Can't find the nipples (and other lubrication issues)

[Hoogah]

I'm greasing my '28 Phaeton for the first time since purchasing it last year, and so learning as I go (with a copy of the Les Andrews manual by my side). I've run into a few issues/questions that I'm sure you guys will be all over (but which may also make me look like an complete idiot ). Oh well, here's goes anyway (and sorry for the lengthy post!).....

1. Can't find the nipples
This has never been a problem of mine until now! I'm talking about the two that are supposed to be located on the brake and clutch pedal bushing. Check out these photos of this area, taken from the back and front. It looks exactly like Les Andres drew it in his book except for NO NIPPLES?? Is something staring me in the face? Like a nipple or two?

P1060798(20%).jpg

P1060799(20%).jpg

P1060800(20%).jpg


2. Too much grease?
I haven't done much greasing, but learnt years ago to pump until I see grease break out somewhere, that way I know the joint is full of grease. This was on agricultural equipment like cultivator tynes, etc. Anyway, not sure if this should apply to the A, and now I'm worried that I've pumped too much grease into three places:
(a) Water pump - The front grease nipple on the water pump (behind fan shaft) took HEAPS, but it didn't come out anywhere. Is that OK? Does this mean that it was really dry in the first place?
(b) U-Joint - as above
(c) Rear axle bearings - again I was expecting grease to emerge from somewhere. I fear that perhaps it did - inside the brake drums?? I've yet to take them off for a look see, but am thinking that this is a likely outcome, and would be a bad thing based on my search of previous threads?
If I'm not sure about previous lubrication history, is there a general rule about how many pumps to put into various areas?

3. Grease gun coupler
My car has a mixture of original and modern grease nipples. I am purchasing the coupler to use on my modern grease gun, as found in the Brattons etc catalogues

GreaseGunCouplerForA.jpg

Does this adapter work with ALL the original nipples? They seem to vary quite a lot and I would have thought that that the tapered ones would need a different fitting to the straight sides ones.

While I don't have an original FORD grease gun, I do have two old Tecalemit grease guns in a similar style to the FORD one (one of them has never been used). I think Tecalemit was a British brand. See photos. Does anyone know if this gun is equivalent to the FORD gun, allowing me to save on the adapter? (I fear not, as "compatibility" doesn't seem to be the natural state of the world we live in. )

TecalemitGreaseGun-Side(Small).jpg

TecalemitGreaseGun-Branding(small).jpg

TecalemitGreaseGun-Nozzle(Small).jpg

4. Blocked nipple
One rear spring shackle nipple is impossible to pump any grease into at all. I've prodded it with a small nail to see if I could push the steel ball in a fraction, and a tiny bit of grease pushed out under pressure, but it made no difference. Any suggestions? I don't want my car to get mastitis!

5. Accelerator Control Shaft
The Les Andrews manual recommends a squirt of oil here. My RHD car looks nothing like the LHD diagram in the manual, so basically I just put a drop of oil anywhere where there is metal pushing metal to move the linkages. Is there anything else I should have done here?

6. Grease recommendations
I realise that this should have been my first question - YESTERDAY! Anyway, long story short is that I'm confused by all the greases on the shelf at my auto store. Is there a guide somewhere that tells me if I have to use different types of grease on different areas of the car? Do you guys keep more than one gun loaded for this purpose?
Will this question open up a can of worms, like oil threads do?
If you feel inclined to respond to this question, can you please stay away from BRAND names, which may not help me in Oz. Thanks.

7. Storing the grease gun
What's the best way to store a loaded grease gun that stops it oozing or contains the ooze without making a mess? Mine oozes what appears to be a light fraction of the grease that separates from the heavy fraction during storage. Not heaps, but enough to be annoying.

Thanks for our opinions on any/all of the above. Today has been a fun learning experience. I've enjoyed poking around under the car.

[Tom Wesenberg]

The first picture looks like you could use a new trunion for the clutch adjuster.

You can store the grease gun wrapped in paper towels and in a plastic bag.

Heat often helps to make stuck nipples take grease. If the nipple has a spring loaded check disc or ball don't use so much heat as to destroy the spring tension.

Rear axle bearings should be hand packed about every 10,000 miles or 10 years. Twice as often if in dusty conditions.

Your grease gun should work on all original fittings.

Maybe someone changed the multiplate tranny and pedals to the later style without fittings.

[George Miller]

not all pedals had grease fittings. Do not remember which years had them.

[Tom Cavallaro]

two things I see wrong...you may have pumped too much in the water pump, which just goes into the water, and the rear bearings may have gotten too much, Im not sure if it will effect the break shoes or not.

[Tom Wesenberg]

The front water pump bearing doesn't matter if it gets too much grease, but the rear bushing does, so just give it one pump with the nut loose. Snug the nut after greasing the rear bushing.

Any moving parts without grease fittings (your pedals) should get a squirt of oil.

[1crosscut]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

If you put "heaps" of grease into the rear of the water pump I would suggest that you consider removing the water pump and try to get the excess grease out of there. If you haven't run it yet you should be able to get most of it. All that extra grease will have to go somewhere and it will probably end up in your radiator tubes blocking flow.

A bit of heat can do wonders in getting grease to flow. It probably is not the grease zirk that is plugged but hardened grease farther in. Gently warm the area and keep trying to push some grease in. Once you get it flowing keep pumping to push out the old hardened stuff.

Most joints you won't do much harm in putting too much grease in except for making a mess with the excess. The exception to this is the rear axle bearings. Forget the grease zirk on those and pack by hand.
Grease it up good and use a rag or two or three to clean off the excess. Drive it for a while and wipe again as grease will continue to make its way out for a while after lubing things up.

Don't grease the zirk on the steering box if yours has one instead of a plug. The steering box takes 600 wt. oil.

Don't forget to oil the distributor and the throttle linkages behind the head next to the firewall.

[Hoogah]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

The first picture looks like you could use a new trunion for the clutch adjuster.

Rear axle bearings should be hand packed about every 10,000 miles or 10 years. Twice as often if in dusty conditions.

Maybe someone changed the multiplate tranny and pedals to the later style without fittings.

Originally Posted by 1crosscut

If you put "heaps" of grease into the rear of the water pump I would suggest that you consider removing the water pump and try to get the excess grease out of there.

A bit of heat can do wonders in getting grease to flow. It probably is not the grease zirk that is plugged but hardened grease farther in. Gently warm the area and keep trying to push some grease in. Once you get it flowing keep pumping to push out the old hardened stuff.

Most joints you won't do much harm in putting too much grease in except for making a mess with the excess. The exception to this is the rear axle bearings. Forget the grease zirk on those and pack by hand.

Thanks for the advice everyone. Seems to be concensus on not using the rear axle bearing grease nipples, but hand packing instead. I'll follow this advice (in future!), as well as trying some heat on the blocked fitting, and pulling off both water pump and brake drums to see where the extra grease has gone and retrieve what I can!

Tom can you elaborate on your comment about the new trunion for the clutch adjuster? Thanks.

[Tom Wesenberg]

That's the round bar that pivots off the pedal loops. See how loose it fits. You'll likely see 2 grooves worn in the trunion. It's not a big deal to use a worn part, but a new part doesn't cost much, so I'd add it to your list for the next order. Cars just operate and feel better when worn parts are replaced with good parts.

[Synchro909]

Hello Hoogah,
Neither of my cars had nipples on the pedals so I fitted them on one and the other, I drilled a hole and countersunk the top of it to take oil. I did the same on the shaft that goes behind the head for the starter. (LHD cars have their throttle shaft go through the same place.)
It sounds as though you have put too much grease in the water pump. If you don't take it off and remove the excess, it will end up all over the motor and firewall. Not a good look. As for the U joint, I only put in one or two pumps.
Rear wheel bearings: The general consensus seems to be to do it by hand. I've always put one or two pumps in the nipple each time. About 50,000miles and all is still going well.
I have encountered many shackle nipples that won't take grease. What has been said above is a good start. If that fails, I take the nipple out and try putting grease through it on the bench. If it is still blocked and I can't clear it, I replace it. If it does pass grease, the problem is further in. Do you have the car off the ground so that the axles are dangling to take the weight of the car off the usual load bearing sides of the shackles? If they are worn, sometimes the groove on the inside of the shackle bush is gone thus sealing off the end of the hole the grease comes through making it very difficult to push grease in because you have to lift the car a little with the pressure from the grease gun to get it to move. To see if they are worn, take a BIG screwdriver and try prying the eye of the spring away from the usual load. If you get movement, they are worn.
Any old chassis grease will do the job for most things but I like to use a good high temperature bearing grease in places like the front wheel bearings. Maybe overkill but I like the feeling of comfort knowing it'll be right.

PS Have you sent off the entry form for the Hamilton rally yet?

[Hoogah]

Originally Posted by Synchro909

Hello Hoogah,
Neither of my cars had nipples on the pedals so I fitted them on one and the other, I drilled a hole and countersunk the top of it to take oil. I did the same on the shaft that goes behind the head for the starter. (LHD cars have their throttle shaft go through the same place.)

The "no nipple" pedals must have been a later (post '28) modification?
Good idea about drilling your own oil ways. What would you do in the meantime?

[/QUOTE] I have encountered many shackle nipples that won't take grease. What has been said above is a good start. If that fails, I take the nipple out and try putting grease through it on the bench. If it is still blocked and I can't clear it, I replace it. If it does pass grease, the problem is further in. Do you have the car off the ground so that the axles are dangling to take the weight of the car off the usual load bearing sides of the shackles? If they are worn, sometimes the groove on the inside of the shackle bush is gone thus sealing off the end of the hole the grease comes through making it very difficult to push grease in because you have to lift the car a little with the pressure from the grease gun to get it to move. To see if they are worn, take a BIG screwdriver and try prying the eye of the spring away from the usual load. If you get movement, they are worn.[/QUOTE]

Haven't tried taking the weight off the wheels. Will do this as my first action (line of least resistance!). I think I replaced both bushes on both sides when I installed the Mitchell O/D, so that shouldn't be a problem, but will check this too.

[/QUOTE]Any old chassis grease will do the job for most things but I like to use a good high temperature bearing grease in places like the front wheel bearings. Maybe overkill but I like the feeling of comfort knowing it'll be right.[/QUOTE]

Goodo, thanks for your advice there too. It's easy to get confused when starting out with a low knowledge base!

[/QUOTE]PS Have you sent off the entry form for the Hamilton rally yet?[/QUOTE]

Not yet, but I'm going to be there for sure. How many A's does the club muster at a weekend event like this, on average? I'm looking forward to seeing the one that went around Australia last year!!

[tbirdtbird]

First he stated he put heaps of grease in the front water pump bearing.

Second, Tom W alerted him to the rear wheel bearings. Meaning, ignore the grease fittings for that. The grease in those bearings has no where to go, and stays in place nicely. Even should you pull the hubs in 10K, I doubt you will find they need grease

Third, for a stuck fitting, change it out for a fresh fitting, heat the area with a propane torch, and apply grease. The old style Alemite fittings are difficult to lock onto the way a modern zerk can be locked onto and good pressure built up to force grease thru. If you like, you can change the fitting back to the alemite style after.

[Tom Wesenberg]

"The "no nipple" pedals must have been a later (post '28) modification?
Good idea about drilling your own oil ways. What would you do in the meantime?"

A few drops of motor oil on each side of the pedals and in the middle of the two pedals will keep the bushings well lubricated. Most of the wear we are now repairing was caused by NO lubrication.

[Hoogah]

Originally Posted by tbirdtbird

First he stated he put heaps of grease in the front water pump bearing.

Second, Tom W alerted him to the rear wheel bearings. Meaning, ignore the grease fittings for that. The grease in those bearings has no where to go, and stays in place nicely. Even should you pull the hubs in 10K, I doubt you will find they need grease

Third, for a stuck fitting, change it out for a fresh fitting, heat the area with a propane torch, and apply grease. The old style Alemite fittings are difficult to lock onto the way a modern zerk can be locked onto and good pressure built up to force grease thru. If you like, you can change the fitting back to the alemite style after.

Actually, I've overdone the rear water pump bearing too (although I didn't specifically say that), so will try to rectify that by removing and seeing what I can scrape back out.

I hear you about the rear wheel bearings! Thanks for reinforcing.

Also appreciate your experience re replacing stuck Alemite fittings with modern zerk. Thanks.

I'll just ask again - did the photos of the Tecalemit (British?) grease gun ring any bells for anyone in terms of compatibility with original grease fittings?

Thanks again for all feedback (on what is a pretty basic set of questions!)

[Tom Wesenberg]

"I'll just ask again - did the photos of the Tecalemit (British?) grease gun ring any bells for anyone in terms of compatibility with original grease fittings?"

See #2

[tbirdtbird]

OK, good.

the deal on the rear WP bearing is to use the special water-soluable grease available from the suppliers very sparingly. This way you wont clog your rad. with non-disolvable grease balls

[abachman3]

The universal joint behind transmission should be pumped full of greadse. Remove one of the screws from the speedometer gear and fill with grease until you get some coming out the bolt hole.

[Hoogah]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

"I'll just ask again - did the photos of the Tecalemit (British?) grease gun ring any bells for anyone in terms of compatibility with original grease fittings?"

See #2

Sorry, I thought you were referring to my modern gun, but couldn't understand why you'd say that. Brain freeze! I'm going to try the Tecalemit gun.

[pooch]

I think the tecalemit gun came in a motorcycle tool kit, from my BSA knowledge (fading quickly ).

Probably same as Pommie cars, dunno .

[Hoogah]

Originally Posted by pooch

I think the tecalemit gun came in a motorcycle tool kit, from my BSA knowledge (fading quickly ).

Probably same as Pommie cars, dunno .

Makes sense. These guns were my dad's, who rode an Excelsior motor cycle back in the 1950s. They were made in Coventry, England.

[George Miller]

Originally Posted by George Miller

not all pedals had grease fittings. Do not remember which years had them.

Looked it up in my book says they were used starting November 1930.