still overheating

[Skibb]

Originally Posted by BILL WILLIAMSON

DON'T forget the NAIL, it REALLY helps prevent water loss!!!! OH! I discovered that at a CONSTANT road speed, if your temp cycles UP & DOWN at regular intervals, "maybe" every 1 1/2 minutes, it's a SURE thing that you are LOW on water!
Bill W.

Thanks to Bill, his suggestion here saved my engine. We drive and tour nicely now. Thanks Bill (& Buster).

[Willynch]

Thanks for all the insight.

Maybe I misunderstand the purpose of the overflow tube. I thought that allowed overflow to spill out. If the radiator was overfilled, this overflow tube would take of that problem.

I have been filling the radiator close to the top. It sounds like that might be a mistake. If so, why is that a mistake? Also, how do I determine the proper fill level for my radiator and my car?

Also, I do not understand why placing a roofing nail (suggestion by Bill Williamson) would be useful? I picture that as a way to obstruct the overflow tube which I assumed was there for a purpose.

Lastly, I also hope my new radiator is not just an "expensive filter". I have barely 50 miles on the car since the radiator was put in. I have drained and refilled it three times; each time the fluid has looked very clear. Hopefully that means I am OK. Lot to learn

[Mitch//pa]

looking inside the top tank you should see a baffle plate which is just above the tubes.. lower the level to that plate or just below it.. yes your over filling the rad you need to leave that much room for expansion..
the difference from the plate to the top of the tank is about a half gallon

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

Originally Posted by Willynch

Thanks for all the insight.

Maybe I misunderstand the purpose of the overflow tube. I thought that allowed overflow to spill out. If the radiator was overfilled, this overflow tube would take of that problem.

I have been filling the radiator close to the top. It sounds like that might be a mistake. If so, why is that a mistake? Also, how do I determine the proper fill level for my radiator and my car?

Also, I do not understand why placing a roofing nail (suggestion by Bill Williamson) would be useful? I picture that as a way to obstruct the overflow tube which I assumed was there for a purpose.

Lastly, I also hope my new radiator is not just an "expensive filter". I have barely 50 miles on the car since the radiator was put in. I have drained and refilled it three times; each time the fluid has looked very clear. Hopefully that means I am OK. Lot to learn

Willy, The nail is a proven old time "fix", it just sits there, doing a little "dance" , acting as a "splash over" shield & it WON'T pressurize the system. At higher REVS, the water REALLY churns in the top tank & water is gradually lost out the overflow tube, by "SPLASH" over.
AND, remember, for those that have a MOTO-METER or a temp gauge, on long runs, you notice the gauges CYCLE UP & DOWN, at about 1 1/2 to 2 MINUTE intervals,---You are LOW on WATER!
AND, like Mitch//pa said, be concerned about Rust FLAKES that get stuck in the upper ends of the radiator tubes!!! ANY amount of cleaning of blocks & heads, NEVER totally eliminates the rust flake problem. A BI-ANNUAL BACKFLUSH, helps.
IF, you could count the number of tubes, you'd be SURPRISED, at how FEW there are! IF you are able to ever see a chunk in a tube, you can suck it out with a MAGONET
AND, DON'T worry about OVERFILLING, that's what the overflow's there for, to belch out excess coolant, when it warms up & EXPANDS. But if you're running Anti-Freeze, it's important NOT to overfill & belch out/dilute your EXPENSIVE stuff!
NOT tryin' to be smart assed or loooong drawn out, jist tryin' to share what I've SEEN/DONE!
Bill W.

[Tom Wesenberg]

I would fill the radiator to just over the tops of the tubes, as Mitch said, then drive it and see if any more coolant goes out the overflow. If it does, then I'd remove the radiator, lay it flat with the front down and your hand over the cap opening, then fill it with water. Now quickly turn it upside down and remove you hand and see if any rust flakes come out. On most radiators it doesn't take many rust flakes to block off enough tubes to cause the coolant to fill the top tank and go out the overflow. I've been through this exact thing a year ago, and it all started when the built up rust in the rear of the block decided to let loose and block the radiator tubes.

[Smurkey]

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I know it's been said, but sounds like everything is OK to me. Just a little overfilled.

195 to low 200s isn't overheating, that's operating temp (so long as it's not BOILING over) but sounds just like the system is reaching its equilibrium and a half gallon is about what you lose if you fill to the top.

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

For those with NO TEMP gauge, if it's quite hot & belching out the overflow, YOU'LL SMELL IT IN TIME TO GET OVER & CHECK THINGS!
Bill W.

[barkleydave]

I went through this fire drill and this is what I did.

1. New Bergs Radiator and New Water Pump
2. Lost 3/4 gallon on 100 mile tour in very hill conditions.

A. Checked for head gasket leak with radiator test kit... A-OK
B. Added Bill's wonder roofing nail
C. Added 165 degree thermostat.

Runs at 195 degrees on a 95 degree day up hill all day!
Last tour we were running 40-45 up long grades and NO coolant loss!

Part of the problem is the new water pumps really move a lot of water which was getting pushed over the top of the overflow tube. The nail did the trick no more loss.
Also the thermostat slows the flow slightly so not so agitated in the top tank.

[grumpyoldsman]

we had a couple of guys buy rads a few years ago and when they installed them there cars started to over heat. the new rads were plugged up with leak stop from the manufacturer. just a thought

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

I DON'T know about now, but in the past, some local engine rebuilders would pour a powdered stop leak, in the block, before putting the heads on.
Bill W.

[Mitch//pa]

ASE technicians in a can...
i guess ill shut my doors

actually when people use ASE technician in a can it is busier
cause that garbage screws things up

[Henry's Lady's Man]

It almost sounds like a stuck thermostat popping, but it's assumed you know that nobody put one in there before you acquired the car. Silly suggestion, but worth adding, I suppose. - Chuck

[burner31]

A thermostat will actually help maintain a negative pressure in the lower block, thus reducing the boiling temp.
Don't ask me how it works, but I seen a long drawn out explanation (with pictures and arrows and everything) on youtube about it, seemed to make sense, and seems to work.
I only run 180 going up hill.
Big change from the 220/boil over days I was having.

[Mike V. Florida]

Originally Posted by burner31

a negative pressure in the lower block, thus reducing the boiling temp.

Yes, water boils at 203 degrees in Denver CO. due to the lower air pressure as compared to sea level.

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

Originally Posted by Mitch//pa

ASE technicians in a can...
i guess ill shut my doors

actually when people use ASE technician in a can it is busier
cause that garbage screws things up

As a matter of fact, SA, I'm NOT an additive proponent. "maybe" some old fashioned Bars-Leaks, for "insurance" or 1/2 jar of STP in a loose/worn OLD engine. I DIDN'T condone the powdered stop leak, thrown in the water jackets of a newly "remanufactured" engine!!!
I have found that a conventional water pump ceramic seal, that continues to squeak, even after a week or so, can be silenced in a NANO second, by adding 2 table spoons of BRAKE FLUID to the radumator! It was recommended by Chrysler Corp! Chrysler came out with some REALLY neat "tricks" in the '60's
Dad

[tonhop66]

I have a 1929 Tudor I have had for many years. It has set in my garage for over 25 years when I got it out last summer. Got it running but had a over heating problem. I even had a small heat problem years ago but just lived with it. This time was much worse. I draind the block and radiator many times and even had the radiator cleaned with only small sucess. I decided to replace the radiator and Leakey water pump. When I plulled the water pump out and looked into the block I found a large Pile of rust. At idle the pump worked and sent water to the radiator but when out on the road the rust pile would stop the water flow and the motor would get hot. Cleaned out the rust pile an now it runs super cool!


.

[JDupuis]

tonhop66. Congrats on making your first post. With great information I might add. You've been a member for 7 years. Wow, I couldn't keep quiet for that long. Glad you finally spoke up. Hope to hear more from you. . Jeff

[redmodelt]

Everybody has jumped on the radiator band wagon, has anyone asked where he is setting the GVA or spark lever? You could be running lean and do you understand the function of the spark lever?

[jw hash]

sound like a head gasket to me.

[H. L. Chauvin]

FWIW: One (1) opinion from past experiences:

After (8) million quick fixes and causes discussed for a restored Model A's overheating problems, two (2) should top the list:

A. Malfunctioning radiator; and/or,

B. Malfunctioning thermostat.

C. Either one could be first or second.