Go Back   The Ford Barn > General Discussion > Model A (1928-31)

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-21-2020, 05:38 AM   #1
SteveR.
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Aledo, TX
Posts: 53
Default Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

The car came with new cast drums when I got it and I need to install them. Will it hurt to keep the shoes?
SteveR. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2020, 06:19 AM   #2
kbinde2
Senior Member
 
kbinde2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Delaware
Posts: 184
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

If you are going to refurbish the brakes, IMO.. I would replace each component as a unit, shoes and drums, and to inspect, clean and re-adjust/replace internal parts as required. Getting stopped safely is priority on our roads today.. kb
kbinde2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Old 10-21-2020, 06:42 AM   #3
ryanheacox
Senior Member
 
ryanheacox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Northwest CT
Posts: 1,047
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

If the shoes are in good shape, linings are thick, pin holes aren't wallowed out, etc. I would have them arced to the cast drums and use them. Are they woven or molded linings?
ryanheacox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2020, 07:35 AM   #4
kenparker0703
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 15
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

For a cost of about $100 for new linings I would replace the linings on the old shoes. While inside the brake mechanisn I would check EVERY component. If any wear shows replace it. Your peace of mind and safety are not worth a few $$$$'s.
kenparker0703 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2020, 03:20 PM   #5
WHN
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Connecticut Shoreline
Posts: 1,195
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

Model A brakes, when done correctly, are really very good.

The secret is, when done correctly. This is not the place where I would try to save money. Anything that is worn, should be replaced. Including, pins, rods, springs, etc.

Done right, you will get thousands of miles of safe driving. Just another thing to check off you list of things to do.

Enjoy.
WHN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2020, 10:27 PM   #6
SteveR.
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Aledo, TX
Posts: 53
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Agree with all of the thoughts above... i'd rather do it once and do it right. With that in mind, I have the drums, what else do I need to buy? How many hours to do the work for a first timer? I did just get done installing a new engine, I could figure out the brakes i just have limited time.

Is there a good shop near Fort Worth that can Arch the linings?
SteveR. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2020, 06:37 AM   #7
Patrick L.
Senior Member
 
Patrick L.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Upstate NY and western Florida
Posts: 5,951
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

Mechanical brakes are a different animal than hydraulic ones. Everything has to be just so for them to work properly. You need good solid contact, tracks, etc. Centering certainly helps. The drums once mounted to the hubs should be cut and trued. The shoes can be sanded to fit reasonable well using sand paper inside the drum.
Its kinda been said that woven shoes are for steel drums and molded for cast, but, I've used either with no issues.
Patrick L. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2020, 07:17 AM   #8
kenparker0703
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 15
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

First you have to get the hubs off of the old drums. 2. clean hubs throughly. 3. Inspect for damage and wear - Replace if necessary. 4. Retrue machine surface on lathe. 5. Swedge new cast drums to hubs - minimum 30 ton press and very carful to get everything PERFECTLY square or will crack drum or hub. 6. Return drum to insure not waraped in swedging process. 6. Inspect all internal parts for wear and replace if necessary. 7. Sand Grind or set new shoes to match diameter of new drums. 8 Assemble.


It could take anywhere fron two days to two weeks to complete depending on your tools available and your expertise. There are NO shortcuts.


I have the equipment to do this but I am 100plus miles away fro you.
kenparker0703 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2020, 11:32 AM   #9
Purdy Swoft
Senior Member
 
Purdy Swoft's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Alabama
Posts: 8,076
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

If the shoes aren't worn down to the point that the rivets are exposed , the shoes could possibly be reused . If you are trying to rebuild the brakes to like new condition, all worn parts should be replaced . I always grind or file a tapered edge on the ends of the brake lining .The tapered edges on the lining will make it easier or possible to install the drums over the relined brake shoes . The square ends of the brake lining will have a tendency to slightly kick outwards when the rivets are installed and the tapered ends of the lining will help prevent interference and drag . Many without model A brake experience will have difficulty installing the brake drums after installing new brake lining . In many cases , when the lining wears enough that it needs to be replaced , the brake tracks will have a dip worn on the tracks where the roller pins ride . The worn spots on the tracks can be welded up in the worn spots or the tracks can be replaced . Worn spots on the brake tracks will cause the shoes to be out of center and the drums won't fit back over the shoes . I have found that replacing the tracks is no guarantee that the drums will fit over the relined shoes . It usually takes a bit of work getting the shoes centered again .
Purdy Swoft is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2020, 04:14 PM   #10
SteveR.
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Aledo, TX
Posts: 53
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

Ken, I have a friend in East TX I told I would come visit soon...I'll give you a call, I may bring my brakes with me.

Thanks for the input everyone!
SteveR. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2020, 05:13 PM   #11
Gene F
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 223
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

I have modern shoes, cast iron drums, and self centering tracks. All rods straightened (they bend more than you would think), new bushings, new pins, everything adjusted up without the suspension hanging. What a difference! A bit of cash, and a bit of time, but well worth it. If you ever drive an A owned by a member of your club, and it has cast iron drums you are gonna want them.

I had the bands before, and they are a waste of time.
Gene F is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2020, 09:32 PM   #12
SteveR.
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Aledo, TX
Posts: 53
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

Anyone know a shop in the Fort Worth area that can assemble the hubs, drums & lugs for me?
SteveR. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2020, 11:04 PM   #13
Dick Carne
Senior Member
 
Dick Carne's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Fayetteville, Georgia
Posts: 366
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

I'm not sure if you are planning to use woven linings with cast iron drums, or bonded linings. In my opinion, woven linings should only be used with steel drums, and bonded linings with cast iron drums. Based upon a mechanic friend's comments, I initially matched up new cast iron drums with new woven linings, but by the end of the first 1000 miles, essentially had no brakes at all, Replacing the woven linings with bonded linings effectively cured this problem. Good luck to you with this project.
Dick Carne is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 07:29 PM   #14
Gene F
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 223
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

Dick, I have heard that too.
Gene F is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 09:32 PM   #15
mass A man
Senior Member
 
mass A man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Danvers, Ma.
Posts: 587
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

Something else must have happened with your brakes Dick. I've had many pre-30's cars and trucks with steel or cast drums, long before bonded, (or molded) linings were even invented. If the brakes were set up right, they never gave me a problem for many thousands of miles other than a tweak on the adjustments. All had woven linings, the only lining available.
mass A man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 11:38 PM   #16
CWPASADENA
Senior Member
 
CWPASADENA's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: PASADENA, CA
Posts: 1,475
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

Henry used woven linings with cast iron drums from late 1931, when he switched from stamped steel to cast iron drums for the Model A, clear up until before the war.

Woven linings work very well with cast iron drums.

Any lining used must be arced to the drums and the shoes centered properly or you will not have the best performing brakes and often will have problems with less than full contact and glazing in the contact areas of the linings.

My experience and my opinion.

Chris W.
CWPASADENA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2020, 07:22 AM   #17
kenparker0703
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 15
Default Re: Can I use new cast brake drums with old shoes?

Currently running woven linings on cast Iron drums on two cars - 31 Coupe and 30 Woody. No problems. What CWP said above in very important. ken
kenparker0703 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:31 PM.