Reproduction fenders

[Ken B]

I have done some searching on old Fordbarn posts about reproduction fenders. I am considering purchasing fenders, splash aprons, and running boards for a 1930 project. I am confused from previous posts about who is making them. Some posts say that all of them are made from Albrecht's Towing in OH. Some other posts say that they are all made by Gaslight Auto parts. And another mentions Brookville Roadster as a maker. Which one is correct? I have heard some horror stories about the fit of the 30 front fenders. Are they getting worse? I would like to get a bit more educated before pursuing these parts. Thanks in advance for any advice.
Ken

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Depends on which fender you are speaking of. Gaslight Auto Parts owns the dies for the front fenders. Albrecht makes rear Coupe/Roadster fenders only. Antique Auto Sheetmetal (d/b/a/ Brookville Roadster) is a wholesale dealer for those two entities.

As far as the 1930 front fenders getting worse, the simple answer is yes. Each time a piece of sheetmetal is drawn over the die, the die wears a tad more. To my knowledge, there are no immediate plans to rebuild/replace the dies.

Bob Johnson has listed a few tech articles I wrote some time ago on how to correct them. CLICK HERE to find a link to them. Hopefully that will give you some additional education in your pursuit.

.

[pooch]

Originally Posted by Ken B

I have heard some horror stories about the fit of the 30 front fenders.

After seeing Brent's work just to fix the gaps and fit on "new" fenders was a nightmare.

I would be pi$$ed off big time if I paid good money for this rubbish.

[Durango]

Rubbish is just what these 30-31 repro. front fenders are. Even after 40 + hours of fitting the splash apron to the fender, when installed had so much stress I decided not to use it. Its sitting out back with the other junk fenders. Gaslite should be ashamed !!
Durango

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Guys with all due respect, while I agree they are not as good as they used to be a decade or so ago, the dies are worn and need to be rebuilt (--or replaced) but the ROI is just not there. They are however, better than nothing! I might also add that the dealers & Gaslight both will be very honest with you and tell you they know the quality is not there on these fenders but they are at least offering them at a price that meets a current need.

Also, the car below actually had reproduction front fenders on it and was entered into fine-point judging at French Lick. Granted this was not without some finesse' & modifications first, but it can be done. On a side note, I recently purchased a NOS left-front 1930 fender for well over 4X the amount of what you will pay for a reproduction fender, ...and was ecstatic to get it at that price! Quality just costs money no matter which route you decide to take.

.

[Pilotdave]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

From Brent's post: "Quality just costs money no matter which route you decide to take." I totally agree.

[Mikeinnj]

So Gaslight will keep banging out crappy fenders, and the Model A owners will keep buying them and pulling their hair out attempting to make them fit ? Sounds mighty stupid to me.

Has Gaslight paid off the cost of the worn out dies they continue to use to make crappy fenders? If so, perhaps it's time for someone to re-tool some new dies that will make NOS quality fenders and the consumers will pay more but get what they pay for.

[Glenn C.]

Crap is right ! I had a pair of 29 repo fenders that flared out on the side, would not butt together with the running boards, bead was too wide, headlight bar holes did not line up. Cost to repair would have been as much as repairing a used set.
My advise......find good used fenders and go from there. That is unless you are a skilled old time body man who likes lots of work.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by Mikeinnj

So Gaslight will keep banging out crappy fenders, and the Model A owners will keep buying them and pulling their hair out attempting to make them fit ? Sounds mighty stupid to me.

Has Gaslight paid off the cost of the worn out dies they continue to use to make crappy fenders? If so, perhaps it's time for someone to re-tool some new dies that will make NOS quality fenders and the consumers will pay more but get what they pay for.

Mike, Glenn, et al,; while you and others may feel it is stupid/crap what Gaslight is doing or producing, some of us are happy to get them and will continue to work them into what we need.

To respond to the second part of Mike's comment, ...maybe that "someone" is you who would be willing to step up and front the money necessary to remanufacture the dies?? I know I cannot afford to do it!


For others who may also be considering this option, lets just assume the price is $200,000.00 for the dies necessary to reproduce only a Left Front fender and you are the "someone" that is going to come to the rescue. So which one do we choose to make? Last November I was up at the archives doing research and if I recall correctly, I found prints that confirm there were 5 different versions of fenders that Ford made to fit the 1930-1931 model. The one that Gaslight manufactures is actually from the Service Replacement fender, --which was never used on production vehicles. As such, you now have some restorers who will claim what you are producing isn't exactly right and therefore they won't purchase it (--thus fewer purchasers) and post comments in public places how you should have done this or that.

So lets assume you have still chosen to re-tool and are going to create the S/Replacement fender which can be modified to fit either year. Now the catalog price you see is not the price the manufacturer gets for his product. Remember the dealer needs to make a profit and the dealer must factor in shipping to his store (i.e.: huge cost) for the resale. Lets just use a hypothetical figure where this new fender will retail for $600.00. Now let's say the maximum $$ amount that you as the manufacturer will be able to wholesale each fender for will be $400.00 FOB. Now you as the manufacturer will have stamping costs, material costs (sheetmetal, die lube, etc.), packaging costs (cardboard boxing & labor to adequately pack), and warehousing costs (building, forklift, shipping labor, etc.). In reality when you factor in all of the other costs, you will be flying to be able to amortize $100.00 off of each fender made to cover just the die costs (...and remember this does not factor in die damage or premature wear areas that must be rebuilt!). So the break even point is theoretically at 2,000 fenders just for the die costs. I personally think that 200 fenders being sold annually is an optimistic figure but even so, that is a 10 year payback providing nothing goes wrong or the hobby does not change directions. Are you still that "someone" willing to re-tool and take the financial risk? If so, I'm sure there are many folks who will sing your praises! I know I would but remember, just like Mr. Becker stated above, you will still have a competitor in Gaslight and some folks will still choose the cheaper, --yet inferior product which means that is just one less unit you were able to sell.

.

[Dodge]

Brent,

Amen.............well said.

[Purdy Swoft]

Here is a set of the repro fenders that I put on the coupe in 94. My daughter now has the coupe and the fenders still look good, eighteen years later. The left front was the hardest to fit. I had to do a bit of cutting and welding where the left front meets the side of the repro splash apron. There was two styles of rear fenders offered at the time. The guy that I bought them from, talked me into using the rears that were twenty dollars less for each. The rears fit without modification but if I did it again, I would use the more expensive fender. These new fenders at the time were not that much harder to fit than the replacement parts that we got from the automakers for the modern cars that we repaired in the body shop. Anybody that is a bodyman or has worked in a body shop will know what I mean. The only replacement body parts that actually fit the modern cars was Volvo. You could lay them in place and all of the gaps and bolt holes would line up. Most bodymen will agree that we only got the reject parts for replacement on the USA made cars. I feel that the repro fenders will be easier to work with than most of the rusted beat up original fenders. It won't be cheap either way if you can't do it yourself..

[Richard Wilson]

Now if I could win one of those BIG lottery jackpots..................new front fender dies and pay off the new Model A Museum and still have money for a peanut butter and jelly sandwich.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by Richard Wilson

Now if I could win one of those BIG lottery jackpots..................new front fender dies and pay off the new Model A Museum and still have money for a peanut butter and jelly sandwich.

Richard, could I possibly persuade you to spend that new-found windfall on something that I personally would deem a little more beneficial to the entire hobby? How about investing in dies to make a few different types of gas tanks instead of fenders??




.

[Richard Wilson]

Good thinking Brent. Gas tanks would sell 10 to 1 over fenders.....IF we could afford the liability insurance. Might have to win two big lotteries.

[ericr]

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

Mike, Glenn, et al,; while you and others may feel it is stupid/crap what Gaslight is doing or producing, some of us are happy to get them and will continue to work them into what we need.

To respond to the second part of Mike's comment, ...maybe that "someone" is you who would be willing to step up and front the money necessary to remanufacture the dies?? I know I cannot afford to do it!


For others who may also be considering this option, lets just assume the price is $200,000.00 for the dies necessary to reproduce only a Left Front fender and you are the "someone" that is going to come to the rescue. So which one do we choose to make? Last November I was up at the archives doing research and if I recall correctly, I found prints that confirm there were 5 different versions of fenders that Ford made to fit the 1930-1931 model. The one that Gaslight manufactures is actually from the Service Replacement fender, --which was never used on production vehicles. As such, you now have some restorers who will claim what you are producing isn't exactly right and therefore they won't purchase it (--thus fewer purchasers) and post comments in public places how you should have done this or that.

So lets assume you have still chosen to re-tool and are going to create the S/Replacement fender which can be modified to fit either year. Now the catalog price you see is not the price the manufacturer gets for his product. Remember the dealer needs to make a profit and the dealer must factor in shipping to his store (i.e.: huge cost) for the resale. Lets just use a hypothetical figure where this new fender will retail for $600.00. Now let's say the maximum $$ amount that you as the manufacturer will be able to wholesale each fender for will be $400.00 FOB. Now you as the manufacturer will have stamping costs, material costs (sheetmetal, die lube, etc.), packaging costs (cardboard boxing & labor to adequately pack), and warehousing costs (building, forklift, shipping labor, etc.). In reality when you factor in all of the other costs, you will be flying to be able to amortize $100.00 off of each fender made to cover just the die costs (...and remember this does not factor in die damage or premature wear areas that must be rebuilt!). So the break even point is theoretically at 2,000 fenders just for the die costs. I personally think that 200 fenders being sold annually is an optimistic figure but even so, that is a 10 year payback providing nothing goes wrong or the hobby does not change directions. Are you still that "someone" willing to re-tool and take the financial risk? If so, I'm sure there are many folks who will sing your praises! I know I would but remember, just like Mr. Becker stated above, you will still have a competitor in Gaslight and some folks will still choose the cheaper, --yet inferior product which means that is just one less unit you were able to sell.

.

it's obviously far more complicated (i.e. expensive) than meets the eye, and the size and shape of a Model "A" fender verifies that. If initial die cost is the big hit in such a project, wouldn't someone farm that out to China? The concept is distasteful to many restorers though WalMart doesn't lose much sleep over it.

[ronn]

Brent, well said. Thank you for enlightening those that don't understand the costs involved in producing parts. I for one will attest that most model A guys are not going to spend 1000. for a perfect fitting fender and so it will never happen.

[Mikeinnj]

Originally Posted by ronn

Brent, well said. Thank you for enlightening those that don't understand the costs involved in producing parts. I for one will attest that most model A guys are not going to spend 1000. for a perfect fitting fender and so it will never happen.

Brent, I understand your concern in this matter. The only source for fenders produces a crappy product which you are willing to buy and pass the additional cost on to your customers for transforming the crappy fender into a somewhat acceptable if not correct fender.

If someone cannot do the metalwork themself and are at the mercy of having the work done by a professional Model A Restoration Shop, they will be paying very close to that $1000.00 per fender, or more, after the initial cost of the crappy fitting repro fender ($500.00) and then a whole bunch of hours for labor at $XX.XX per hour, plus paint. So Ron, in answer to your comment, you are spending that $1000.00 per fender now.

I say boycott any manufacturer who produces crappy reproduction parts otherwise you are "rewarding bad behavior". Tell your suppliers you won't buy junk for your Model A. so they will pressure the manufacturers to produce a better quality product.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by Mikeinnj

Brent, I understand your concern in this matter. The only source for fenders produces a crappy product which you are willing to buy and pass the additional cost on to your customers for transforming the crappy fender into a somewhat acceptable if not correct fender.

If someone cannot do the metalwork themself and are at the mercy of having the work done by a professional Model A Restoration Shop, they will be paying very close to that $1000.00 per fender, or more, after the initial cost of the crappy fitting repro fender ($500.00) and then a whole bunch of hours for labor at $XX.XX per hour, plus paint. So Ron, in answer to your comment, you are spending that $1000.00 per fender now.

I say boycott any manufacturer who produces crappy reproduction parts otherwise you are "rewarding bad behavior". Tell your suppliers you won't buy junk for your Model A. so they will pressure the manufacturers to produce a better quality product.

I appreciate your perspective. The other thought in this is that there are generally two other viable alternatives. #1 is just to use whatever rough original fender that you can find and fix to the best of your abilities & budget and use it as-is. #2 is if money is really tight and one has few skills, then fiberglass fenders are always an option for that person. While there is fitting to be done, the cost outlay and materials/skills needed to do the work is minimal. To me it is a priorities deal where one must put a $$ value on 'Quality', ...and only the person with the wallet can establish that.

Finally, your comment of "If someone cannot do the -work themself and are at the mercy of having the work done by a professional ..." kinda applies to all facits of owning/restoring a Model-A. If you do not have the capability of pouring & machining engine babbit, you are at the mercy of having the work done by a professional. If you cannot sew fabric, you are at the mercy of having the work done by a professional. If you cannot paint, -or plate, -or cut glass, -or "whatever", ...you are at the mercy of having the work done by a professional!

[pooch]

Is Chinese sheetmetal drawn over inferior dies any better than USA made fibreglass?

Both ain't original parts.

[Ken B]

Thanks to all that have replied. I have to agree with Brent. The costs of making new dies are way too high for anyone to pursue the project. I am interested in building a 1930 C-Cab delivery. I do have front fenders that could be brought back to life. The rear fenders on the other hand are very rough. Also, the rears are from a coupe and might be too wide. Does anyone know what width rear fenders would be correct for a woodie or C-cab delivery body?

[bobscogin]

Originally Posted by pooch

Is Chinese sheetmetal drawn over inferior dies any better than USA made fibreglass?
Both ain't original parts.

That's true, but metal, even if stamped over less than perfect dies, is a lot closer to original than fiberglass no matter where it is made. Just my opinion of course.

Bob

[Mike V. Florida]

Originally Posted by bobscogin

That's true, but metal, even if stamped over less than perfect dies, is a lot closer to original than fiberglass no matter where it is made. Just my opinion of course.

Bob

I'm sure a few fine point cars started with less then perfect steel fenders and I'm also sure there were none with fiberglass.

[desotoguy]

All this about "fenders" is confusing. Would one of you guys with the poor quality fenders please post pictures pointing out what is wrong with them. Are they to wide, to long, bolt holes wrong, curvature not right, just plain don't the car? I could use repo front fenders for a 31, don't mind some metal work, just would like to have an idea before I order. If anybody wants to just git a set out of your garage, send pm, I will pay shipping.

[ericr]

Originally Posted by fordgarage

Labor and production costs are lower in China, but steel is not, and die and mold engineering and materials is not much different than the US. A good tool in China is also expensive.

I spent five years in China and worked with Huawei on tens of millions of dollars worth of OEM automotive injection molds. When we first hooked up with them about 2006 they were making tooling primarily for plastic washing machine parts. I immediately saw their potential to develop quality tooling for large automotive interior and exterior parts based on their management and workforce attitudes and philosophies. They were very collaborative, and eager to improve their capability and quality.
态度 决定 一切 !

Now they are a large supplier of sophisticated large instrument panel, fascia, and grille tools to GM and other OEMs. They are still one of my favorite mold/tool shops. They are lower cost than Canadian and US tool shops, but not by a lot. Equal or better quality though. If I was going to make something like a fender or gas tank in China, I would start by looking for a similar shop in the stamping tooling business.

http://www.huaweimould.com/index.php?pagekind=other

just out of curiosity, isn't the big complication in making dies calculating for shrinkage in the final metal product? You just can't simply use an original fender for a pattern because if you did, the ultimate product would somehow end up undersized?
There was a guy based in California back in the '80s that was trying to reproduce, in stages, the Deluxe Phaeton. He did not allow for shrinkage in the process and all his products were slightly small....I know, I bought a rumble lid and roadster doors from him that were ill-fitting.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by desotoguy

All this about "fenders" is confusing. Would one of you guys with the poor quality fenders please post pictures pointing out what is wrong with them. Are they to wide, to long, bolt holes wrong, curvature not right, just plain don't the car? I could use repo front fenders for a 31, don't mind some metal work, just would like to have an idea before I order. If anybody wants to just git a set out of your garage, send pm, I will pay shipping.

With all due respect, ... I thought I did!! Scroll back to the top of this thread to post #2. It gives you a link and shows first-hand the problems and how to address them.


.

[Flat32]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

I looked at the fender fit procedure Brent linked to and it looks like the repro apron got most of the modifying. Granted the fender is at fault according to what I'm reading in this thread, but is the repro apron a perfect copy or is it also at fault?

From a toolmaker's perspective and having dealt with poorly made and fitting sheet metal parts for a 1932 3 window body restoration it seems to me that relatively simple and cheap modification dies could be made for the local areas of the repro fenders needing correction. Another possibility could be making a set of apron dies to match the repro fenders.

While objectionable on many fronts a fiberglass apron made specifically to use with the repro fenders is probably the cheapest way to deal with the problem.

In my view any tool made of steel can be repaired or adjusted. An enterprising soul might find the owner of the existing tooling and what it would cost to buy them.

Ray

[desotoguy]

Thanks Brent, I must have had a bit of brain fade when I read the post. My real point is the terminology of some of the posters. I suppose it may be my Southern heritage but to post that a product is "crap" and not give more detail or pictures as to what was wrong is not the thing to do. From what I see in your pics the places which don't match and the bead can be fixed, and if one is unable to find an original set that can be repaired in 40 hours, the repo is the only choice we have. As to the "Chinese" comments, anything that is "made in China" was sourced, approved and sold by an American supplier. Maybe as a hobby we should quit buying anything that is not "Made in the USA", then the vendors would have all those parts on their shelves. Some people might be surprised that some of the better known CNC machines used in the US are Chinese made.

[Purdy Swoft]

Originally Posted by Flat32

I looked at the fender fit procedure Brent linked to and it looks like the repro apron got most of the modifying. Granted the fender is at fault according to what I'm reading in this thread, but is the repro apron a perfect copy or is it also at fault?

From a toolmaker's perspective and having dealt with poorly made and fitting sheet metal parts for a 1932 3 window body restoration it seems to me that relatively simple and cheap modification dies could be made for the local areas of the repro fenders needing correction. Another possibility could be making a set of apron dies to match the repro fenders.

While objectionable on many fronts a fiberglass apron made specifically to use with the repro fenders is probably the cheapest way to deal with the problem.

In my view any tool made of steel can be repaired or adjusted. An enterprising soul might find the owner of the existing tooling and what it would cost to buy them.

Ray

I used the repro splash aprons on my 31 tudor and they matched the radius of the original front fenders, about as good as could be expected. I did have a bit of a problem at the back fenders. I had to trim a small amount of the trench that the running boards fit into off at the rear. The back fenders overlapped the trench. No problem for me, I'm use to makeing parts fit... This would be a problem for the person that expects them to fall into place.

[dumb person]

How would you know that the car is not distorted? Most cars are not new old stock anymore.

[Carbroke]

Hydro-forming technology for pressing parts only require a male die half that would make the cost for developing the die much less expensive.

The male die is pressed into a sheet of metal and the female side is replaced by a tank of fluid with a strong membrane stretched over it. As the male die presses into the membrane, the fluid pressure is increased behind the membrane and the metal forms against the male die perfectly. Advantages are also gained in that the metal can stretch much easier due to less resistance so things can be pressed that were nearly impossible with typical male/female dies.

Die wear is also much less than what it was before, but because the cost to make a single male die is so much more reasonable, the overall costs to maintain proper dies is better.

[Skrain]

I once asked Bert's in Denver about the cost of a pair of 1930 Welled front fenders I saw advertised in the swap meet pages, and Steve told me that $2300 for a decent pair of original 1930 Fronts with spare tire wells was not excessive!
I wonder what the going rate for original fenders is at Hershey?
As my late partner who was in the Antiques Business told me; "Something is only worth what someone is willing to pay you for it, or what you are willing to pay someone else for it!"

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by Skrain

I once asked Bert's in Denver about the cost of a pair of 1930 Welled front fenders I saw advertised in the swap meet pages, and Steve told me that $2300 for a decent pair of original 1930 Fronts with spare tire wells was not excessive!
I wonder what the going rate for original fenders is at Hershey?
As my late partner who was in the Antiques Business told me; "Something is only worth what someone is willing to pay you for it, or what you are willing to pay someone else for it!"

Last year I paid nearly that amount for one NOS L/F welled 1930 fender. Yes, $1,000-$1,200 a piece is the going price for a nice fender.

To a certain extent I agree with your late partner in that the market does generally set the price, however original parts are not being made any longer and just because someone is unwilling to pay your price this year for top quality merchandise does not mean it won't bring more next year.

In the case of a nice original fender vs. a reproduction, often times the reproduction fender will cost the same as the original fender by the time all the work is completed making the reproduction fender usable. If you are going to have the same amount in it, why not just pay for the better quality original fender?

Originally Posted by Carbroke

Hydro-forming technology for pressing parts only require a male die half that would make the cost for developing the die much less expensive.

The male die is pressed into a sheet of metal and the female side is replaced by a tank of fluid with a strong membrane stretched over it. As the male die presses into the membrane, the fluid pressure is increased behind the membrane and the metal forms against the male die perfectly. Advantages are also gained in that the metal can stretch much easier due to less resistance so things can be pressed that were nearly impossible with typical male/female dies.

Die wear is also much less than what it was before, but because the cost to make a single male die is so much more reasonable, the overall costs to maintain proper dies is better.

Is this an area where you would be able to assist the hobby by offering new reproduction fenders?

[john charlton]

I know not directly related but worth a thought . I was trial fitting front fender /splash shield /running board and nothing would line .Turned out repro running board bracket was one inch too short.

John in no change in the weather Suffolk County England.

[Stretch Cab]

Why couldn't a shop buy the fenders direct and make the changes needed? The shop could mate them to an original car to check fit and sell them at an extra charge to cover his costs and help the hobby out. This would buy some time before the dies had to be changed and end the problem of bad fitting fenders. Supply and demand for sure..................

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by Stretch Cab

Why couldn't a shop buy the fenders direct and make the changes needed? The shop could mate them to an original car to check fit and sell them at an extra charge to cover his costs and help the hobby out. This would buy some time before the dies had to be changed and end the problem of bad fitting fenders. Supply and demand for sure..................

They could. I proposed that very thought about 3 years ago in French Lick, IN and offered to buy 10 sets at a time. I proposed that I could sell 10-20 pairs annually. The "hang-up" was Gaslight had/has a small dealer about 15 miles away from my shop who has been a dealer for years. They admitted that many years that dealer might only buy one fender but they feel obligated to honor their territorial agreement. I guess I understand but that little dealer is costing them, ...and the entire restoration hobby way more than they realize.

If you want to even think this through even further, they are outsourcing the well installation anyway, so they could just as easily outsource the repairs and offer them in two forms, ...ones that fit, and ones that don't. Maybe someone else in an unrestricted territory could buy in and offer this service??

[Greg Jones]

I for one will attest that most model A guys are not going to spend 1000. for a perfect fitting fender and so it will never happen.

Boy I would sure buy perfect front fenders at a grand a pop. Having restored a few front 30 and 31 Model A fenders, I can honestly say that would be a bargain. Never messed with the Gas Light fenders, though. Brent is right...at least it is a starting point.

[larrys40]

Brent, I agree with your thoughts and synopsis of the Repro fenders.... I agree that good originals are the best answer.. I just bought a set for my 68C that were off a MARC of Excellence where they were upgrading to NOS welled. Equal to the price for the repros. On the whole, there are still a few deals out there.. but it is tough to find enough for the need... and in my opinion the repros are better than not having the option. I put a set on back in the early 80's and they still look awesome. No one except for those who fP judge would know. I put a set on this spring on a fellows '30 coupe and yes, they were a ton of work.. but then... once all the issues are resolved they looked great. We are fortunate to have a supply of reproduction parts today that is way better than it was 25 years ago ( I was 28 then) and still had my "A" ten years then... without them many of the cars would not be on the road or in the condition they are in. Like Brent I am thankful someone invested the money, time, and had the passion to do what it took to get the task done. I realize the die situation and will not beat up anyone over the quality as I understand the situation and am glad to have them as an option if needed. Actually they are very cheap when you consider what they probably should be.

Happy metal working!
Larry Shepard

[kelley's restoration]

i hate to say it like this, but since its such a big price to fix the fender why not retool the splash apron....at least the front nose part
for the record....i would rather rework og fenders any day than gaslights
tk

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by kelley's restoration

i hate to say it like this, but since its such a big price to fix the fender why not retool the splash apron....at least the front nose part
for the record....i would rather rework og fenders any day than gaslights
tk

Interesting thought but I think the old saying "Two wrongs do not make a Right." would apply.

.

[kelley's restoration]

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

Interesting thought but I think the old saying "Two wrongs do not make a Right." would apply.

.

i agree thats why i hate to say it
tk

[Cape Codder]

Brent,
Hope this isn't to much off topic but I have a question.
In post #2 of this thread you gave a link to an article you wrote on "Reproduction Fenders". In that article you said "I have a set of vice grips that are specifically made to straighten a bead". Could you post some pictures of those vice grips?
Thanks for your time.
Cape Codder

[darrylkmc]

Originally Posted by kelley's restoration

"i hate to say it like this, but since its such a big price to fix the fender why not retool the splash apron....at least the front nose part"

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

"Interesting thought but I think the old saying "Two wrongs do not make a Right." would apply."

Brent, Isn't refitting the splash aprons exactly what you are doing in this article?

http://www.modelahouse.com/tech/fender/fender2.html

Just wanting to see if we are on the same page here, what a difference from my experience with the fit years ago.

Darryl in Fairbanks, Owner of a pair of the first run of Gaslight fenders made.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by Cape Codder

Brent,
Hope this isn't to much off topic but I have a question.
In post #2 of this thread you gave a link to an article you wrote on "Reproduction Fenders". In that article you said "I have a set of vice grips that are specifically made to straighten a bead". Could you post some pictures of those vice grips?
Thanks for your time.
Cape Codder

I don't have a picture of either pair I have but here is a picture of Will Cronkrite's taken from his website.






.

Originally Posted by darrylkmc

Originally Posted by kelley's restoration

"i hate to say it like this, but since its such a big price to fix the fender why not retool the splash apron....at least the front nose part"

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

"Interesting thought but I think the old saying "Two wrongs do not make a Right." would apply."

Brent, Isn't refitting the splash aprons exactly what you are doing in this article?

http://www.modelahouse.com/tech/fender/fender2.html

Just wanting to see if we are on the same page here, what a difference from my experience with the fit years ago.

Darryl in Fairbanks, Owner of a pair of the first run of Gaslight fenders made.

Well kinda. On those, it is kinda confusing in that they were converted to '30 style fenders where the short apron was fitted to the outline of the fender flange. THEN the fender flange is removed and replaced because if you recall, the short apron was spot-welded onto the fender in 1930. Also, there is work to do in the tail section, and almost always the bead flares out like the Chitty Chitty Bang Bang car.

.

[Cape Codder]

Thanks for the link to the pictures of the bead pliers.
Cape Codder

[Tinbasher]

Work with the best you can get. I made up a pair of rear fenders for a 32 Chev 40 years ago when A/m wasn't available. I had 60 hours in each rear fender just for the metal work.
It takes me about 6 - 12 hours to rework a 30 - 31 front fender from Gaslight, better than 40 hours to repair an original!!!
The Old Tinbasher

[Portland/JohnR]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Hi all! Can someone tell me who the manufacturers of 28-29 sedan rear fenders are?

[oldredford]

WTF people, if you don't like the repops then don't buy them. I have bought several sets and yes they do require work to fit. I am not an expert but I have had good results with mine... No they won't pass a high point inspection but who the fxxk cares. We all should be glad someone is at least popping these fenders out. At least you have a core to work with. I can't believe some folks....Try finding a good original pair.

[pgerhardt]

Originally Posted by Glenn C.

Crap is right ! I had a pair of 29 repo fenders that flared out on the side, would not butt together with the running boards, bead was too wide, headlight bar holes did not line up. Cost to repair would have been as much as repairing a used set.
My advise......find good used fenders and go from there. That is unless you are a skilled old time body man who likes lots of work.

I found the quality of the 28-29 reproduction front fenders much better than the 30-31. The pair I installed on my 29 tudor fit fine.

[Keith True]

I put some new 28-9 front fenders on a few years ago.I expected some problems,but every bolt dropped right into place.I had some problems with a set of new 31's,but they were minor.The big problems were not the fault of the fenders.Both running boards had been pushed back,bending the brackets and rear fenders.Just 1/4 inch,but it might as well have been a foot.I started with the front fender braces and headlight bar.Once I had those correct I straightened the running board brackets and it all fell into place.Then all I had to do was to modify the curve of the fender where it meets the splash apron.I have a metal man as a garage tenant,he trimmed and welded,he did both in 1-1/2 hours.That was welded and fitted,not metal finished.

[JohnLaVoy]

I have seen these comments about the reproduction fenders and find them incorrect. I was told by one restoration shop that there would need to be all this cutting and fitting to make them work. I took the project home and a couple of simple cuts to the area that connects to the apron and they fit fine. After the first one it was pretty simple. I even ordered a 29 fender to check those and the same results.

[JOHN CT]

Originally Posted by dumb person

How would you know that the car is not distorted? Most cars are not new old stock anymore.

I agree. Maybe with 80 year old cars sagging frames warped bodies, just adds to fenders and other reproduction parts not to fit properly.

[denniskliesen]

After reading all the posts about fenders repop and original, does anybody consider how much more a Model A is worth in unrestored condition with perfect fenders?

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Geez guys, do y'all even read ALL the posts? This thread is over 5 years old

This thread only resurfaced because a new Fordbarner came asking a question about something totally off topic (rear Sedan fenders for 28/29). Why not answer his question instead? To answer you John, I am unaware that anyone is manufacturing Sedan rear fenders at this time.

[Keith True]

A bodyman was looking at my roadster and commented that it was worth more in pieces than as a whole car.That set everybody here off to making guesses as to what it was worth that way.Rust/crack/dent free front and rear fenders,perfect stainless,body in the same condition,straight hood,etc.The nice original one piece running board splash aprons seemed to have everybody stumped as to price guessing.It is a 35,000 mile car and we figured the running gear was the least valuable part of the car.

[Roadster62]

Just installed a left front welled fender we got from TAM'S on a '31 two door Phaeton, it just bolted on in seven hours. The fender to apron/running board fit was fine, lots of clamps and fussing to get to the hole scribing. Once bolted on the outer bead needed some work to get rid of a wave. Not a future show car,driver quality job, all the fenders, running boards, and aprons are repops, so are the front fender brackets, overall fit is really nice. Bob

[SteveB31]

Ahooga parts in Ohio has purchased the tooling for both styles of sedan rear fenders as well as coupe/ roadster rear fenders, from Funks that used to make them. He has not completed them yet, but should have them done this summer.

Steve @ Bert's