The Ford Barn

jnunez1955 · 12-18-2010, 09:26 PM

Im working on a Model A...and i want to hear from everyone who kept their stock steering and forgot about the f1/f100 steering.

I really want to keep my steering column but everyone says to trash it and go with the 1948-56 truck steering box.
But i read in some places...if the Model A steering box is restored properly that steering can be just as good.
is this true?

Glenn C. · 12-18-2010, 09:36 PM

What year of A do you have ? Makes a big difference if it is a 28 with a 7 tooth box or a 29 - 31 with a two tooth steering box.

jnunez1955 · 12-18-2010, 09:41 PM

'31 Model A.

31Tudor · 12-18-2010, 10:05 PM

Any nicely well restored steering box, works great. The notion that you have to put a different gear box in is just not true. I have restored and run both 2 tooth and 7 tooth and they have very little play in them when done properly.

Dick Deegan · 12-18-2010, 10:12 PM

I have a 30 Coupe with the original 2 tooth steering box which I rebuilt a couple of years ago. The only item in the steering system that is not stock is a short pitman arm.

My steering has very little play ( about 1/2") and the car steers just fine at the speeds that I drive - up to 50 mph and a little more on occasion.

Dick

Peter J · 12-18-2010, 10:26 PM

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I swapped out my 29 7 tooth for a 2 tooth. Took it to a friend who showed me what parts needed replacing. I ordered the new parts and replaced them with no problems. I used Les Andrews' book when adjusting it and it works great. Put in a shortened Pitman arm also.
Pete

Kevin in NJ · 12-18-2010, 11:13 PM

In the past people who have driven properly rebuilt original and F100 boxes found only one difference. When at slow speed or stopped the F100 was easier to turn.

Never tried a F100 so I do not know.

I do know there is some bad info published on rebuilding the box. The retailers are also selling the wrong bushings. The bushings are too large. Some say it is ok to ream the bushings to size which will result in rapid wear. You should align hone to size.

Les's manual would have throw away a NOS sector shaft base on too large a diameter published in his book. This wrong number is also use in Brattons catalog.

Go to my web site tech articles for some more details on sector shaft fitting.

Geo. H · 12-19-2010, 01:03 AM

I rebuilt my 31 A box and it works so well I threw my unmodified f-100 box in the corner and left it there.

Milton · 12-19-2010, 01:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geo. H

I rebuilt my 31 A box and it works so well I threw my unmodified f-100 box in the corner and left it there.

Did your rebuild include a needle bearing, sealed, sector shaft housing?

Milton · 12-19-2010, 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter J

I swapped out my 29 7 tooth for a 2 tooth. Took it to a friend who showed me what parts needed replacing. I ordered the new parts and replaced them with no problems. I used Les Andrews' book when adjusting it and it works great. Put in a shortened Pitman arm also.
Pete

I understand the shorter pitman arm will provide easier steering but what is sacrificed? When turning the wheel from stop to stop do the king pin locking bolt nuts still provide the stop or is it stopped by the worm and sector? How much rotation of the steering wheel to turn a 90 degree corner?

Mike V. Florida · 12-19-2010, 02:46 AM

What you have experenced is the "new is better" syndrome.

Let me change that a little and ask are you planning to use your car as a daily driver, putting tens of thousands of miles a year on it?

If so then you might be better off putting newer stuff into the car to cut down on the time/expense it takes for routine maintenance. Another words turn it into a Shay.

If you are only using it a 1000 or so miles and like to brag that it is as built 80 years ago fix what you have.

As for needle bearings I have read in the different forums that the harness in the shaft is just not there for needle bearing and wear will take place. Again if you are not going to dive the wheels off the car needle bearings are not necessary.

jerry shook · 12-19-2010, 05:19 AM

I have 30 coupe a 31 S/W with orignial steering rebuilt with needle bearings, easy steer kit and shortened pitmun arm both work great, steer easy. I have a 30 town sedan with a f-100 box it works great steer,s better then the original . I dont notice any difference in cars with the shorter pittum arm other then they steer better. MERRY CHRISTMAS.

John LaVoy · 12-19-2010, 08:42 AM

I have driven the seven tooth steering for years, have used the two tooth for a few years and have the F100 box and the EZ Steer box in cars currently. The two tooth will work very well for you, but it needs to be restored and adjusted properly, following Les Andrews instructions work well. The other area is the front end itself needs to be correctly installed and restored for the best steering.

tuneman · 12-19-2010, 09:30 AM

I have driven both the old and the new.
You need to do this also. Ask one of the guys that is telling you to through away your stock
steering box to let you drive his. Then you can judge for yourself

Joop · 12-19-2010, 09:56 AM

I have an original unrestored steering box in my car with 47000 original miles.

It only needed a small adjustment to be perfect again.

nick c · 12-19-2010, 11:15 AM

You might get a hold of Secrets magazine July 2004 pg 21 to 25. It states the year is 1953 - 56 f 100. I'm restoring a 29 AA, I know the 29 steering was not as good as the 30-31, so I might go with the f100 column.
carry on nick

J Franklin · 12-19-2010, 12:04 PM

My original 1930 2 tooth with new sector bushings steers very well, there is no need to make a replacement. Most of us drivers are men after all. are we not?

sturgis 39 · 12-19-2010, 03:40 PM

There was an article in "Secretes of Speed" about the failure of a F-100 steering box. They bore the shaft for the light rod. Apparently the rod was bored too big and the shaft broke and the car lost steering.

Karl · 12-19-2010, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joop

I have an original unrestored steering box in my car with 47000 original miles.

It only needed a small adjustment to be perfect again.

The more experience I have with Model A's the more I realise that the orginal set up is pretty good. So far I have removed and replaced with original parts a modern Bendix starter drive , Modern points, Nylon inserts in the steering gear and an air filter All with IMO improvement in the way the car functions- Karl

12-18-2010, 09:26 PM	#1
jnunez1955 Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 60	Model A steering Im working on a Model A...and i want to hear from everyone who kept their stock steering and forgot about the f1/f100 steering. I really want to keep my steering column but everyone says to trash it and go with the 1948-56 truck steering box. But i read in some places...if the Model A steering box is restored properly that steering can be just as good. is this true?

12-18-2010, 09:36 PM	#2
Glenn C. Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Didsbury Alberta Posts: 838	Re: Model A steering What year of A do you have ? Makes a big difference if it is a 28 with a 7 tooth box or a 29 - 31 with a two tooth steering box.

12-18-2010, 09:41 PM	#3
jnunez1955 Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 60	Re: Model A steering '31 Model A.

12-18-2010, 10:05 PM	#4
31Tudor Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: North Carolina Posts: 611	Re: Model A steering Any nicely well restored steering box, works great. The notion that you have to put a different gear box in is just not true. I have restored and run both 2 tooth and 7 tooth and they have very little play in them when done properly.

12-18-2010, 10:12 PM	#5
Dick Deegan Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 527	Re: Model A steering I have a 30 Coupe with the original 2 tooth steering box which I rebuilt a couple of years ago. The only item in the steering system that is not stock is a short pitman arm. My steering has very little play ( about 1/2") and the car steers just fine at the speeds that I drive - up to 50 mph and a little more on occasion. Dick

12-18-2010, 10:26 PM	#6
Peter J Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Olympia, WA Posts: 691	Re: Model A steering Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) I swapped out my 29 7 tooth for a 2 tooth. Took it to a friend who showed me what parts needed replacing. I ordered the new parts and replaced them with no problems. I used Les Andrews' book when adjusting it and it works great. Put in a shortened Pitman arm also. Pete

12-18-2010, 11:13 PM	#7
Kevin in NJ Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: South East NJ Posts: 3,398	Re: Model A steering In the past people who have driven properly rebuilt original and F100 boxes found only one difference. When at slow speed or stopped the F100 was easier to turn. Never tried a F100 so I do not know. I do know there is some bad info published on rebuilding the box. The retailers are also selling the wrong bushings. The bushings are too large. Some say it is ok to ream the bushings to size which will result in rapid wear. You should align hone to size. Les's manual would have throw away a NOS sector shaft base on too large a diameter published in his book. This wrong number is also use in Brattons catalog. Go to my web site tech articles for some more details on sector shaft fitting.

12-19-2010, 01:03 AM	#8
Geo. H Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 374	Re: Model A steering I rebuilt my 31 A box and it works so well I threw my unmodified f-100 box in the corner and left it there.

12-19-2010, 02:46 AM	#11
Mike V. Florida Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: South Florida Posts: 14,054	Re: Model A steering What you have experenced is the "new is better" syndrome. Let me change that a little and ask are you planning to use your car as a daily driver, putting tens of thousands of miles a year on it? If so then you might be better off putting newer stuff into the car to cut down on the time/expense it takes for routine maintenance. Another words turn it into a Shay. If you are only using it a 1000 or so miles and like to brag that it is as built 80 years ago fix what you have. As for needle bearings I have read in the different forums that the harness in the shaft is just not there for needle bearing and wear will take place. Again if you are not going to dive the wheels off the car needle bearings are not necessary. __________________ What's right about America is that although we have a mess of problems, we have great capacity - intellect and resources - to do some thing about them. - Henry Ford II

12-19-2010, 05:19 AM	#12
jerry shook Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 516	Re: Model A steering I have 30 coupe a 31 S/W with orignial steering rebuilt with needle bearings, easy steer kit and shortened pitmun arm both work great, steer easy. I have a 30 town sedan with a f-100 box it works great steer,s better then the original . I dont notice any difference in cars with the shorter pittum arm other then they steer better. MERRY CHRISTMAS.

12-19-2010, 08:42 AM	#13
John LaVoy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Rocklin, CA Posts: 1,219	Re: Model A steering I have driven the seven tooth steering for years, have used the two tooth for a few years and have the F100 box and the EZ Steer box in cars currently. The two tooth will work very well for you, but it needs to be restored and adjusted properly, following Les Andrews instructions work well. The other area is the front end itself needs to be correctly installed and restored for the best steering.

12-19-2010, 09:30 AM	#14
tuneman Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 264	Re: Model A steering I have driven both the old and the new. You need to do this also. Ask one of the guys that is telling you to through away your stock steering box to let you drive his. Then you can judge for yourself

12-19-2010, 09:56 AM	#15
Joop Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Glendale, AZ Posts: 2,953	Re: Model A steering I have an original unrestored steering box in my car with 47000 original miles. It only needed a small adjustment to be perfect again. Last edited by Joop; 12-19-2010 at 10:11 AM.

12-19-2010, 11:15 AM	#16
nick c Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 260	Re: Model A steering You might get a hold of Secrets magazine July 2004 pg 21 to 25. It states the year is 1953 - 56 f 100. I'm restoring a 29 AA, I know the 29 steering was not as good as the 30-31, so I might go with the f100 column. carry on nick

12-19-2010, 12:04 PM	#17
J Franklin Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Oregon Posts: 5,964	Re: Model A steering My original 1930 2 tooth with new sector bushings steers very well, there is no need to make a replacement. Most of us drivers are men after all. are we not?

12-19-2010, 03:40 PM	#18
sturgis 39 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Lead. South Dakota Posts: 963	Re: Model A steering There was an article in "Secretes of Speed" about the failure of a F-100 steering box. They bore the shaft for the light rod. Apparently the rod was bored too big and the shaft broke and the car lost steering. __________________ IF IT CAN NOT BE FIXED WITH BLASTING WIRE, JB WELD OR DUCT TAPE ---IT CAN NOT BE FIXED Do not get me started on the stupidity of ethanol. I think one of the monitors is from Iowa and he will delete the thread. Last edited by sturgis 39; 12-19-2010 at 06:22 PM.