Model A Need a List of parts to Buy

[coee]

Have a modelA stock motor.. I want to keep it in the truck.. I would like to go down the freeway around 65 75 but still drive around town... what do i need to buy ???? T5. head,, headers,, manifold... any help would be great.....thanks

[J Franklin]

Buy a modern car and enjoy the Model A for what it is and was. Buy a shea model a replica if it is the shape of an old car with modern speed and handling you are after.

[Mike V. Florida]

Log into the HAMB site and ask there. This site by design and declaration of the owner is for Model A RESTORATION. (Ryan owns both sites, Fordbarn and HAMB)

Hot rod sites are a dime a dozen but sites for stock fords are rare.

HAMB SITE HERE

[Chris in WNC]

"what do i need to buy ???? "

BRAKES!!!!


actually, if you modify the Model A sufficiently to be safe at those speeds, it will in my opinion no longer be a Model A....

[Dave in MN]

Coee,
As you have just discovered, on this site there is a lot of respect for the Model A as Henry built it, a resistance to change it and equal resistance to discuss it. I respect their opinions and intent of this Forum. Other than a Mitchell overdrive, I have a Model A that looks stock but will perform like you wish. When I first purchased this car, I wanted to go fast and set about to re-build it to do so without being unreliable.
I experienced the speed and you know what I learned from it...45 mph is much more enjoyable. I'll take the particulars of your request off this site and contact you through email to share the info for your "List of parts to buy" if you really want to go fast.
Good Day!
Dave in MN

[Charlie Stephens]

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Coee,

You need the following:
1. Good life insurance
2. Good health insurance
3. Good auto insurance

After you have all of the preceding items and run your car up to 75 MPH you will find that the real limiting factor is the basic design of the car. The front fenders act like airplane wings. The front end of the car will lift up and the steering will feel like power steering. The first 18 wheeler that passes you pushing a lot of air in front of it and sucking a lot of air behind it will give you a thrill that is hard to duplicate. I have a '31 RDPU, 3.54 rear end and a stock B engine except for a "Police" head. It will do 65 MPH plus (I have never tried out the plus) but is definitely not comfortable for any long time for the previously listed reasons. It seems comfortable at 55 MPH but even that gets tiring after a hundred miles. You will find yourself gripping the steering wheel tightly and paying 100% attention to your driving. Even after incorporating everything mentioned in the previous posts I think you should plan of 55 MPH for any long term driving.

Charlie Stephens

[Charlie Stephens]

Originally Posted by Dave in MN

Coee,
As you have just discovered, on this site there is a lot of respect for the Model A as Henry built it, a resistance to change it and equal resistance to discuss it. I respect their opinions and intent of this Forum. Other than a Mitchell overdrive, I have a Model A that looks stock but will perform like you wish. When I first purchased this car, I wanted to go fast and set about to re-build it to do so without being unreliable.
I experienced the speed and you know what I learned from it...45 mph is much more enjoyable. I'll take the particulars of your request off this site and contact you through email to share the info for your "List of parts to buy" if you really want to go fast.
Good Day!
Dave in MN

Dave,

I would like to see your list and think it is suitable to post here. I am assuming of course that you are talking about upgrades to a Model A/B engine and not getting into SBC's, disc brakes and independent front suspensions.

Charlie Stephens

[Dave in MN]

Charlie,
The comment from your post is right on. "The front fenders act like airplane wings. The front end of the car will lift up and the steering will feel like power steering." Over 70 mph with the top up, (phaeton) the car rises up and feels like it is riding on air. With the top down it feels a bit more in control. I only take it up in speed on a freeway. Driving anything over 55 mph on a two lane road scares me.
Here is my list:
1929 Phaeton Body (light weight but with the top up, it is like pulling a parachute)
Early 1930 block inserted almost 10 years ago, mains and rods,
51,000 miles and no trouble…have not had the pan off yet
Original rear main seal system, modern style front seal. No leaks…none!
Replaced the head gasket @ 12,000 miles because I pulled the head to check for carbon build-up. Replaced the head gasket again at about 38,000 with a silicone style gasket due to a slight leak...no leaks since
Standard oil pump and gravity oiling system with an A-Fordable (valve chamber cover) almost full flow oil filter, dipper oiling of the insert rods, oil line to the center main cap from the pump
Counterweighted later style crank (non-beavertail), lightened flywheel (40 lb), V-8 pressure plate
26% Mitchell overdrive, standard ratio rear end
5.9 Brumfield head
1.73" intake valves, 1.5" exhaust valves with rotators & hardened seats, one piece valve guides, touring cam, bronze timing gear with matched crank gear (was expensive as I recall)
Bored out intake manifold ('B" spec), performance tuned Zenith carb, standard exhaust manifold and standard Arries (sp?) stainless steel muffler, no engine pans
Full circle bronze rear thrust, 1/2 circle bronze front thrust w/ 45 degree bevel @ leading edge of thrust washer (helps build a little pressure on the oil as the crank spins)
.125 (by choice) V-8 GM style oversize pistons (Heaven forbid GM pistons in an A!)
Rods, pistons weighed and matched in weight
Crankshaft & flywheel/pressure plate balanced individually and then as one assembly
Largest cooling capacity pressurized Brassworks radiator with expansion tank.
I check the coolant level in the spring...rarely add any water/antifreeze solution.
Minnesota...Ya...You betcha for sure....50/50 antifreeze is required...IMO.
Nurex Electronic ignition, stock adjustment of advance on the timing, Nurex high output alternator, Halogens out front, LEDs @ the rear
Cast iron drums on all four, not juice...brake rods as Henry made them...I keep them tight and tuned...
40-50 mph most of the miles
60-70 mph on the freeway many times each summer
Held it at 75 to 78 mph on the freeway for 180 miles once (could have kept going but needed to stop for gas...really sucks the fuel at that speed) 20-22mpg @ 30-45 touring speeds
This engine has done everything I have ever asked it to do.
No signs of any problems yet...still has great power...still do not need to add any oil between the oil changes at 3,000 mile intervals.
I really like this engine! (I guess, you probably could tell that!)
I have rebuilt 40 engines in the past 3 years. Three are finished with similar specs to my engine another is being assembled this month, 5th next month.
IMO: The reason this engine has held together: All of the above but most importantly, the counterweighted crank, exhaust valve rotators and an overdrive to keep the rpms down at the higher speeds.
After all I did to make it fast would I do it again...I don't know...I thought I wanted to go fast but I discovered it is not at all pleasant driving above 55. The best drive in a Model A is 35-45 mph with a group of good friends making frequent stops along the way. I probably needed to make the car go fast just to discover what a lot of guys on this forum already knew.
Good Day!
Dave in MN
www.durableperformance.net

[hardtimes]

Originally Posted by coee

Have a modelA stock motor.. I want to keep it in the truck.. I would like to go down the freeway around 65 75 but still drive around town... what do i need to buy ???? T5. head,, headers,, manifold... any help would be great.....thanks

coee, "what do I need to buy"
Well, all those things you mention, AND more! Where to start?
Besides making your A 'stock' engine durable/reliable for the 'long run' and high speeds...you might consider how your car will behave/react/stop from 65/75mph! In other words, let's say that an "emergency" stop is required at those speeds! You never hear (here)of any of those incidents/results..do you? I've often wondered why..could it be that there are never any such emergencies encountered, hmm ? Anyway, anyone going those speeds on any road should have thought out....tires/aerodynamics/handling/preventative maintenance/braking capacity and components of your vehicle. Some things among many to consider!
Now, what to buy list:
I'd suggest a new crank, new cam, new 2x2 downdrft 81s, stainless valves with hard seats, coated tube ex header, electronic ign module, insert mains/rods, full pressure with filter system, stipe oil pump, lightened flywheel with V8 clutch pkg, '39 topldr w/zepher gears and new 3:54 R&P rear. Hmm, I'm sure that I've left some goodies off list, but sure others will fill in the b....ks!

[Bob/Kansas City]

Tons of insurance! Driving a Model A at 75 mph... Dude!
Buy a street rod.

[Kevin in NJ]

What are your real goals?

Build the engine and drive line to factory and you get 60 to 65 MPH or more. Add on the high compression head and a new cam and you will probably can get the 75 MPH.

But lets be real. How much are you actually going to drive that fast to warrant the expense?

My brothers 31 coupe has been run with a stock head since 1970 and with a used B cam since 86. It has been run over 60 MPH for significant amounts of time. It is not a hell on wheels ride, it feel comfortable. This is a car that was put together by a 15 year old boy. It is showing some of the problems of a not well ground crankshaft and you can tell there is some imbalances. So far the only parts to fail were done by professional builders.

My fordor was run in the 55 60 range quite a bit once I rebuilt the brakes and front end. If you saw the car you would not think it to be a 45 MPH car.

The Model A was designed to run 55 MPH and the dealers were told to demonstrate it runs 65.

Now how fast do you really need to go and for how long? If you intend on running a bizillion miles at highway speed then some thoughts might be needed on an overdrive.

If you want a reliable car that can run 65 MPH then learn what it takes to build back to factory and consider a new cam and a new head as your starting point.

Keep in mind that when you take factory prints to a machine shop and they will tell you that you want race car accuracy.

Now you could spend a ton of money on a car that runs 75, but how much do you really need it. A properly redone close to factory car will get you 30,000 to 50,000 of running in the 60 MPH range on todays highways.

Built it right, know what factory means and you will have a get in go car that needs little maintenance.

Be wary of the modern improvements. They are not all they are cracked up to be.

[Jason in TX]

I once had a sales person tell me that when purchasing something (I was buying a mountain bike) people often spend 99% of the time making sure that the object they are buying will do what they need it to only 1% of the time.

Think about when you buy a washing machine, you shop around for the one that has the light duty wrinkle free anti twist ultra balanced hydrosonic turbo sprayers, but when it gets to your house, you just throw clothes in it and turn it on.

So, back to Model As. You probably won't be driving this on the highway daily fighting traffic like you do in your Modern car, so ask yourself what your real use of the car will be.

2 engine examples
I took a stock rebuilt Schwalms engine, put a lightened flywheel and "B" grind cam in it, and then put a high compression head on it (aprox 7:1), dual 81 strombergs and dual exhaust with no mufflers, and it easily runs around town at 55 MPH. It can get up to 65 on the highway, and no Overdrive.

I have another rebuilt engine, .80 over, lightened flywheel, touring cam, BF head and stock intake and exhaust and it's not as quick off the line, but will get up to 55 as well, but much more slowly. Turn on the Volvo over drive for another 10 mph with the throttle half way down. I haven't pushed it much above 65 on the 19" skinny tires yet.

[msmaron]

Originally Posted by coee

Have a modelA stock motor.. I want to keep it in the truck.. I would like to go down the freeway around 65 75 but still drive around town... what do i need to buy ???? T5. head,, headers,, manifold... any help would be great.....thanks

Why do you want to go that fast, where you going in a Model A that you need to travel that fast and stay on the road.. Safety first, speed later...oh you might want to consider a modern car or a shae replica!

[Kevin in NJ]

From another perspective.

I do not run over 65 in my modern car. I live in NJ so they are using tickets to fund the state and towns. I have taken the attitude of why do I need to go anywhere that fast.

Short of very long trips you never save that much time. You take a lot of risk.

A properly done to stock A moves out pretty good. It will pass modern 4 cyl going through mountains in PA. They can be happy running all day long at 55 MPH and not strained running over 60.

So what do you really need in the A?

Clearly there is nothing wrong with the exercise in how fast can you make it go.
BUT
It is important to understand that speed equipment and overdrive is not needed for most of the driving. Be it touring at 45 in a group or getting to the show keeping with traffic running 65 for a couple of hours.

Properly restored to original specifications, the Model A is a very capable car.
Conversely, the A can be put together with junk and still do pretty good, but you will have a 45 MPH or less car.

This coming from someone who has done 80 MPH around my small city many times. Hey, it was a Mustang and it needed to exercised and I had my blue lights on
Did mention the 66 Fastback sitting in the back garage waiting to be put together?

[Charlie Stephens]

I forgot to include in my previous post that you will get extremely poor gas mileage at 65/75 MPH. The Model A has the aerodynamics of a box and the wind resistance goes up as the square of the speed. Combine this with an inefficient engine and the gas mileage will be terrible. The box like aerodynamics will also impact wind buffeting especially when passing 18 wheeler trucks at high speed or driving on windy days on a road that periodically passes through canyons that cause a sudden wind load (don't ask me how I know).

Charlie Stephens

[coee]

Just let everone know... I have two 1930 five window coupes with 350.....

My truck ,,, I just wanted to keep the model A in it ..... looking for speed was the wrong wording......I ment I want to be able to leave my town and drive the back roads in a timely matter.... Maybe even get on the freeway.......

[Mike V. Florida]

Originally Posted by coee

Just let everone know... I have two 1930 five window coupes with 350.....

My truck ,,, I just wanted to keep the model A in it ..... looking for speed was the wrong wording......I ment I want to be able to leave my town and drive the back roads in a timely matter.... Maybe even get on the freeway.......

I'll say it again;

Log into the HAMB site and ask there. This site by design and declaration of the owner is for Model A RESTORATION. (Ryan owns both sites, Fordbarn and HAMB)

Hot rod sites are a dime a dozen but sites for stock fords are rare.

HAMB SITE HERE

[Tony S,Fl.]

Just remember and I quote. Drive as fast as your guardian angle can fly. And a panic stop at those high speeds will make a Model A look like a dice on a crap table. Tony

[Jordan]

You can only go as fast as your motor will let you. I would never go that fast on a babbit engine, especially an older rebuilt one. I have an inserted Engine from Rich in Skokie, Il. It will do 65 with ease and it's hauling around a big town sedan. No overdrive. Do i keep it there, no for personal reasons i choose not to go that fast. But it will do it if i wanted it to, and that's at half a pedal. I've never driven a faster & stronger engine. It will climb mountains in 3rd gear no problem. Inserted mains and rods, original oiling system, Chevy 283 pistons bored .125, oversized valves, snyders high comp head, FS ignition, and modern forklift carb. It would cruise at 65 all day, but i choose not to do it. The faster I go, the smoother the engine gets, but the longer it takes to stop.

[Geo. H]

The 39 top loader is a fine idea, but scratch the Zephyr gears. They're only good for bragging rights with the rear end ratio you've selected.