|
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) |
|
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
05-10-2021, 11:04 AM | #1 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: SW WA
Posts: 639
|
PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Hello... As some of you know, I am in the middle of restoring my '36 Pickup. I now have two choices on engines for my pickup, the 8BA that it came with when I bought it, and a '41 59A thanks to a fellow Barn member. I am leaning towards using the 59A and am looking for recommendations on experienced flathead engine rebuilders or machinist in the PNW. I am in halfway between Seattle and Portland, but would be willing to travel up to 5 hours, possibly more, for the right person. I am not opposed to doing some of the disassembly and reassembly, but I have no way to do any of the machine work, and would be more comfortable having someone with experience rebuild at least the short block for me. Any recommendations on shops or things that I should consider are appreciated.
Thanks for the help! |
05-10-2021, 11:13 AM | #2 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Minnesota, Florida Keys
Posts: 10,259
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
I think the first thing you should do is determine exactly which early engine you have. There is no such thing as a 1941 59A. The "5" designates the year of introduction, in this case 1945. If it is a '41 engine, here is a good chance that it is a 221 ci rather than a 239. If it really is a 59n (there are a bunch of varieties), it would probably the best choice if both engines are in the same shape. You should also be aware the the pre-'49 engines have full-floating rod bearings, which can be hard to find, expensive, and difficult to fit. Unless you already know the condition of both blocks, the first thing you have to do is disassemble them and do some preliminary crack checking. You decision may have already been made for you.
The way things currently work out, you will be lucky if even one of the blocks is good. |
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) |
|
05-10-2021, 11:49 AM | #3 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: East Shore of LAKE HOUSTON
Posts: 11,106
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Quote:
Not so fast.....! As so eloquently explained by our illustrious friend Bruce Lancaster (RIP), see below. "I believe the 41A was of course given the "1" designation in the parts book to indicate that it was in the 221 family, but was made with a full set of 59 cores except for the actual barrels and so retained the 59 designation. 3 1/16 59 blocks are around, but I don't know of anyone who has seen a 41 casting...hence my belief that these oddities ARE the 41A block. The "1" designation generally survived here with the 51, indicating Ford as distinguished from Merc models and parts...then in '47-8 and on into the early '50's the parts prfixes went nuts for a while." In other words, a "factory" REPLACEMENT block for '38-'42 24-stud, 221 cu. in. engines. DD Last edited by V8COOPMAN; 05-10-2021 at 02:10 PM. |
|
05-10-2021, 01:57 PM | #4 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: langley bc canada
Posts: 21
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
I heard Dave Tatum in Mount Vernon used to be very good at rebuilding and machine work. No personal experience just word of mouth from reliable friends.
Try calling 360-770-3760 Tatum Custom Engines Pete |
05-10-2021, 02:37 PM | #5 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Minnesota, Florida Keys
Posts: 10,259
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Quote:
|
|
05-10-2021, 03:28 PM | #6 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4,429
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
|
05-10-2021, 04:14 PM | #7 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: SW WA
Posts: 639
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Thanks guys. I appreciate the info. I know my 8BA block is good and was running when I got it. I have performed a visual inspection for cracks but nothing more. I will contact Dave Tatum to see if he is still doing this work. I’d like to speak with whoever I plan to do the rebuild to ask whether I should perform the tear down or if I should let the rebuilder do it. I’ve never rebuilt a Flathead so I just want to make sure I avoid any possible mistakes. Thanks for the replies.
|
05-10-2021, 04:43 PM | #8 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Grays Harbor County, Wa
Posts: 223
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
I had my 8ba rebuilt by Cope Bros. in Parkland (Tacoma) 253-531-1776 with good results.
Over the years I've had them do a few SBC's, and a BBC also, all with good results. Call Darrel he's straight shooter, and a good guy.
__________________
"Get your facts first..then you can distort them as you please" Last edited by FHFD; 05-10-2021 at 05:22 PM. |
05-10-2021, 05:00 PM | #9 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: East Shore of LAKE HOUSTON
Posts: 11,106
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
.
OldGold ......Whoever you come-up with, just maybe run the name by some of us here BEFORE you commit or drop your engine off. There are a couple of INFAMOUS, so-called flathead rebuilders up that direction that have literally stolen multiple THOUSANDS and thousands of dollars from customers that trusted them with engine projects, that literally YEARS later, still can't get the "scums" to finish and return their engines. We're talking about 'lawyers and the Sheriff' type situations. BE CAREFUL!! IF you are careful, there ARE still some excellent flatty rebuilders doing honest business out there. DD |
05-10-2021, 05:36 PM | #10 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: SW WA
Posts: 639
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Thanks! I’ll be sure to do that. I spoke with Dave Tatum on the phone today. He is still building flatheads but told me he’s taking some time off until Sept. due to back surgery. I’m in no hurry getting an engine ready for my pickup since I still have so much to do on just the body, but I am trying to get all my ducks in a row. Perhaps Dave is the guy I should use or maybe there is someone else in my area I should consider.
|
05-10-2021, 06:09 PM | #11 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 2,871
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Dave Tatum was said to build flatheads that would humble a small block Chevy, so you are in good hands.
|
05-10-2021, 06:35 PM | #12 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4,429
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
If Dave is still doing motors he is the go to guy in your area. Dave will not stroke you. From my experience he does what he says and is as good a FH builder there is. He is worth the wait.
|
05-10-2021, 07:20 PM | #13 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Wa.
Posts: 5,373
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Try Marshall Woolery at Thun Field Hot Rods in Tacoma. He farms some of the machine work out but the finished product is first cabin.
Tell him I sent you and he won't double the price. |
05-10-2021, 08:41 PM | #14 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Shelton, WA
Posts: 3,777
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Dave Tatom is both a personal friend and my engine machinist. I have 3 flatheads he built plus a stroked brand X engine. One engine is highly modified, one is bone stock in my Dearborn car, and one slightly modified. The thing to remember about Dave is that he is north of 80 and has slowed down a lot, mostly due to back issues. As others have said, his work is VERY good, however his health has slowed him significantly. I hope his back issue is able to be fixed and he gets back to it soon. You need to have a good or fixable block, he doesn't scrounge like in the old days. You can look at davetatom.com for some information but any prices listed are obsolete. He also used to rebuild airplane engines so that should tell you something about the quality of his work.
|
05-10-2021, 08:52 PM | #15 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Wa.
Posts: 5,373
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Dave is a good friend of mine also. We are in the same club and I have known him for many years. I have used his main caps on several of my engines. I knew of his medical problems is why I didn't mention him.
|
05-11-2021, 09:53 AM | #16 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Vancouver, Wa.
Posts: 193
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Portland Engine Rebuilders is also a good firm.
They did the hot little flatty in a 34 pickup, recently donated to our museum (WAAAMuseum.org). Also did a 460 BBF for me more recently. High quality work, reasonable prices! |
05-12-2021, 10:04 AM | #17 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Omak, Washington
Posts: 205
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
I have heard that Earl Floyd is a good builder. Don't know if he still does it. 28915 N.E. 82nd Ave, Battle Ground WA, 98604. 360-687-2202
|
05-12-2021, 05:01 PM | #18 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: SW WA
Posts: 639
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
I spoke to a couple guys mentioned here. One wants to buy a new 8ba crank, cam, rods, etc to replace the factory installed 41 crank due to the rod bearings. I’ve heard about the bearings being hard to locate for the motors around 1941, but does a stock rebuild really warrant replacing the crank, assuming the original is still good? Thanks for the help here. I do not have much experience with flatheads and certainly never rebuilt one, so I appreciate all the help.
|
05-12-2021, 05:10 PM | #19 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Bellingham, WA
Posts: 213
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
I'd second either Marshall Woolery or Dave Tatum...
As others have said Dave is getting up there; I haven't seen him since I retired from the aircraft gig a couple of years ago. Hope he can get his back fixed... |
05-12-2021, 05:48 PM | #20 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Charlotte NC KiWi-L100 available here
Posts: 2,945
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Bearings are not that hard to come by & floaters are a great bearings. Preserve.
|
05-12-2021, 09:36 PM | #21 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Orcas Island Washington
Posts: 4,843
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
I also can vouch for Dave Tatum. Last time I stopped by his shop he was sitting on a stool setting valve lash. He has always been good to me with price and his old flying stories are worth the drive. Actually about 1/2 hour after I get off the ferry.
__________________
Owner/Operator of 'Jailbar Ranch' on the side of Mt. Pickett. Current stable consists of 1946 1/2 ton pickup turned woodie wagon with FH V8, 1947 Tonner Pickup (red) mostly stock with exception of a cummins 6at turbo diesel, 1946 Tonner Pickup (green) with 226 cu in 6 cyl flathead, 1979 Toyota landcruiser wagon, completely encased in 1947 Ford Jailbar sheet metal. Ok, cornbinder rear fenders..... 'Rusty ol' floorboards, hot on their feet' (Alan Jackson) |
05-13-2021, 08:02 AM | #22 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Pahrump, NV
Posts: 372
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Quote:
I would highly recommend them for any flatty work. As I remember he even said they had a set of torque plates. |
|
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) |
|
05-13-2021, 08:46 AM | #23 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2021
Location: Perry Mo.
Posts: 455
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Old Gold , Where are you located ? Im in Olympia and have the same ? . I'm rebuilding a 8CM for my 41 pickup and think I have found a shop to do it. Tim
|
05-13-2021, 11:10 AM | #24 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: SW WA
Posts: 639
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
I have contacted most the rebuilders mentioned in this thread and every one of them, so far, has seemed to know what they’re doing but each have a different approach to rebuilding these old flatheads. A couple want to replace the crank with either a later model factory crank, one guy wanted to buy an all new crank, rods, cam, etc. and some are fine with using the factory internals. I still have yet to determine if this engine is a 221 or a 239 but I’m sure it’s a 1941, possibly a 1942 based on what I’ve learned from previous engine identification discussions. The consensus with all the builders is that determining whether the block is good is the first step and that a visual inspection for cracks doesn’t tell the whole story since cracks can show up during the magnafluxing as well as after the machining operations. There does appear, from what I can see since it’s still assembled, is that there is a bit of rust and corrosion inside the heads, water pumps, and I’m assuming it carries on throughout the block. I know this will need to be cleaned out and pressure tested. Is there anything wrong with running the factory crank? Are floater bearings that bad or are they just a paint to deal with. If this motor seems solid and cannot visually find any cracks, is there any reason why I shouldn’t just replace some gaskets, oil, clean out the rust and see if it’ll run? Prices on a rebuild so far are $5k - $11k. Most likely, I will have the machining done by someone qualified and assemble the motor myself, to not only learn more but also to save a few bucks. I still have plenty to do on my ‘36 pickup so I’m not in any hurry on this engine, but still wanting to get an early jump on it. I appreciate all the advice.
Tim, I am in Silver Creek... about an hour south of Olympia. Let me know what you’ve found out. Thanks. |
05-13-2021, 11:25 AM | #25 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Charlotte NC KiWi-L100 available here
Posts: 2,945
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
For a stock engine or even mild hot rod your crank is just fine as I stated earlier floater bearings are just fine to very good & really no big deal to set up.
|
05-13-2021, 04:23 PM | #26 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Minnesota, Florida Keys
Posts: 10,259
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
|
05-13-2021, 05:22 PM | #27 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Charlotte NC KiWi-L100 available here
Posts: 2,945
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Quote:
Or need bearings right away you may pay big $ for them but with patience it’s not necessary. The lil 60 bearings can be even more of a challenge but agin with patience my inventory is large at little cost. Please note. I am not in the parts business so I purchase for the engines I build for customers & myself. Cheers Tony eg. .030 under rod bearings to suit 2" crank journals for $150 for sale right now available to all that look. Thats not expensive in my world. Last edited by KiWinUS; 05-13-2021 at 06:06 PM. |
|
05-15-2021, 12:45 PM | #28 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: SW WA
Posts: 639
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
What you guys are debating about seems to be the main difference between the builders I've spoken to. Half are good with the factory type bearings and the others want to install all new later model crank, rods, cam, etc. or at least use good factory 59A or 8BA pieces. I'm not looking for any more performance than a factory prewar flathead provided. I want it to run good and be reliable, but I don't expect much more from the old flathead than that. I'll most likely run the floater bearings and the crank that is in the engine, assuming the crank is good and that I can find the size of bearing I need. Thanks
|
05-15-2021, 01:32 PM | #29 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Minnesota, Florida Keys
Posts: 10,259
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Quote:
|
|
05-16-2021, 04:05 PM | #30 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: SW WA
Posts: 639
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Thanks for all the help!
|
01-03-2022, 01:27 PM | #31 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Jan 2022
Posts: 2
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Has anyone had recent contact with Dave Tatom? He has been laid up in the hospital and then assisted living since June. I was in regular contact with him up until a few weeks ago and now his cell# is disconnected. He had to shut down his business and his landlord said that his helpers have cleaned out his shop.
|
01-03-2022, 03:43 PM | #32 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Shelton, WA
Posts: 3,777
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Dave will probably not be back in business himself. I think he is selling or has sold his mahine tools to a person who wants to learn flatheads from Dave. The thing is, Dave is still in rehab and who knows when or if he will be strong enough to assist the new guy. Sad that this knowledge and experience is slowly disappearing. As I said in a previous post, I have several engines he did the machine work on. I spoke with him just a couple of days ago.
|
01-04-2022, 08:37 AM | #33 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Chester Vt
Posts: 8,840
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Great post. First thing, what do you expect from the finished product? Also the 8ba block and rotating assy would be my first choice, as it's the least expensive to rebuild. The block can also be used by putting the 59 Head and cam init. Again cost savings ans a quality finished product. 258ci with milled heads, stock early intake and distributor, Excellent performance and economy.
Gramps |
01-04-2022, 09:47 AM | #34 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2021
Location: Perry Mo.
Posts: 455
|
Re: PNW Flathead Rebuilders
Hi OG360, I had the same ? about one year ago. I found three old school shops that know what they are talking about. All of them are very busy. Buds in Lake wood has done work for me on my flat head Cadillac and really knows his stuff. How ever he is 80 years old and not taking any more work on until he finds more machinist for his shop. Barry's in Chehalis is very good and had two 8BAs on the floor when I was there last spring talking with him. I ended up going to Portland Engine Rebuilders because I wanted hard seats cut into my 53 block and they had the equipment and experience to do it. Great guys with lots of experience with flat head fords. Be warned these guys are all good but have long waiting lines. The shortest time frame was Barry's at four months. Prices seemed to be around $3000 at that time. Of course that depends on the work you want done. Where are you at? I'm Olympia. Tim
|
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) |
|