bob C]

Originally Posted by 53_mercLuke

I have the alligator clip straight at the - battery terminal

Well there's the problem, should be on the + terminal that goes to the chassis ground.

Bob

[53_mercLuke]

Ok so I flipped the test light to the + side and I have power to the coil from the switch and power at the circuit board, I do not have power to the + of the coil to the distributor though, and I literally just ran down to Napa and got another new coil, this is number 3. I still have no spark

[Bob C]

Originally Posted by 53_mercLuke

Ok so I flipped the test light to the + side and I have power to the coil from the switch and power at the circuit board, I do not have power to the + of the coil to the distributor though, and I literally just ran down to Napa and got another new coil, this is number 3. I still have no spark

You shouldn't, the wire from the distributor supplies the ground from the
points to the coil +. The ignition switch supplies the power to the coil -.

Bob

[53_mercLuke]

Originally Posted by Bob C

You shouldn't, the wire from the distributor supplies the ground from the
points to the coil +. The ignition switch supplies the power to the coil -.

Bob

Ok so why dont I have spark? Coil, condenser, points, cap, wires, plugs are all new. If I take a plug wire from the cap and plug it into the coil and have my spark tester hooked to the wire and the plug I still have no spark.