Yes,there IS such a critter as a factory FOM flat 6 Ford!

[LazarusLong]

And I FINALLY found one and bought it all. Come to find out,even the tailshaft and the driveshaft are different than those on the flat V-8 FOMs.


Can't say this stuff is rare,but a couple of years ago the Henry Ford Museum people told me they had never seen a flat 6 FOM.


Now that I have this,I can finally put my 51 Victoria up for sale. Refused to sell it before because if the VA finally amputates my left leg,I wouldn't have a shoebox to drive.


All I need now is to get some money to finish the upholstery in the Vicky,get it painted,and put the new chrome on it. I should easily get enough money from selling it to completely redo my 51 biz coupe,and have money left over.


HEY! I have been told all my life that "There is a first time for everything"!

[LazarusLong]

test

[tubman]

Pictures please.

I wish I was rich! I'd buy your Victoria in a heartbeat. I already have someone who covets my coupe.

[39deluxecp]

What are you talking about

[tubman]

Mr. Long (he has taken his avatar name from a character in a Robert Heinlein novel. Methuselah's Children) has an interest in 1951 Fords. Because of some phyical problems, he would like to install a Ford-A-Matic in his 1951 Ford DeLuxe coupe. Most of us here do not believe that Ford offered their new automatic transmission behind the "H" 6 cylinder engine, because it would have been a very unpopular 1 year only option.

He appears to have found an existing example.

Is that essentially correct, Mr. Long? (I apologize for stepping in here, but when I am is such a position, I find that everything is more clear to all if a third party explains what's going on).

[flatford8]

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The part I didn’t get was “FOM”.......so it’s Ford-O-Matic ......right? ......good luck with your project!!...........Mark

[LazarusLong]

Originally Posted by tubman

Pictures please.

I wish I was rich! I'd buy your Victoria in a heartbeat. I already have someone who covets my coupe.

I'm weird. I bought the Vicky because it had a FOM trans,and I could get by with it until I could find the "right" 6 cyl biz coupe and the parts to convert it to auto trans.


Yes,I know a C4 CAN be adapted to the flat 6,but I didn't want a C4. I wanted an original flat 6 auto trans option to prove to people such a thing really did exist.



Keep an eye out because once I get it repainted ,the interior refinished,and get all the new chrome on it,this is one of the place I will be listing it. Need to sell it to get the money to redo the coupe.

[LazarusLong]

Originally Posted by tubman

Mr. Long (he has taken his avatar name from a character in a Robert Heinlein novel. Methuselah's Children) has an interest in 1951 Fords. Because of some phyical problems, he would like to install a Ford-A-Matic in his 1951 Ford DeLuxe coupe. Most of us here do not believe that Ford offered their new automatic transmission behind the "H" 6 cylinder engine, because it would have been a very unpopular 1 year only option.

He appears to have found an existing example.

Is that essentially correct, Mr. Long? (I apologize for stepping in here, but when I am is such a position, I find that everything is more clear to all if a third party explains what's going on).

Mr tubman,your understanding is perfect.



I HAD to post about it here because I know of no other place with such dedicated shoebox fans,and as I had mentioned before,even the people at the Henry Ford Museum had never heard of or seen a flat 6 51 Ford with a FOM transmisson.


Others,including shoebox parts vendors and restorers told me such a thing had never existed,despite me having factory sales literature produced by Ford offering the new Automatic trans as an option with the 6 cylinder engine.


Basically,I found it by hounding ebay sellers who were selling 51 Ford stuff. I would just send them emails through ebay asking if they had any FOM parts for a flat 6 Ford,and after several years,got lucky when one seller answered that he had it all and would sell it for 400 bucks.


AFAIC tell,the ONLY thing he was missing was a FOM steering column,which I already have.


I will try to post some photos of the tailshaft and driveshaft tomorrow.

[LazarusLong]

Originally Posted by flatford8

The part I didn’t get was “FOM”.......so it’s Ford-O-Matic ......right? ......good luck with your project!!...........Mark

Yup,FOM is shorthand for Ford-0-Matic,although it is usually abbreviated as F-O-M.



I abbreviated even that here because I didn't think anyone here would be confused by it.


My apologies.

[51 MERC-CT]

Although Ford may have equipped some of their '51 6 cyl. cars with the automatic, I don't ever recall them being offered to the public.
I can visualize someone at some time fabricating a conversion for their personal use as a possibility.

[LazarusLong]

Originally Posted by 51 MERC-CT

Although Ford may have equipped some of their '51 6 cyl. cars with the automatic, I don't ever recall them being offered to the public.
I can visualize someone at some time fabricating a conversion for their personal use as a possibility.

I have factory sales literature that says you are wrong.

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by LazarusLong

I have factory sales literature that says you are wrong.

I said I did not recall them being offered to the public.
I did not say that they did not.
How am I wrong?

[LazarusLong]

You were wrong because they WERE offered to the public.


I also vaguely recall reading somewhere that the sold so poorly,at one point Ford just scrapped the unsold flat 6 FOM shoeboxes.


Which kinda makes sense. Ford was all about V-8's back then,and the typical Ford buyer wanted a V-8.


Add to that the biz coupes were mostly fleet sales and fleet buyers wouldn't want to spend extra on an option like that when they could have a standard trans with overdrive.


Different times/different world.

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by LazarusLong

You were wrong because they WERE offered to the public.


I also vaguely recall reading somewhere that the sold so poorly,at one point Ford just scrapped the unsold flat 6 FOM shoeboxes.


Which kinda makes sense. Ford was all about V-8's back then,and the typical Ford buyer wanted a V-8.


Add to that the biz coupes were mostly fleet sales and fleet buyers wouldn't want to spend extra on an option like that when they could have a standard trans with overdrive.


Different times/different world.

Ok, I will surrender and accept that you think I am wrong.
Now, I will offer a little information about the fitment of the torque converter to the engine.
When fitted to the V8 the crankshaft is different from the standard shift crank.
It requires that the crank hole to be bigger.
This may or may not apply to the 6cyl.
If the crank was meant for the standard configuration it may be too small and require machining.
This most likely means engine disassembly.
In addition, the automatic starter is different than the standard starter.
Just something to consider.

[RalphG]

Here is an original Fordomatic ad for 1951. They state, "available for the 100 hp V8 and the 95 hp six. It was not an issue here in Canada since I don't think six cylinder engines were even offered in the shoebox Fords.

[tubman]

He's right; I blew the picture up until I could read it and it says "95 HP Six".

Had to be very unpopular for the reasons "Lazarus Long" stated. This was done after Henry's passing; he would never have wasted the time and effort. I'll bet they lost a ton on each one they built.

[rotorwrench]

Ford did a mid year 6- cylinder change for the first G series in the 1941 pickups. They had to change the front cross member to get it to fit since it was still using the early type frame but more of them survived due to the popularity of that design.

The Tudor & Fordor sedans were popular in that time frame and a lot of folks likely wanted to try out the new FOM trans. The Korean War was on and it looks like it had an effect. I've not yet seen an H-series motor with an automatic but I'm not surprised if they are out there. There were certainly plenty of V8s that had them. I'd love to see a photo of that motor & trans.

[petehoovie]

Originally Posted by RalphG

Here is an original Fordomatic ad for 1951. They state, "available for the 100 hp V8 and the 95 hp six. It was not an issue here in Canada since I don't think six cylinder engines were even offered in the shoebox Fords.

[LazarusLong]

FOM FLAT 6 BELL.jpg

I hope this thing gets bigger when you click it. Not very computer literate,but this is a list of the parts for a 1951 Ford Ford-O-Matic transmission,both 6 cylinder and V-8.


I am ASSUMING that where there are no different parts numbers for a flathead 6,that those parts will work with either. This is just a GUESS,so try to find someone who knows this to be a fact before you go spending a lot of money on any of these parts.


Will post photos of the trans and the driveshaft later,when it cools down enough for me to go outside and in my storage building. Damn stuff weighs a freaking ton!

[petehoovie]

Originally Posted by LazarusLong

Attachment 471550