Install oil filter

[AnthonyG]

Got my 8BA apart for other reasons some might know about, thinking I might as well put an oil filter set up while apart. What’s best & How to? Oil pan off heads off, block in indexing stand.

[JSeery]

Depends on what you are wanting, I like the 95% setup. It is fairly simple to do. If you want full-flow there are several approaches.

[AnthonyG]

J u got way more experience than me. Assuming 95% must b good if unlike? I think that pulls oil to filter from top rear oil port where normally oil pressure transducer goes then how’s it get back into oil pan? Is there a kit?

[40cpe]

The process requires drilling/tapping in the oil passages. Maybe not a good idea on an assembled engine unless one has a way to keep chips from ending up in the engine.

[JSeery]

No kits that I am aware of, but fairly simple parts to set up.

[JSeery]

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If your wanting something somewhat bolt on, there are units (kits) for sell that work directly from the oil pump and out the side of the oil pan. I have zero experience with any of them!

https://flatheadspeedandmachine.com/...sion-kits.html

http://www.gollershotrods.com/catalog.aspx

http://myplace.frontier.com/~wgmumaw...ilterBills.htm

[Robert61]

I did what is depicted in the sketches above but I also plugged the passage going from the pump cavity to the rear main. I then drilled a new passage down from the fuel pump push rod to the rear main and added the hole to the bearing. This way all three mains feed off of the center tube and are fully filtered. Going like the sketch shows will not filter the rear main or rod bearing. This couldn't be done on an assembled engine.

[tubman]

With the low mileage and general overall pampering these cars usually get, the original bypass system is just fine. As a matter of fact, in most situations it may be superior to the alternatives because it will remove smaller particles than a system using a regular full flow element. When was the last time you ran your car down an old dusty dirt road? Or went 5000 miles between oil changes? If you are subjecting your vehicle to these extreme conditions, you may want to consider upgrading the system, but for most of us, the bypass system is just fine. The common knock on these systems is that all of the oil does not get filtered as it passes through the pump and supply system. That may be, but I think it was someone on here who did some experimenting and found that all of the oil goes through the filter in a five minute period. With the finer filtration capabilities provided, it's perfectly adequate and possibly a better way to go.

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by tubman

With the low mileage and general overall pampering these cars usually get, the original bypass system is just fine. As a matter of fact, in most situations it may be superior to the alternatives because it will remove smaller particles than a system using a regular full flow element. When was the last time you ran your car down an old dusty dirt road? Or went 5000 miles between oil changes? If you are subjecting your vehicle to these extreme conditions, you may want to consider upgrading the system, but for most of us, the bypass system is just fine. The common knock on these systems is that all of the oil does not get filtered as it passes through the pump and supply system. That may be, but I think it was someone on here who did some experimenting and found that all of the oil goes through the filter in a five minute period. With the finer filtration capabilities provided, it's perfectly adequate and possibly a better way to go.

Totally agree and it was I who determined that at idle speed, 5 quarts of oil
goes thru the bypass filter in 11 minutes, as it does thru the Amsoil bypass filter I adapted to mine.

[Desoto291Hemi]

Unless I change my mind,,,,I’m gonna go with the stock filter system.
I’m not gonna change it extra,,,I’m just going to change it when it is supposed to be and use good oil.

Tommy

[estout81]

Good thinking Tommy. My '51 has the stock filter and keeps the oil real clean. Don't try to out engineer the engineers.

[3739ford]

I'm building a 276 cu in and plan on using stock oil filter. I have a 1942 Ford GPW jeep all original and oil stays clean.

[Desoto291Hemi]

Thanks Estout,,,,
It is good to hear an encouraging post about stock filters.

Even with my everyday off topic stuff,,,I still check the dipstick.
As long as the oil on the stick is honey golden,,,it’s still fresh.
After it turns a lite brown,,,it is getting contaminated some.
Dark brown ,,start looking at the mileage and figure a time to change it.
It’s not just mileage,,,,,just like hours on an industrial engine,,and idle hours,,,,oil gets contaminated from fuel .
Anyway,,that is my plan.

Tommy

[AnthonyG]

Looks like whether full flow or 95% flow the return hole in rear of engine needs to B drill & tapped creating potential for metal chips in flow path. As I’m not doing a rebuild & just replacing a piston indications r not to do. Guess I’ll pass & just keep changing oil every 1500 miles.

[AnthonyG]

Thx for all the INFO

[Ol' Ron]

I have an engine mount for the filter that I use once in awhile, however after everything is said and done I move the oil filter to a bracket behind the steering box. In my truck, it on the trans mount crossmember. I do this to clean up the engine, looks better.

[AnthonyG]

51 Merc-CT, the top pic is ur setup, in it I see the oil comes out of the provided threaded hole usually used for oil pressure transducer then goes through ur AMS filter then out & downward following dip stick tube. But where does it go back into engine where it goes out of sight? Also did u increase the size of the NPT threaded hole where oil out is?

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by AnthonyG

51 Merc-CT, the top pic is ur setup, in it I see the oil comes out of the provided threaded hole usually used for oil pressure transducer then goes through ur AMS filter then out & downward following dip stick tube. But where does it go back into engine where it goes out of sight? Also did u increase the size of the NPT threaded hole where oil out is?

The oil returns to where it normally does from the original bypass filter to the side of the block.

[AnthonyG]

51 Mercury-CT, Thx, got it! So ur happy w results, how many miles since conversion? I can use oil pressure port NPT threaded hole (W/O larger drill tap modification) as supply to filter if I see correctly? Looks like u use the lower ( 90 degree indexed) oil pressure port hole for ur oil pressure transducer?

[JSeery]

Originally Posted by AnthonyG

51 Mercury-CT, Thx, got it! So ur happy w results, how many miles since conversion? I can use oil pressure port NPT threaded hole (W/O larger drill tap modification) as supply to filter if I see correctly? Looks like u use the lower ( 90 degree indexed) oil pressure port hole for ur oil pressure transducer?

Be sure you understand how this type of filter works. It is basically the same as the original by-pass filter (which is a good filter system). But, it require a restrictor to keep the oil pressure up going to the engine. Without the restrictor you are shortcutting the oil path to the engine and reducing the oil flow.


Also, there is no reason to drill the return into the block. Drilling the oil pan would be much simpler. If I were doing this modification I would put a 90 deg fitting through the oil pan with a short extension on the inside to direct the return oil toward the bottom of the pan.

Update: drilling the oil pan would apply to a 59a block, not an 8ba!

[AnthonyG]

J & 51Merc-CT, here’s what I’m understanding. I’ll plan to install the spin on filter base w unfiltered oil coming from upper oil pressure port as is w no mod & use existing npt threaded hole. Filtered oil to be directed thru side of of oil pan w 90 degree fitting directing oil toward bottom of pan. To install restriction to maintain good oil pressure to engine I’m thinking the fitting size where the oil is going into the oil pan would be 1/4” ID feeding from filtered oil side & unfiltered oil from oil pressure port @ 1/8”ID? That should cause restriction that’d keep pressure up enough in the engine?

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by AnthonyG

51 Mercury-CT, Thx, got it! So ur happy w results, how many miles since conversion? I can use oil pressure port NPT threaded hole (W/O larger drill tap modification) as supply to filter if I see correctly? Looks like u use the lower ( 90 degree indexed) oil pressure port hole for ur oil pressure transducer?

For your information my setup is not a conversion such as the 95% conversion.
My setup is still a bypass oil filter system just like the factory used.
The only difference is that I adapted an Amsoil spin-on bypass filter which has the ability to filter out smaller (3 micron) particles than the original canister type filter does.
There is not any drilling or tapping involved to install this system.

[Ronnie]

Here is another spin on used for bypass filter situation. Quite common most of the filter mfg's will have this application. They already have a restriction orifice inside all you need is an adapter with 5/8" thread another easy to get item.


http://catalog.hastingsfilter.com/Pa...rtnumber=LF117


Ronnie

[40cpe]

You have an 8BA, so you have the tapped hole above the oil pan for a return. It should not be restricted. The supply from the engine oil gallery is from one of the ports on the rear. The supply line should be restricted with about .060" opening. Your proposal of a 1/8" restriction sounds large.

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by AnthonyG

J & 51Merc-CT, here’s what I’m understanding. I’ll plan to install the spin on filter base w unfiltered oil coming from upper oil pressure port as is w no mod & use existing npt threaded hole. Filtered oil to be directed thru side of of oil pan w 90 degree fitting directing oil toward bottom of pan. To install restriction to maintain good oil pressure to engine I’m thinking the fitting size where the oil is going into the oil pan would be 1/4” ID feeding from filtered oil side & unfiltered oil from oil pressure port @ 1/8”ID? That should cause restriction that’d keep pressure up enough in the engine?

As stated there has to be a .060 dia. restriction hole before the filter.

[JSeery]

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As 40cpe & 51merc posted, the restrictor goes on the inlet side to the filter should be .060. You can purchase restrictor fittings that are used for modern turbo charger installations.

Sorry about the drill the oil pan input, I normally work with 59a blocks and missed you were using an 8ba!!

[AnthonyG]

Thx all, I do finally have a clear understanding of what needs to b done & how to do it! All very informative! As usual Fordbarner’s & their Experience is great!

[JSeery]

Here is an example of a restrictor. Just an example, there may be better ones out there. https://www.ebay.com/itm/OBX-Turbo-O...-/121528353369

[MGG]

A couple of years ago I resurrected a 59AB style V-8 in a 1940 big farm truck. We used it last for many hours on my grandfathers farm in the 1960s. When I first changed the oil (stock by-pass system) I found NO restrictor in either the block outlet or the housing inlet. Inside the filter housing was only one .060 hole in the vertical outlet pipe. Since this is the only way the oil can get out of the filter, that had to be the restriction. Has anyone else encountered this?

[Brian]

In my opinion, having that restrictor in the outlet is a more sensible place to have it...At least oil passing through it has been filtered to 3 micron, so not gonna get clogged...

[marko39]

Originally Posted by Brian

In my opinion, having that restrictor in the outlet is a more sensible place to have it...At least oil passing through it has been filtered to 3 micron, so not gonna get clogged...

Either place should serve the purpose but on the inlet side should reduce pressure in the canister.

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by Brian

In my opinion, having that restrictor in the outlet is a more sensible place to have it...At least oil passing through it has been filtered to 3 micron, so not gonna get clogged...

The standard replacement canister filter does not have the 3 micron filtering capabilities that the Amsoil filter does.
Every 8BA canister filter housing that I have looked at has (2) .063 dia. return holes in the center stand pipe.
This insures that excess pressure will not be built up in the canister.

[tubman]

Given the O/P's situation (not a complete rebuild), I would think the best answer for him is to go with a replacement 8BA bypass filter system at this point.

[ford38v8]

Originally Posted by MGG

A couple of years ago I resurrected a 59AB style V-8 in a 1940 big farm truck. We used it last for many hours on my grandfathers farm in the 1960s. When I first changed the oil (stock by-pass system) I found NO restrictor in either the block outlet or the housing inlet. Inside the filter housing was only one .060 hole in the vertical outlet pipe. Since this is the only way the oil can get out of the filter, that had to be the restriction. Has anyone else encountered this?

While anything can happen, I'd be willing to bet that you are mistaken in your recollections of what you found a couple years ago. There are two main reasons that an inlet restrictor is needed and was supplied on the original filter system: ONE, without that restrictor on the inlet side, the pressure in the canister could otherwise build to overwhelm the top perimeter gasket or top bolt gasket, and TWO, upon changing the oil and filter, the engine would starve for oil till the cannister filled, finally to be restricted at the outlet.

[Desoto291Hemi]

Boy,,,,I wish I had a like button for all these responses.

Yes,,,,,.060 restriction,,,,,,also,,,,,my canister had .063 holes in the tube.
Awesome info,,,,,should help this guy a lot,,,,save him some oiling issues.

Tommy

Oh yeah,,,,I was reading on some site,,,here or the Hamb,,,,about a guy that had a leaking top cover,,,no matter what he did,,it leaked.
He had removed the orifice at the inlet side of the housing and it over pressurized the can.

[MGG]

Originally Posted by ford38v8

While anything can happen, I'd be willing to bet that you are mistaken in your recollections of what you found a couple years ago. There are two main reasons that an inlet restrictor is needed and was supplied on the original filter system: ONE, without that restrictor on the inlet side, the pressure in the canister could otherwise build to overwhelm the top perimeter gasket or top bolt gasket, and TWO, upon changing the oil and filter, the engine would starve for oil till the cannister filled, finally to be restricted at the outlet.

Two things I know for sure that I am not mistaken about are:
1. I did not find any external-to-the-canister restrictor.
2. We drove the truck for years that way around the farm and countryside delivering hay and other farm products.

At the time I was nervous about it so I added a restrictor fitting at the canister inlet. When I change oil next, I will be sure to, again, double and triple check the canister inside outlet pipe for outlet holes, and report back if anyone is interested.

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by MGG

Two things I know for sure that I am not mistaken about are:
1. I did not find any external-to-the-canister restrictor.
2. We drove the truck for years that way around the farm and countryside delivering hay and other farm products.

At the time I was nervous about it so I added a restrictor fitting at the canister inlet. When I change oil next, I will be sure to, again, double and triple check the canister inside outlet pipe for outlet holes, and report back if anyone is interested.

You may indeed not be mistaken.
Your recollections are of the first generation of accessory oil filters and not the same design as the later 8BA standard equipment ones.
The single .060 dia. hole in the stand pipe was probably the restictor hole

and was the way it may have been engineered.
Your adding an outside restrictor hole probably just helped to insure less oil pressure in the cannister. (I wouldn't sweat it)

[Desoto291Hemi]

My restriction is in the brass tee that also fits the pressure sending unit.
You don’t know it is there unless you clean it and try to fit a small bit in there,,,,it was .060 thousandths,,,just like everyone said .

Tommy

[AnthonyG]

Putting engine back together. I found/bought an original bypass filter canister set up. Good shape w the original pressure sender & the .060” reducer still on it. I couldn’t believe the guy shipped it so dirty & still filled w gunky oil & an old filter in it! Anyway need the to-from lines & found these on EBay. Says fits a ‘49-‘53 F1 but thinking it’ll fit my 8BA? Thoughts?

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by AnthonyG

Putting engine back together. I found/bought an original bypass filter canister set up. Good shape w the original pressure sender & the .060” reducer still on it. I couldn’t believe the guy shipped it so dirty & still filled w gunky oil & an old filter in it! Anyway need the to-from lines & found these on EBay. Says fits a ‘49-‘53 F1 but thinking it’ll fit my 8BA? Thoughts?

You can obtain steel fuel/brake lines in various lengths from NAPA.
They can be bent to suit and have the flares and nuts already to install into
the fittings. That is what I used.

[AnthonyG]

Putting engine back together. I found/bought an original bypass filter canister set up. Good shape w the original pressure sender & the .060” reducer still on it. I couldn’t believe the guy shipped it so dirty & still filled w gunky oil & an old filter in it! Anyway need the to-from lines & found these on EBay. Says fits a ‘49-‘53 F1 but thinking it’ll fit my 8BA? Thoughts?

[AnthonyG]

Sorry, forgot the picture of the lines

[tubman]

I would expect them to fit fine. I have never used those exact lines, but I have mixed and matched many parts between car & truck engines, and with the exception of the water pumps and belts never had any problem. If those fit I would use them, because fitting regular off the shelf lines would probably require cutting and double flaring, which isn't the most fun thing in the world. Plus, I find bending them just right to be a real pain (in the fingers) as well.

[AnthonyG]

Thx Denny, I ordered.

[19Fordy]

Anthony : You can make your own lines using 1/4 inch brake line tubing. Make steel connectors by drilling out the shanks of some 3/8 dia. bolts and soldering them to the lines as needed. You can see them in the photos. Also couplers are used to join male ends of fuel line.

[Aarongriffey]

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I neglect changing my oil filter on my 8RT a lot. That’s a big reason to use AMSOIL.
Even if you think the original filter set up is better, the spin on filter is more likely to keep the oil cleaner because it is less apt to be neglected.
Hey 51 merc, You left your lights on!

[tubman]

How can you forget a filter that's right up there in your face everytime you check the oil? I would think it would be a lot easier to forget a full flow filter, especially if it's mounted remotely down in some dark abyss.

You are correct (in my opinion) when you say "the original filter set up is better".

[flatheadmurre]

The lines a std 1/4 brakelines and fittings...i just flare them the size i need for my aplication.
No need to make any special hardware.
The optimum filter setup would be a fullflow directly from pump and keeping the bypass for fine fitration...but who wants all that plumbing

[JSeery]

Curious on stationary engines, how did they keep track of oil changes? Hour meters? On some aircraft the is an hour meter that operates when oil pressure is present.

[AnthonyG]

Nicely don 19Fordy!

[19Fordy]

Thanks Anthony. One last thought. In order to make it easier to install the oil lines put your oil filter canister into position but, don't tighten it down until AFTER you install all the other oil line connections. Makes it easier for the threads on the fittings to "catch".

[AnthonyG]

Good advise! Thx for all the great info. I’ll post a pick when complete. I’m having the original equipment Canister I found powder coated black gloss. I have a repro of one of the original decals used on the canister. Should look great & will b happy to have a working filter!

[tubman]

If the engine is really an 8BA, it is from a car, not a truck, and the oil filter canister should be bronze, like the rest of the engine. An exception would be an early '49, which I believe is blue. Gloss black will certainly look nice, but I thought I'd mention this. (I don't remember the kind of vehicle this will end up in.)

[AnthonyG]

My ‘35, went w an 8BA mainly for the removable bell but also cause lots of enthusiasts like them. Kind of emulated the original ‘35 Engine by building the front of the engine like an 59A w a crab style front center distributor. Hind sight is 20/20 & wish I’d of gone w verticle distributor mounted higher.

[AnthonyG]

Bypass oil filter installed. Thx for all the tips & advice here’s a pic.