P & G Valve Gapper

[packrat5]

My recollection of them, they just read the clearance, and didn't bounce all over. Either you have the tool not on right, or the adapter isn't the right one. Our kit as I recall, had all the adapters in the box, and a label on the cover telling the size spring they fit on. I would think someone out there (literature hoarder) has an old instruction/application sheet that could be copied.

[Crankster]

Well the whole valve & spring assembly is moving at idle, no way around that. I should have tried dropping the idle RPM down. It is the right model.

[packrat5]

Man, I wish I could see one again. It's been too many years. The tool should not jump around. It clamps to the retainer and the very top of the spring. The dial reads the top of the rocker arm.

[Crankster]

With the engine idling, how could it not bounce? I should maybe shoot some video. If you take a look at Gil's page over at squarebirds I linked to, he talks about this a little bit in that it "takes practice" to read to some degree. Other models like the 300 included a remote camera type switch to freeze the high point reading.

Instructions are sort of scarce, but I've found some parts online and squinted at some of the eBay auction photos that show others, lol. The whole unit sits on top of the valve spring retainer, the inner barrel foot goes between the rocker arm and valve stem and shows the clearance between them on the dial. BUT, even when the engine is at idle that cylinder's valve is moving up and down a few times a second or whatever. See where I'm going with that?

[Dominic Hide]

Crankster, your model has a large faced gauge that sits at 90 degrees to the valve top. It is also quite heavy and not balanced well and will indeed be difficult to read on an idling engine, if you could keep it on there. On the other hand Packrat5, you are remembering a model 300. While it uses the same barrel and retainer it is quite different in appearance. It has a much smaller and lighter gauge, but more importantly it is built with the face pointing straight up at the user. This means that instead of having to move your head/eyes up and down with the opening and closing of the valve the gauge now just moves down and back up and (as long as you have reasonably young eyes that can hold focus) is easy to read with the engine running.

I have used both but prefer the larger static version. Adjusting rockers that use screw and locking nuts on a running engine is more than my arthritic fingers can handle. Also the newer replacement interference adjuster is lighter and uses a smaller hex head than the original '57 pieces and are prone to breaking when trying to adjust with motor running.

I hope this helps explain the confusion.

[Crankster]

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I'm amazed that nowhere on the internet, as I can find anyway, has anybody scanned the instructions. At least not for this model. The 300 "Universal" instructions can be found online.

From what I was able to gather I thought they were all designed to be used at idle, or could be anyway. They do work great. I posted on another thread here, will be replacing valve springs, and will be taking a look at the rocker arms & rocker shaft for wear and galling. The rocker arms are getting hard to find or are pricey. The shop manual, in bold letters no less, sez not to grind the rocker tips.

[packrat5]

There you go. Someone has finally felt sorry for us, and jumped in. As I remember, the tool moved up and down of course, but didn't jump around. The idle also had to be set as low as possible to give you enough time between strokes. My boss was extremely adept at this, and could set them really fast, and at a high rpm too. I would turn down the idle as low as possible, and then the engine would often conk out while turning the locking type adjuster. I can still remember him bitching at me to go faster, and "turn the goddamn idle up kid" The oil light would be on all the while, and the mains would be clunking away. Even then, I never understood the reason to not pressurize the rocker shafts, and I once for grins pinched them shut on a job, and the oil light went out, and the bearings stopped clunking. He looked over at me, but never said a word. He knew what I had done. Man, I hated those engines! I have a somewhat warmer feeling about them now, but I think it's the "nostalgia factor". If I to work on them again on a daily basis, I think I would have found a different vocation. I left there in 63, and went to, you guessed it a Ford dealership. My God, more y-blocks! Only now a couple of things changed. First thing we didn't patch anything to "save the guy a couple of bucks". In went a Ford authorized rebuilt engine. The new oils were out, and that Rotunda stuff was phenomenal, and that was all we used. No more sludged up engines! Now those y-blocks required very little attention except oil changes. I switched my job designation from grease bag to new car prep. I got paid more than double what I was making, and never had to get dirty. Life was good.

[Oldmics]

I have a 300. Never used it on a running engine.

Oldmics

[Oldmics]

Smore

[Oldmics]

Fin

[Crankster]

Originally Posted by Oldmics

I have a 300. Never used it on a running engine.

Thanks for posting those pics! Much appreciated.

The instructions there allow that "Some mechanics prefer to adjust valve clearance with the engine stopped." That does sort of imply to me that they were designed to be used at idle. I looked at the 300 model for a while but by now they are often incomplete and wasn't sure exactly what barrels are required for Y blocks. And they often want too much $$. Found the 111 for under $50, which is at least reasonable.