The Ford Barn

JWL · 10-15-2017, 11:05 PM

I fixed one such case by machining it flat in the worn area and fastening a thick steel washer with c-sink screws thru the rear face into the washer. Made a simple face cutter from 3/8 square tool steel and piloted at both ends of the case with a piece of 3/4" water hardening drill rod. Although I did the machining on a good sized vertical mill it could be done in other ways.

bobH · 10-15-2017, 11:54 PM

I've only crossed this bridge once, and it was back in the 60's. (So, I'm dated.)
At the time, we had a cast iron repair place nearby. I took the case to them, and they applied braze material to the severely worn area. Looking back, I know I could have done this myself.
Anyway, they put on extra material, which needed to be machined down for proper cluster end-clearance. I was VERY lucky to work at a place that had a great machine shop. And, I went to the tool crib and borrowed a back-side spot facer. The cutter was the same diameter as the thrust washer that needed to rest there. And, the shaft was the proper diameter to fit the countershaft hole. So, I simply did a back-side spot face, using my drill press. After reading all the above posts, I can't believe how lucky I was to be able to do what I did. It worked perfect.
And, by the way, I'm still in contact with the person that owns the vehicle with that transmission. It's been 50 years, and that transmission is still working fine.

Mart · 10-16-2017, 07:57 AM

The job is done.

Thanks for all the helpful suggestions.

I slept on it and read all the helpful comments this morning. I started looking at what I had, thinking some sort of arbor was the way to go.

I found an old "tank cutter". It has a 5/16" square hole through it and is close to 3/4" diameter. I hand ground a lathe tool bit to act as a facing cutter.

I built up the shank with the mig welder.

I turned the shank down and set it up in the 4 jaw to get it as true as I could with the original diameter.

At that point I realised it was probably better to try and do the job in the lathe, as the arbor is now as true as it could ever be having just been turned.

I had to use the little myford lathe to turn up a stub to support the other end of the casing.

I couldn't pull the casing with the tailstock as the taper would probably let go, hence the stub support.

The trans case was set up on the arbor and the tool inserted and set up. I gave it a test spin and all felt well, so I started cutting. I all appeared to be going well so I kept going until the face was fully cleaned up.

But the problem was that the face came out concave. Hardly surprising given the setup.

I came up with a quick and dirty way to beef up the tool bit using one of the lathe quick change toolholders. This one has a V at the bottom so clamped squarely to the arbor.

This seemed a lot better so I continued on until the face was fully cleaned up.

As far as I can tell using a straight edge with a light behind the face is flat. It looks good anyway.

So thanks for the comments it really helped.

If I were planning to do it again I would probably make improvements to the tool. But, for what it took, I was surprised at how well it came out.

Mart.

Mart.

Cliff Ramsdell · 10-16-2017, 03:24 PM

Good going Mart. nice and simple. I too have used stainless shims inn the past to fix a damaged case. I think they came from McMaster Carr or MSC products, can't recall but the machinist at work helped me out. no issues.

Cliff Ramsdell

RalphM · 10-16-2017, 04:11 PM

Nice job!

Charlie ny · 10-16-2017, 05:43 PM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Mart,
Now I know why the industrial revolution started in Great Britain.
I'm thinking you attached the case to the cross slide to feed it into the tool,
yes ? Your method makes the repair absolutely doable...
Charlie ny

cas3 · 10-16-2017, 06:51 PM

looks good!

Talkwrench · 10-16-2017, 07:06 PM

Great ...Geez you don't muck around, job done!

JM 35 Sedan · 10-16-2017, 09:35 PM

Nice job Mart. Thanks for posting the pictures showing how you did the job. You got the wheels turning in my head on how an amateur machinist like me might attempt doing this if it becomes necessary to save an otherwise good transmission case.

zzlegend · 10-16-2017, 11:08 PM

SHEEEESH Mart.................Let me see if I can go find that scrap guy and send those cases to you.

Fine job.

Mart · 10-17-2017, 02:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charlie ny

Mart,
Now I know why the industrial revolution started in Great Britain.
I'm thinking you attached the case to the cross slide to feed it into the tool,
yes ? Your method makes the repair absolutely doable...
Charlie ny

Not quite, Charlie. The case was floating between the stub arbor in the 4 jaw chuck and the 3/4" support in the tailstock. I just nudged the toolpost against the casing and gently pushed it to the right allowing the tool to cut the inner face.

I didn't take a photo of the setup but did make a couple of little movie files, I can't post them here, but if I get them up on youtube I'll put a link in here.

Thanks all for the kind words.

Mart.

Charlie ny · 10-17-2017, 05:29 AM

Bloody genius !!
Charlie ny

tubman · 10-17-2017, 05:47 AM

You do nice work! Quick too!

JM 35 Sedan · 10-17-2017, 05:58 AM

Yeah, post those movies on YouTube please

Mart · 10-17-2017, 02:47 PM

Ok, you asked for it..

A bit rough and ready and not edited at all. I'm a very untidy and messy worker.

Part 1 (the first attempt - came out concave due to insuffient tool support).
https://youtu.be/WBRWMXzZXR4

Part 2 (just a quickie. - with the tool backed up by improvising a tool holder clamped to the arbor)
https://youtu.be/uFWaF82F8yU

Mart.

mfagan · 10-17-2017, 03:03 PM

Remarkable ingenuity!!!!!!

revkev6 · 10-17-2017, 03:13 PM

love how that turned out.. If I did it I know with 100% certainty that the tool would have grabbed and somehow ejected the case onto my foot lol

good for you for having better execution and all of your toes!

Angledrive · 10-17-2017, 04:28 PM

Well done, where there is a will there is a way.

Paul · 11-03-2017, 01:54 PM

nicely done

Ol' Ron · 12-30-2017, 03:36 PM

I go with Charkie. Making up a spot facer would be quite simple and a steel spacer could be pined and epoxyd to the case. Or a standard mill could have the reverse cutter on it. My onlly concern is how thick is the case in this area. I gave up on these transmissiond 60 years ago after I blew my third or fourth one. However for the restorers I believe these are fixable, at a reasonable price. At my age and eyesight , I think I could still do it. If someone had bad case I'd' TRY and fix it, at no charge. But it has to get alittle warmer, it was 16 below this morning.

10-15-2017, 11:05 PM	#21
JWL Member Emeritus Join Date: May 2010 Location: Fitzgerald, Georgia Posts: 2,204	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? I fixed one such case by machining it flat in the worn area and fastening a thick steel washer with c-sink screws thru the rear face into the washer. Made a simple face cutter from 3/8 square tool steel and piloted at both ends of the case with a piece of 3/4" water hardening drill rod. Although I did the machining on a good sized vertical mill it could be done in other ways.

10-15-2017, 11:54 PM	#22
bobH Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: so cal, placerville, vegas Posts: 1,394	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? I've only crossed this bridge once, and it was back in the 60's. (So, I'm dated.) At the time, we had a cast iron repair place nearby. I took the case to them, and they applied braze material to the severely worn area. Looking back, I know I could have done this myself. Anyway, they put on extra material, which needed to be machined down for proper cluster end-clearance. I was VERY lucky to work at a place that had a great machine shop. And, I went to the tool crib and borrowed a back-side spot facer. The cutter was the same diameter as the thrust washer that needed to rest there. And, the shaft was the proper diameter to fit the countershaft hole. So, I simply did a back-side spot face, using my drill press. After reading all the above posts, I can't believe how lucky I was to be able to do what I did. It worked perfect. And, by the way, I'm still in contact with the person that owns the vehicle with that transmission. It's been 50 years, and that transmission is still working fine.

10-16-2017, 03:24 PM	#24
Cliff Ramsdell Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Windsor Locks, CT. Posts: 244	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? Good going Mart. nice and simple. I too have used stainless shims inn the past to fix a damaged case. I think they came from McMaster Carr or MSC products, can't recall but the machinist at work helped me out. no issues. Cliff Ramsdell

10-16-2017, 04:11 PM	#25
RalphM Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: North Pole, Alaska Posts: 2,651	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? Nice job!

10-16-2017, 05:43 PM	#26
Charlie ny BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 3,019	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Mart, Now I know why the industrial revolution started in Great Britain. I'm thinking you attached the case to the cross slide to feed it into the tool, yes ? Your method makes the repair absolutely doable... Charlie ny

10-16-2017, 06:51 PM	#27
cas3 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: sw minnesota Posts: 4,568	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? looks good!

10-16-2017, 07:06 PM	#28
Talkwrench Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 2,687	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? Great ...Geez you don't muck around, job done! __________________ *"Came too close to dying to stop living now!"*

10-16-2017, 09:35 PM	#29
JM 35 Sedan Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Near Rising Sun, Maryland Posts: 10,858	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? Nice job Mart. Thanks for posting the pictures showing how you did the job. You got the wheels turning in my head on how an amateur machinist like me might attempt doing this if it becomes necessary to save an otherwise good transmission case. __________________ *John* *"Never give up on what you really want to do. The person with big dreams is more powerful than one with all the facts". Albert Einstein*

10-16-2017, 11:08 PM	#30
zzlegend Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Reseda, Calif. Posts: 2,188	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? SHEEEESH Mart.................Let me see if I can go find that scrap guy and send those cases to you. Fine job.

10-17-2017, 05:29 AM	#32
Charlie ny BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 3,019	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? Bloody genius !! Charlie ny

10-17-2017, 05:47 AM	#33
tubman Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Minnesota, Florida Keys Posts: 10,303	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? You do nice work! Quick too!

10-17-2017, 05:58 AM	#34
JM 35 Sedan Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Near Rising Sun, Maryland Posts: 10,858	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? Yeah, post those movies on YouTube please __________________ *John* *"Never give up on what you really want to do. The person with big dreams is more powerful than one with all the facts". Albert Einstein*

10-17-2017, 02:47 PM	#35
Mart Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Solihull, England. Posts: 8,745	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? Ok, you asked for it.. A bit rough and ready and not edited at all. I'm a very untidy and messy worker. Part 1 (the first attempt - came out concave due to insuffient tool support). https://youtu.be/WBRWMXzZXR4 Part 2 (just a quickie. - with the tool backed up by improvising a tool holder clamped to the arbor) https://youtu.be/uFWaF82F8yU Mart.

10-17-2017, 03:03 PM	#36
mfagan Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Kaufman, TX Posts: 822	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? Remarkable ingenuity!!!!!! __________________ Marvin Fagan 214-697-8430

10-17-2017, 03:13 PM	#37
revkev6 Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: western Mass Posts: 365	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? love how that turned out.. If I did it I know with 100% certainty that the tool would have grabbed and somehow ejected the case onto my foot lol good for you for having better execution and all of your toes!

10-17-2017, 04:28 PM	#38
Angledrive Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Lakeland Florida Posts: 303	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? Well done, where there is a will there is a way.

11-03-2017, 01:54 PM	#39
Paul Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Lahar Valley, WA Posts: 44	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? nicely done __________________ it's all good

12-30-2017, 03:36 PM	#40
Ol' Ron Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Chester Vt Posts: 8,857	Re: Early ford trans case: Rear thrust face. Repairable? I go with Charkie. Making up a spot facer would be quite simple and a steel spacer could be pined and epoxyd to the case. Or a standard mill could have the reverse cutter on it. My onlly concern is how thick is the case in this area. I gave up on these transmissiond 60 years ago after I blew my third or fourth one. However for the restorers I believe these are fixable, at a reasonable price. At my age and eyesight , I think I could still do it. If someone had bad case I'd' TRY and fix it, at no charge. But it has to get alittle warmer, it was 16 below this morning.