'54 Y-Block push rods

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by JimNNN

I'm not a member at Y-blocks unlimited, but when I tried to register this morning, it said "registration disabled." They may be getting a lot of spam, or something, so they're taking measures.

See The Attached Jim -

There is so much knowledge there it is a shame that you cannot use it.

When you ordered the push-rods, did you know the engine was a 239?

[JimNNN]

Again, I really appreciate your help and support, KULTULZ. I contacted Eaton Balancing about getting on the forum.



I did know that it was a 239 cid engine. I'm guessing I bought the rods about 10 years ago. Just looked for my receipt and didn't find it, but I'm pretty sure I didn't buy them directly from Elgin, though I could be wrong. I think maybe I bought them from a parts supplier on eBay.

[KULTULZ]

I meant when you purchased them, did you realize the engine was a 239 rather than a 272/292/312? That may be the problem.

[JimNNN]

Yes, I knew it was a 239. I had the shop manual by that time, and besides the previous owner had told me it was a 239.



I see what you mean that the ball ends are tips that I guess can be changed out(??) With that in mind, I see what you're saying about the push rods likely being hollow.



Anyway, when I was last up at storage, I set the preliminary lash at .019" with the original push rods per the shop manual, and had to loosen many of them (ie, increase the clearance) to get there. I figured that would this would result in a bit more ticking in my typically very quiet motor, and I was right. I've always heard that solid lifters usually had more ticking than hydraulics, and this was part of the reason for checking lash: my engine seemed a bit on the quiet side.


However, I recently saw a video from Y-block guy Tim McMaster that said you can set the lash as low as .015" to help the engine run a little quieter. Any opinions on this? Don't want to wear valves or seats more than I need too.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by JimNNN

Yes, I knew it was a 239. I had the shop manual by that time, and besides the previous owner had told me it was a 239

But the 239 was not discussed in the 1957 FORD WSM. How did you come to discover the difference other than the former owner being honest? Did you mention 1957 FORD on the order? That may explain the length difference.

I see what you mean that the ball ends are tips that I guess can be changed out(??) With that in mind, I see what you're saying about the push rods likely being hollow.

ELGIN gives you a choice of four type ends. I found the description in their catalog but cannot find it again. The PN PR-71 gives you the end types -

[KULTULZ]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

As for valve lash, follow this thread - https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showt...06#post2031506

He is in the same situation. Any questions feel free to ask.

EDIT -

However, I recently saw a video from Y-block guy Tim McMaster that said you can set the lash as low as .015" to help the engine run a little quieter. Any opinions on this? Don't want to wear valves or seats more than I need too.

The most likely reason McMasters suggests a tighter lash (IMO) is that the valve tip on the rockers are subject to very extreme wear making proper valve lash a guessing game.

TED EATON - JOHN MUMMERT - TIM McMASTERS (and one other that I can't remember) are the final authority regarding FYB. Just take everything you read with a grain of salt and ask is this the best method for my engine.

[JimNNN]

Thanks for the advice, KULTULZ. BTW, what the Y-Block forever forum is apparently doing is limiting the times within which people can register for the forum. I guess this is pretty effective in limiting the spam that was mentioned in the link/note you provided. Many thanks to the mods at this forum in keeping the spam off. Not an easy job I'm sure.


I never mentioned to anyone that my car was a 1957 (??) It's a '54. I remember that the rods were advertised as fitting a 1954 y-block 239...but I can't remember where I bought them, exactly. My shop manual is for '54. If I mentioned "1957" anywhere in this thread, I misspoke. Sorry! Here's my car:

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by JimNNN

I never mentioned to anyone that my car was a 1957 (??) It's a '54. I remember that the rods were advertised as fitting a 1954 y-block 239...but I can't remember where I bought them, exactly. My shop manual is for '54. If I mentioned "1957" anywhere in this thread, I misspoke. Sorry! Here's my car:

Originally Posted by JimNNN

POST #1

... correct for a 1954 Ford 239 Y-block. Also, I saw (on ebay) yesterday a set of new 239 rods that look pretty much like the Elgin replacements I bought (but they aren't Elgin.)

...uh...

No, that seems to be my mistake. I am confusing your car with another thread.

SENILE and CRS.

Sorry about that ...

[paul2748]

The problem with the TBlock forum is spammers. Because of this, you have to go directly to the moderator (Ted) to become a member.

[JimNNN]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

...uh...

No, that seems to be my mistake. I am confusing your car with another thread.

SENILE and CRS.

Sorry about that ...

No prob! Appreciate your help, especially in helping me around the YBF forum issue.



Paul said:

The problem with the Y Block forum is spammers. Because of this, you have to go directly to the moderator (Ted) to become a member.

I just registered there a few minutes ago. Looking forward to being a member. Thanks to Ted and the mods for letting me join.



Here's a Y-block question that some of you probably know, though. I set my final hot lash today with the existing rods today in case I decide to keep them instead of changing them out (if the new ones won't work.)



I basically followed the shop manual, but I didn't get one aspect of the instructions. I set the lash in a preliminary adjustment per the manual (ie, with the engine cold and not running.) THe manual then says to do a second valve lash check with the engine warmed up and idling. How do you check the lash with a regular feeler gauge while the engine is idling? I'm guessing there's some special tool for that I don't have. I just got the engine up to norm oper. temp, then shut it off and removed the covers and checked the lash the same way I did the first time.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by JimNNN

I basically followed the shop manual, but I didn't get one aspect of the instructions. I set the lash in a preliminary adjustment per the manual (ie, with the engine cold and not running.) THe manual then says to do a second valve lash check with the engine warmed up and idling. How do you check the lash with a regular feeler gauge while the engine is idling? I'm guessing there's some special tool for that I don't have. I just got the engine up to norm oper. temp, then shut it off and removed the covers and checked the lash the same way I did the first time.

(IMO) -

You set all cyls cold to get them somewhat in the ballpark. You then start the engine and bring it to operating temp and then go through them again hot.

You can adjust while running with just a feeler gauge but it takes experience and perseverance as the early FYB had two piece adjusters and that is difficult to keep up with. If you were an experienced LINE TECH in the day, you would do them while the engine is running to make your flat-rate.

Again, the FYB is infamous for rocker tip wear that will give incorrect feeler gauge readings. If that bad, you would have to replace or have faced.

Here's a Y-block question that some of you probably know, though. I set my final hot lash today with the existing rods today in case I decide to keep them instead of changing them out (if the new ones won't work.)

If any of those rods were bent, you need to shake them, as they will most likely bend again and if straightened will not be true and throw your lash off. Either find NOS (again junk) or quality aftermarket tubular rods).

[Crankster]

Originally Posted by JimNNN

THe manual then says to do a second valve lash check with the engine warmed up and idling. How do you check the lash with a regular feeler gauge while the engine is idling?

What (Ford) manual says to set them with the engine idling?

I'm not doubting you, but by '64 they didn't specify that anymore. I may have to feed my ODC and go down to the garage and actually check the manual, but pretty sure on that.

I never worried about it that much, but if I were going to go through the trouble of setting them hot, I'd want the engine hot. As in summertime hot, after a highway run. That's the only way engine oil will get up to temperature, the coolant temperature is kind of a false indication.

You can sacrifice a .019" feeler gauge (or whatever clearance desired) by bending it at the correct angle, or buy one. It will beat them up badly. The idea, I've never tried it, is to slow the idle down as low as it will go, and stay running btw.

What you really want if you're that picky is a "P&G Valve Gapper" which is designed for this (engine idling).

[JimNNN]

Originally Posted by Crankster

What (Ford) manual says to set them with the engine idling?

'52 - '54 manual, '54 addendum.

[flatrod]

The problem with setting them hot not running, is that it is not hot by the time you are done. What I do is have them rough set, run it up to temp, both oil and water temp. The pop a cover off, set any cylinder up to TDC on the firing stroke, check lash, make note, then come back the next day and check it again. That will give you the proper cold lash setting. I suspect it will only be about .002 to .003 different. But if you had aluminum heads, swell would be about .006 to .007, if all aluminum, block and heads I have seen as much as .020 swell.
I see no way to accurately set lash hot unless you can do it running. With shaft rockers, that is hard to do specially with early adjusters.

[JimNNN]

Originally Posted by flatrod

The problem with setting them hot not running, is that it is not hot by the time you are done. What I do is have them rough set, run it up to temp, both oil and water temp. The pop a cover off, set any cylinder up to TDC on the firing stroke, check lash, make note, then come back the next day and check it again. That will give you the proper cold lash setting. I suspect it will only be about .002 to .003 different. But if you had aluminum heads, swell would be about .006 to .007, if all aluminum, block and heads I have seen as much as .020 swell.
I see no way to accurately set lash hot unless you can do it running. With shaft rockers, that is hard to do specially with early adjusters.

Thanks for the input Flatrod. That helps. I set my lash at what I guess you could call a "tight" .019 inch when up to temp (more or less) but not running. I put the feeler gauge in then tightened the adjuster enough to hold the feeler gauge in place, but not so tight that the gauge couldn't be reinserted (snugly with effort) after the adjuster was secured in place. This resulted in tightening up the lash on the valves compared to the cold setting I did (which was probably unnecessary in my case.) It did result in quieting down the ticking that I had after the initial cold adjustment.



I think I was more or less consistent from valve to valve, but who knows. I'll be undoing all of this if I put the new rods in, which I'm talking to the folks over on the Y blocks forever forum about now.

[JimNNN]

Okay, an update: I replaced one rod and tested it with cautious cranking, then took out the rocker shafts and replaced them all. Preliminary lash adjustment made. Seems to work fine. I drove it around for twenty minutes or so with no apparent problems. I'll still have to do a final lash adjustment with the engine hot (probably one bank at a time.)



So much ado about nothing on my part (which is common.) Both the vendor and manufacturer said they were the correct push rods for my car, but when they looked different than the originals I didn't know what to think.



I did a better job of straightening the originals than I remember doing. At a glance I couldn't tell that any had ever been bent, though I'm sure a good straight edge would reveal the truth. I'll keep the originals with the car. BTW, my engine is an EBU.

[KULTULZ]

A cheap and easy way to check a push-rod for straightness is to roll it across the kitchen table. Of course, do not do this while the wife is in the house.

[JimNNN]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

A cheap and easy way to check a push-rod for straightness is to roll it across the kitchen table. Of course, do not do this while the wife is in the house.

Just move the kitchen table into the garage...problem solved!

[Crankster]

Originally Posted by JimNNN

Preliminary lash adjustment made. Seems to work fine. I drove it around for twenty minutes or so with no apparent problems. I'll still have to do a final lash adjustment with the engine hot.

One thing I noticed messing around with different lash settings, whether on the "tight" or "loose" side of spec, performimg a vacuum test after adjustment is a really good QC check. Normally a stock Y-Block pulls 20" at idle (at sea level). If manifold vacuum were to drop off noticeably after a valve adjustment, then the lash clearances are on the "too tight" side, I assume because valves are opening too early. This vacuum business might be tough to determine with a performance engine (camshaft), but on a stocker it will be very noticeable.

[JimNNN]

Thanks for the info, Crankster.