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Old 09-21-2020, 01:44 PM   #1
PeteVS
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Default F1 Brake return springs

The shoes I got for my F1 brakes going onto my project car have two sets of holes (see picture) which I assume are for the shoe return springs. The upper set of holes put hardly any tension on the springs while the lower holes make it darned near impossible to get the springs on. Which is right? Does it appear that I have the correct springs? Thanks!
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File Type: jpg F1 return springs sm.jpg (68.9 KB, 91 views)
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Last edited by PeteVS; 09-21-2020 at 01:50 PM.
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Old 09-21-2020, 01:51 PM   #2
JSeery
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Default Re: F1 Brake return springs

The parts I use with the F1 backing plates are the same for several years, some up into the 70s. I'm not at my computer right now (that's where all my photos are).
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Old 09-21-2020, 02:32 PM   #3
Bob C
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Default Re: F1 Brake return springs

I looked in the F series shop manual and it looks like the springs go in the upper
holes you show. If your picture is the right front looks like your shoes are on wrong,
short shoe should go on the front.
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Old 09-21-2020, 03:25 PM   #4
19Fordy
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Default Re: F1 Brake return springs

Here's what the 49-51 merc front brake shoes look like. I am not sure but I bet they are the same as the F100 11x2 brakes as the Merc rear was used in pickups also. Are you sure you have the correct shoes? Click on picture to enlarge shoes.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/b.../model/mercury
I don't recall if front and rear are the same.
https://shoebox-central.com/1949-195...nt-brake-shoes

I Bob C got it right.

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Old 09-21-2020, 11:12 PM   #5
rich b
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Default Re: F1 Brake return springs

Springs look like they are too long. From the appearance they look like springs for 12" brake. What's the part number?

Check the amount of coil spread on the blue springs on an F-1 brake assy.

The two springs on the left are for 11" brakes; while the one on the right is for a 12 brake.
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File Type: jpg P7160017 (Medium).jpg (57.2 KB, 43 views)
File Type: jpg 11vs12 springs (Medium).jpg (36.6 KB, 24 views)
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Old 09-22-2020, 02:07 AM   #6
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Default Re: F1 Brake return springs

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Quote:
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Springs look like they are too long. From the appearance they look like springs for 12" brake. What's the part number?

Check the amount of coil spread on the blue springs on an F-1 brake assy.

The two springs on the left are for 11" brakes; while the one on the right is for a 12 brake.
Thanks! It looks like I have about the same amount of "coil spread" using the upper holes on my shoes as your blue springs show. Also, the image on Fordy's post only shows the upper holes. So I'll go with the upper holes. As.a final check, could you give me a measurement for the various springs from where they're hanging in your picture to the "tail" sticking out at the bottom? I don't have a part number for the springs. I've had them set aside for the project for years now.
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File Type: jpg 11vs12 springs (Medium).jpg (38.0 KB, 6 views)
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Old 09-22-2020, 04:23 PM   #7
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Default Re: F1 Brake return springs

48 thru 63 should all be the same. If you have a parts store nearby you might be able to compare the ones you have to ones in stock.

Here is the manual diagram.
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File Type: jpg brake_b4416f9d4603ef72552cb83fed1c50458e47c8a1.jpg (83.5 KB, 28 views)

Last edited by JSeery; 09-22-2020 at 04:37 PM.
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Old 09-22-2020, 04:40 PM   #8
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Default Re: F1 Brake return springs

And don't forget the switch the shoes around. In your first post they appear to be on backwards.
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Old 09-22-2020, 08:16 PM   #9
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Default Re: F1 Brake return springs

Quote:
Originally Posted by JSeery View Post
And don't forget the switch the shoes around. In your first post they appear to be on backwards.
Thanks for the spring info. I'll try the local parts house tomorrow.

Brake shoes are driving me crazy. I'm building an A using Lockheeds in the rear and Bendix up front. I have the rears installed upside down (I modified the backing plates to get the bleed screw on top.) and the Lockheed shoes are now big in the back, small in the front. That got my brain upside down and backwards! Got 'em fixed today. They were only wrong on the side in the photo.
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Old 09-22-2020, 08:34 PM   #10
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Default Re: F1 Brake return springs

I don't think it is near as big a deal with the Lockheeds as it is with the Bendix brakes. It might be worth it to purchase a spring kit, they are fairly cheap.

Here are the numbers I use if you are interested. I use the self-adjusters on the F1 backing plates even though Ford didn't use them until later on. They will fit, so I use them.
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File Type: jpg F1 Spring Kit.JPG (29.9 KB, 20 views)
File Type: jpg F1 Brake Shoes.JPG (24.7 KB, 5 views)

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Old 09-23-2020, 12:06 AM   #11
rich b
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Default Re: F1 Brake return springs

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeteVS View Post
Thanks! It looks like I have about the same amount of "coil spread" using the upper holes on my shoes as your blue springs show. Also, the image on Fordy's post only shows the upper holes. So I'll go with the upper holes. As.a final check, could you give me a measurement for the various springs from where they're hanging in your picture to the "tail" sticking out at the bottom? I don't have a part number for the springs. I've had them set aside for the project for years now.
The springs have pretty good tension and take some stretching to install.

If you hook a tape measure on them; the springs for the 11" brakes measure
about 4-7/8" end to end compared to about 5-3/8" for the 12" brake springs.

The part numbers I use for F-1 & F-100 are UP80403 from NAPA or H111 from other vendors. These numbers are for a pack of four retract springs.

Usually, I only assemble manual brakes; so I buy the parts separately as the H7144 "complete" kit is for self-adjusting brakes and only includes two retract springs.
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Old 09-23-2020, 03:56 AM   #12
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Default Re: F1 Brake return springs

Thanks to all!!
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Old 09-23-2020, 09:44 AM   #13
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Default Re: F1 Brake return springs

Yes, the H7144 & UP2247 are for a whole kit. It is around $9 to $10, so cheap enough to just get the whole set. If you just want the springs, then use the numbers Rich posted.
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Old 09-23-2020, 10:16 AM   #14
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Default Re: F1 Brake return springs

.

Here's a FAIRLY-simple way to remember which shoe lining...BIG or LITTLE...goes toward the REAR, on either brake type.

Bendix Big in Back

Lockheed Little Lags

DD
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Old 09-23-2020, 10:58 AM   #15
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Default Re: F1 Brake return springs

Quote:
Originally Posted by JSeery View Post
Yes, the H7144 & UP2247 are for a whole kit. It is around $9 to $10, so cheap enough to just get the whole set. If you just want the springs, then use the numbers Rich posted.
What I was getting at is that if you are doing manual brakes; you would need to buy two of those kits to get enough retract springs.

Or, if you want go with self-adjusting brakes you would also need to buy in addition, left and right self-adjuster "repair" kits; and by rights cut another access slot in the left side backing plate.
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