Lower (internal) water pump bolt, snapped.

[FordCustom]

Six sided socket, extension, and a 3/8" ratchet. It barely took any force at all. Certainly less than the other side, which came right out. If it was stuck enough to snap the head off, then how bad is going to be getting the rest out? I looked up a few pictures of flatheads, to find one with the pump already off. It "looks" like you can get to the back side, sort of? Through the hole in the block. I could be wrong though.

I was happy and about to send my pumps to FL. Now this. Oh well, I can try the old standbys. PB, heat, and welding something to it, which may free it up. It broke right below the head, so there's something to work with at least. I always use easy outs as a last resort, since I have never had much success with them. They either slip or break off as well.

Welcome to flatheads, am I right?

[ford38v8]

Check to see if it is stainless before you weld on it.

[uncle max]

Originally Posted by ford38v8

Check to see if it is stainless before you weld on it.

It matters not. Use an E-312 stainless electrode or ER-312 tig rod. Either way, 3/32" diameter is about right.
The 312 carries 120,000 lbs tensile and nearly 40% elongation.
It has never failed me.
Be sure to let it cool before undoing it.
Most welding supply stores have 1 lb tubes.
UTP 65, Eutectic 680, Xergon Xtractalloy, Rockmount Brutus, Allstate Stud Plus, MG 600, to name a few. All glorified 312 alloy.

[Rand]

Easy out = bad bad word
Don't ask me how I know
Good luck!
Randy

[40cpe]

I recently had the same experience. I welded a nut on it twice, only to have it twist again just below the nut. My theory is that it was a soft bolt.

You can't see the bolt through the hole in the block. It is drilled/threaded in the casting.

If welding a nut on it doesn't work bolt the pump back on and find the largest bit that will fit the hole in the pump. Drill just deep enough for the point to find the center of the bolt. Use that center and graduating larger bits to drill enough to pick out the remaining threads.

[alan]

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sounds like there is enough left to place a larger nut over the protruding bolt and weld this nut to the stub--heat from welding will loosen the grip and the welded on nut will give you something to turn--when you re-install be sure to use a neverseize of some kind on the thread and use a SS bolt if you can find one

[JM 35 Sedan]

Had the same thing happen on a 59 engine. Hex head of bolt snapped off leaving ~ 3/8" - 1/2" of the bolt sticking out of the block. Heated the cast iron around the bolt and applied some candle wax. Let things cool down. Applied heat again around the bolt, clamped vice grips to what was left of the bolt, and threaded it out of the block. When you put pumps back on, use a good quality stainless steel bolt in that location with anti seize on threads.

[FordCustom]

Well, both of the bolts were pretty rusty on the head, so I don't believe they were stainless? Also the one that broke was a 9/16" head, and the one that came out was 1/2" head. The exposed bolts all turn easily, thank goodness.

As far as welders go. All I have at the moment is a simple mig welder.

[FordCustom]

I will try a magnet on the broken head.. For the replacement I was thinking grade 8 with a good amount of anti sieze, Maybe some black permatex around the head. Allowed to "harden" though. That stuff will seal anything. Never really had a leak on any water related automotive job I've done with it. It might could keep the coolant from entering the threads again.

[Henry Hopper]

http://www.drapertoolbox.co.uk/drape...tud-4307-87936

Now the head is off it becomes a stud, how about trying a stud extractor?it can get a good purchase down the shaft of the broken bolt and may be the answer to your problem.

[FordCustom]

I don't know how much of the bolt is sticking out yet, but that might could work.

I have another question? How do you keep the engine supported while you have the pumps off? I was thinking some lengths of 4x4 standing vertical under the manifolds?

[G.M.]

Block of wood under the FRONT EDGE of the pan with a jack. G.M.

[FordCustom]

I tried to jack it up on the front of the pan, and I noticed the pan starting to crush before it lifted off of the mounts, so I gave up on that. Jacking on the front corner of the pan only lifted one side. This is going to be for several days, while the pumps are off being rebuilt. I NEVER trust a hydraulic jack to hold something that long, personal experience with a jack collapsing slowly overnight. Maybe some jack stands on the exhaust manifolds, with blocks of wood underneath?

[FordCustom]

The bolt is definitely steel. A magnet snapped to it immediately. I guess if all else fails, I can drill it, and tap new (slightly larger) threads in the block.

[uncle max]

Originally Posted by FordCustom

Well, both of the bolts were pretty rusty on the head, so I don't believe they were stainless? Also the one that broke was a 9/16" head, and the one that came out was 1/2" head. The exposed bolts all turn easily, thank goodness.

As far as welders go. All I have at the moment is a simple mig welder.

At this point, you won't hurt anything.
Go ahead and try your MIG. The difficult thing will be holding the nut in place while you weld it. Run it hot, but be sure to let it cool before you try undoing it. A good time for a bit of candle wax too.

[G.M.]

Originally Posted by FordCustom

I tried to jack it up on the front of the pan, and I noticed the pan starting to crush before it lifted off of the mounts, so I gave up on that. Jacking on the front corner of the pan only lifted one side. This is going to be for several days, while the pumps are off being rebuilt. I NEVER trust a hydraulic jack to hold something that long, personal experience with a jack collapsing slowly overnight. Maybe some jack stands on the exhaust manifolds, with blocks of wood underneath?

You use a 2X4 about 12"s long and put the long end across the front EDGE of the pan where it starts to curve up toward the pulley. It won't dent the pan. A short block back on the flat part of the pan will dent it. I have done this hundreds of times and never bent a pan. G.M.

[G.M.]

Max even if it was a SS bolt it can be welded with steel MIG wire. 40 years ago I had a trailer repair company that was streatching steel tank trailers. They were putting a stainless center section about 8' long in the center and were trying to use SS MIG wire which wasn't running to good out of position. We tried Page AS-18 steel wire and it did a good job. The welds were lab tested for bend and pull tests and was approved and that's what was used on a number of trailers. Rust wasn't a concern and there is a mixture of SS in the the weld. G.M.

[BillM]

Instead of welding a nut directly to the stub end it might be easier to weld a thick washer to it and then weld a nut to the washer.

[ford38v8]

Fordcustom, apparently you're not reading the replies from those who know the answers. Read post #7 and follow John's advice regarding the new bolt. Use his candle wax advice before welding also. Use a block of wood under the front of the pan as GM advised. These answers are all tried and true methods. Why ask questions if you disregard the expert answers received?

[FordCustom]

Well, I've always been one to go my own path. Not that it always pays off, but just the way I am. I do COMPLETELY appreciate the advice, and I ended up with a block of wood dead center on the front of the pan, just as he advised. Common sense prevailed after all.

With that said, it's time to crack open a beer!!

I bought one of the spiraled easy outs, drilled the 7/64's hole, and after a short while, snap! Just as I suspected would happen. So, I drilled that out with the original size bit, then gradually got larger bits out, and so on. Well, the remnants of the old bolt still refused to budge. I remembered finding an ancient looking box of 3/8"x16 taps in the garage. This was my long time S/O's Fathers garage at one point, and he had some useful things in there.

I looked up the drill bit size(5/16's) and drilled it all the way. I ran the tap in until it stopped thinking this would NEVER work in a million years. It was going in WAY too easy, or so I thought. I cleaned out the hole after screwing the tap out, then used a washer laden bolt into the hole. Apparently the tap went in that easy, because it went straight into the old threads, and cleaned them out. I tightened the bolt thinking for SURE it would strip. It tightened until I dared not push it any further, and held!!

Man that was a nail biter, I can still taste the PB Blaster, haha. Thank you ALL for the advice given. I seemed to have dodged a .50 caliper bullet on this one!