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Old 10-12-2021, 09:55 AM   #1
Pech33
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Default No Thermostats

Removed all the peripheral components in preparation for pulling the engine from my 40 convertible and I found no thermostats. No wonder it never got the temperature gauge to move very far. My question is, what is the benefit of not having thermostats. When I replace the antifreeze, what is the correct mixture?
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Old 10-12-2021, 10:38 AM   #2
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Default Re: No Thermostats

The correct ratio is 1:1.

There are nearly as many opinions about thermostats as oil choices.
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Old 10-12-2021, 11:24 AM   #3
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Default Re: No Thermostats

Many opinions, but I believe there is only one correct one. Ford put them in initially, so there has to be a good reason, because they did not waste money on things that were not necessary. If the rest of your cooling system (clean block and good radiator) is in good shape, properly functioning thermostats will not cause it to overheat. If your radiator is partially clogged or your block is half full of crud, removing them may allow the engine to overheat a little less, but it is not addressing the actual problem. It's kind of like cutting your finger and putting a band-aid on your toe. Running an engine that has a properly functioning cooling system with no thermostats will cause the engine to run too cool, which will cause sludge and other problems.

Run 'em, and if it overheats, it means that the rest of the cooling system needs attention.
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Old 10-12-2021, 01:59 PM   #4
1931 flamingo
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Default Re: No Thermostats

My 40 has no stats and warms up to mid gauge after running for a while. Temp does increase if I'm doing 60 MPH or pulling a long hill, cools right down after the hill.
Paul in CT
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Old 10-12-2021, 03:09 PM   #5
51woodie
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Default Re: No Thermostats

I have 180 stats in my '46 Coupe, 59AB, and it runs at 180 pretty much steady, and warms up quickly. In reading some posts, I found my fan is a six blade, rather than the standard four blade, which I'm sure helps with the cooling. Kind of wondered why it sounded a bit noisy at revs when accelerating, so now I know it's fan noise.
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Old 10-12-2021, 03:35 PM   #6
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Default Re: No Thermostats

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The ratio of antifreeze to water depends on the area where you live and the temperature you can expect to get down to in the winter. The antifreeze containers will recommend a ratio for protection to various low temps. We have mild winters and my cars are garaged so I use a miserly 3:1 mix.
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Old 10-12-2021, 06:46 PM   #7
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Default Re: No Thermostats

anti freeze mix will depend on the brand type and your location follow the directions on the pack theres just to many out there to say do this or that . thermostats well that question goes around so many times it should be dizzy personally im with Tubman ford fitted them and henry didnt spend a cent he didnt have to also after 45 years as a mechanic wouldnt run with out them they do so much more than just control temp . If it overheats you got bigger problems that need to be addressed
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Old 10-12-2021, 06:56 PM   #8
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Default Re: No Thermostats



Extra Instruments in "51 woodie's" 1946 Ford Sedan Coupe.
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Old 10-12-2021, 06:59 PM   #9
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Default Re: No Thermostats

I like running wo thermos. biggest advantage is warming up engine in winter, otherwise I will argue they are useless.....

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Old 10-13-2021, 07:32 AM   #10
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Default Re: No Thermostats

Thermostats are good. If it overheats with thermostats fitted it normally isn't the fault of the thermostat.
They can fail though and if that is the case removal of the stat will get you home.
But if the stats are good having them in place is a good idea.
Mart.
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Old 10-13-2021, 09:51 AM   #11
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Default Re: No Thermostats

Are those gauges 6 volt or are they 12 volt “stepped up” to run on 6 with a converter?
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Old 10-13-2021, 10:48 AM   #12
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Default Re: No Thermostats

The pro/cons of thermostats is similar to the pros/cons of getting vaccinated for Covid 19, don't confuse me with facts, I have my mind made up.
When I went through mechanics school in the early 1940's I can clearly recall the subject of engine heat, 180 degrees was considered to be the optimum operating temp for all vehicles.
Prior to the 1950's, anti-freeze was generally alcohol based, alcohol boils at 180 degrees so the norm was to drain the anti-freeze in the spring and take out the thermostats, in the fall the stats were put back in and anti-freeze in lieu of water was put into the engine. The common thinking was that the thermostats were only needed for 'the heater'.. Sound familar!
I can clearly remember when I was a teenager working in service stations how hard it was to drain the oil, the oil was so contaminated with sludge it was thicker than molasses, and would burn the skin on your arm if you did not have long sleeves on.
Hmmmm, Preaching to the choir again Bill.
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Old 10-13-2021, 12:25 PM   #13
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Default Re: No Thermostats

Pech33. The gauges are Stewart Warner. The temp has a tube running from the back of the gauge to a sensor in the left cylinder head. The vacuum gauge is tapped into the intake manifold and connected with a 1/8" plastic tube. The oil pressure gauge is fed from a port on the left rear of the engine, again with a 1/8" plastic tube. No electrics involved, unless you want to have lights in the backs of the gauge to see them at night. There are some that worry about the oil gauge being fed by a plastic tube, but I covered mine with wiring harness sheath at potential wear points. I installed these before I could get all my dash instruments working, so I could drive the car and know what the health of the engine was. The "Moto-Minder" vacuum gauge was just for fun, but also indicates the health of the engine.
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Old 10-13-2021, 02:09 PM   #14
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Default Re: No Thermostats

Excellent. Not sure what I was thinking, of course they are mechanical. I think I can get an oil pressure gauge with a copper line. Thanks.
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Old 10-13-2021, 10:06 PM   #15
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Default Re: No Thermostats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mart View Post
Thermostats are good. If it overheats with thermostats fitted it normally isn't the fault of the thermostat.
They can fail though and if that is the case removal of the stat will get you home.
But if the stats are good having them in place is a good idea.
Mart.
There is a type of thermostat that, if it fails, will fail open.
As I understand it's called a "reverse poppet" thermostat, but no one I've dealt with recognizes this term. They are as one would expect, more money.

Karl
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Old 10-13-2021, 10:50 PM   #16
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Default Re: No Thermostats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karl Wolf View Post
There is a type of thermostat that, if it fails, will fail open.
As I understand it's called a "reverse poppet" thermostat, but no one I've dealt with recognizes this term. They are as one would expect, more money.

Karl
Karl is right; I stepped up and bought a couple for my '51. So far, so good.
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Old 10-13-2021, 11:46 PM   #17
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Default Re: No Thermostats

Everything you ever wanted to know about Reverse Poppet Thermostats here > https://www.coolcatcorp.com/thermost...ermostats.html

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Old 10-14-2021, 12:13 AM   #18
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Default Re: No Thermostats

For what it's worth my Avatar '32 has a '33 engine which was rebuilt circa 1972. It has no thermostats and runs at about 160. In stop and go traffic and at prolonged stopped conditions it will rise to around 180 and then the old radiator will show its age (dribble). At some point in its life the fan blade scarred the radiator and caused a leak when warm. This car doesn't get driven much and sludge is not an issue.
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Old 10-14-2021, 09:14 AM   #19
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Default Re: No Thermostats

IMHO, As many who run with, run without. While I totally agree Stats are needed in the cold weather! Also totally agree as A few have said Henry was frugal & when Henry built them & were fresh off the assy. line. All the water veins in the engine were rust free & wide open. When they were new they needed to restrict the water to get to a good running temp as the coolant flowed so well! I believe the reason for so much arguing & lamenting about it now stems from most oldster engines still around even after rigorous methods to clean water veins have some to a lot of rusty veins slowing the coolant flow. Ergo much arguing & lamenting. I have a ‘49 8BA, been rebuilt by a reputable builder w a good reputation. Rebuilds hundreds of all type older & newer engines. Has a special shop in his factory to rebuild nothing but Ford Flatheads for 40 plus years & uses the latest methods to clean the cooling Sys. He’s indicated more than not call w cooling issues. His advice always the same, try lower temp Stats if still an issue run Stats only in cold weather. I only run my ‘35 from Mid April to end of Oct. I don’t use Stats anymore as they always caused a cooling issue & my cooling issues went away. Runs between 180 & 200 always. JMHO.
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Old 11-01-2021, 04:22 PM   #20
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Default Re: No Thermostats

I run 160 thermostats and it works always very well. IMO the engines should not run cooler than 160-180...and 200 is not a problem at all for a well built Flathead. But what do i know?
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