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Old 10-02-2020, 06:19 PM   #1
fred93
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Default 29 Tudor stop light switch question

I replaced the old stop light switch with a new one and I adjusted it so the stop lights would not stay on when the brake pedal is released. After the owner drove the car a few times he said the the engine died and would not restart.

I had installed a 30 amp circuit breaker previously and he said the ammeter was going to full discharge and then back to zero. It kept doing that so I thought that the cutout points were sticking. After checking the cutout I found that it was working ok, but I found that there was a short in the stop light system. I looked under the car and found that the stop light switch rod had been pulled out too far and the pin actually fell inside of the switch housing, making a short. Then when the brake pedal was released the brake return springs actually bent the brake switch housing --see photos.

After I removed the switch and bent it back to it's original shape I reinstalled it and it still seems like the rod is too short or the whole switch needs to be moved forward. If I press down really hard on the brake pedal it seems like that rod would fall inside of the switch again.

Why would the pin fall into the housing like that?

I guess that I have something adjusted incorrectly?

I bought the switch from Bert's.
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File Type: jpg IMG_7442.jpg (59.1 KB, 80 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7450.jpg (53.3 KB, 84 views)
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Old 10-02-2020, 06:52 PM   #2
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

Not per judging standards. You can always replace the rod with a spring. Correct size and tension spring will not break or distort the switch.
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Old 10-03-2020, 08:59 PM   #3
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

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Originally Posted by modela@aol.com View Post
Not per judging standards. You can always replace the rod with a spring. Correct size and tension spring will not break or distort the switch.
Thanks for your reply--

The spring option at first sounded like a good idea, but the more I thought about the less I liked it.

So I decided to remove the switch and make the internal rod longer, that way it can never fall into the housing again. I also decided to put a fuse on the hot wire going to the switch. That way if there is ever another problem all that will happen is I won't have stop lights, but I will still be able to drive the car. The way it was left me strained on the side of the road!!!

The first photo is the switch without the extended rod--the second photo is after I extended the rod (I went a little over board on the length but I don't think that will be a problem--I figured I could always cut it back if needed)
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Old 10-03-2020, 09:31 PM   #4
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

I am a great believer that if you are the only mechanic in 90 years to make the rod longer that you have overlooked the real problem!
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Old 10-03-2020, 10:57 PM   #5
Dan Partain
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

The real problem is that your brake pedal is moving too far due to the brake system. The brake pedal won't move very far the brakes are restored and adjusted properly.
In other words, if your brake pedal is moving far enough to dislodge the shaft of the brake switch you have a problem with the brakes.
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Old 10-04-2020, 01:18 AM   #6
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Partain View Post
The real problem is that your brake pedal is moving too far due to the brake system. The brake pedal won't move very far the brakes are restored and adjusted properly.
In other words, if your brake pedal is moving far enough to dislodge the shaft of the brake switch you have a problem with the brakes.
X2 Definitely.
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Old 10-04-2020, 05:55 AM   #7
Mike Peters
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question
The real problem is that your brake pedal is moving too far due to the brake system. The brake pedal won't move very far the brakes are restored and adjusted properly.
In other words, if your brake pedal is moving far enough to dislodge the shaft of the brake switch you have a problem with the brakes.

This is probably why Ford went to a different stop light switch in 1930. The newer style works the opposite way the 28-9 style works. With the newer style switch, the brake pedal contacts the switch in the off position when pedal is NOT depressed. Contact with switch is released when brake pedal IS depressed in the on position. Therefore, not matter how out of adjustment your brakes are, your stop light switch will never be damaged.
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Old 10-04-2020, 09:54 AM   #8
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

Could it also be due to "reproduction" failure?

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Old 10-04-2020, 01:43 PM   #9
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

So, here's a picture of an NOS brake light switch. The rod extends about 1-1/2" from the body while the switch is relaxed. I suspect that Dan is correct in that the travel of your brake pedal is way too excessive.
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Old 10-04-2020, 03:17 PM   #10
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

I had exactly the same problem on the 28, took the break light switch apart and made the rod longer and it solved the Problem of having it get stuck inside the switch and shorting out. Also had a problem with the copper contacts inside the switch connecting as the break is depressed, had to bend them a little to make sure they touched When the break was depressed.

Last edited by Dougs 28; 10-06-2020 at 04:51 PM.
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Old 10-04-2020, 06:30 PM   #11
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

In Fred's first picture, it looks like the rod is being pulled from the housing at an angle. Is this correct? Shouldn't it be pulling straight out of the switch housing?

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Old 10-05-2020, 04:34 PM   #12
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Karr View Post
So, here's a picture of an NOS brake light switch. The rod extends about 1-1/2" from the body while the switch is relaxed. I suspect that Dan is correct in that the travel of your brake pedal is way too excessive.
Thanks for your reply Gary,

The reproduction stop light switch that I purchased from Bert's only extends one inch, when in the relaxed position (see photo)

I guess that puts the finger on the Chinaman that made the repo switch.
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Old 10-05-2020, 04:54 PM   #13
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

Quote:
Originally Posted by w.michael View Post
In Fred's first picture, it looks like the rod is being pulled from the housing at an angle. Is this correct? Shouldn't it be pulling straight out of the switch housing?

W. Michael
Thanks for your reply,

When the switch rod went past the rear support of the housing and fell inside the housing, the rod had no place to go when the brake pedal was released. So what happened is the rod hit the rear support somewhere other than the hole in the support and the force was so great that it bent the housing and the rod.

I am aware that I made the extension longer than I needed. But the extra length is not interfering with anything else and I will guarantee you that the switch will NEVER do that again!! That situation left the owner with a car that had to be towed back home, not good!
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File Type: jpg 1-2020.10.02 DAMAGED STOP LIGHT SWITCH.jpg (77.5 KB, 16 views)
File Type: jpg 3-2020.10.02 BENT SWITCH.jpg (61.7 KB, 13 views)
File Type: jpg 5-SWITCH ROD BENT.jpg (62.2 KB, 16 views)
File Type: jpg 7-After welding extension.jpg (58.4 KB, 14 views)
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Old 10-05-2020, 07:47 PM   #14
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

About a year back there was a batch of 28-29 switches that the rods were too short and pulled out of the housings. Returned them all to our supplier, ones we have now are correct as are the NORS Cole-Heresee ones we have.
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Old 10-05-2020, 08:03 PM   #15
fred93
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Partain View Post
The real problem is that your brake pedal is moving too far due to the brake system. The brake pedal won't move very far the brakes are restored and adjusted properly.
In other words, if your brake pedal is moving far enough to dislodge the shaft of the brake switch you have a problem with the brakes.
Thanks for your reply--

I can't stay that the brakes have been adjusted per what ever books are out there, but I do know the the pedal does not go to the floor when pressed. I adjusted all four wheels so that the brake shoes were just starting to touch the drums. After adjusting the brakes I had a very firm pedal with minimal pedal travel. I am sure that when Henry designed this car he took in to account that the brakes would eventually wear down and the pedal will travel more and more.

Look at the photo that Gary Karr posted and then look at the photo of the repo part that I bought from Bert's. I rest my case!
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File Type: jpg Original stop light switch from Gary Karr.jpg (47.5 KB, 15 views)
File Type: jpg new repo from Bert's.jpg (49.7 KB, 16 views)
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Old 10-05-2020, 08:08 PM   #16
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

Quote:
Originally Posted by OLDMANKOHOUT View Post
About a year back there was a batch of 28-29 switches that the rods were too short and pulled out of the housings. Returned them all to our supplier, ones we have now are correct as are the NORS Cole-Heresee ones we have.
Thanks for your reply--

I purchased this switch on Oct 10, 2019

Lucky me!
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Old 10-05-2020, 08:10 PM   #17
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

Quote:
Originally Posted by McMimmcs View Post
I am a great believer that if you are the only mechanic in 90 years to make the rod longer that you have overlooked the real problem!
Thanks for your reply--

It seems that there are others that had the same problem! Read them!
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Old 10-06-2020, 11:43 AM   #18
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Default Re: 29 Tudor stop light switch question

I want to thank everyone who replied to this post. I just spoke Steve at Bert's about the situation with the stop light switches. I found out that the switch that I bought last year is the same switch that is being sold today. And that switch does have a shorter rod then the original; however, when the brakes system is adjusted properly it has been working okay.

As I see it, the shorter rod is a problem when the brakes start to wear down. Supposedly, no one makes a correct stop light switch at this point. Steve's suggested using an original stop light switch, if possible.

My suggestion is that if you cannot find a good original switch you CAN modify the reproduction switch. See prior posts for modification.
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