The Ford Barn

Hot Rod Reverend · 10-22-2010, 08:45 PM

http://s249.photobucket.com/albums/g...t=100_4309.mp4

The above link will take you to a video of my 292 running with open headers and a VS57 blower set up for a 55 or 56 Ford passenger car. Plans are to install it into a 55 Sunliner as a mild custom. Is anyone on the forum running this kind of setup in their 55 or 56? I have a couple of questions about fuel delivery and overall setup.

When I finally put the engine under load, I know that fuel delivery will be a problem. The fuel pressure needs to be about 2-3psi above the boost pressure, I believe. My main concern is not overpowering the teapot's needle and seat. I have modified the carb per Paxtons' instructions concerning the pressurization, bigger jets and passageways, etc, so we are good there. I have a new FE Holley fuel pump that flows 9psi, but how do I regulate that? And will I need more?

I have been told that I should use something like the "Mileage Minder" (an AMC or Mopar 60's fuel delivery part that regulated flow according to engine vacuum, I think). Can this be boost referenced to work? Or should I hook the vacuum port to the vacuum port on the rear of the teapot?

Also, just what are these things "supposed" to sound like? I can hear a slight whine, and at 4000 rpm, the blower puts out 3.5 psi according to my gauge (this is in hi boost, which I did in spurts not wanting to lean out the carb). I did take the blower apart to replace the large O rings that were pretty hard, though not cracked. The casing would leak just a little bit. Now there are no leaks at all, and the interior of the casing was already super clean.

This setup was to get all the parts together (a 2 year process), and to see if I could at least get it to run. I guess I surprised myself!

Future plans are to install a 312 crank, a blower cam, hi lift rockers, 471 heads (thanks Mike!), and put a T85 with R11 overdrive behind it. Thanks to Frank Lydell of Rockford, MI, too. He has been a big help in my search for parts and general knowledge.

Merlin · 10-23-2010, 06:18 AM

Very nice!

38 coupe · 10-23-2010, 07:56 AM

The old standby to get proper fuel pressure was to "boost reference" the stock fuel pump. The bottom of a stock fuel pump (single action, not dual action with vacuum pump built in) has one or more holes in it. These holes keep the area under the pump diaphragm from developing either a vacuum or a pressure; air can run in and out of the area under the diaphragm depending on whether the diaphragm is up or down. If this area has the same pressure as the blower is producing, then you can pump fuel higher than this pressure. If more than one hole is present, solder all but one closed. Drill out and tap the last hole with a small pipe tap. Run a line from the carb hat to this tapped hole. This is best done with the fuel pump disassembled at put in a new diaphragm.

50 merc · 10-23-2010, 09:06 AM

If it were me I would be installing an electric fuel pump and an adjustable regulator. And if you are not converted to 12volt they do make 6volt pumps, This should not be much different than running a blower on anything else that is running a carb.

Ole Don · 10-23-2010, 09:31 AM

I'll share what I learned. My 312 ran out of fuel in third gear at the HAMB drags. I installed a small rectangle pulse pump. It worked great when the car hadnt been run for a while, instead of grinding for 30 seconds, it would start in about two turns. It made little difference in racing. I pulled the fuel tank. The stock 5/16 fuel line screws in to a bulkhead fitting soldered in at the factory. The inside of the bulkhead fitting would not pass a 3/16 drill!!! I plugged the stock hole and made a new one at the top of the tank. I ran a 3/8 line from inside the tank to the new Holley type pump mounted just ahead of the rear axle, then new 3/8 line to the stock truck 292 mechanical engine fuel pump, then to a Holley regulator, and to the carb. The car no longer runs out of fuel. I can use the electric whenever I want, for primmng or racing, the mechanical pulls through it fine.

50 merc · 10-23-2010, 10:11 AM

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I agree with Ole Don and yes it is better for the pump to push not suck so location is important. he could always swap out carbs as well

Hot Rod Reverend · 10-24-2010, 06:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 38 coupe

The old standby to get proper fuel pressure was to "boost reference" the stock fuel pump. The bottom of a stock fuel pump (single action, not dual action with vacuum pump built in) has one or more holes in it. These holes keep the area under the pump diaphragm from developing either a vacuum or a pressure; air can run in and out of the area under the diaphragm depending on whether the diaphragm is up or down. If this area has the same pressure as the blower is producing, then you can pump fuel higher than this pressure. If more than one hole is present, solder all but one closed. Drill out and tap the last hole with a small pipe tap. Run a line from the carb hat to this tapped hole. This is best done with the fuel pump disassembled at put in a new diaphragm.

Referencing the original pump was an idea that I had...but I bought that Holley fuel pump to give me all the pressure I would need (no more than 8-9 psi) at the carb. Right now, the engine has the original dual pump installed, and of course, it works fine with no load on the engine. I would imagine that once we have a load, I will need more fuel delivery. I would also have to rebuild that old fuel pump (been a year or two since I did that, but I know the parts can be expensive). Would you happen to know what the psi limit is on that style of pump?

50 Merc - my question is about regulating the fuel flow. Running an original teapot carb (I am trying to get the look of a period 50's supercharged engine) I am concerned about overpowering the teapot. Most regulators are only good for one psi setting. I need something that would adjust as I needed more fuel flow, so that I am not flooding my needle/seat at idle. Any good ideas on that one?

Ole Don - Moving to a 3/8" fuel delivery line is certainly not out of the question, neither is modifying the fuel tank. I will keep that in consideration too.

Is anyone currently running a blower like this one?

Dominic Hide · 10-24-2010, 07:45 PM

I ran my '57 with three 94's inside a pressure box for several years. To solve the fuel supply problem I used a pump from an FE with an extra spring inside the stock one. This gave a constant 10 lbs of pressure, more than enough to overcome the 5 lb the McCulloch makes. To stop this pressure from overcoming the needle and seat at idle and low demand I ran a relief return line to the gas tank. The fuel will take the path of least resistance and the 1/16 hole in the top of the filter supplies that path. (See first picture.) I have not driven the car in its current two fours configuration, but it starts and idles fine with the same fuel supply system in place.

10-22-2010, 08:45 PM	#1
Hot Rod Reverend Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Lancaster, CA Posts: 917	VS57 Y block eye candy http://s249.photobucket.com/albums/g...t=100_4309.mp4 The above link will take you to a video of my 292 running with open headers and a VS57 blower set up for a 55 or 56 Ford passenger car. Plans are to install it into a 55 Sunliner as a mild custom. Is anyone on the forum running this kind of setup in their 55 or 56? I have a couple of questions about fuel delivery and overall setup. When I finally put the engine under load, I know that fuel delivery will be a problem. The fuel pressure needs to be about 2-3psi above the boost pressure, I believe. My main concern is not overpowering the teapot's needle and seat. I have modified the carb per Paxtons' instructions concerning the pressurization, bigger jets and passageways, etc, so we are good there. I have a new FE Holley fuel pump that flows 9psi, but how do I regulate that? And will I need more? I have been told that I should use something like the "Mileage Minder" (an AMC or Mopar 60's fuel delivery part that regulated flow according to engine vacuum, I think). Can this be boost referenced to work? Or should I hook the vacuum port to the vacuum port on the rear of the teapot? Also, just what are these things "supposed" to sound like? I can hear a slight whine, and at 4000 rpm, the blower puts out 3.5 psi according to my gauge (this is in hi boost, which I did in spurts not wanting to lean out the carb). I did take the blower apart to replace the large O rings that were pretty hard, though not cracked. The casing would leak just a little bit. Now there are no leaks at all, and the interior of the casing was already super clean. This setup was to get all the parts together (a 2 year process), and to see if I could at least get it to run. I guess I surprised myself! Future plans are to install a 312 crank, a blower cam, hi lift rockers, 471 heads (thanks Mike!), and put a T85 with R11 overdrive behind it. Thanks to Frank Lydell of Rockford, MI, too. He has been a big help in my search for parts and general knowledge. __________________ Lancaster, California Visit hotrodreverend.com to view hundreds of pictures and videos of the build of the 1955 Ford Club Sedan! Last edited by Hot Rod Reverend; 10-22-2010 at 08:51 PM.

10-23-2010, 06:18 AM	#2
Merlin Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Inman,SC Posts: 192	Re: VS57 Y block eye candy Very nice!

10-23-2010, 07:56 AM	#3
38 coupe Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: South Texas Posts: 1,651	Re: VS57 Y block eye candy The old standby to get proper fuel pressure was to "boost reference" the stock fuel pump. The bottom of a stock fuel pump (single action, not dual action with vacuum pump built in) has one or more holes in it. These holes keep the area under the pump diaphragm from developing either a vacuum or a pressure; air can run in and out of the area under the diaphragm depending on whether the diaphragm is up or down. If this area has the same pressure as the blower is producing, then you can pump fuel higher than this pressure. If more than one hole is present, solder all but one closed. Drill out and tap the last hole with a small pipe tap. Run a line from the carb hat to this tapped hole. This is best done with the fuel pump disassembled at put in a new diaphragm.

10-23-2010, 09:06 AM	#4
50 merc Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Ontario Canada Posts: 67	Re: VS57 Y block eye candy If it were me I would be installing an electric fuel pump and an adjustable regulator. And if you are not converted to 12volt they do make 6volt pumps, This should not be much different than running a blower on anything else that is running a carb.

10-23-2010, 09:31 AM	#5
Ole Don Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: St. Michael, Minnesota Posts: 1,713	Re: VS57 Y block eye candy I'll share what I learned. My 312 ran out of fuel in third gear at the HAMB drags. I installed a small rectangle pulse pump. It worked great when the car hadnt been run for a while, instead of grinding for 30 seconds, it would start in about two turns. It made little difference in racing. I pulled the fuel tank. The stock 5/16 fuel line screws in to a bulkhead fitting soldered in at the factory. The inside of the bulkhead fitting would not pass a 3/16 drill!!! I plugged the stock hole and made a new one at the top of the tank. I ran a 3/8 line from inside the tank to the new Holley type pump mounted just ahead of the rear axle, then new 3/8 line to the stock truck 292 mechanical engine fuel pump, then to a Holley regulator, and to the carb. The car no longer runs out of fuel. I can use the electric whenever I want, for primmng or racing, the mechanical pulls through it fine.

10-23-2010, 10:11 AM	#6
50 merc Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Ontario Canada Posts: 67	Re: VS57 Y block eye candy Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) I agree with Ole Don and yes it is better for the pump to push not suck so location is important. he could always swap out carbs as well

10-24-2010, 07:45 PM	#8
Dominic Hide Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 63	Re: VS57 Y block eye candy I ran my '57 with three 94's inside a pressure box for several years. To solve the fuel supply problem I used a pump from an FE with an extra spring inside the stock one. This gave a constant 10 lbs of pressure, more than enough to overcome the 5 lb the McCulloch makes. To stop this pressure from overcoming the needle and seat at idle and low demand I ran a relief return line to the gas tank. The fuel will take the path of least resistance and the 1/16 hole in the top of the filter supplies that path. (See first picture.) I have not driven the car in its current two fours configuration, but it starts and idles fine with the same fuel supply system in place.