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Old 01-12-2021, 01:34 PM   #1
alexiskai
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Default Insurance policy w/o liability?

My insurance policy at American Collectors is being shifted to a new carrier partner and I wanted to take the opportunity to shop around. I have liability coverage (but not collision/comprehensive) through USAA. I don't want to pay for liability twice, but both Hagerty and Grundy won't sell a policy without liability.

Anyone know a carrier that'll sell such a policy? I can always stick with my current arrangement but I thought I'd ask around. For reference, my current policy is $100/yr, which is hard to beat if liability is bundled.
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Old 01-12-2021, 02:00 PM   #2
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Default Re: Insurance policy w/o liability?

Hagerty is a little over the hundred(depending on how much you value the car).
Unless you're strapped for cash I would just go ahead and get it. JMO
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Old 01-12-2021, 02:56 PM   #3
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nobody is as inexpensive as JC Taylor. they are the largest for a reason.......
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Old 01-12-2021, 08:18 PM   #4
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Default Re: Insurance policy w/o liability?

Mine is with American Family insurance. Everything including stated value of $34,000. $200.00 per year. Includes towing, rental car if needed.
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Old 01-13-2021, 08:19 AM   #5
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Default Re: Insurance policy w/o liability?

I agree with you not wanting to double pay, but like the previous answers I dont think that full coverage with a specialty carrier is all that expensive. The one thing you may want to double check on is if forbid, there is an accident whom will pay? I had a fire and double coverage (business ins. and personal ins.) and it got a little tricky over who payed for what. I know its apples and oranges but...........
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Old 01-13-2021, 09:36 AM   #6
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Default Re: Insurance policy w/o liability?

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I agree with you not wanting to double pay, but like the previous answers I dont think that full coverage with a specialty carrier is all that expensive. The one thing you may want to double check on is if forbid, there is an accident whom will pay? I had a fire and double coverage (business ins. and personal ins.) and it got a little tricky over who payed for what. I know its apples and oranges but...........
I agree, the double coverage and potential for passing the buck is what I specifically want to avoid.
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Old 01-13-2021, 10:55 AM   #7
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Default Re: Insurance policy w/o liability?

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I agree, the double coverage and potential for passing the buck is what I specifically want to avoid.
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Old 01-13-2021, 11:44 AM   #8
BRENT in 10-uh-C
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I agree, the double coverage and potential for passing the buck is what I specifically want to avoid.
Colin, I have actually encountered this in my work with customers who had a casualty claim. Passing of the buck is not done. If anything, they are all too excited that you had double coverage. The only thing that makes this unlawful is if you try to make two claims without the other insurer's knowledge to collect additional monies.

What I have noticed is the insurer with the oldest date on their policy typically takes the lead (-ie: sends the adjuster, asks the questions, sends all the forms). The way I understand it, they typically subrogate to the other insurer for their percentage of the claim. Where we typically see double coverage done is when someone has a car that they need 'XX' amount of coverage and the insurer will only go maybe 60% or so on agreed value. I don't know how that is handled on total-loss claims though. These would be questions for the underwriter.

On a side-note, it seems the industry has begun to swing more to Values established by the total amount of the purchase price and proof of parts purchased. In other words, for a fine-point Roadster that is purchased for $5k and most of the parts were restored by the hobbyist instead of purchasing repro is more difficult to get a fair-market value. In the example of my shop where 90% of the costs for a restoration is billed as labor, it is even more difficult. To make this even more understandable (???), suppose on my invoice I list 40 hours @ $100 per hour to completely rebuild and assemble an engine, and I also list $1,000 of parts used. This totals $5k. In this scenario, they will use the $1k for parts to establish a value but not the $4k of labor. On the other hand, if I were to list $6,500 for 'Complete Rebuilt Engine' in the parts section, the value will be increased by the $6,500 instead of the $1k. So for me, if on the invoice I list each component (steering column, rear end assy., front axle assy., brake system, etc) as an inflated, -but realistic number, it increases the value to the Insurer instead of listing all of the labor it took along with parts.


As far as a policy that does not carry liability, I would think a museum would be the one to get a second opinion on. Typically their vehicles are on static display without the need for a liability policy.
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Old 01-13-2021, 11:52 AM   #9
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Default Re: Insurance policy w/o liability?

If you oil your change purse it wont squeek to much when you open it.A policy for a 100 or so bucks, even if it laps over existing coverage (not a bad thing) for your pride and joy.. I couldn't write the check fast enough.
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Old 01-13-2021, 11:56 AM   #10
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Colin, I have actually encountered this in my work with customers who had a casualty claim. Passing of the buck is not done. If anything, they are all too excited that you had double coverage. The only thing that makes this unlawful is if you try to make two claims without the other insurer's knowledge to collect additional monies.

What I have noticed is the insurer with the oldest date on their policy typically takes the lead (-ie: sends the adjuster, asks the questions, sends all the forms). The way I understand it, they typically subrogate to the other insurer for their percentage of the claim. Where we typically see double coverage done is when someone has a car that they need 'XX' amount of coverage and the insurer will only go maybe 60% or so on agreed value. I don't know how that is handled on total-loss claims though. These would be questions for the underwriter.

On a side-note, it seems the industry has begun to swing more to Values established by the total amount of the purchase price and proof of parts purchased. In other words, for a fine-point Roadster that is purchased for $5k and most of the parts were restored by the hobbyist instead of purchasing repro is more difficult to get a fair-market value. In the example of my shop where 90% of the costs for a restoration is billed as labor, it is even more difficult. To make this even more understandable (???), suppose on my invoice I list 40 hours @ $100 per hour to completely rebuild and assemble an engine, and I also list $1,000 of parts used. This totals $5k. In this scenario, they will use the $1k for parts to establish a value but not the $4k of labor. On the other hand, if I were to list $6,500 for 'Complete Rebuilt Engine' in the parts section, the value will be increased by the $6,500 instead of the $1k. So for me, if on the invoice I list each component (steering column, rear end assy., front axle assy., brake system, etc) as an inflated, -but realistic number, it increases the value to the Insurer instead of listing all of the labor it took along with parts.


As far as a policy that does not carry liability, I would think a museum would be the one to get a second opinion on. Typically their vehicles are on static display without the need for a liability policy.
So basically no one wants to pay for quality goods and services.. this is why our hobby suffers. Mostly the owners don't want to pay up for goods and services.. and it seems the insurers don't want to either..
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Old 01-13-2021, 12:47 PM   #11
BRENT in 10-uh-C
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So basically no one wants to pay for quality goods and services.. this is why our hobby suffers. Mostly the owners don't want to pay up for goods and services.. and it seems the insurers don't want to either..

John, I think that is a pretty accurate statement.

The leading issue when I deal with an Insurer is "replacement value". What is it going to cost to replace my vehicle with one exactly the same condition mine was 15 seconds before the casualty.

The textbook response from the insurer is always we watch the prices of Hemmings, eBay, and other sales venues for these cars, so we have a pretty good idea what the realistic market value is. My response is always these cars listed are generally "used vehicles with deficiencies". The vehicle my customer wants you to insure has brand new paint, new upholstery, totally rebuilt mechanicals throughout, and other similar items where it really isn't comparing like items. I tell them credit me the price for the 'used car' and give me the money to replace the paint with new, replace the upholstery, and rebuild all the mechanicals, and we are good. That is how we have dealt with underwriters.

Ironically, I can give them an invoice for the same exact vehicle that has $60k worth of labor and $20k of parts (-total of $80k) or $60k worth of parts listed and only $20k of labor, ...and they will agree to a higher value on the invoice with the higher parts total even though both vehicles are the exact same, and the invoice amount is the exact same total.
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Old 01-13-2021, 01:29 PM   #12
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Default Re: Insurance policy w/o liability?

Thanks folks, I got the Hagerty policy. Extra $60 a year but worth it for the roadside assistance and the absence of hassle.
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Old 01-13-2021, 04:11 PM   #13
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Default Re: Insurance policy w/o liability?

I asked Allstate to add my A to the regular policy. They just bought a Hagerty full coverage policy and added it on. Said that was cheaper than adding a new vehicle to the policy.,
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Old 01-15-2021, 10:11 PM   #14
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Default Re: Insurance policy w/o liability?

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Mine is with American Family insurance. Everything including stated value of $34,000. $200.00 per year. Includes towing, rental car if needed.
Check your policy again. "Stated value" can have depreciation. You need "Agreed Value" policy that will pay that amount if the damages are up to that amount. Big difference between "stated" and "agreed"!!!!! I have my Model A and 64 Corvette with the National Corvette Museum. They write coverage thru American Modern.
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Old 01-16-2021, 01:03 PM   #15
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Default Re: Insurance policy w/o liability?

I've always went with agreed value insurance on my old cars that I've restored main reason if I start with a vehicle with a purchase price on title of $3000. and do the work myself I don't always have documentation to prove stated value . Have not had any claims but friends have had good luck with Grundy and Hagerty .
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Old 01-16-2021, 06:40 PM   #16
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Default Re: Insurance policy w/o liability?

I can’t imagine having two insurance companies trying to settle the same accident claim.
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Old 01-16-2021, 10:31 PM   #17
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I canít imagine having two insurance companies trying to settle the same accident claim.
Basically one writes the repair estimate. The Estimator submits it to the second company. Basically they split and each pays for half up to their exposure limits.
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Old 01-16-2021, 11:23 PM   #18
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Basically one writes the repair estimate. The Estimator submits it to the second company. Basically they split and each pays for half up to their exposure limits.
And what happens if they don’t agree? One wants to write it off and the other says fix it ?
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Old 01-17-2021, 04:21 PM   #19
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Default Re: Insurance policy w/o liability?

I had an incident with a modern car several years ago with Insurance.

Young girl flying down an icy street rams into my car parked along the curb. Really does a lot of damage.

My insurance company (somebody in Seattle) calls and says they are going to total the car. The next day, same company, I get a call from somebody in Indianapolis says 'we are going to rebuild your car. Where do you want the work done?' and I say OK, tell them where to fix it, they flatbed it there and the car is fixed.

A few days after I get the car home the Seattle office (remember his is MY insurance company) calls and starts bawling me out for having the car repaired. I told them 'That is your problem. You'd better call (gave Seattle the name and number of the Indianapolis office that had called) and YOU can yell at them' and hung up.

Never heard from anyone again

In response to the original post about Liability, before I got Hagerty and had my regular car insurance cover the old cars, I'd call in October and drop all but Comprehensive, and then call again in about April and put it back on full coverage for the driving season. With Hagerty (or Grundy they are good too, or JC Taylor or other old car insurers) you are covered 365 days a year. And the price with Hagerty was less money than what I did before PLUS my everyday insurance did not have 'Agreed Value' you are at their mercy!
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Old 01-18-2021, 12:44 AM   #20
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McMimmcs, Talk about agreeing. Your profile says you are in Pigeon Forge, yet this is floating about. https://www.sarnialambton.on.ca/busi...ne-immigration
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