How Many Model A's are left ?

[DougVieyra]

I am wondering if anyone has come up with a recent calculation as to how many Ford Model A's are left.

Several years ago, I made my own 'Ball Park' guess-timation: MAFCA has about 14,000 members, MARC has about 11,000 members, with maybe, two thousand over-lapping members. That would be roughly 23,000 members of the two National clubs. Somewhere, long ago, I read a survey that indicated that there were an average of three Model A's per member. Some guys are sensible with just one car - others with less self-control - with 3, 4, 5 or more. But three cars was the average at that time.

Using those old figures, 3 times 23,000 would be somewhere in the 'ball park' of 70,000 Ford Model A's. Then there are all those Model A owners who have no club affiliation with either MARC or MAFCA. Just how many is anyone's guess, but less say another 5,000 who are just not 'joiners'. At three cars each, that adds another 15,000 cars to the previous 70,000, for a total of 85,000 Ford Model A's.

IF this number is anywhere close to the actual (forever unknown) number, then it would make for a fairly impressive survival rate of the 5 million or so Ford Model A's that were made between 1928 and 1931. (Yes, I know that production began in late 1927 and ended in early 1932).

Because my first 'old car' was a 1928 Chevrolet, and I am also a student of Automotive history, I am familiar with the fact that in 1928 Chevrolet sold significantly more cars than Ford; and for the four years of Model A production, Chevrolet had pretty much matched Ford production. So where are all those Chevrolets ? Dumb question - please don't answer.

So, I would like to get other opinions and input to this question of " How Many Model A's are left ? "

[Mike V. Florida]

247,133, in the book "The Legendary Model A Ford:..." it says 250,000, but I think he is a bit over optimistic.

[Wick]

Someone posted a few months back that he did a search on the web and there were 3,500 Model A's for sale in the USA at that moment.
I see new finds showing up all the time. Some may be just a frame and cowl,so I think the number will keep going up.

[QGolden]

Hmm, if there were 3.500 cars for sale, I have to think that the number would represent more or less complete cars, mostly running. Say a selling average of 8,000 dollars each, that would be about $28,000,000 of available inventory at any point in time. Good thing to remember when you are out looking for one.

[Mitch//pa]

i think your way short of 5,000 non joiners or just A's sitting in barns and fields. it's impossible to know but the figure would be suprisingly high IMO.

[gz]

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I would guess that less than 10% of the Model A owners out there are a member of either national club. I bet if you took a poll of all of the Model A owners that currently have cars listed on Ebay you would find that virtually none of them members of either national club. I wonder how many Model A enthusiasts on this website alone are not members of either national group? I've sold a lot of Model As over the years to new collectors and even though you encourage people to join I am sure almost none of them have. In the old days (read: before computers) the only source of parts and information was through the national and regional clubs via listings in their publications and through personally connecting with other members. (Remember how we could not wait to tear the cover off The Restorer or Model A News to see what was for sale in the back? Remember when Hemmings really was the "Bible"?) Now, the information and parts sources are at everyone's fingertips, 24 hours a day. While I certainly feel that interest in Model As (as well as other prewar cars) is at an all time high, and will continue to grow, the amount of club members-in any of the cars clubs, not just the Model A clubs-will at best hold its own if not decline slightly. Personally, I would never give up my MARC/MAFCA (and other old car club) memberships but that is just me. Time will tell....

[Terry,NJ]

Geez, this is hard to know! However, I've seen the estimated world wide population at 250,000. This does not seem unreasonable. I agree with Mitch, there are more non-joiners than joiners. About the Chevies, From what I've heard, they had more wood in them than the Fords. But mostly, the Fords got better gas mileage and were held back from the WW2 scrap drives.
Terry

[John Duden]

Originally Posted by Wick

Someone posted a few months back that he did a search on the web and there were 3,500 Model A's for sale in the USA at that moment.
I see new finds showing up all the time. Some may be just a frame and cowl,so I think the number will keep going up.

Wick-
Start a new thread on the rebuilding of the low mileage A! and close up shots!!

[bart78]

I think there is more than people think left. At least it seams that way around here. I have a few insurance guys that find cars for me. And they tell me that they see quite a few of them in old barns or garages. And even out to pasture. The more these old folks die off. We will see more cars.

[cradlescyth]

I have a 2dr coup about two blocks from me.
Been there for years and will be form many more, if the owner has his way.

I'v been trying to buye it for the last three years since I found it in the garage.

He keeps saying that he is going to restore it.I have great doubts about this.

How many more out there like this ????

[bart78]

Tons

[al's28/33]

Good question Doug...... too bad the DMV from each state couldn't be polled with that info from the historic plates they issue or some other simple way of knowing our cars had a special classic/antique designation. But then that would include your 1928 Chevy too!

[dave in australia]

Don't forget all the non USA A's as well. The A was a truly international car. I would just call the number 'lots'.

[Ron/IA]

Here is an article I wrote for our club's newsletter in October. Of the estimates and conjectures I have seen over the years; this is the one I like the best.

Have you ever wondered how many Model A’s still survive today? Of the Ford TriMotor planes built (199), there are 8 still in existence. Since the plane is 80+ years old (as is the Model A), and lasted longer than initially predicted (just as our Model A’s have); we can apply a similar ratio from the TriMotor to the Model A (since they were both built by Ford Motor Company). That would calculate there being approximately 190 to 200-thousand A’s still around. No wonder it’s been said there are more Model A’s than all the other antique cars put together.

[V4F]

so many are hidden in garages , etc. I don't see how you could even guess .......

[Rowdy]

I would guesse around 500,000 left taking into account nonrunning stored away complete cars and restored cars that have barely seen the light of day since the 70's. I know of 22 restored cars in the area that basicly have not moved in 40 years and nearly 150 complete nonrunning, but rather complete cars stored away for many years. To some my estimate would seem quite high, but I have to think the truth would suprise most. Rod

[CarlG]

The figure I have heard for years is one million world wide.

[ericr]

I talked to several old timers who bought late '20s Chevrolets as used cars in the '30s, and they all said it was common even at that stage to put carriage bolts through the door framing to keep the doors workable.

[Terry,NJ]

An older cousin of my father (now deceased) had a 28 or 29 chevy and said that year was notorious as an axle breaker.
Terry

Originally Posted by ericr

I talked to several old timers who bought late '20s Chevrolets as used cars in the '30s, and they all said it was common even at that stage to put carriage bolts through the door framing to keep the doors workable.

[DougVieyra]

When I was a 'youngster' (oh, those were the dayzzz . . . ) the figure I most often heard was 'about a quarter of a million - 250,000. But I have since learned that that figure was/is a bit like that elusive Duesenberg that someone heard for someone, who has it on good 'authority' that a he once heard of a guy that had his ex-brother-in-law tell him that he saw a Duesenberg, covered with dust, sitting in a single-car garage, which had it's owner dead for low these many years - the car is out there 'somewhere'. But in fact, we just can't seem to find it.

After being in the 'hobby' for over 50 years now, and 'bumping elbows' with a great many Model A owners (and their cars, and their parts), I have since come to very seriously doubt that a quarter of a million Ford Model A's exist. At best, I believe that if we were to double my base number (85,000) to take into account all the 'nooks and crannies' of the existing Model A Stock, at 170,000, we would still fall short of having a quarter of a million Model A's.

[Veger]

I'm still new to owning a Model A and a AA but here in Kentucky I see MANY old cars out there. Lol there is one guy down the road has a Model A Museum! Of course each Museum is a idea of the owner in this case, lol its all the Old Model A's and AA's he found in fields, under trees or in a garage. He took them back to his place and there they sit just like they was from the find. Lol one Phantom he found in a barn that has Bird Crap ALL Over it. I must say it looks GREAT in his Museum just like all his others. He has a GREAT collection of AA's I'm like him I think they look GREAT just like they are. It would be a safe bet to say his collection has some 30 Model A's AA's along with a LOT of cowls. WOW it really is a fun Time to look at what most ppl would call Junk. LoL And we can't forget to add the Doodlebugs in the count Too. Google DoodleBug and find out How MANY there is out there. I think I want a AA doodlebug one of these days just for spare parts on my AA StakeBed LoL

[Terry,NJ]

Doug, There's always the chance that you may be right. Try this, Does every town over 1000 population have at least one or two model As? From fully restored to a frame sitting on blocks (My boss from Ringoes, NJ had nine) How many towns over 1000 are there? As an example, NJ has 564 towns. Now you know it has a lot more than 564 model As. My town of Jackson had at least a dozen, that I knew of.
Terry

[DougVieyra]

One thing that is unique to the Ford Model A : whatever that unknown survival number is, what is sure, is that the number will continue to grow. With a great bulk of component parts cluttering up our 'back forty' we have an tremendous potential for 'growth'.

When I was first interested in and involved with the Model A in the mid-1950's (in those days when there were no 'Parts Houses'), every one I know who had a Model A, had at least an additional couple of frames, two or three engines, a stack of transmissions, a pile of rear-ends, boxes full of brake drums/backing plates, fenders, hoods, running boards, etc. etc. All of the essential 'guts and back bone' of what is needed to build a 'new' Model A are still present with us.

Unfortunately for me, I was/am one of those 'old codgers', and still swim in a sea of original Ford-made Model A parts. Now, while these bits and pieces may eventually be worked into the creation of a 'new' completed car, at the moment they only represent 'potential' - not existing Ford Model A's.

However, having such a large stock of original component parts is very encouraging. Ignoring places like BERT'S acres and acres of original Ford Model A cars, parts & 'bits and pieces' (what was called a 'Junk Yard' in the old days), there are a great many of Model A owners who have stock-piled component parts - a good portion of the 5 million Model A's that were made. (see Ford Barn Forum post "How Do U Store/Find ?") These will eventually add to our tally, ensuring that our venerable and ubiquitous Model A will survive in the public conscience forever more.

So whatever the number, either my conservative 170,000 or the more optimistic 250,000 - the number is relatively staggering, in relation to all the other surviving marques of the 1920's and 1930's. I suspect that we are not too far away (if not there already) that the general public will equate 'old car', 'antique car', 'historic car' etc., with the Ford Model A.

[plind]

Originally Posted by CarlG

The figure I have heard for years is one million world wide.

Yes, i belive to.. Here in Scadinavien we have a lot of Model A... And i have in my mind, that there are company´s living to make new part´s for Model A.. And there is many Company´s and i do belive they do it fine..

[Purdy Swoft]

I'm with CarlG. I believe that at least a million still exist. Many have been built from NOS, repro and good used parts . Brookville has made quiet a few new roadster bodies

[Binger]

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Originally Posted by Terry,NJ

An older cousin of my father (now deceased) had a 28 or 29 chevy and said that year was notorious as an axle breaker.
Terry

This is true. I have a '30 Chevy and they do break often. I even carry a spare in the trailer when I go on tour. Paid off when I was on the Glidden tour in Colorado a couple of years ago. Sorry to hijack the thread with my OT post.

[Wick]

This past summer I looked at 3 Model A's and 2 T's in a Garage just outside of town Sitting there for 20 to 40 years and will be until I make room for them? 2 more A's came to the Island this summer that I know of. And the T's that are showing up.
The Low mileage A has been named "The Lady" she is resting with a good coat of Gibbs oil. Her time will come.

[George D]

Just finished and got running over the weekend an A made from spare parts and swap meet stuff. What ever number you settle on, add 1!

[Bob Johnson]

The actual number will never be known. How many Model As are not registered ? What constitutes a Model A ? There are just too many unknowns. Here are some estimates base on different samples.

(1).
I live in a town with about 50,000 people. I know of 25 Model As in my town. There is likely 10 to 25 that I am unaware of. There are about 300,000,000 people in the United States. Using those number the estimate would be 200,000 to 300,000 Model As in the US.

(2)
I know of 25 Model A Town Cars. There were 1198 Town Cars made. Total Model A production was about 4.7 million. So we get about 100,000 Model As still around.

3)
Cabriolets. The production totals were 68A 17,774, 68B 38,000, 68C 5,200. The Cabriolet Club has a count of 68A 50, 68B 102, 68C 74. Those compute to 13,000 13,000 and 67,000.

(4)
400A There were 5072 Convertible Sedans made. The A400 club has a count of about 150 cars. That computes to about 140,000 cars.


Which estimate would you pick. The number of Cabriolets in the Cabriolet Club is likely only a small percentage of the surviving Cabriolets. The Town Car and Convertible Sedan numbers are likely closer to the actual remaining cars. But the survival rate of those body styles may not be representative of all the body styles. After all 25% of all Model A made were Tudors.


Bob

[milo]

WOW.. Sounds like there's still plenty to restore or HOT ROD...

[dumb person]

How many left? not enough. Club numbers sound odd. Most of those people are probably all members of the same family or something & would have to overlap. i almost never see model 'A's, i would have thought maybe 6,000 in the USA & another 4,000 worldwide.
Most model 'A's i see with original spec' chassis are roadsters or coupes & only some of them have original bodies, the rest will never rust again. There was this old man who bought a really nice roadster but one day he noticed the chips in the paint were not rusting, only the gas tank was steel.
That is how the surviving population of model A fords look from here.

[ronn]

I find 1 million to be overly optimistic and can believe 250,000.

I also see so many cars being "destroyed" as rods that I am not as optimistic as some on this board about survival rate. I am not talking about minor alterations, but total gut jobs. Punch in Model A ford on ebay and what percentage are rods and what percentage pure. Pure loses by a long shot.... and will continue to.

[ericr]

Originally Posted by Terry,NJ

An older cousin of my father (now deceased) had a 28 or 29 chevy and said that year was notorious as an axle breaker.
Terry

I believe that, I have seen a picture of a special Chevrolet tool called an Axle Shaft Remover in a independent garage supply catalog.

[JtownJoe]

actually 247,134 (nobody knows about mine)

[DougVieyra]

I recently checked with the U.S. Census Bureau and they have informed me that in the last U.S. Census, besides counting the number of people in the United States, while they were in the neighborhood, they also conducted a separate census on the number of Ford Model A's.

The number they tallied, counting all 50 States, was 148,263. This number included all cars that were running, as well as those that were not running or licensed. It included all Fords that looked like a Model A. It did not look under the hood or at the chassis. It DID NOT include uncompleted cars, unfinished chassis, bodies, etc.

However, the Official U.S. Census report of all the Model A's in the U.S., did not account for all the other Ford Model A's outside the U.S. A contact has been made with both the C.I.A. and the KGB, as well as the Mossad, for information gathering by those key international intelligence agencies. A world-wide total is expect from them within the next year. As this information becomes available to me, I shall share it with the FORD BARN FORUM.

[Mike V. Florida]

Originally Posted by DougVieyra

The number they tallied, counting all 50 States, was 248,263. This number included all cars that were running, as well as those that were not running or licensed. It did not include unfinished chassis, bodies, etc.

.

Just missed being the closest by one.

[ericr]

I wonder if state motor vehicle bureaus have any kind of breakdown on titled cars by age or historical plates.

[MikeK]

I must be turning my calendar pages too fast. Here it's obviously April 1st and I was thinking it was the middle of November.

Mike V. - Check your math. 248,263 - 247,133 does not = 1 !!

[30coupeguy]

I have in front of me the Volume 57 issue 3 (September/October 2012) copy of the MAFCA "Restorer".
Starting on page 24 are the remarks to the 2012 Convention by Edsel B. Ford ll. He states "The good news is that there are over 250,000 model A's still on the road today, many of them right here in Marquette this week. with another 750,000 or so awaiting restoration."
I personaly have zero knowledge on the subject and can not comment, butYes,I read and reread those numbers and I reread it again before replying to the thread.
Great subject, thanks for starting
Burt

[Purdy Swoft]

I think that Model A's were still made in South America and other countries for years after the 1932 cut off date here in the United States. This would greatly increase the number of model A's Actually produced to way over five million. Lots of model A's have been built from NOS and reproduction parts that remained in production for years after actual model A production. On another note, it ain't good when the CIA and KGB starts looking into stuff. Who knows what might be next !!!!!!!

[DougVieyra]

Purdy - sad to say, 'it ain't so'. Only the Ford Factory at Dearborn, Michigan made the Ford Model A.* They then shipped some units and components overseas to other Ford plants for assembly. When Dearborn stopped production in early 1932, that was the end of production. Like everywhere, foreign plants did continue to use up existing stock on hand.

*Now we can talk about Henry Ford (who was a Socialist as well as a Capitalist) giving the rights and tooling to building the Ford AA Truck in 1932, to Communist Russia, to help with one of their '5-year' plans. (see paragraph, below) And, while the Russians continued to build AA Trucks (and about 300 Model A Sedans) from 1932 through 1936, the numbers were small and do not contribute significantly to the roughly 5 Million Ford Model A /AA's produced in the U.S. Additionally, the Nazi war machine that over-ran Russia in 1941 though 1944 obliterated just about everything - including the Russian-made Ford Model AA trucks and the 300 cars made at the Gorky plant. Few (if any) have survived.

And too, later, although the Russians continued to use the Model B Ford engine in their GAZ-M1 utility vehicles (think Jeep) in 1936 through 1942, the GAZ could in no-way be thought of as a Ford Model A. GAZ = Gorkovsky Avtomobilny Zavod , translated as, 'Gorky Automobile Plant' , started in 1932 as NAZ, a cooperative enterprise between Ford and the Soviet Union.

As to "Lots of Model A's have been built from NOS stock and reproduction parts . . ." ,
those numbers are included in the tally, and would not add to the final tally.

And too, if one were to look at the origins of a great many of today's European Model A's, it will be discovered that they were bought in the U.S. and imported to Europe AFTER WWII, mainly in the 1970's, '80's & '90's, and continues today. So their numbers would be part of the U.S. 'body count'. The horrific devastation of WWII left only an extremely small number of European-assembled Ford Model A's to be counted as 'survivors'.
__________________________________________________ _

And Purdy Swoft - regarding the CIA and KGB (and Mossad) I apologize for my line in an earlier post about the Census Bureau, if it upset you. It was meant to be 'tongue-in-cheek' to help illustrate that the 'Census Bureau' post was a spoof and not an actual event.

[CarlG]

Originally Posted by 30coupeguy

I have in front of me the Volume 57 issue 3 (September/October 2012) copy of the MAFCA "Restorer".
Starting on page 24 are the remarks to the 2012 Convention by Edsel B. Ford ll. He states "The good news is that there are over 250,000 model A's still on the road today, many of them right here in Marquette this week. with another 750,000 or so awaiting restoration."
I personaly have zero knowledge on the subject and can not comment, butYes,I read and reread those numbers and I reread it again before replying to the thread.
Great subject, thanks for starting
Burt

There's your Million.

[DougVieyra]

"There's your Million", re: Edsel Ford II

We have to ask ourselves, 'Where did Edsel Ford II get that 250,000 number?" He got it from the same place that I first saw that number years ago. From an early 'Coffee Table' book show-casing the Model A Ford. The author then, and Edsel Ford II now, had/has no definitive viable source upon which to base that number. It just 'seemed' 'about' right, for the author of the Coffee Table book. The same can be said of Edsel Ford II (a man whom I greatly admire). Like many 'facts' and 'notions', without any valid basis, they just keep turning up, soon entering folk lore - or as some would say, "Ford Lore".

And IF Edsel Ford's other 'folk / Ford lore' number (750,000) is to be believed, that means that if you have a Model A in your garage, then you must also have three other Model A cars "awaiting restoration". And for every other restored Model A, there are three additional Model A's waiting for restoration. Well, I don't have the six (I have two restored Model A's) other cars for my share, so you must have my six in your garage, in addition to your own (3 or 6 or 9, etc.) cars to be restored. And I really do not believe that to be the case.

Now if Louis or Gaston Chevrolet were to have given the speech at the 2012 Convention, I am sure we would have heard a different number, more closely related to facts, with perhaps a gentle slant toward a lessor survival number. After all, it must be remembered that each salesman (whether Ford or Chevrolet) does have his own prejudice and bias motivation to 'spin' the facts in their own favor to advance their own agenda.

[ronn]

"Don't forget all the non USA A's as well. The A was a truly international car. I would just call the number 'lots'."


Upon further thought,
I know we have quite a few on this board from Down Under, a few from Germany and Europe, but am amazed that there doesn't seem to be anyone on here from Russia and very few from South America. It may be a matter of communication difficulty. but certainly a few A's exist over in Russia and elsewhere..... still looking for that elusive towncar!
Would love to have a weigh in of those not located here in the States.

[somethingspecial]

Did any body also count the hot rodders that took the body and sheet metal to make them

[BCCHOPIT]

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Don't forget new ones are made every day...
Don't forgot get about the Hotrods... I know of more
Hotrods then stockers.

[mikebowling]

Model A survival rate??I live in a pretty "normal" neighborhood and I have three, my neighbor behind me has 2or3 ( and a bunch of old trucks,stock cars,motorcycles etc) Another guy right down the street has a barn load of old cars including 2or3 Model A's and a ton of parts, and I'm 36 miles North of Boston- not exactly out in the sticks! They're EVERYWHERE and I'm glad so many have survived.Alive and doing well here! My Ford of choice? "30-31 all day long. Keep diggin' em up! Mike from Mass.

[Hitchhiker]

What about all the ones sitting in Museums. That has to be a significant quantity.

[glenn in camino]

I have 6 and none are for sale right now. I suppose someday my wife and daughters will sell them all cheap, just to get rid of them. I'm in good health right now, but stay tuned.

[ALAN BENNETT]

How many Model A's are listed with the DMV's that are hot rods.
I have it from a good source that the states are going to start to ask for pictures when renewing the yearly licenses! If the DMV's pull this off just for license revenue maybe we can get a more accurate count form the DMV's or maybe MAFCA or Maffi or Restores Club can do a project, then we just need to find out how many are not registered at all and haven't been for years!

[ronn]

Glenn, I'll take the wagon. Put my name next to it...............))

[DougVieyra]

Glenn - according to Edsel Ford II, besides the six cars you have restored, you also have another 18 cars 'to be restored'. Or is it that you have two cars restored and the other 4 are to be restored ?

Twenty-four Ford Model A's in anyone's garage is a bit of a clutter, so let's hope that you have just two cars restored and are "going to get around to it, one of these days", with the other four cars.
__________________________________________

Part of our problem in trying to 'get a handle' on a 'rough' number of how many Model A's have survived, is the fact that there is no definitive definition of what a Ford Model A is in today's cluttered car world. I do not want to start a new thread (although it might be an informative one) to get a consensuses of what constitutes a Ford Model A, but I suppose a few gound rules of definition would be in order.

Does a visually stock Model A, that has installed a Pinto engine, count ? Does a Gibbons Body with a fabricated 'box' frame, count ? Does a coupe that has been 'chopped and channeled', count ? Does that smashed up, rusted partial roadster body that sits in the 'South Forty' count ? The difficulty of where to 'draw the line', is why we shall never have an answer to 'How Many Model A's are left.

The passed 80+ years have left Henry's creation in a jumble of distorted variations and 'improved' versions of the original car. I suppose that because of the elusiveness of a firm definition and agreement of just what does constitute a Ford Model A, we can never get an answer to the question. But at least the question did get some of us to think about the question, and perhaps expand our understanding of how far some of us define what a Ford Model A is.

[CarlG]

Hmmmm, Looks like, smells like, sounds like, feels like . . . . . (am I missing something?)

[Gunmetal blue2]

I know of 2 Model A's in a woods that are all there but, have trees growing through them. To bad its been so long ago that don't remember were the woods is. I have a 1929 AA CCPU and not a member of any club.

[DougVieyra]

Carl G - ". . . am I missing something ?"
___________________________________

Six guys in a bar after three MINUTES of drinking : ask each of them 'WHAT' the perfect woman, "looks like, smells like, sounds like, feels like". You may find that you will hear six different answers.

Six guys in a bar after three HOURS of drinking : ask each of them 'WHAT' the perfect woman, "looks like, smells like, sounds like, feels like". You may find that you will hear six different answers - answers that differ from the ones they gave while still sober.

Ask the same six guys in church, three days later (and sober), and you may get six different answers - answers that are all together different from the ones they had said at the bar.
__________________________________________________ __

So as long as we have more than one guy to define the Model A, we will never know how many there are. So, I guess the best answer is : LOTS !
Now, all six or our guys, drunk or sober, in a bar or in church, should (maybe) agree on "How Many Model A's Are Left." WE are only left with the expression of our enthusiasm - LOTS ! - SCADS - A BUNCH - A BILLION - MORE THAN CHEVY ! ! !

[Bob Bidonde]

The survival number of Model "A" Fords is unrivaled by any other make and model of automobile.

[ronn]

except maybe VW beetles..................????????????????????????? ??????

[Bill G]

So,almost 6 years to the day from the original question, we still haven't come up with an answer??

[redmodelt]

The survival number of Model "A" Fords is unrivaled by any other make and model of automobile.
I don't think so: There is another car the Model T and maybe even the VW bug.

People ask the same question about the T and get just about as far as this got, no one knows for sure.

[daveymc29]

Personally I have run into Five or six collections that aren't open to the public, of all sorts of cars. The bulk of these collections is usually Model T and Model A, seems to me about 50-50. Then there are the guys that have Marmon's and Duesenberg's. They always seem to have six to 10 A's and T's as well. I have a friend that has 10 or more A's that are complete old cars and a couple he shows. Few will ever see any but the two or four that he shows and the one he drives on tours, but hi pile grows, I'm dow to two, so I can say for sure there are more than two, but anything else seems to be speculation. I ran into a warehouse in Oakland that must have 100 cars in it and people tell me this is only one of several, same in Vallejo. Found a few buildings in Buena Vista, population maybe 25, with probably 60 airplanes under roof and another 20 or 30 cars tucked in there and motorcycles in the owners house, in the living room. The numbers of all things collectible well absolutely amaze most of us, just in our home towns. I have no idea, but the million mark, if proven, wouldn't surprise me.

[denis4x4]

Every time this question pops up, I make the suggestion that MARC and MAFCA do a joint project and poll the insurance companies, state DMV’s and museums.

[Synchro909]

Originally Posted by denis4x4

Every time this question pops up, I make the suggestion that MARC and MAFCA do a joint project and poll the insurance companies, state DMV’s and museums.

That wouldn't cover any Model As outside the US and even then, I bet there are plenty out there just sitting in sheds not insured, not registered and belonging to people who are not members of a club.
I don't think this question can be answered accurately.

[Ted Duke]

IMHO no one knows how many Model A's are left. First, we can't agree of what is a Model A because do you count a chopped channeled V-8 with fat tires?



Second, Many are hidden. Mine is in a garage and not yet roadworthy. There is one across the street (restorable) and NOT for sale. Another less than a mile away is in a barn with chickens living on it (nice amateur restoration some years back, driven a few times and parked).


I know of several nearby belonging to people who are NOT in a club and NOT in anyone's COUNT. I would say about a dozen in my county. Mulitple it however you want... NO one KNOWS. LOL

[History]

My friend, who was a sea bee in Vietnam was telling me that he can think of around 60ish model A's in our county. The county has a population 11,000ish.

I'd bet there are very few, if any he doesn't know about.

[JoshuaSchubert2000]

I am aware of about 70 Model As here in mid-Missouri, including my own two, one of which is non-running and the other which is virtually a farm vehicle. Out of those 70, I’d say 60 are fully restored. These body styles range from the Woody to trucks to coupes and even a Vicky. All years are covered by these. Those 70 vehicles are split among about 50 guys. I don’t know if this is a good representation of just an excess in an area or what; that’s probably the case though. I’d say that from what I’ve seen and researched and the guys I’ve talked to that the 200,000 number would be a good international estimate, given the vast majority of European models were melted during the Second World War according to my European friends.

[john charlton]

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I think you would be really amazed at how many As survive .My son and I have 14 between us mainly by accident like Topsy said "they just grewed".I have worked in Brazil many still on the road in the seventies also Uruguay .We have 6 on the road here in England the rest are projects but with all parts . I would say 500000 to 750000 exist worldwide not counting GAZ .i know most of you will laugh in disbelief but TRUST ME !!!


John in Suffolk County England .

[Ernie Vitucci]

I think that John is in the ball park. Look how many companies sell parts for our cars. From what I know and the parts availability now vs in the 60's when I had my first 'A' it is far easier to bring on back than it used to be. Here in Arizona, we see them coming out of all sorts of storage places and going back on the road with almost all parts available at Arizona Model A, not to mention all of the national suppliers and clubs. Ernie in Arizona

[Tudortomnz]

You can probably get a good approximation of US numbers, but internationally, a survival rate in South America [ Ford US biggest export market] plus good survival rates in Sth Africa, Australia & New Zealand.Any cars found in War zones [ Europe & Asia]were often shipped back to conquerors country or destroyed. Gaz? Maybe not many.
250,000 worldwide?

[Jeff/Illinois]

I live in a small farming community. In our town and within two miles of town in the country we knew of 12 Model A Fords. All but one were restored and running. The unrestored one was a '30 Coupe that the owner had a health issue that set him back. There were Roadsters, Sedans, Coupes, an AA truck and a Roadster Pickup in the mix.

I was the only one who ever belonged to MAFCA. I gave issues of The Restorer to all of those guys and they all said 'no' they weren't interested in being in any clubs. They did like the magazines though

[Synchro909]

This thread so far has reminded me of one of my late father's favourite lines. "If all the economists in the world were laid end to end, they still wouldn't reach .... a conclusion!"

[bgarrett]

I have 10 Model As,only one registered and driving

[M.W.Miller]

I have found;when looking, I have yet to go into any small town and not find something related to a model T or model A.

[30 Closed Cab PU]

Originally Posted by Synchro909

This thread so far has reminded me of one of my late father's favourite lines. "If all the economists in the world were laid end to end, they still wouldn't reach .... a conclusion!"

lol

[HOTRODPRIMER]

4,858,644 is but one number quoted to have been built, I believe there arestill more than enough to satisfy the demand. HRP

[warrene]

I'm 86 and have been there/seen it, the reason there are so many Model A's (and T's for that matter) is because of Henry's insistence on quality and simplicity, he had the best engineers, the best metallurgists and the best workforce, I hate to dump cold water on you Chevrolet guys but facts are facts, the Chevy of those days was a poor car in many ways, far too much wood in bodies, poorer steels, axles would break with cars parked, the OHV valves poorly oiled. In the T days Chev' owners would replace their axles with Ford T axles (they fit) to avoid breakdowns.
In short, one look at the survivor rate tells the story, Ford made one hell of a good car, that's why they're still going and why the Chevrolet's are gone, or nearly so.
There, I've said it and I'm glad folks

warrene

[ronn]

not more then 5%

one in twenty is alot. most people do not own a model A.
but for some reason, many of you still think 20% of them are out there.
aint happenin!

[Pete]

Since the laws of physics have not been repealed, there can be only one answer to the question.
Every model A that was made still exists but not in the original condition. Some exist as new restored. Some exist as rust. Some exist as vapor.
You can NOT destroy matter. You can only change it's form.
However, we can now create matter with the Hadron Collider.

[Chuck Dempsey]

Pete - "However, we can now create matter with the Hadron Collider." Physics isn't my strong point. Does the collider create matter from energy? Seems like 'rust' and 'vapor' are matter, as much as the original steel or rubber. We convert matter to energy when we burn a candle. Have we now reversed it?

Thanks!

[Jim Huseby]

Maybe this has already been mentioned on this thread, but I wonder how many more Model A's there are now than when this thread began. I am building a phaeton from useless Model A scraps. I have also built ten running chassis from parts and then built the bodies for them, plus another 20 speedster bodies for A chassis. That's 31 Model A's that weren't, but now are. There must be a hundred other people doing the same now. www.olympicspeedsters.com

[Pete]

Originally Posted by Chuck Dempsey

Pete - "However, we can now create matter with the Hadron Collider." Physics isn't my strong point. Does the collider create matter from energy? Seems like 'rust' and 'vapor' are matter, as much as the original steel or rubber. We convert matter to energy when we burn a candle. Have we now reversed it?

Thanks!

Yes, matter is created from energy.

[Conaway2]

No one knows the answer to this question. I read somewhere years ago that approximately 50% of the cars originally produced have survived. I have no idea where this number came from, but I would like to believe it !@

[EJ]

I have one here in Birmingham UK.

[DBrer]

There are enough to keep a lot of parts houses in business thank goodness.