Non fitting / defective aftermarket parts

[SteveB31]

Great thread.

Cost (price) is 99% of the problem. I had three guys call me this week wanting Chinese steering wheels (we only sell USA Made ones) because they are $20 cheaper. Who would of thunk that? Happens all the time.

Steve @ Bert's

[Hoogah]

Originally Posted by SteveB31

Great thread.

Cost (price) is 99% of the problem. I had three guys call me this week wanting Chinese steering wheels (we only sell USA Made ones) because they are $20 cheaper. Who would of thunk that? Happens all the time.

Steve @ Bert's

Steve, do you mind me asking how the quality control system works from your perspective? How are repro parts tested before full scale production? How is feedback used to improve parts that fall short of requirements? How hard is it for you to facilitate improvement within your suppliers, and what are the impediments?

What should we, the customers, be doing?

[40 Deluxe]

Worthwhile discussion! My input: Consumers need to respectful in voicing their concerns to the vendors and suppliers. On the other hand, the vendors and suppliers need to be more forthcoming and accurate in their catalogs and ads. They surely know if part X fits well or not. If it is simply too expensive to pay for OEM quality tooling, but a close facsimile is affordable, just say so! Don't brag up the 'sorta fits' part as if it were the real thing. Tell us why it may not fit and how to make it fit. Trust is a two-way street.

[dumb person]

I found the fit of parts is not that bad. Modern subaru have less parts available.

[Y-Blockhead]

Originally Posted by dumb person

I found the fit of parts is not that bad.

My guess is you haven't bought any parts made by Vintique.

[KenCoupe]

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A few years ago a representative from a software company came to my place of work. While we were waiting for other people to arrive at the meeting, she noticed the picture of my Model A on my computer and mentioned that her husband had an antique car but it was a steam car. I asked if it was a White steamer - she was surprised I knew what a White was because most people only know a Stanley steamer. I asked her what her husband did for parts because they don't have Snyders, Brattons, etc for Whites. She said he made most of the parts he needed (and this was before 3D printers). I personally don't have the equipment or the ability to fabricate the parts I need so I appreciate that we have many suppliers from which to purchase parts.

[Dodge]

I strayed to some orphan cars for awhile, but after chasing down parts for one car for
eight years I am back to Fords, (Model T and Model A)
Sometimes to get the car by I buy a repo part and if there is a problem with it I modify
if possible while looking for good original restorable pieces.

[Mike V. Florida]

I find it interesting the defense of the poor parts with the attitude of "at least we have them".

Is a poor fitting, or non fitting part really better then an original part that needs restoring? Are we not using the same techniques on the poor reproduction part then we are on original parts. If reproduction parts are good enough as is then why not an original part and a can of spray paint?

When a circus elephant is born the circus places a large chain on the leg of the baby. pull and pull as it might there is no where to go but the end of the chain. Day after day, month after month the elephant gives up and the then even a weak chain is enough to "hold back" the grown elephant. Have we become so used to poor parts that we are now like the circus elephant?

[Hoogah]

Originally Posted by Mike V. Florida

I find it interesting the defense of the poor parts with the attitude of "at least we have them . . . . Have we become so used to poor parts that we are now like the circus elephant?

I guess that's why I started this thread. So many complaints about poor parts but so much acceptance of this as a fact of life! Surely it costs the same to carefully make a part with the hole in the wrong place or a mis-shaped curve as it does an accurate reproduction. I am grateful for the availability of parts for our cars but I don't get the complacency about shoddy workmanship!

[trubble]

Wondering why one or both of the national organizations doesn't have a committee to review of rate reproduced parts.

[[email protected]]

Over the years I've known guys that were Model A flippers. They would quickly and cheaply assemble a barn find Model A and sell it for a quick big profit. They were never looking for quality just cheap parts.

[Steve Wastler]

For those who think it's hard to find good original and nos parts should have been looking 30-40 years ago. Prior to the Internet, it was by letters, phone calls, more letters and you still wound up with the incorrect original part. It's amazing how many mint original and nos parts are out there for the picking, just by sitting at the computer or in your easy chair with your smart phone.

[TomballMottershaw]

I generally found the repo parts to be very good.
I would be a liar... to say I don't like the cheaper parts.
but I do buy the USA/Europe part over other areas.

For say, tires I bought the 5 $99 Universals, not the $160 Firestone's.
They are made in Vietnam and have worked well for the 1 year I have had them on.
Tires have a limited shelf/use life independent of how much they are used.

say spring shackles, the USA ones are expensive and don't "look" right, but function durable & well... except for the grease fitting popping out.
for stop light switches the

summary:
Parts selection: It's a hard decision tree and lots of competing goals and constraints.

for me, I wanted a car that runs well, and I can drive in the mud or rain, and look original... at 10+ft.

There are plenty of perfection restored machines that are wonderful, for me the fun is driving them to the store after work.

[Y-Blockhead]

Originally Posted by Mike V. Florida

I find it interesting the defense of the poor parts with the attitude of "at least we have them".

Is a poor fitting, or non fitting part really better then an original part that needs restoring? Are we not using the same techniques on the poor reproduction part then we are on original parts. If reproduction parts are good enough as is then why not an original part and a can of spray paint?

Originally Posted by Hoogah

I guess that's why I started this thread. So many complaints about poor parts but so much acceptance of this as a fact of life! Surely it costs the same to carefully make a part with the hole in the wrong place or a mis-shaped curve as it does an accurate reproduction. I am grateful for the availability of parts for our cars but I don't get the complacency about shoddy workmanship!

I totally agree.

It wouldn't have cost anymore to make a reproduction part correctly in the first place as it did to produce the incorrect parts that are available today.

I have begun to ask the vendors who makes the parts before ordering. There are some manufacturers reproduction parts that I refuse to buy (I mentioned one earlier in this thread).

And a shout out to Bert's. They are the only vendor that asked me WHY?? I won't buy a particular 'Brand'.

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

Two sample rear fenders were sent to China, for reproduction. One suffered a shipping dent!---You guessed it, the R/R's came back, with a "no charge" DENT!
Bill W.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by Y-Blockhead

It wouldn't have cost anymore to make a reproduction part correctly in the first place as it did to produce the incorrect parts that are available today.

Ummmmm, based on my experiences, this is NOT a factual statement. I can think of many examples where authentically making an item is much more costly. Someone mentioned Spring Hangers (Shackles) above, this a great example. The original item started off as a hot rolled steel rod and was heated and stamped in about 4 separate operations before being machined. Today's units are cast. It would not surprise me if the actual forging & machining costs would be over $40-$50 a set. This would be production costs, not retail price. Like Steve Becker stated above, our experiences counter what most people say, and most hobbyists will not pay $75 for an authentically-made spring hanger when a off-shore set can be purchased for less than half the costs.

I could site many other examples but reality is most Model-A hobbyists verbally speak one thing but purchase another. It is a matter of priorities in my view, the ones that truly want a quality item WILL take the time to find it, --or will do whatever it takes to get their item restored back within factory specs. Others it seems, typically take the easier route.

[Y-Blockhead]

Hi Brent. Yes I see your point on an operation like you mention. I was thinking more along the lines of a simple casting like this cowl light arm so the holes line up...



or drilling and tapping a hole straight.

This "reproduction" would NOT have cost any more to make correctly. As it is it is unusable.

[Rowdy]

Yip, the discussion was about the junk plugging up my shop. Fuel pump, seems third time was a charm. I am not sure what the odds of getting 2 bad fuel pumps in a row, but just did it. Thankfully my pickup is back on the road after being broke since early July. New clutch, fuel pump and some general repairs. New head gaskets in my wifes car and new fuel pump and ignition switch in my daughters car. Not to mention the brake job on my parents Blazer, which I ended up with 1 bad caliper and a defective hose. Had .006 taper on theating surface that would not allow it to seal. All are out of my shop now. Maybe home won't feel like a continuation of work for a while. Rod

[denis4x4]

After looking at Y-Blockhead's post showing the cowl light arm, I'm going to bet that the manufacturer of that particular part made a casting from another repro part and that the pattern "grew" causing the mismatch. I've seen SBC performance intake manifolds made off shore that weren't even close. But, they were $100 cheaper than an Edlebrock or Offy manifold so the buyer was OK with reworking the bolt holes to make them fit. Accepting crap parts isn't limited to the A hobby. Walmart has become the world's largest retailer because our culture has shifted from being a producer of goods to a provider of services and everybody is looking for the cheapest item. To paraphrase Pogo, "I've met the enemy and it is us".

[Mike V. Florida]

Originally Posted by trubble

Wondering why one or both of the national organizations doesn't have a committee to review of rate reproduced parts.

The "model a times" magazine was supposed to do just that,

"We review reproduction parts to help the restorer seek out the best value for their project. We will high-light various services offered around the country to assist in finding someone to do the job you don't care to tackle."

I used to subscribe to it.