Go Back   The Ford Barn > General Discussion > Model A (1928-31)

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-27-2019, 03:46 PM   #1
woofa.express
Senior Member
 
woofa.express's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Tocumwal, NSW, Australia
Posts: 1,159
Default Take a gander at this.

My buddy Phillip is in Oshkosh at the world renowned airshow. Here are 2 pictures he sent me. You will recognize the engine.
I don't understand why the builder of this aeroplane, serial number 0000000001 has positioned the radiator in the line of sight. His or her neck must be sore by the time they reach their destination from craning to see in front.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg model a engine 1.JPG (52.0 KB, 949 views)
File Type: jpg model a engine 2.JPG (53.6 KB, 830 views)
__________________
I know many things,
But I don't know everything,
Sometimes I forget things.

And there are times when I have a long memory.
woofa.express is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2019, 04:28 PM   #2
Dirtrack49
Senior Member
 
Dirtrack49's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Tehachapi California
Posts: 103
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

That airplane is a Pietenpol Air Camper. Was one of the early home built experimental aircraft circa 1932. Bernard Pietenpol, the original creator of this design, first had a single place model circa 1929 that used a Model T engine.
These aircraft have been built from plans and still are today, ever since Pietenpol started selling the plans way back when.
Most of these aircraft run more modern 4 cylinder opposed light aircraft engines. But the purist, prefer the original Model A engine with a high compression head. The radiator is positioned out of neccesity and is the original setup. Makes for a very warm ride in the summer!
Below is a pic of my Grega GN1 which is a modification of the same aircraft. I will probably go with an engine from a 1940's light aircraft vs. the Model A engine.
On the other side of my hangar is a pic of my 1946 J3 Cub and my Van's RV4.
Not only addicted to cars, I like airplanes too!
My wife tells me it would be easier to collect motorcycles. Please don't get me started.
Tom L.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Pietenpol.jpg (58.8 KB, 566 views)
File Type: jpg RV4 J3.jpg (51.0 KB, 536 views)

Last edited by Dirtrack49; 07-27-2019 at 04:50 PM. Reason: year model
Dirtrack49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Old 07-27-2019, 04:30 PM   #3
flatford39
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: NE Illinois
Posts: 496
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Love to see more pics of the engine area. There doesn't seem to be a fan so is there an auxiliary pump. Also the exhaust is intriguing. Why does number 4 only appear to have a muffler.
flatford39 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2019, 04:48 PM   #4
Patrick L.
Senior Member
 
Patrick L.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Upstate NY and western Florida
Posts: 5,889
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

I helped a friend with a Pietenpol and offered him an A engine. He chose a C series Continental which I think was a good choice, all things considered. As reliable as we know the A engine is, I doubt I'd strap my fanny in one with that engine.
Patrick L. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2019, 04:59 PM   #5
Dirtrack49
Senior Member
 
Dirtrack49's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Tehachapi California
Posts: 103
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Most guys put Continental A65, A75, or C85 engines in these aircraft. However, there are several with Corvair engines and just about anything else you can think of. I happen to have a Franklin 90hp that may end up in mine.
I live in the mountains and the density of altitude can be pretty scary in the summer. The more power the better.
Here's another pic of an A engine installation.
Tom L.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Piet rt ft.jpg (80.8 KB, 451 views)
Dirtrack49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2019, 05:02 PM   #6
woofa.express
Senior Member
 
woofa.express's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Tocumwal, NSW, Australia
Posts: 1,159
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtrack49 View Post
That airplane is a Pietenpol Air Camper. Was one of the early home built experimental aircraft circa 1932. Bernard Pietenpol, the original creator of this design, first had a single place model circa 1929 that used a Model T engine.
These aircraft have been built from plans and still are today, ever since Pietenpol started selling the plans way back when.
Most of these aircraft run more modern 4 cylinder opposed light aircraft engines. But the purist, prefer the original Model A engine with a high compression head. The radiator is positioned out of neccesity and is the original setup. Makes for a very warm ride in the summer!
Below is a pic of my Grega GN1 which is a modification of the same aircraft. I will probably go with an engine from a 1940's light aircraft vs. the Model A engine.
On the other side of my hangar is a pic of my 1949 J3 Cub and my Van's RV4.

Not only addicted to cars, I like airplanes too!
My wife tells me it would be easier to collect motorcycles. Please don't get me started.
Tom L.



Hi Tom, that was great. I have never seen even a picture of one in the past. I'd never even heard of one. I had assumed it was a recent build by "Uncle Guru", have I got the name correct. Donald Duck's uncle.? I had a beautiful Cub, gave it to my son and he traded it for a C180. I was disappointed but kept that to myself, after all I did tell him it was his aeroplane. I think the RV series are the best private planes in the world. My favourites being the 7 and 9. I have had 15 aeroplanes, mostly ag but have sold them all. My licence expires in 3 weeks and I don't plan on renewing it. I've had 51 years of cropdusting and feel I've had sufficient. Maybe I should start an album in this forum.
thanks for that welcome information on that Pietenpol. gary
Attached Images
File Type: jpg cub6.jpg (19.0 KB, 151 views)
__________________
I know many things,
But I don't know everything,
Sometimes I forget things.

And there are times when I have a long memory.
woofa.express is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2019, 05:12 PM   #7
woofa.express
Senior Member
 
woofa.express's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Tocumwal, NSW, Australia
Posts: 1,159
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by flatford39 View Post
Love to see more pics of the engine area. There doesn't seem to be a fan so is there an auxiliary pump. Also the exhaust is intriguing. Why does number 4 only appear to have a muffler.

Hi Flat ford. you will notice the engine is facing rear to the front and what you figured was a muffler was a hot air catchment and I figure it was for the carby to prevent or clear carb icing. It certainly wouldn't be for pilot heating for as Tom said it's fairly warm sitting directly behind the radiator.
Did you see Tom had one hanging up in his shed along with 2 other going aeroplanes. I just hadn't expected to learn of any others apart from the display at Oshkosh. That's amazing.
__________________
I know many things,
But I don't know everything,
Sometimes I forget things.

And there are times when I have a long memory.
woofa.express is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2019, 05:23 PM   #8
Dirtrack49
Senior Member
 
Dirtrack49's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Tehachapi California
Posts: 103
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Gary, don't stop flying!
I have been doing it for over 50 years and I am now 70. Hope I can go at least another 10 years.
I once met a fellow at Santa Monica airport circa 1970's, that flew in "on" a 1917 Curtis Pusher. He was 93 years old at the time!
Below some more pics. One looks like it is running a Corvair engine. The Brit plane is running what appears to be a Continental.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Pietenpol lake.jpg (60.1 KB, 287 views)
File Type: jpg Pietenpol.air.camper.g-buco a.jpg (34.0 KB, 266 views)
Dirtrack49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2019, 05:24 PM   #9
Tudortomnz
Senior Member
 
Tudortomnz's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Canterbury, New Zealand
Posts: 1,240
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Fantastic! Do the planes running other type engines have a radiator? [Is it necessary in a small plane?]. The A engine was apparently used because of the low rev. torque but you would need fail safe/back up ignition system!
Re not being able to see ahead, Charles Lindberg could not see directly ahead in Spirit of St Louis, tricky on take off & landing but he was a superb pilot. Cheers.
Tudortomnz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2019, 05:47 PM   #10
Dirtrack49
Senior Member
 
Dirtrack49's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Tehachapi California
Posts: 103
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Yet another Model A "Piet".
The only ones I have seen with radiators are with a Ford Model A engine producing hopefully 50 h.p. at sea level with a high compression head. At my altitude, I would never get off the ground in the summer. Even with a Continental A65 it would be scary. My Cub is running a C85 which can get me out of most mountain strips. Most everyone with old planes here in the mountains run at least 85 hp engines.
Tom L.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Piet Model A eng.jpg (74.0 KB, 373 views)
Dirtrack49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2019, 06:10 PM   #11
redmodelt
Senior Member
 
redmodelt's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Portland OR
Posts: 5,216
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

The Model T Ford Club of America has a Model T version in their museum.
__________________
I know the voices aren't real but damn they have some good ideas!
redmodelt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2019, 08:49 PM   #12
1946
Member
 
1946's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Tasmania Australia
Posts: 62
Smile Re: Take a gander at this.

Dose any one know what type magneto the pilot has on the motor.I would dearly love to get one for my Speedster build. I would also like the plans to the motor mods as they have a modified oil pressure system. There is one been built in Northern part of the state with a two spark plug head. I too am an aircraft owner / nut owning a English Auster Series J1, a small three seat ex army obvservation aircraft of 1946 vintage, and have a 1917 Henderson motorcycle under a slow rebuild. Wife says no more..... one aircraft-two Vintage cars-two motor bikes, and a couple of hit and miss motors....she may be right.
__________________
Tassie Devil
1946 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2019, 08:57 PM   #13
duke36
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,214
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Go on to the Pietenpole website: can purchase plans, etc. and get a lot of info.
duke36 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2019, 10:45 PM   #14
woofa.express
Senior Member
 
woofa.express's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Tocumwal, NSW, Australia
Posts: 1,159
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1946 View Post
Dose any one know what type magneto the pilot has on the motor.I would dearly love to get one for my Speedster build. I would also like the plans to the motor mods as they have a modified oil pressure system. There is one been built in Northern part of the state with a two spark plug head. I too am an aircraft owner / nut owning a English Auster Series J1, a small three seat ex army obvservation aircraft of 1946 vintage, and have a 1917 Henderson motorcycle under a slow rebuild. Wife says no more..... one aircraft-two Vintage cars-two motor bikes, and a couple of hit and miss motors....she may be right.


write a private message to me with your phone number. My son Dennis's in the process of overhauling a six cylinder continental and his old ones, which performed well are being replaced. I'll give you Dennis's phone number. I suspect they will be Bendix.
__________________
I know many things,
But I don't know everything,
Sometimes I forget things.

And there are times when I have a long memory.
woofa.express is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2019, 11:23 PM   #15
eagle
Senior Member
 
eagle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Eagle Bend, MN
Posts: 1,630
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

His or her neck must be sore by the time they reach their destination from craning to see in front
You don't look "out the front" you look along the side and downward when taking off or landing. Nothing to see directly ahead and above you except blue sky...if the ground is that direction you're in big trouble. I've flown behind an A engine in an old Piet. Plenty of leaking oil, JB weld on a frost crack etc. Plenty of power/lift. Best sounding airplane engine EVER.
__________________
"There are some that can destroy an anvil with a teaspoon and shouldn't be allowed to touch anything resembling a tool."
eagle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-28-2019, 01:09 AM   #16
Synchro909
Senior Member
 
Synchro909's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 5,245
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

This Model A had quite a significant racing history hereabouts in the day. It is stillabout and has twin ignition - magneto and coil.
https://www.justcars.com.au/cars-for...ter/JCM1461460
__________________
It is no burden to carry a little extra knowledge.
Synchro909 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-28-2019, 05:59 AM   #17
Gary/IA
Senior Member
 
Gary/IA's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Ellston, Iowa
Posts: 237
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtrack49 View Post
Gary, don't stop flying!
I have been doing it for over 50 years and I am now 70. Hope I can go at least another 10 years.
I once met a fellow at Santa Monica airport circa 1970's, that flew in "on" a 1917 Curtis Pusher. He was 93 years old at the time!
Below some more pics. One looks like it is running a Corvair engine. The Brit plane is running what appears to be a Continental.

Ernie Smith, Red Oak, Iowa, at 100 still had his license and and was flying. He is now in Assisted Living and has gave up flying. That was a couple of years ago. He was the oldest licensed pilot in US.



About 60 years ago, he took me up in my "47 J3 Cub and did a loop, scared the heck out of me.
Gary/IA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-28-2019, 06:25 AM   #18
Benson
Senior Member
 
Benson's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Snork Key
Posts: 2,090
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

delete

Last edited by Benson; 07-28-2019 at 07:13 AM.
Benson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-28-2019, 11:43 AM   #19
Jim Brierley
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Temecula, CA
Posts: 3,366
Default Re: Take a gander at this.

The Piet was built during the depression years, engine choice was because of cost and availability, plus it runs happiest in the right RPM's for prop efficiency. His first version was the 2-place "air camper", later built the single-place "Scout" version, Model T powered, because of requests for one that could be built even cheaper. You think it scary to fly? these engines were raced, as synchro said, successfully and reliably for many years, even at Indy, with a T powered entry finishing in 5th place one year!
Jim Brierley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-28-2019, 02:16 PM   #20
woofa.express
Senior Member
 
woofa.express's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Tocumwal, NSW, Australia
Posts: 1,159
Default Re: Take a gander at this.



Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Eagle Bend, MN
Posts: 1,438


Re: Take a gander at this.
His or her neck must be sore by the time they reach their destination from craning to see in front
You don't look "out the front" you look along the side and downward when taking off or landing. Nothing to see directly ahead and above you except blue sky...if the ground is that direction you're in big trouble



I question my technique ?
maybe I've been doing it wrong all my life. I always figured if the trees are getting bigger I am descending and if they are getting smaller I'm ascending. it's always worked for me.
__________________
I know many things,
But I don't know everything,
Sometimes I forget things.

And there are times when I have a long memory.

Last edited by woofa.express; 07-28-2019 at 03:35 PM.
woofa.express is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:20 PM.