Scanning Paint Chips From Paint & Finish Manual

[Ed in Maine]

In picking a paint color, how accurate can I expect the paint dealer's scan of a paint chip from the Paint & Finish Guide to be? Is this the next best method of procuring a mixed paint if you don't like the results of using paint codes? what has been your experience. Thanks for your help, Ed

[Oldbluoval]

The scan tool isn't "on the money" as I've found it.
My dealer has a massive chip book and it has been better for me to find
A match that they have formula for.....
But that's not always perfect either

[jb-ob]

ED,

That depends on the color and the size of the chip and the color 'universe' in their computer.

I've been able to 'stump' PPG's scanner with dark blues and since brown is not a popular car color today, they have no references.

The 'matches' that PPG finds are on a scale of 1 thru 25. 1 thru 5 is a close match, beyond 18 is useless. I recently scanned an era Acme Paint chip of Rock Moss Green which gave a#4 match to a 2015 Ford color 'Amazon Green'.

Another source are the 'Fleet Color Books' and Foreign Car Chips, both having excellent collection of solid colors. I found a visual match in an 1980's Volvo color for Bronson Yellow.

Lastly some tints simply don't exist today from government regulation, so that perfect match sometimes is impossible to re-create.

Your eyes are different from mine, your car will be in your garage, be creative in your search to find exactly what you like. The Bronson / Volvo color I simply saw out on the street.

Best...

[Mike V. Florida]

It has been posted here before that the computerized system that paint dealers use do not match the actual color of the sample but hatch it to a pre made formula in their system.

PP&G's RapidMatch XI spectrophotometer, when used "A comparison is made between the vehicle Target color and the color database." Please notice it says database, if the exact color is not in their database, the closest color they have will appear with a percent match number.

What does that mean to us? Unless the color of our A's were used within 40-50 years the odds of the color being in the database is nil.

[kenparker]

couple years ago I went to my local auto paint company and ask for a gallon of Rock Moss Green. I brought along a section of my hood off my '28 pickup which had a Rock Moss green paint job on it but faded and worn and chipped after neary 30 years of use (truck was painted back in the '80's).

They scanned ithe section of hood and two days later I picked up the gallon and painted the truck. Here is what I got. John Deere Green. The wife liked it so it stays on the truck. ken p.s. BTW truck is for sale now.

[Keith True]

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Years ago I set out to blast and paint the tubs on 23 dump trailers.The owner wanted the same color on one that he had just bought,but didn't know the color.I took the trailer to the paint store to match,and the guy came out to show off his new scan tool.I think Ditzler called it the Prophet.The guy doing the mixing was just handed the formula the tool came up with,and he mixed me up a half dozen gallons to get me started.It was purple.It was supposed to be Fruehof silver aluminum.Napa has a listing for Kewannee green,if you mix the number in their book it comes back as Sherwood green.A friend went to paint his 28 Sport coupe some original color,after he got the paint home he found the computer had crossed it to John Deere green also.

[Terry, NJ]

And of course, Most of us are aware of what PPG did to the "Drabs". My eyes see brown and green, yet originally it was two shades of brown.
Terry

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

This is always a controversial topic when this comes up here because only a portion of the correct answer comes up.

First off, when you have a chip (-or panel scanned) it does find the closest match in the database and from there it is considered a tintable match. Now here is where folks get skewed on their thinking. A trained and experienced eye of a painter or a paint mixer can see color that the average person cannot. They can take that Amazon green and add a few grams of a toner and then compare it to the chip and have a direct match. Therefore there is not a valid excuse for not matching the chip in the Paint & Refinish Guide.

The second side of this is, both PPG & DuPont have the original Ford Model-A color formulas already in their databases. Therefore in theory, if the paint counterman has done his job correctly, AND if the chip book is not damaged or their color anaylizer is not out of calibration, it should bring up the direct match without any toners needed. Now don't get excited if Washington Blue shows up named Johnson Blue, because that same color might have been used on a different application. So again, no valid reason why not to have the accurate match.

[RJV]

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

This is always a controversial topic when this comes up here because only a portion of the correct answer comes up.

First off, when you have a chip (-or panel scanned) it does find the closest match in the database and from there it is considered a tintable match. Now here is where folks get skewed on their thinking. A trained and experienced eye of a painter or a paint mixer can see color that the average person cannot. They can take that Amazon green and add a few grams of a toner and then compare it to the chip and have a direct match. Therefore there is not a valid excuse for not matching the chip in the Paint & Refinish Guide.

The second side of this is, both PPG & DuPont have the original Ford Model-A color formulas already in their databases. Therefore in theory, if the paint counterman has done his job correctly, AND if the chip book is not damaged or their color anaylizer is not out of calibration, it should bring up the direct match without any toners needed. Now don't get excited if Washington Blue shows up named Johnson Blue, because that same color might have been used on a different application. So again, no valid reason why not to have the accurate match.

When I painted my roadster Washington blue, the formula came up with the existing formula for Mercedes blue and also Massachusetts state police car blue. Inside the paint store with florescent lighting they looked the same. Outside in natural light the last one looked closer to the chip (to me and the paint guy). Probably would have cost more if I got the Mercedes blue! LOL

[jb-ob]

Brent.

Yup, in a perfect world maybe.

Here in reality, the EPA long ago outlawed certain Iron Oxide tints, so the best the paint store can give you is something close. Don't think about repairing & matching an old lacquer or enamel paint job because the correct tints are out lawed.

Every time new & improved paint chemistry is created to satisfy the EPA, tints change as do the results.

Brent, our 'mileage will differ' on this one.

[Terry, NJ]

Much is in the eye of the beholder! I used to have a 1962 Ford F-600 that My wife and I use to argue endlessly over the color of the cab. I saw a purple and she saw blue. The kids (Girls) sided with her. So I guess it's the proportion of the rods and cones or whatever other color sensing nerves, cells, what have you that make us see what we see.
Terry

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by jb-ob

Brent.

Yup, in a perfect world maybe.

Here in reality, the EPA long ago outlawed certain Iron Oxide tints, so the best the paint store can give you is something close. Don't think about repairing & matching an old lacquer or enamel paint job because the correct tints are out lawed.

Every time new & improved paint chemistry is created to satisfy the EPA, tints change as do the results.

Brent, our 'mileage will differ' on this one.

As I said above, this always seems to bring controversy as we only like to believe what seems believable. We repair old existing paint all the time with gas tank repairs, and I feel we do a pretty good job of matching thru tinting. Again, this comes back to having a trained eye and talent. Yes, some of the heavy metals have been regulated, and pigments have changed thru technology, but I am pretty sure that you as a pinstriper would agree with me that the three primary colors are still the same.

[jb-ob]

Brent,

Yes the three primary colors exist but the quality is not close to what it was 20 years ago. Back then red would cover like cement but today if I don't doctor the color, it won't cover over white, black & etc.

15 years ago a local painted his Stutz in a Corvette dark green Centari Acrylic Enamel. DuPont Centari has long been discontinued so five years ago I had the original paint code and had it had it scanned in PPG Concept. Nice color but no 'exact' match to myself or the owner. The old tints simply don't exist and the new ones are not the same.

No 'controversy' to this painter......

[captndan]

Many people get in too big of a hurry when painting their car. Go to car shows. Find a color that is perfect for your car then ask who painted it. Talk to the painter and get all the details. Then buy your paint.