The Ford Barn

capthayes · 10-18-2023, 01:06 PM

Hello all. I could use some guidance from the expert's.

I purchased a 1946 super deluxe sedan that had been in long term storage (12 years).

The guy I bought it from bought several from an estate sale.

Car looks really great. They replaced the fuel tank, fuel filter, pump and distributor and got the engine fired up.

It had no brakes and numerous electrical issues from sitting so long.

I trailered it home and replaced the master cylinder, wheel cylinders, brake lines, and all shoes.

I had no issues with the front but had a difficult time getting the left rear drum and hub off. I did have the special tool but still had a hard time.

After I replaced the shoes and cleaned up the drums I attempted to install the drums and hubs. The right rear went on okay but I battled with the left rear and when I got it on it was so tight I could not turn it even with the brakes adjusted all the way in. I took the drums to several machine shops for turning but none had a tool small enough to go through the hub.

After fighting with it I decided there must be something wrong with the hub and drum so I ordered new rear drums and hubs.

Installed bearings and seals in the hubs and installed hubs.

Cleaned drums prior to install. They went on but were still tight so I did not adjust shoes at all.

Car is in the air on jacks with rear tires and wheels installed. I started and ran in gear thinking they might just need to be run in.

No luck, still to tight to turn by hand.

Also, the only wheel that spun while in gear was the drive side. Is that correct?

Any advise would be greatly appreciated.

Ggmac · 10-18-2023, 01:13 PM

Sometimes aftermarket shoes ar made a little longer where they go into the wheel cyl .
Another possibility is that the e brake isn’t completely released . Did you try to remove the ebrake cable ? Compare your old shoes to the new and compare the tabs that go into the wheel cyl . Im working on a 41 and 46 now .

capthayes · 10-18-2023, 03:00 PM

help

capthayes · 10-18-2023, 03:04 PM

Thank you Ggmac. I heard that from the sales guy at early ford south. I did disconnect the emergency brake. Still the same. I will try grinding down the tabs a bit tomorrow.

Also, do you know which wheel is the drive wheel? When I had it on jacks and running in gear the left rear was the only wheel turning.

capthayes · 10-18-2023, 03:10 PM

I have not figured out how to see new responses without me replying to the thread

47topless · 10-18-2023, 03:15 PM

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Why did you replace the shoes? If you can remember which wheel they came off of, replace the old shoes back on and see if that solves the tightness. Or, as suggested above, compare the new shoes with the old ones. May at least give you some clues.

Ggmac · 10-18-2023, 03:47 PM

Did you make sure the brake shoe tabs are seated in the slots of the wheel cyl pistons ?

Your rear end is a differential, not a posi , it’ll put power to one wheel , the one with least resistance. If you were on jack stands SAFELY in gear and idling, pull on the parking brake cable running to one rear wheel ( after the split ) it should make the other wheel spin .

capthayes · 10-19-2023, 03:48 AM

Some of the shoes were deteriorating due to long exposure from brake fluid after the cylinders failed. I dont have the old shoes to compare. Thanks all. I will dive in again and see if I can grind down a bit to make the work.

alanwoodieman · 10-19-2023, 07:29 AM

usually just the very end of the shoes need a little grinding down, make sure the adjustments are all the way in and have not gone beyond the stop part which must be against the shoe but not pushing it out. try a machine shop with a big lathe to turn the rear drums that is how I do it.

1942deluxe · 10-19-2023, 10:01 AM

I ran into the same problem on my 46 Fordor. I ground the end of shoes that goes into the wheel cylinder. One drum was tighter than the other so I used a fairly thin drum I had on that wheel. Still not happy with it. On my 42 I had no issue but that has the adjusters at the bottom of the backing plate. Following....

capthayes · 10-20-2023, 08:59 AM

Well I ground down the tabs on the shoes and got that to work, However I still have an issue with the new hubs. For some reason they do not quite fully seat. The hubs spin if installed by themselves. The drums spin if installed by themselves. When I put them togeather I can see that the hub is not fully seated. I put the old hubs and drums on and they do seat.

I am going to put a call in to C and G to see if they can provide technical help. That is where I purchased the hubs, drums, bearings and seals.

Newc · 10-20-2023, 10:05 AM

Note the upper inside edge of the 'Key' must have a rounded edge- the 'key' upper edge can bite into the hub. Been there. Newc

capthayes · 10-22-2023, 06:06 AM

Newc, Thanks and I removed the key and rounded the edge as you advised. Still the same.

I suspect the the drums are bottoming out on the brake shoes. The manufacture of the drums and hubs has a tolerance stack problem.

I put the old drums and hubs back on an plane to return my entire order to C and G.

10-18-2023, 01:06 PM	#1
capthayes Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2023 Posts: 11	1946 super deluxe sedan rear axile Hello all. I could use some guidance from the expert's. I purchased a 1946 super deluxe sedan that had been in long term storage (12 years). The guy I bought it from bought several from an estate sale. Car looks really great. They replaced the fuel tank, fuel filter, pump and distributor and got the engine fired up. It had no brakes and numerous electrical issues from sitting so long. I trailered it home and replaced the master cylinder, wheel cylinders, brake lines, and all shoes. I had no issues with the front but had a difficult time getting the left rear drum and hub off. I did have the special tool but still had a hard time. After I replaced the shoes and cleaned up the drums I attempted to install the drums and hubs. The right rear went on okay but I battled with the left rear and when I got it on it was so tight I could not turn it even with the brakes adjusted all the way in. I took the drums to several machine shops for turning but none had a tool small enough to go through the hub. After fighting with it I decided there must be something wrong with the hub and drum so I ordered new rear drums and hubs. Installed bearings and seals in the hubs and installed hubs. Cleaned drums prior to install. They went on but were still tight so I did not adjust shoes at all. Car is in the air on jacks with rear tires and wheels installed. I started and ran in gear thinking they might just need to be run in. No luck, still to tight to turn by hand. Also, the only wheel that spun while in gear was the drive side. Is that correct? Any advise would be greatly appreciated.

10-18-2023, 01:13 PM	#2
Ggmac Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: Lake worth Florida Posts: 1,101	Re: 1946 super deluxe sedan rear axile Sometimes aftermarket shoes ar made a little longer where they go into the wheel cyl . Another possibility is that the e brake isn’t completely released . Did you try to remove the ebrake cable ? Compare your old shoes to the new and compare the tabs that go into the wheel cyl . Im working on a 41 and 46 now .

10-18-2023, 03:00 PM	#3
capthayes Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2023 Posts: 11	Re: 1946 super deluxe sedan rear axile help

10-18-2023, 03:04 PM	#4
capthayes Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2023 Posts: 11	Re: 1946 super deluxe sedan rear axile Thank you Ggmac. I heard that from the sales guy at early ford south. I did disconnect the emergency brake. Still the same. I will try grinding down the tabs a bit tomorrow. Also, do you know which wheel is the drive wheel? When I had it on jacks and running in gear the left rear was the only wheel turning.

10-18-2023, 03:10 PM	#5
capthayes Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2023 Posts: 11	Re: 1946 super deluxe sedan rear axile I have not figured out how to see new responses without me replying to the thread

10-18-2023, 03:15 PM	#6
47topless Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2022 Posts: 281	Re: 1946 super deluxe sedan rear axile Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Why did you replace the shoes? If you can remember which wheel they came off of, replace the old shoes back on and see if that solves the tightness. Or, as suggested above, compare the new shoes with the old ones. May at least give you some clues.

10-18-2023, 03:47 PM	#7
Ggmac Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: Lake worth Florida Posts: 1,101	Re: 1946 super deluxe sedan rear axile Did you make sure the brake shoe tabs are seated in the slots of the wheel cyl pistons ? Your rear end is a differential, not a posi , it’ll put power to one wheel , the one with least resistance. If you were on jack stands SAFELY in gear and idling, pull on the parking brake cable running to one rear wheel ( after the split ) it should make the other wheel spin . Last edited by Ggmac; 10-18-2023 at 03:52 PM.

10-19-2023, 03:48 AM	#8
capthayes Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2023 Posts: 11	Re: 1946 super deluxe sedan rear axile Some of the shoes were deteriorating due to long exposure from brake fluid after the cylinders failed. I dont have the old shoes to compare. Thanks all. I will dive in again and see if I can grind down a bit to make the work.

10-19-2023, 07:29 AM	#9
alanwoodieman Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: upstate SC Posts: 2,964	Re: 1946 super deluxe sedan rear axile usually just the very end of the shoes need a little grinding down, make sure the adjustments are all the way in and have not gone beyond the stop part which must be against the shoe but not pushing it out. try a machine shop with a big lathe to turn the rear drums that is how I do it.

10-19-2023, 10:01 AM	#10
1942deluxe Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Albion, PA Posts: 713	Re: 1946 super deluxe sedan rear axile I ran into the same problem on my 46 Fordor. I ground the end of shoes that goes into the wheel cylinder. One drum was tighter than the other so I used a fairly thin drum I had on that wheel. Still not happy with it. On my 42 I had no issue but that has the adjusters at the bottom of the backing plate. Following....

10-20-2023, 08:59 AM	#11
capthayes Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2023 Posts: 11	Re: 1946 super deluxe sedan rear axile Well I ground down the tabs on the shoes and got that to work, However I still have an issue with the new hubs. For some reason they do not quite fully seat. The hubs spin if installed by themselves. The drums spin if installed by themselves. When I put them togeather I can see that the hub is not fully seated. I put the old hubs and drums on and they do seat. I am going to put a call in to C and G to see if they can provide technical help. That is where I purchased the hubs, drums, bearings and seals.

10-20-2023, 10:05 AM	#12
Newc Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 2,488	Re: 1946 super deluxe sedan rear axile Note the upper inside edge of the 'Key' must have a rounded edge- the 'key' upper edge can bite into the hub. Been there. Newc

10-22-2023, 06:06 AM	#13
capthayes Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2023 Posts: 11	Re: 1946 super deluxe sedan rear axile Newc, Thanks and I removed the key and rounded the edge as you advised. Still the same. I suspect the the drums are bottoming out on the brake shoes. The manufacture of the drums and hubs has a tolerance stack problem. I put the old drums and hubs back on an plane to return my entire order to C and G.