NEW starting problem

[1931 flamingo]

Sorry, didn't see this back up again.
I re-polarized the reg/gen. All wires on reg in correct position. I will do the above suggestion this am.
Paul in CT

[1931 flamingo]

V8COOPMANN
With BOTH wires off the gen and batt disconnect ON, it still motored !
Interesting.
Paul in CT

[Bob C]

Finally, now we know it's the starter solenoid.

[V8COOPMAN]

Originally Posted by 1931 flamingo

V8COOPMANN
With BOTH wires off the gen and batt disconnect ON, it still motored !
Interesting.
Paul in CT

OK PAUL!

Now, let's THINK about it! With BOTH wires off of the generator, it is VIRTUALLY IMPOSSIBLE for the GENERATOR to "motor"! Can you agree with that?

I have suspected that your solenoid has likely had it's 'shuttle' (the movable plunger inside the solenoid) freeze in the "energized" position. This would mean that ANY TIME that your BATTERY cut-off switch is closed (turned-on), the starter will crank the engine over. In other words, your solenoid is KAPUT! It possibly has a dead short running through it.

So, let's re-affirm. With BOTH wires disconnected from your generator, when you turned BATT disconnect on, the generator DID NOT turn, but the engine cranked-over?

Is THIS the condition we now have?


If so, we will run one more simple test! DD

.



.

[glennpm]

It could also be a stuck in, grounded/shorted wire or internally fused starter button. Paul, could you please disconnect the wire to the starter button and try turning your battery cut-off switch on?

If that test fails disconnect the wire at the solenoid that goes to the starter button.

If both fail the solenoid is defective.

https://thirdgenauto.com/shop-parts/...ct_cat=starter


Glenn

[V8COOPMAN]

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Originally Posted by glennpm

It could also be a stuck in, grounded wire or internally fused starter button. Paul, could you please disconnect the wire to the starter button and try turning your battery cut-off switch on?


Glenn

Very true! So as not to confuse stuff, let's let Paul report back, one test at a time. DD
.

[glennpm]

Yes agreed!

[1931 flamingo]

Yes,the engine turned over. Disconnected the starter button wire at the solonoid, still turned over. It's a new sol from Joe's.
New reg from Joe's.


Paul

[Mart]

Do you have the battery and starter cables connected to the same side of the solenoid? If not then the solenoid is faulty.

[V8COOPMAN]

Originally Posted by 1931 flamingo

Yes,the engine turned over. Disconnected the starter button wire at the solonoid, still turned over. It's a new sol from Joe's.
New reg from Joe's.


Paul

Hey Paul .....NOW you're cooking, my friend. We're getting somewhere doing these steps in a methodical manner.

So, now you SHOULD be able to see that the generator was NOT "motoring" all this time. Kevin and Bob C both were on to something having to do with the solenoid last week. I'm going one step further THINKING that you have a defective solenoid, doing what I described in my POST #44 above.

So Paul, let's run ONE last test. Make sure your BATT disconnect is OFF.

Make sure that the SMALL wire is disconnected from the small post on solenoid.

Set your METER to OHMS.....that 'horseshoe'-looking symbol. Note what your meter reads when you touch BOTH probes together.....CONTINUITY.

Now, touch one meter lead to the big lug on your solenoid with BATT cable.

Then, touch the OTHER meter lead to the big lug on solenoid CONNECTED to STARTER.

Does the meter show CONTINUITY?

DD





.

[Bob C]

This was posted on his starter thread.




Senior Member



Join Date: May 2010
Location: new britain,ct 06052
Posts: 9,116


Re: Starting problem, help please.
Still have trouble. I've made sure starter push button is grounded. The only way I can get it to turnover is to jump from the neg battery terminal to thee small stud on the new solenoid. Solenoid BAD??
Paul in CT

[koates]

Paul, you may have the incorrect type of solenoid fitted. The original Ford type has only one small terminal which has to be grounded by the starter push button to operate the starter. There is another type that requires power from the starter button to the small terminal to activate the starter. Then there is another type that has two small terminals. There are other types as well. Also the main battery cable and the starter main cable have to be the correct way around. So just exactly what do you have ? Regards, Kevin.

[1931 flamingo]

To all: I feel so stupid for misdiagnosing the problem I can't sleep.
Originally I did have the wrong sol installed (from NAPA), got the correct one from Joe's. Then I was able to get the car to start but when shut off the gen at first started to make noise and then eventually it would turn over(I now realize it was the starter trying and then succeeding to engage.
V8COOPMAN, I will do the latest test in the morning.
Paul
Thanks to all for bearing with me.

[V8COOPMAN]

Originally Posted by 1931 flamingo

To all: I feel so stupid for misdiagnosing the problem I can't sleep.
Originally I did have the wrong sol installed (from NAPA), got the correct one from Joe's. Then I was able to get the car to start but when shut off the gen at first started to make noise and then eventually it would turn over(I now realize it was the starter trying and then succeeding to engage.
V8COOPMAN, I will do the latest test in the morning.
Paul
Thanks to all for bearing with me.

Paul ....No need for beating yourself up. I've made a mistake or three over the years. No doubt that going through the symptoms methodically, all roads point to either a seized plunger, or the wrong solenoid entirely. The one you want is available from several sources. I like Michael Driskell's 3rd Gen Automotive in Tennessee for friendly, KNOWLEDGEABLE help from Michael himself on the phone. He has the stock type solenoid like you need. You need an "01A-11450" Solenoid. Tell Michael that you want that nice METAL solenoid like below! It is even clearly marked which pole the BATTERY cable goes on....it makes a difference!

Ask to speak with Michael Driskell himself, and he will make sure you get the CORRECT solenoid. When you receive it, I will be happy to help make sure that you have no trouble installing it, plus we're going to have to re-polarize your generator again. I'm glad to help, or Kevin or Bob C....any of us will get ya going comfortably. DD






Contact Michael Driskell at 3rd Gen Automotive (Click the link BELOW):

https://thirdgenauto.com/


Third Gen Automotive
Phone: 844-327-5988
2600 Old Nashville Hwy
McMinnville, TN 37110

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[1931 flamingo]

I will ck the continuity today and re-order. The last one I got from Joe's, nutton on the bottom and Ford logo.
Again, Thanks.
Paul

[glennpm]

Hi Paul,

Is the one from Joe like the 3rd gen one Like that that I linked and DD posted a picture of?
Call Joe, he knows what he is doing and very helpfully.

Glenn

[1931 flamingo]

Yes, same solenoid,button on bottom, same part #.
V8COOPMAN: It shows continuity. Re-ordering today (2, just in case).
Paul in CT

[V8COOPMAN]

Originally Posted by 1931 flamingo

Yes, same solenoid,button on bottom, same part #.
V8COOPMAN: It shows continuity. Re-ordering today (2, just in case).
Paul in CT

Ya done GOOD, Paul! No way that solenoid should show continuity across those two BIG lugs. That is like hooking starter directly to BATT!

Hopefully, we ALL have learned how important it is to do methodical testing, ONE step at a time. Once the NEW solenoid shows-up, you should be rollin' & cruisin' in an hour or less. Glad you're on your way!

That Tinky thingy can go pound sand! DD

[Tinker]

Originally Posted by V8COOPMAN

That Tinky thingy can go pound sand! DD

Geez, you can't let it go can you! hahaha. You were going to write this off and move on to the next post previously. I don't care if you think I should pound sand.

Glad you slowed down and talked with the individual and not just throw info and talking about some guys can't get it. Read the previous threads and think about it. Maybe just post the info and see what happens or doesn't.


"Patience is also a strong virtue of mine, and I try my best to COMMUNICATE concisely with folks....to include those that MAY be a little behind the UNDERSTANDING or LEARNING curve (as Kevin alludes to)....hence, my penchant for supportive and informational drawings & diagrams.

[1931 flamingo]

V8COOPMAN
Thanks for "hanging" in there for me. The sol DID work when originally put in a week and a half ago. Just a bad one or could something have caused it to fail??
Will update when I get new sol.
Paul in CT