Preparing for the end.

[Stretch Cab]

No, I'm not a Prepper but I have been thinking a lot lately about what my wife would do if I died un-expectantly. My cars and stuff have been in storage for most of our married life (44 years this month) and now that we have settled down in the US I am getting unpacked and sorting and I'm realizing that I have a bunch of stuff along with cars that she really doesn't know anything about.

Obviously if I'm dead I won't have any say as to what she does with the cars and stuff and as obvious, I won't care. But I do care about not leaving her or the kids with any stress because of my toys.

Have any of you done a spread sheet or a simple list of your stuff and either listed who you wanted it to go to or stated a reasonable current value along with what you paid for it to help with a sale if needed?

If you have done the value part, where did you come up with your values? I think you would get tired if I started listing "what's it worth" posts!

I know values change over time but at least she would have a reference point to start with.

[Oldbluoval]

“What it’s worth”is a moving target and subject to opinion, situation and the economy at the time. What it’s worth of late has been weakening imho
It is good to get an inventory for sure and add today’s “worth”.
One of the best thing to do is line up a trusted fellow hobbyist to aid in dispersal. I repeat trusted!

[griffin]

I'm very fortunate in that my wife shares my enthusiasm of the old car hobby. I'm upfront with her on what things are valued at, but she's not concerned with that. Most likely she'll sit on stuff for a bit out of nostalgia but will eventually get with one of our many friends to help her value items at that time or simply gift cars/parts/tools to someone she knows will value and care for what has been given.
Her being active in the hobby keeps her keen to people who are dishonest as she has seen how vultures can circle.

[Dennis Pereira]

This has been on my mind as well like a take all price for the good bad and ugly .

[Eccentric Old Guy]

Get a will, and put your wishes in writing......problem solved!

willing.com makes it easy.

[KGBnut]

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My father is a clock collector. Some of his clocks are quite valuable (although antiques aren't as popular as they were just a few years back). His will is written in very general terms of what happens to his stuff. He took slips of paper, put peoples names on them and stuck them to the back of clocks; furniture, some of his tools, and important keepsakes. Whoever's name is on it, will get it. On some, he even wrote why he selected it for them.

He is 92 and still around...and still telling his best stories.

[Oldbluoval]

Eccentric…..not that easy but a will does specify who gets what. Will cannot produce a buyer at any value nor knowledge of the recipient.
The problem is I’ve seen many unsuspecting/unknowing heirs get $.10 on the $1.00. There a vultures among us.

[goodcar]

I listed everything done to the car, the costs and have the receipts. Listed a price range. Also have a few parts with values marked. Swagged the values based on ebay going prices--not asking prices. Who knows what will happen but I will rest better knowing that I at least tried.

[Ed in Maine]

This topic has been on my mind also. The hobby has been very good to me. I have had a lot of fun over the years. Obviously the big things, the cars, can be appraised and sold. I hope to enjoy them till the end. If I get the opportunity, (knowing the end is coming), I will strive to sell before. It is all the stuff that goes with the hobby, parts and tools that I want to be used by other restorers. There are plenty of young restorers, raising families, that are finding it difficult to participate in the hobby.



I think the answer can be easy. First, make it very clear to your heirs, DO NOT THROW THE STUFF IN THE DUMPSTER!!! It is time to help out the next generation of restorers. Contact your local Model A Clubs and give the stuff away. Most of the tools you have are well used and do not have a lot of value. It is important to label things so the future owner knows what he is looking at. In my case, there is Model T stuff, Model A stuff and 1932 stuff. Put things in one location and label the location. Alternatively, take your stuff to a flea market/car show and plan on selling it at a very reasonable low price. I would even consider a couple of "free piles" so you are not taking the stuff back home.



If you have any restorations in progress, make an effort to get the car back together and presentable. It is the only way it will have any value. Good luck everyone and make the most out of a wonderful hobby. Ed

[J Franklin]

Price paid and date gives a good reference point. Maybe add adjusted price if the item has been refurbished after it was purchased. After that, adjusting for the current conditions will be a lot easier. It might be best to take surplus to a few swap meets or some well described garage sales before you no longer can.

[nkaminar]

I just recently had a legal will prepared. But for all the miscellaneous stuff like the tools I wrote out a "living will" in my own handwriting. It is not legal but it is with the legal will and spells out what to do with the tools, etc. and also what was done to my Model A and the current estimated value. In the legal will the Model A gets sold and the proceeds divided among the kids. But if someone wants it bad enough they can buy it for the going price minus what would be their share of the proceeds and the remaining proceeds divided among the remaining kids. None of my kids have a burning desire to own the Model A. But who knows what will happen when the time comes. The living will can be revised at any time in the future.

In my living will, the parts go with the car. There are not that many, I try to keep the inventory down as much as possible and only keep spare parts around that I am likely to need.

I bought my Model T from a gentleman who was 85 and who felt it was time.

[JoeCB]

Ya' I hear you on this, not getting any younger here as well. I little variation on the issue.. Only one Model A and maybe a couple boxes of parts, should be no problem there. What will be a problem is the basement machine shop. A couple of lathes, shaper, mill, tooling, etc etc, We have been in this house for near 50 years. Fortunately we have a walk -out basement. so moving the heavy stuff is not too big a deal. Nice modern well maintained house 2k S.F. I had a thought the other day, market the house complete WITH the shop! Understand that will severely limit the market, but for the right guy, what a bonanza. Any real estate professional opinions?
Joe B

[alexiskai]

Where I live, there are a few auction houses that specialize in online estate sales, often living estates. I've noticed that tools, particularly vintage tools in good condition, tend to fetch good prices (good for the seller, I mean). The trick is to work with an auction house that already has a good mailing list of guys who are in the market for the sort of thing you're selling. Don't go with the one that does fine art and jewelry.

[ronn]

I like Eds take. give away the smalls and write a list every 2-3 yrs as to values of vehicles you own. It gives a starting point and that is what matters. If you are currently restoring a car, it will go up in value a bit, a few yrs out, by the improvements made. if left in pieces, it may even go down........

It isnt rocket science, but in the end, is a smart thing to do, as it doesnt take that long for you, as the collector, to figure out basic values.

[SHEC]

Trust in a family Trust legally prepared providing peace of mind and protection for all involved.
Wills have their place - trusts are accessible for updates etc.
Having covered two family members without a trust during probate.... believe me it’s well worth looking into.
You definitely want to avoid PROBATE Court.
Best to all ✔️

[Synchro909]

My biggest fear is that after I die, my wife sells my stuff for what I told her I paid for it!
Seriously now. I had a friend who owned several Model As and was diagnosed with a terminal condition. He had time to get things organised with his family and although she hasn't said so, his wife is selling off some of his collection at prices he put on them. IMO, that was smart because as soon as he took the assisted voluntary dying package and departed this world, I bet the vultures were circling.

[Ray in La Mesa]

I second SHEC, set up a trust for you & your wife. Family can turn ugly where $$$ are involved.

[woofa.express]

What should I do?

I have always had a love affair with the Model A since I was a kid but I was aged forty before I got one. As a kid I always wanted a bicycle but had a horse. That was not what I wanted.
As a result my four kids always got bicycles. In later years I bought three Model A’s and one classic G.M. Holden with the view of giving each of them an vintage or classic motorcar.
Myself, I am besotted with the A’s but don’t warm to the Holden but my kids have no interest in any. One saving Grace is one daughter in law likes two of the A’s. I can’t sell any because they have been allocated and promised.
Both Patsy and I have learned not to give our kids things that we think they should have. They have different aspirations which does not include vintage motorcars. I now wish I had purchased only one A for myself.
If you wish to read a short story on giving away the farm to the young generation do read story 166 from ‘tell a Model A story’. Whilst it is a good story and an eye opener for us all it is quite contrary to what I have written above.

[Oldbluoval]

Woofa….

One of my favorite quotes is from the movie “A River Runs Through It” with Brad Pitt..

“When you love someone the things you most want to give them are the things least wanted”

How true

[Incognito-A]

For vehicles: Make sure that the recipient is on the title with you, ie you “or” recipient whether that be your wife or kids. That is the easiest way to avoid putting vehicles in a will or trust and automatically avoids probate.

Car and collectible markets go up and down all the time. I’m not sure putting a fixed value on these items is the best way to go. Are you really going to spend the time and effort to price out everything on even an annual basis? My suggestion would be to have a trusted friend or two that knows your hobby, whatever it might be, to be listed as an advisor.

Get advice from a reputable estate planning attorney.

[eagle]

One thing I think about, I love my "stuff" but its almost always for a sentimental reason. There are a lot of farm retirement auctions here, usually because of a retirement to the cemetery. Its sad to see it but its life. If possible, make plans to give the items that mean most to you to someone you know will love it too. If its all about the money you're probably in it for the wrong reasons.

[Mulletwagon]

This prooved to be quite a thread ! Many good suggestions. I have noticed the best deals on classic cars - especially Model As - is often vehicles sold by widows who want them gone ASAP. My plan is to sell cars myself when I feel the time is right. I would much prefer to leave the family with $$ rather than stuff to unload by the fastest means.

[denis4x4]

When we had our trust and wills made, the attorney set the wills up with q blank page along with instructions on how that page becomes a legal document. In as much as there are constant changes in car ownership, it’s easy to keep it current. Putting values in a will is folly in my opinion. Same with the clause that Model A’s can’t be sold to a hot rodder. Try that one on Judge Judy!

[ricconhan]

Just take sticky notes and apply to the parts with a note to not sell for less than .....

[SHEC]

Originally Posted by denis4x4

When we had our trust and wills made, the attorney set the wills up with q blank page along with instructions on how that page becomes a legal document. In as much as there are constant changes in car ownership, it’s easy to keep it current. Putting values in a will is folly in my opinion. Same with the clause that Model A’s can’t be sold to a hot rodder. Try that one on Judge Judy!

Amen brother.
Auto prices can be a moving target. Like many true Ford fans, much of the value we put in them is sentimental. Like others have noted, I have seen many an A being sold for way less than what many perceive it to be worth. Families that have little or no interest in the car/truck often let them go for a fraction of what we think it’s worth.

Tough decisions ahead for many of us......

[Rodrelic]

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$hit, I realize I am nowhere on this now, thanks for the reality check. My daughter once asked me what my prewar A V8 was worth and answer is priceless. Sad son in law is clueless, cannot troubleshoot a lawnmower, etc….
Am just going to continue on making rods and hope to use up my parts and make good runners

[DKnapp]

I decided to give my Model A's away before I reached the end. My kids grew up in the Model A hobby, so they had an interest in them. I gave my son a late '31 Station Wagon, one of my daughters a late '31 Cabriolet and am giving my oldest Grandson a '29 Business Coupe. However, I am only 84 and decided we still needed a Model A, so I bought a '28 Speedster. I liked the speedster so much that I decided to use up some of my parts and am now just finishing building another Speedster. My six grandchildren all love the speedsters, so now I've got the problem of who gets the speedsters. I hope I live long enough that this problem resolves itself.

[ronn]

interesting how some of you resort to attorneys, wills and trusts. Not that Im saying its wrong, but are your valuables really that valuable? mine sure arent and the prices I set will be close enough to not have wasted $ on all of the fees and taxes some of you speak of. Perhaps there are many more rich people on this board then I realize..........?
yes rhetorical.


on another note, a few of you mention selling when the time is right. we dont always have that choice to make. Provided we are healthy that is fine. Have a major stroke or worse and how did that timing work out for you?

[Oldbluoval]

Understand lawyers and fees but…..always a but!
One better understand exactly what happens dying with out a will. In most states all goes to a spouse. If you have no spouse better understand how the attribution rules are in your state. Also better have cash accounts as joint or pay on death. Otherwise, deemed heir could be in for a long haul in getting access to funds.
Various powers of attorney should be in place in case you can’t act for yourself.
Unfortunately it’s not that easy to disregard the system. Banks, courthouse, insurance and DMV can make life miserable!!

[Mike Peters]

Our daughter once asked me what she is going to do with all my stuff, meaning cars, parts farm equipment, etc.
I told her to call the local auction company whom I trust, and they will come out, line it all up and sell it. She gets a check at the end of the day. Daughter liked this approach.

[jb-ob]

I'm in agreement with Blue Oval, why are you convinced you will be the first to go ?? If not, what then ?

Assuming you are the first to pass, why is it your family & friend's responsibility to dispose of the 'stuff' YOU bought ? Maybe it's time YOU started to lighten the collection in satisfying directions of YOUR choice.

True story.

I was asked by the Grandson what would it cost to have his Grandfather's car pin striped. After giving the Grandson the price, he said he would have to 'consult' with the family. The agreement among the family members was that the Grandson could enjoy the car as long as he maintained it. Any expenses had to be agreed upon by the family.

Grandfather bought the car new in 1931 in LA and when he passed, in his will he left a stipend to cover continuing maintenance expenses of the Sport Coupe so as not to burden his heirs.

(Thought sure they would have liked Grandfather's initials painted on the car as well, but "O, No", that was something Grand Dad would never have wanted.)

[Stretch Cab]

Good morning everyone,

I was going to jump back in last night but thought I would let it run until this morning. I must say that you have given me a lot to think about and a lot to get started on.
I too had the idea of owning a car for each of the grandkids but the reality of that has set in that most of them would not want it or know what to do with it.

When my dad passed away he thought he was dividing up his cars fairly and gave me a 53 Chevy Convertible and a 31 Deluxe Rdst. My brother got a 34 Cabriolet. I personally don't think the deal was fair for my brother but he isn't a car guy and gave the Cabriolet to his son who took the rare dual side mount front fenders off, along with the rear to make a "Hiboy" out of it. He is to busy so the Cabriolet just sits in his garage.

I gave my son the 53 and because of the cost of new tires and lack of time it too just sits in the garage. I had given my daughter my 30 Rdst. PU but now have it back in my garage after her divorce. At least her x didn't force her to sell it. I had given it to them thinking that they would enjoy it but her husband wasn't into old cars.

I think from reading all of your thoughts that I am going to sit down with the kids after talking to my wife and form a plan for making sure the government doesn't get anything from the deal and my wife and kids are happy.

I know we need a trust as soon as possible so I will start working on that. I will also incorporate some of your other ideas as well. I love just sitting and looking at my cars, memorabilia and tools. I actually call my shop my museum. It is mostly memories that I have made over the years so kind of hard to pass those along. Whether I wind up selling it all and enjoying retirement a little more if/when that day comes or saving it for the kids will remain to be seen. I may have sufficient time to know what would be best for them but am going to prepare as if I don't. After all, it is only stuff!

Thanks so much for letting me put this topic out there. Each of your responses were valuable.

[77Birdman]

Like them or not you need to consult an attorney and get a will. Things need to be spelled out. Let the lawyer know whom you want to have what. As far as parts that have been accumulated, get rid of all of that stuff now. Whether through sales or donations to clubs etc. If you dont plan on any more restorations keeping a bunch of stuff laying around is doing no one any favors. Keep the cars. May be over simplified but if you have a child that you want to have your car give it to them now. Transfer ownership but keep it in your possession until....Value means absolutely nothing at this point. Sticky notes, writing down on notebook paper, telling your best friend he can have such n such means ZIP at your demise. The courts will intervene. My wife works for an attorney and has seen this kind of situation way too many times. Unless its written in something that is legally binding it means nil.

[jb-ob]

And may your last check bounce........

[Roger V]

Several people I respected discussed this at a National Meet around eight years ago. When the majority came up with a age that was about ten years away, I started selling my near-50 year collection of parts and Model A's. I kept two that my wife didn't want to sell. She thanked me for not leaving a big task. I did tell her previously to just have an auction as it wasn't going to change her lifestyle as you can do very well on somethings and very bad on others. I maintain a list of my cars with current values for which I update periodically. I also list a company that she can call to come get the cars for consignment. Like others, my children are not interested. Since my tools would have an interest by all kinds of people, I told her to have an auction company pick them up. We have had a will and a trust since we were young so that's covered.

[SHEC]

Folks please consider this. Wills are good but don’t get your heirs out of Probate court.
Trusts do avoid Probate court.
Unless you have gone through the Probate process, then you truly may not know the extent of such a deal. Lotsa fun work (not), and a happy attorney on the other side. $$$$$$ in their pockets.
Wills are a reflection of the era of the Model A and maybe that is why many here only consider the will as a last stop. We thought of our family when we put together a family trust 25 years ago.

So perhaps the best solution is: drive the Fords all we want ( as I try to do) and sell a few things if that makes sense. Set up a trust and also have a will in place if you want to specify certain things to certain folks, and save the heirs more heartache when we exit the Ford road.
Just another thought about a not so fun topic - but a reality.

[SHEC]

Originally Posted by Stretch Cab

Good morning everyone,

I was going to jump back in last night but thought I would let it run until this morning. I must say that you have given me a lot to think about and a lot to get started on.
I too had the idea of owning a car for each of the grandkids but the reality of that has set in that most of them would not want it or know what to do with it.

When my dad passed away he thought he was dividing up his cars fairly and gave me a 53 Chevy Convertible and a 31 Deluxe Rdst. My brother got a 34 Cabriolet. I personally don't think the deal was fair for my brother but he isn't a car guy and gave the Cabriolet to his son who took the rare dual side mount front fenders off, along with the rear to make a "Hiboy" out of it. He is to busy so the Cabriolet just sits in his garage.

I gave my son the 53 and because of the cost of new tires and lack of time it too just sits in the garage. I had given my daughter my 30 Rdst. PU but now have it back in my garage after her divorce. At least her x didn't force her to sell it. I had given it to them thinking that they would enjoy it but her husband wasn't into old cars.

I think from reading all of your thoughts that I am going to sit down with the kids after talking to my wife and form a plan for making sure the government doesn't get anything from the deal and my wife and kids are happy.

I know we need a trust as soon as possible so I will start working on that. I will also incorporate some of your other ideas as well. I love just sitting and looking at my cars, memorabilia and tools. I actually call my shop my museum. It is mostly memories that I have made over the years so kind of hard to pass those along. Whether I wind up selling it all and enjoying retirement a little more if/when that day comes or saving it for the kids will remain to be seen. I may have sufficient time to know what would be best for them but am going to prepare as if I don't. After all, it is only stuff!

Thanks so much for letting me put this topic out there. Each of your responses were valuable.

Thank you for this real world look at the discussion. I like what you and many other thoughtful and knowledgeable folks have shared. With my A , I have jokingly told my son to set me in it and make it my funeral pyre as I know I am the sentimental keeper of the family Ford, with now one else to follow so far. Sick joke to some, perhaps - but sadly may ring true.
Congratulations on a real discussion with your loved ones. Good luck with the trust.
All the best ✔️🇺🇸

[Keith True]

There is a T buried about 3 miles from me,just outside the cemetery fence.A couple got married,neither had ever been married and were getting along in age.They bought a new T,and drove it to Niagra Falls.They had kept the T,and when the wife died the husband wanted the T to be buried with them.He was told there was no room for a car,but was told he could bury it outside the fence. The man that told me the story was the one who dug the hole.He got $3.to do it,and another $3.to drag the car to the site and place it with his team.I can't remember if he told me it happened before he went off to war,or just after.A friend was knocking a driveway in next to the cemetery,and I told him about the car buried there.He later told me that he struck iron about a foot down,and normally he would have ripped it out,but knowing about the car he just broke off what he needed to to get a driveway in there.

[SHEC]

Originally Posted by Keith True

There is a T buried about 3 miles from me,just outside the cemetery fence.A couple got married,neither had ever been married and were getting along in age.They bought a new T,and drove it to Niagra Falls.They had kept the T,and when the wife died the husband wanted the T to be buried with them.He was told there was no room for a car,but was told he could bury it outside the fence. The man that told me the story was the one who dug the hole.He got $3.to do it,and another $3.to drag the car to the site and place it with his team.I can't remember if he told me it happened before he went off to war,or just after.A friend was knocking a driveway in next to the cemetery,and I told him about the car buried there.He later told me that he struck iron about a foot down,and normally he would have ripped it out,but knowing about the car he just broke off what he needed to to get a driveway in there.

Further proof that truth is stranger than fiction. So, was he buried with his wife or in the T?

[Keith True]

They are buried side by side in the cemetery next to the fence,with the car about 8 feet away.I really wish I had gotten more information from the farmer that dug the hole and buried the car.I have no idea what year the T was,but was told the couple bought it new when they got married.My mother is the cemetary historian in town,she will have the ages and dates of death recorded.I thought she knew the whole story,turns out she only knew the basic facts.She didn't know who did the job,and she knew him well,she could have asked him at any time.If he was alive he would be 101 now.

[Gene F]

Originally Posted by Stretch Cab

Good morning everyone,

I was going to jump back in last night but thought I would let it run until this morning. I must say that you have given me a lot to think about and a lot to get started on.
I too had the idea of owning a car for each of the grandkids but the reality of that has set in that most of them would not want it or know what to do with it.

When my dad passed away he thought he was dividing up his cars fairly and gave me a 53 Chevy Convertible and a 31 Deluxe Rdst. My brother got a 34 Cabriolet. I personally don't think the deal was fair for my brother but he isn't a car guy and gave the Cabriolet to his son who took the rare dual side mount front fenders off, along with the rear to make a "Hiboy" out of it. He is to busy so the Cabriolet just sits in his garage.

I gave my son the 53 and because of the cost of new tires and lack of time it too just sits in the garage. I had given my daughter my 30 Rdst. PU but now have it back in my garage after her divorce. At least her x didn't force her to sell it. I had given it to them thinking that they would enjoy it but her husband wasn't into old cars.

I think from reading all of your thoughts that I am going to sit down with the kids after talking to my wife and form a plan for making sure the government doesn't get anything from the deal and my wife and kids are happy.

I know we need a trust as soon as possible so I will start working on that. I will also incorporate some of your other ideas as well. I love just sitting and looking at my cars, memorabilia and tools. I actually call my shop my museum. It is mostly memories that I have made over the years so kind of hard to pass those along. Whether I wind up selling it all and enjoying retirement a little more if/when that day comes or saving it for the kids will remain to be seen. I may have sufficient time to know what would be best for them but am going to prepare as if I don't. After all, it is only stuff!

Thanks so much for letting me put this topic out there. Each of your responses were valuable.

I had to giggle after reading this. I have been caught a time in the garage or barn, sitting in one of my cars with a cookie and a bottle of beer just enjoying the view. LOL (I'm 61)

[SHEC]

Originally Posted by Keith True

They are buried side by side in the cemetery next to the fence,with the car about 8 feet away.I really wish I had gotten more information from the farmer that dug the hole and buried the car.I have no idea what year the T was,but was told the couple bought it new when they got married.My mother is the cemetary historian in town,she will have the ages and dates of death recorded.I thought she knew the whole story,turns out she only knew the basic facts.She didn't know who did the job,and she knew him well,she could have asked him at any time.If he was alive he would be 101 now.

Now New Hampshire sounds like an interesting place. Thanks for sharing ✔️

[woofa.express]

It’s now your farm Wilhelm.

I worked in an area where there were several expat German farmers, one being Wilhelm Grieve. He could hardly speak a word of English, but he could manage to say “More beer Gary”.
A personable fellow with personable wife, Ingrid and 3 kids who became high achievers. His dad came to visit him I remember. He had only one hand and a hook in place of the second. Lost it on the Russian front and would have died had a high ranking officer and personal friend not spotted him and took him for medical help. Anyway I am getting off the point of this story.
Wilhelm inherited the family farm. A farm that had been in the family for over 440 years. One day Wilhelm said to dad “I would like to sell the farm” and dad said “it is now your farm Wilhelm” meaning it is yours to do what you wish. I have never forgot that and have adopted the same concept and practise.

I owned a pristine Piper Cub. It was totally rebuilt from a corrosion free airframe. Had intended to spend 65K on it but like old cars it escalated in cost. After two years the novel aspect wore off and it sat in the shed for another two years without me flying it. So I gave it to my son Dennis.
Not forgetting Wilhelm’s dad, I told Dennis he now owned it. After 5 years he traded it on a Cessna 180. That type once was our family aeroplane in which I taught he and his brother to fly in. He is tickled pink with his trade and I’m pleased for him although a little sorry to see the Cub go.
So what are we to do with our prized possessions? It’s an individual choice but don’t assume you know what your kids should have.
It is Wilhelm in the picture. Not far from reach is a stubby and glass of beer.
.

[woofa.express]

What should I do?

I have always had a love affair with the Model A since I was a kid but I was aged forty before I got one. As a kid I always wanted a bicycle but had a horse. That was not what I wanted.
As a result my four kids always got bicycles. In later years I bought three Model A’s and one classic G.M. Holden with the view of giving each of them an vintage or classic motorcar.
Myself, I am besotted with the A’s but don’t warm to the Holden but my kids have no interest in any. One saving Grace is one daughter in law likes two of the A’s. I can’t sell any because they have been allocated and promised.
Both Patsy and I have learned not to give our kids things that we think they should have. They have different aspirations which does not include vintage motorcars. I now wish I had purchased only one A for myself.

[ThosD]

I have been into the Model A hobby for 5 months. Before I started, I told my wife that I would probably be spending more on the project than it's projected market value. For me it's an investment in my soul, not my estate.
To her question about what to do with an old car and the parts that may not be attached, I told her to just call the local Model A club.

[Jeff/Illinois]

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Originally Posted by ThosD

I have been into the Model A hobby for 5 months. Before I started, I told my wife that I would probably be spending more on the project than it's projected market value. For me it's an investment in my soul, not my estate.
To her question about what to do with an old car and the parts that may not be attached, I told her to just call the local Model A club.

Welcome to the hobby! And, you have the right mind set

If you look at buying a new car or truck (Ph. Co. that I sit on the BOD for just bought a new Chevy Silverado, three quarter ton etc. etc. and is shelling out $54K before taxes and al of the extra costs) and it will be worth what, $20K in 4-5 years? So my point being, you buy a new car or truck and you will eat 20-30,000 in depreciation in just a very few years, so the money you put in a Model A Ford ain't that big of a deal

[ronn]

If you look at buying a new car or truck (Ph. Co. that I sit on the BOD for just bought a new Chevy Silverado, three quarter ton etc. etc. and is shelling out $54K before taxes and al of the extra costs) and it will be worth what, $20K in 4-5 years? So my point being, you buy a new car or truck and you will eat 20-30,000 in depreciation in just a very few years, so the money you put in a Model A Ford ain't that big of a deal
in the normal world Jeff, you would be correct. the way things are going, that new silverado might be worth 100k in 5 years.......................

[Brad in Germany]

Originally Posted by Incognito-A

For vehicles: Make sure that the recipient is on the title with you, ie you “or” recipient whether that be your wife or kids. That is the easiest way to avoid putting vehicles in a will or trust and automatically avoids probate.

Car and collectible markets go up and down all the time. I’m not sure putting a fixed value on these items is the best way to go. Are you really going to spend the time and effort to price out everything on even an annual basis? My suggestion would be to have a trusted friend or two that knows your hobby, whatever it might be, to be listed as an advisor.

Get advice from a reputable estate planning attorney.

Having a title with "or" with you and the other person listed on the title gives the right of the "or" person to sell your car when they see fit, at any time (even against your will). To protect your vehicle from the possibility of the other person selling it from under you (or before you are maybe ready to sell it), it is better to designate a beneficiary on the title instead. That avoids your car from entering probate, keeps it out of the total value of your estate (avoids possible taxes) and insures that the ownership of your car transfers to the person you wish, upon your demise.

In Maryland the process is super easy, just fill out the "Transfer Upon Death" form for your vehicle(s) and MD will then issue you a new title for your car which includes the TUD designation......so when you die, the designated person can immediately take possession of your car and dispose of it as they see fit, with no need to wait for the probate process. Most states offer similar TUP program for your vehicles and for anything else that has a title (or deed).

Similarly for your deeded property (house, land, farm, etc) you can designate a beneficiary directly on the deed in what is called a Life Estate Deed. That allows the transfer of the deed upon your demise but keeps the property out of probate.

Everyones' situation is different, but to avoid probate and to avoid the need to pay some expensive attorney to settle your estate and/or to manage a Trust, best to designate TOD (Transfer on Death) on all of your financial assets (bank accounts, investments, etc), and designate a beneficiary on your vehicle titles (per the above) and set up a Life Estate Deed for your property (or anything you might have that has a deed). Any tangible goods that do not have a title or deed can be covered in your will and with a codicil as things change in your estate after you have signed your will.

In addition, the disposition of specific tangible items in your estate (like car parts, collectables, jewelry, your collection of Amish quilts, heirlooms, petroliana collection, tools, etc) can be managed via a "Tangible Personal Property Memorandum".....which can be modified (without an attourney) as you add or dispose of items in your estate while you are still alive.

Brad in Maryland

[Jeff/Illinois]

Originally Posted by ronn

If you look at buying a new car or truck (Ph. Co. that I sit on the BOD for just bought a new Chevy Silverado, three quarter ton etc. etc. and is shelling out $54K before taxes and al of the extra costs) and it will be worth what, $20K in 4-5 years? So my point being, you buy a new car or truck and you will eat 20-30,000 in depreciation in just a very few years, so the money you put in a Model A Ford ain't that big of a deal
in the normal world Jeff, you would be correct. the way things are going, that new silverado might be worth 100k in 5 years.......................

True bud, these are crazy times for sure

[Jeff/Illinois]

Originally Posted by Brad in Germany

Having a title with "or" with you and the other person listed on the title gives the right of the "or" person to sell your car when they see fit, at any time (even against your will). To protect your vehicle from the possibility of the other person selling it from under you (or before you are maybe ready to sell it), it is better to designate a beneficiary on the title instead. That avoids your car from entering probate, keeps it out of the total value of your estate (avoids possible taxes) and insures that the ownership of your car transfers to the person you wish, upon your demise.

In Maryland the process is super easy, just fill out the "Transfer Upon Death" form for your vehicle(s) and MD will then issue you a new title for your car which includes the TUD designation......so when you die, the designated person can immediately take possession of your car and dispose of it as they see fit, with no need to wait for the probate process. Most states offer similar TUP program for your vehicles and for anything else that has a title (or deed).

Similarly for your deeded property (house, land, farm, etc) you can designate a beneficiary directly on the deed in what is called a Life Estate Deed. That allows the transfer of the deed upon your demise but keeps the property out of probate.

Everyones' situation is different, but to avoid probate and to avoid the need to pay some expensive attorney to settle your estate and/or to manage a Trust, best to designate TOD (Transfer on Death) on all of your financial assets (bank accounts, investments, etc), and designate a beneficiary on your vehicle titles (per the above) and set up a Life Estate Deed for your property (or anything you might have that has a deed). Any tangible goods that do not have a title or deed can be covered in your will and with a codicil as things change in your estate after you have signed your will.

In addition, the disposition of specific tangible items in your estate (like car parts, collectables, jewelry, your collection of Amish quilts, heirlooms, petroliana collection, tools, etc) can be managed via a "Tangible Personal Property Memorandum".....which can be modified (without an attourney) as you add or dispose of items in your estate while you are still alive.

Brad in Maryland

Good things to know, thanks.

Wish life was simpler but it isn't anymore.

[Oldbluoval]

One prime factor..
You better know state law in which you are domiciled.

[ronn]

cash it all in- bury it in the ground and leave a note to whomever is left.........


no probate
no lawyers
no stinkin government

[J Franklin]

Originally Posted by ronn

cash it all in- bury it in the ground and leave a note to whomever is left.........

no probate
no lawyers
no stinkin government

You must not have any friends or organizations you want to support.

[ronn]

Just my family J.


The ones that supported me.

[Oldbluoval]

So ronn….
When you gonna know when to do that? Now, next year…5 years from now?
So do it next year and then live another 20?
Seriously, that really isn’t planning as this thread was meant to be
But if that’s what you want to do…this is America have at it. Let us know and someone will get a metal detector and be all over your yard.
Don’t forget to leave a note in case not found!!

[ronn]

actually, have been selling off this past year. still have too much and am going to keep selling.


20 cars is too much. I will whittle it down to 5. I have a couple of detectors here.


Have at it! lol


we all have diff ideas Oldblue. Mine is not necessarily the "right" one, but I do laugh at all of you who make huge plans and spend more on lawyers then the estate is worth.


reminds me of life insurance..........spend spend spend for years and get little back in the end.
My "life insurance" is the rust in my yard. The wife will get by fine on it........
yes we eat road kill.

[Stretch Cab]

Hey Ronn, a relative passed away not long ago and just before he died his son was visiting him. He told the son upon his death to look in the 5 gallon buckets in the garage. I think the son looked on his way out and found almost $250,000.00 in cash under a layer of sand in the buckets.
As you said, no lawyers, probate or taxes. It has been a hassle to get it invested under the radar since then.

[ronn]

easy peasy Stretch- just buy silver and gold.


no inflation problem there. Everything else is overpriced at the moment.

[Keith True]

I don't think anybody will have to worry about a federal inheritance tax from my estate.I won't meet that 11 million dollar threshold where it kicks in.We don't have a state one where I live either.

[nkaminar]

We had a friend who just died. He was in his 60's and appeared healthy. Went into the hospital with a pulmonary embolism and was dead the next day. Point is it can happen very quickly. Best to be prepared and have a will. If nothing else, write something out in your own handwriting and stash it somewhere where it will be found.

[ronn]

sort of my point Keith

much adu about nothing. If you are wealthy, then you are the exception and already have everything in place.

[katy]

I'm 81 going for 100, when I get there I',m going for 200, I have a will and don't worry about "the end".

[ronn]

Katy,

interesting..... give us an idea of what Canadian law is on inheritance. would be interesting to know. I would also like to know how all of this goes "down under"....

no pun intended.

[clifforddward]

Comments about values over time are important considerations. I had a 68C back in the 1980s and I recently realized that now 30+ years later that same car would cost me less to acquire today....

[J Franklin]

Originally Posted by clifforddward

Comments about values over time are important considerations. I had a 68C back in the 1980s and I recently realized that now 30+ years later that same car would cost me less to acquire today....

I smell a little exaggeration, but then maybe not.

[katy]

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Originally Posted by ronn

Katy, interesting..... give us an idea of what Canadian law is on inheritance. would be interesting to know. I would also like to know how all of this goes "down under".... no pun intended.

All I know is that when my wife passed away a few years ago, we were co-owners of everything, estate, vehicles, chattel goods, etc. She had a will leaving everything to me and that I was executor of the estate. We were co-owners from the day we were married. I never heard from Revenue Canada about any tax owing.
I like to keep my mouth shut, as my dear old Dad told me: Just keep a smile on your face and your big mouth shut.

[ronn]

so Katy, somewhat similar to here in the US.

J franklin- I woulkd agree with clifford on some of that.....A 400s selling on BAT for 22k and 30k respectively. They couldnt have been bought that cheaply just 5 years ago.

While many of the basic cars are just holding their own, some of the expensive models have dropped ridiculously. which could be a good thing, if youre not selling.

[Gene F]

Originally Posted by ronn

so Katy, somewhat similar to here in the US.

J franklin- I woulkd agree with clifford on some of that.....A 400s selling on BAT for 22k and 30k respectively. They couldnt have been bought that cheaply just 5 years ago.

While many of the basic cars are just holding their own, some of the expensive models have dropped ridiculously. which could be a good thing, if youre not selling.

I can hardly believe how the prices of good "baby-birds" have dropped. Some of the expensive classics are likely next. The Packards are not always desirable to people that are turning 50 and up through about age 65. They seem to want muscle cars. Sure Packards won't be cheap, but I think their prices are going to start to drop.

[Mister Moose]

Originally Posted by Gene F

Sure Packards won't be cheap, but I think their prices are going to start to drop.

If so, I'd be happy to tool around in a 30's Packard roadster. Red please, with a camel top.

[Oldbluoval]

While many of the basic cars are just holding their own, some of the expensive models have dropped ridiculously. which could be a good thing, if youre not selling.

Yeah but…….these days with the cost of restoration (materials, labor, machine shop, plating..on and on) you’re going to be upside down in any Model A. It cost about as much, sometimes more, to restore a basic closed car (coupe, Tudor, Fordor) as a A400, 180a, cabriolet. Albeit the cabriolet is loaded with plating!
Of course the initial cost is more but more apt to recoup more dollars out of the rarer styles than the mass produced, large production basic body styles. Of late, I’ve seen basic well-restored coupes/tudors going for $10k ish; got to be 1/2 to 1/3 of invested cost
Imho

[ronn]

so moral of the story is to buy the best car you can......cheaper in the long run.

an old restoration can be much more affordable then a new one, at todays labor and materials rates.