Lincoln Y-Block 318 Problems

[Ratfink1973]

Hello, my Name is Dieter and i am from austria. 40 Years old and i have an Lincoln Capri from 1953. I Hope this is the Right Place for my Problems with the Motor.
The carburetor is in Bad condition.
It is the First Holley 2140 Called also teapot. The linkage from this Sicks wrong Air.Did anyone know where i could become an good Holley 2140 or what must i change wehen i want take an other carburetor?
Thanks and greetings Dieter
Sorry for my Bad english

[Dobie Gillis]

Guten Tag, Dieter, und Wilkommen! There are a couple of guys on this forum with deep knowledge of the early Holley carbs and also rebuild them. It sounds like the throttle shaft bore needs to be re-bushed or an oversize shaft installed. If you would rather use a modern carburetor you will need an adapter plate between the carb and intake manifold. These are available from many stateside performance suppliers, such as Speedway Motors, Summit and Jegs. You will also need a 1957 or later distributor since the original distributor was vacuum advance only and will not work with any other carb (look up Loadamatic for a full explanation).

I'm sure more guys will add to this discussion. Good luck with your Lincoln; the '53 is one of my favorites.

[scicala]

Originally Posted by Ratfink1973

Hello, my Name is Dieter and i am from austria. 40 Years old and i have an Lincoln Capri from 1953. I Hope this is the Right Place for my Problems with the Motor.
The carburetor is in Bad condition.
It is the First Holley 2140 Called also teapot. The linkage from this Sicks wrong Air.Did anyone know where i could become an good Holley 2140 or what must i change wehen i want take an other carburetor?
Thanks and greetings Dieter
Sorry for my Bad english

Hello Dieter,

I have rebuilt and restored quite a few of the Holley 2140 and 4000 carburetors for 1953 through 1956 Lincolns along with all other teapots and all carburetors in general. I now have two rough core carburetors that could probably be used to make one good carburetor.

It's you're choice to do something like that or if you wanted to switch to a more modern 4 barrel carburetor and try to find a 1957 or later distributor. That may be difficult to find a distributor. Not sure.

If you are interested, let me know and I can send you a personal message on Ford Barn with the details. Sal Cicala

[Bruce Compton, Canada]

Hi Dieter : I'm pretty sure that the Ford 292-312 Y Block (1957 +) distributor will fit your 317 but the drive gear will have to be changed to 15 teeth. Not sure about your oil pump drive, but if it's a flat tab you will have to deal with that too. Check with Bubbas Ignition on this site as he does what he call a "butt change" to make the '57 up distributors fit the early motors. As well, Sal knows what he is talking about and would be a good guy to help you with a carburetor selection. My car is a 1954 Mercury that has a modified '57 distributor and a Holley 390 cfm carb and it runs better than new, and although it's not totally original, I'd never go back. Good luck : Bruce

[Daves55Sedan]

In case someone did not already mention it, if you do decide to change to a '57 and later carburetor, it is a good idea to also change to the later distributor.
I believe BUBBA's Ignition has dealt with modifications to the original Lincoln 317 distributor.

[Ratfink1973]

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Hello, thanks for the answer. Did anyone know, is the Holley 2140 SG carburetor the same as the first series and could i take this one on my Motor?Could i become a new diaphragm for the distriputor?
Greetings from Austria Dieter

[Jay in Mass]

Originally Posted by Ratfink1973

Hello, thanks for the answer. Could i become a new diaphragm for the distriputor?
Greetings from Austria Dieter

Welcome Dieter
You came to the right place and will get help and good information on this site.

bekommen auf English ist to get
become auf Deutsch ist werden

I always had trouble with those two words also.

[scicala]

Originally Posted by Ratfink1973

Hello, thanks for the answer. Did anyone know, is the Holley 2140 SG carburetor the same as the first series and could i take this one on my Motor?Could i become a new diaphragm for the distriputor?
Greetings from Austria Dieter

Hi Dieter,

The Holley 2400 SG carburetor is for a heavy truck with a governor on the carb. Would not connect properly and would have low power and RPM because of the governor.
Also, changing the diaphragm on the distributor will not make a newer style carburetor work with it. The problem is no centrifugal advance in the distributor, and the Holley 2400's have the wrong vacuum signal for a 1957 and later distributor.

Sal

[Oldmics]

Dieter

If you have any interest I have a used 57 distributor that is from a 368 engine.
Its a 15 tooth drive gear so it should be correct for your needs if you decide to upgrade the carb.

I can be reached at my regular e address at

[email protected]

I can provide references to show that I am an honest car guy.You gotta be careful dealing on the web.

Best regards,Oldmics

[Ratfink1973]

Hello and thanks for the answer.
Now i have two options:
I take the Holley2140 and hope that someone could overhaul it here in Austria.
New diaphragm for the distributor

Or new distributor, Adapter plate and other carburetor
Which Carburetor is good for this motor and could i become new?
Thanks and greetings from Austria Dieter

[Dobie Gillis]

Originally Posted by Ratfink1973

Hello and thanks for the answer.
Now i have two options:
I take the Holley2140 and hope that someone could overhaul it here in Austria.
New diaphragm for the distributor

Or new distributor, Adapter plate and other carburetor
Which Carburetor is good for this motor and could i become new?
Thanks and greetings from Austria Dieter

If you are going to go with a modern carb your best options are probably the Holley 390 cfm or the Edelbrock Performer 450 cfm. Both have vacuum operated secondaries which are forgiving of slight over-carburation. The Edelbrock is easier to tune than the Holley, but both are good choices.

[Ratfink1973]

Hello, is it possibble to get a new distributor from an Ford Y Block that fits on my Lincoln?I did not find the adapter plate for a new carburator. From which company could i become this part?


Greetings Dieter

[Dobie Gillis]

This is a link to a classic Lincoln parts supplier. It is for a rebuilt distributor for a 1954 Lincoln and would likely work for your car with little or no modification. You will need to send them your old distributor or pay a core charge.

http://lincolnoldparts.com/mm5/merch...ow=&range_high=

[scicala]

Originally Posted by Dobie Gillis

This is a link to a classic Lincoln parts supplier. It is for a rebuilt distributor for a 1954 Lincoln and would likely work for your car with little or no modification. You will need to send them your old distributor or pay a core charge.

http://lincolnoldparts.com/mm5/merch...w=&range_high=

A 1954 distributor is not correct for what Dieter is talking about. He needs one with centrifugal advance if he is going to use a modern 4 barrel carburetor.

Dieter, if you are going that way, why not contact Oldmics for his 1957 distributor ?

[Oldmics]

Hi Sal

Dieter and I are in communication about the dizzy.

I did acquire that 56 setup.I"ll fill you in offline.

Oldmics

[Dobie Gillis]

Hmm, I guess I misread his post.

Dieter, the carb adapters are available online from Speedway Motors, Summit and other speed parts suppliers.

Here is a link to the Speedway Motors adapter.

http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Holley...pter,5551.html

It says "flathead" but also works on y-blocks.

[Ratfink1973]

Hello and thanks for the answers.
Now i wait for the answer from Oldmics about the Shopping costs to austria.with wich carburburator did you make the best experience? In Austria the Most People Take Edelbrock, because they mean they are Plug and Play in contrast to holley.
Greetings Dieter

[Dobie Gillis]

I have an Edelbrock Performer series 500 cfm and am very pleased with it. Holleys are good, too, but generally require more fiddling for optimal results.

[Ratfink1973]

Hello, is this the right distributor for my Lincoln?http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/x,ca...,parttype,7108
Greetings Dieter

[Dobie Gillis]

Yes, that's the one. Compare drive gear tooth count and swap the drive gears if necessary.

[Ratfink1973]

Hello, today i become an Second Lincoln Capri for Parts. It has an manuell choke and an distributor that is not the original.How could i post a pictures here? Maybe someone could Tell me something about this.
Greetings Dieter
Edit: Now i take a Look on oldcarmanualprojekt and the distributor was from 1952 and 1954.Could i take a new carburetor with this distributor?
Sorry for this questions, but here in austria it is not easy to become Parts for this old Lincolns.

[Dobie Gillis]

Old Lincoln parts are hard to find regardless of the locale. The '52-'54 distributor is the Loadomatic variety. It will work with a Loadomatic carburetor. If you are going for a more modern carburetor then you will need a later model distributor that has both centrifugal and vacuum advance. The original type carb can be modified to work with a later model distributor, but not vice versa.

[Ratfink1973]

[Ratfink1973]

Did directupload not work on this forum?

[Dobie Gillis]

Dieter,

When you start a thread or reply to one and want to attach a pic click the "Go Advanced" button below the reply window. Above the window click on the paper clip icon to add an attachment. When the window pops up you'll see 2 options. You can either upload a file stored on your computer or one stored on the internet (upload from a URL). Below the 2 options is a key showing the maximum size allowed by attachment type. You may need to resize your pic so it will load.

[Ratfink1973]

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picupload

[Ratfink1973]

http://postimg.org/image/3n9si6563/
Could someone tell is this the distributor which i need when i want to replace the carburator?
Greetings from austria dieter

[Dobie Gillis]

That is a Loadamatic distributor and not suitable for any but the original carburetor. The 2 advance springs are visible on top of the plate.

You may need to get an aftermarket distributor. MSD has one:

http://www.speedwaymotors.com/MSD-83...utor,8950.html

Not cheap but it will fit your 317. You may need to swap your gear onto it. Evidently about the only parts that will easily interchange between Ford and Lincoln y-blocks are the distributors and oil pumps.

[Ratfink1973]

Ok, thanks for the Info. Now i Must wait for the Gas tank, because it was very rusty and Dirty inside. Two weeks ago i send it to a Company they make it rust Free and coated it.
Greetings Dieter

[Ratfink1973]

Did someone know where could i become the nipple for the vacuum line from the Motor to the carburator? One line is from trhe carburator to the Motor and one from the carburator to the Distributor.
greetings Dieter

[Ratfink1973]

Hello could someone Tell me what is with oldmics? I Wrote him some Mails and PMs and become no answer. Greetings Dieter

[Ratfink1973]

Helle, After some weeks i have some news. The Tank is now ready. Complete rust free,and next Week i take it home. The electric is 99% ready and all Lightshow are burning.
The only Problem that i have is the distributor. Where could i become an Y-Block distributor, so that i could take an better carburetor than the Original one.
Greetings Dieter

[Dobie Gillis]

You're in luck. According to John Mummert's website the only parts that interchange between the Lincoln and Ford Y-blocks is the oil pump and distributor. Mummert is a very well respected Y-block expert. So any 1957 or later distributor will work. Earlier distributors will fit but will not play well with any carb except the original type.

Here's a link to Mummert's site: http://www.ford-y-block.com/lincoln-y.htm

[Oldmics]

Originally Posted by Dobie Gillis

You're in luck. According to John Mummert's website the only parts that interchange between the Lincoln and Ford Y-blocks is the oil pump and distributor. Mummert is a very well respected Y-block expert. So any 1957 or later distributor will work. Earlier distributors will fit but will not play well with any carb except the original type.

Here's a link to Mummert's site: http://www.ford-y-block.com/lincoln-y.htm

NO THATS NOT CORRECT !!!!!!!!!!

You can use a Y Block distributor BUT the drive gear must be changed or else SERIOUS damage will occur.

Oldmics

[Dobie Gillis]

He can swap the gear from his original distributor to the new one assuming it's good.

[Oldmics]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Now that will work by replacing the dizzy gear.

I never saw that portion of Mummert"s site. He needs to specify that the distributor gear has to be changed for the engine use.

Oldmics

[Pack guru]

I was reading this forum I know it's older . It said on bubba's fix it site and it took me to an old Lincoln parts store but I don't know how to get ahold of them or I've tried. I was wanting to know about the oil pump and drive rod are the 57 distributor they were talking about putting in detrick's car. Will that 1957 oil pump and drive rod court so I can use the 57 distributor in my 1953 317 cubic inch it has a different oil pump rod can I just be changed to the 57 model?

[rotorwrench]

Don't be afraid to start a new thread for stuff like this.

The Y-blocks that were made for Lincoln and trucks are not quite the same as the smaller Y-blocks made for the Ford & Mercury products. I don't have the Big Job truck books to check but I have some Lincoln books. The Ford & Mercury stuff may be different than the larger truck & Lincoln Y-blocks. *The 57 Mercury had the 368 engine option so they are a Lincoln type Y-block and the distributor should work on a 317 if you can change the oil pump to the hex drive.

The difference between the early 1954/55 & some 56 Ford Y-blocks ignition system and the late 56 & 57 ignition system has mostly to do with the type of system that they had. Holley made carburetors and ignitions for FoMoCo for a long time and the systems were related in that the early ones were the Load-O-Matic system and the later ones were not. The Load -O-Matic required a proper carburetor to operate the vacuum control for the automatic spark advance. The later set up used a different form of vacuum control that is more like the systems used well up into the 1960s & early 70s. They also have a centrifugal advance to work with the vacuum spark control that the Load-O-Matic didn't have.

I looked at the Lincoln parts books and compared them to the Ford & Mercury parts books and all I can say is that they are similar but not the same. The big Lincoln motor used the Load-O-Matic but all the part numbers are different. I don't know how similar they may be. Some parts cross over and some don't.

The early Ford Y-blocks used the blade & slot type oil pump/distributor drive but that changed when the later type oil pump came out. The big Lincolns changed over to the late type non-Load-O-Matic is 1957 as well and it also had the new style drive from the pump. My only concern about a swap would be whether the ignition timing curve might be different or whether there might be a difference in length of the distributor shaft. Someone that knows the differences between big Y-block and the normal Y-block could confirm better than I can.

*I found this on the HAMB. It says they can be interchanged but the drive gear is different. 15 tooth instead of 14 tooth on the drive gear.
https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/...it-lyb.565279/

[Lost and Profound]

I am currently having a similar issue. The carb on the 53 lincoln capri is siezed and doesnt appear to be in any hurry to free up. Bit lost about the earlier part of this thread when saying the distributor would not work with any other carb as it is vacuum advance? Is it ported or manifold vac? and why would it not work with any other carb ? Thanks in advance

[dmsfrr]

Originally Posted by Lost and Profound

. . . Bit lost about the earlier part of this thread when saying the distributor would not work with any other carb as it is vacuum advance? Is it ported or manifold vac? and why would it not work with any other carb ? Thanks in advance

The '56 and earlier distributors use only a very low vacuum signal (0 to 5 inches) from the '56 and earlier carburetors to advance the timing, they don't have any centrifugal advance at all, just the vacuum signal.

'57 and later distributors use a ported signal of 5 to 20 inches of vacuum from the carburetor to 'fine tune' the timing advance, which is primarily controlled by centrifugal fly-weights.
There isn't a practical way a '57 and later carburetor can properly operate an earlier distributor.
.

[Dobie Gillis]

The Loadomatic distributor timing advance was vacuum only, there were no flyweights. The vacuum supplied to the distributor was through a special passage in the carburetor and was varied by throttle opening. Effectively they were a matched pair. The advance specs varied between brands (Ford, Mercury, Lincoln) and likely by engine displacement. Any other type of carburetor will not supply the proper vacuum signal to the distributor. The engine will run with the wrong type of carb, but not very well except within a vary narrow range of RPMs and load. Performance and gas mileage will be the pits. It wasn't one of Ford's better ideas.

[scicala]

Originally Posted by Lost and Profound

I am currently having a similar issue. The carb on the 53 lincoln capri is siezed and doesnt appear to be in any hurry to free up. Bit lost about the earlier part of this thread when saying the distributor would not work with any other carb as it is vacuum advance? Is it ported or manifold vac? and why would it not work with any other carb ? Thanks in advance

Hello,

I have a restored Holley 2140 carburetor for a '53 Lincoln 317 if you are interested. It's a one year only carburetor. There is an add for it in the swap meet section of Ford Barn. It won't let me load pictures, but if you give me your email address I can send pictures.

Sal (586) 612-1650 [email protected]

[Lost and Profound]

Thanks for the replies all. Makes sense now. I dont like it... but it makes sense.

[KULTULZ]

It seems to me the first question to ask yourself is if the car will be a driver, performance and/or a dedicated restoration.

There is nothing wrong (IMO) with LOAD-O-MATIC for an everyday street car if tuned properly with matched components. If you want to bypass the LOM and perhaps gain a little more performance, you would then consider the 1957/ DUAL ADVANCE DIST and an appropriate carb.

I used to exchange with person(s) in EUROPE some time ago, and each country seemed to have their own car club, thereby being able to help one another. There was one guy (GERMANY?) that setup a method where he would have filled a container with orders in N. JERSEY and it came in @ Antwerp to hold import costs down.

[packrat5]

Guys, the y-block and Lincoln distributors interchange. All you need to do is switch the gears. Plus, if you do that you will have to upgrade to a later hex-drive oil pump as well.

[TomO]

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The 53 Lincoln distributor had a mechanical advance that was connected to the throttle on the carburetor. To change to a later carb and distributor, you will probably have to change the linkage and make sure that it works with the hydramatic.


IMHO your best bet is to buy the 1953 carburetor from Sal and use that. I am running one of his rebuilt carbs on my 53 Lincoln and it worked fine until someone "fixed" it before it was broken.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by TomO

The 53 Lincoln distributor had a mechanical advance that was connected to the throttle on the carburetor. To change to a later carb and distributor, you will probably have to change the linkage and make sure that it works with the hydramatic.

Another little interesting caveat -

Learn something everyday here ...