Air filter for Model A

[TDO]

Has any one used this Air filter on there model A . That's on E-Bay for $67.80. And what is your opinion of it.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-Model-A...-/160908017894?

[silversink]

overpriced-----look at it---its 2 pipe fittings and a hose piece and a catalog filter--make your own.

[gweilbaker]

Is that the filter that defies the laws of physics by working on "un-balanced" vented carbs? It does look cool.

[Charlie Stephens]

Excellent idea if you plan to drive off road across the desert. At the rate I use my Model A and the roads I drive on it will outlive me so I think I will skip the filter.

Charlie Stephens

[vermontboy]

Back in the sixties when some of us were driving these as our only vehicles (commuted every weekend from Rochester NY to Utica NY going to college) I don't ever recall seeing an air filter on any of them except for one show winner who had an original Air-Maze on his for shows.
Or is my memory poor ?? Mine had a stainless flex tube between the breather pipe and the carb, but outside of that I just don't recall seeing them. Nor do I ever recall lack of an air filter being a problem, although I suppose the dust and dirt could shorten the life of bearings and rings.

[Gold Digger]

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I've got an oil bath air cleaner off an old hay baler engine that I put on my 2-door 29 back 43 years ago and works fine but have always wondered if it has the right balance of air. Didn't know about those things back when. I did worry about sucking the oil out of it when I would get up to 70 mph but never had that problem either.

[Purdy Swoft]

I'm not a believer in air filters on model A's with updraft carbs. They mostly cause rich operation and cause more problems than they solve. Thats just me though. If you like it, go for it

[darrylkmc]

The last thing that I would want is Gasoline drenched ABS plastic that close to my exhaust.

Darryl in Fairbanks

[TDO]

My thoughts were the same as ya all. Thanks for your opinion.

[Growley bear]

Originally Posted by gweilbaker

Is that the filter that defies the laws of physics by working on "un-balanced" vented carbs? It does look cool.

K&N air filter, the best filtration with the least restriction. Buy it once; according to K&N service every 50,000 miles. I service mine a little sooner. I am running a K&N on the air maze 90 degree adapter on a Zenith 2. Works great.

Chet

[Jerry in Shasta]

One our club members has one he will give away. It will not stay on the carb.
The unit is too heavy and comes loose from the carb. when you hit a bump.

It is held on the carb. by a hose clamp and short piece of radiator hose, that's all. You get a little oil or gas on the joint and you can't keep it on.

JB

[160B]

I use a K&N E-3050 air filter in an original Airmaze. I have one on my 1931 160B for 30,000 plus miles and also have one on my 1931 68B for 3,000 plus miles. The filter does not cause the engine to run rich and makes a significant improvement on keeping the engine oil cleaner over time. I used to change oil every 500 miles and it was dark and dirty, now I change oil based on color and usually change oil at 1,000 miles or even 1500 miles.

[eagle]

I use an original AirMaze and have no ill performance effects. I drive dusty gravel roads all the time and don't want that grit traveling through my engine.

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by eagle

I use an original AirMaze and have no ill performance effects. I drive dusty gravel roads all the time and don't want that grit traveling through my engine.

The oil wetted mesh should grab a lot of dust and not cause any noticeable restriction.

[Willie Krash]

I use a K&N and have had no problems.

[Bruce]

I use the "overpriced" High Boy. Bought it on eBay. Cost was cheap when compared to my spare time to play with Model A's ... and I work for free! Add in the gas and wear and tear on my truck to drive to and from Menards and I'm money ahead. I like Rich Falluca and I've given him a small fortune for a couple really good running engines, but I do not want to write another check to AER for a long time. If keeping dirt from being sucked into the carb might keep me away from Skokie a little longer, the filter is a "no brainer," even if Henry didn't think they were necessary.

[mshmodela]

Originally Posted by darrylkmc

The last thing that I would want is Gasoline drenched ABS plastic that close to my exhaust.

Darryl in Fairbanks

Agreed. If I drove on mostly dirty roads I might consider

http://www.snydersantiqueauto.com/5431

[JOES31]

If you are using a filter with the downdraft carbs I would only consider using a filter that is above the carburetor. If you have a small leak and it accumulates into the filter then you have a dangerous hazard with it right next to the exhaust.

If it couldn't be above the carb then I would go without. My opinion.

Joe

[Barber31]

Just bought the filter that "U's" back under the carb. Suppose to be hi flow filter. I haven't received it yet so I'll see how the fit and finish goes.

[FrankWest]

Out of the showroom I thought these 4 cylinder fords had no air filters.
Wasn't the first airfilter introduced on the v8?
I am so confused

[Growley bear]

Oil bath.

[eagle]

Originally Posted by FrankWest

Out of the showroom I thought these 4 cylinder fords had no air filters.
Wasn't the first airfilter introduced on the v8?
I am so confused

When I say "Original" AirMaze filter, I mean an AirMaze that was bought by my grandfather back in the late 30's or maybe 40's. He never told me when he bought it but I do remember him saying it was necessary, in his mind, on gravel roads. It is an aftermarket item. He used it for many years, I use it now.

[Bob Bidonde]

An intake air filter is not a good idea because it:
> restricts breathing that results in a reduction of toque and power;
> enriches the air/ fuel mixture and fowls the spark plugs.

[dlfrisch]

I use the same K&N filter as senior member 160B

My theory: Keep the intake air clean. Seems to make common (cents).

[gweilbaker]

Just FYI:

Carburetors fall into two types, one the unbalanced type and the other a balanced type unit. In the bowl cover of the unbalanced type carburetor, is a hole drilled to a definite dimension. It is through this hole that air flows and exerts pressure, or pushes against the gasoline in the float bowl.


The air going through the air horn has no effect on the gasoline in the float bowl of the unbalanced type of carburetor. As a result, should the air filter on the carburetor be restricted with dirt, oil, or any foreign substance the air flow into the air horn would be slowed down or reduced in volume. When this happens, the carburetor not getting sufficient flow of air runs rich, because the pressure on the fuel in the float bowl remains the same as normal,.



In the balanced type of carburetor this cannot happen. The vent hole in the bowl cover is internal and the float chamber is vented by means of a tube into the air horn. If the flow of air into the air horn is restricted, by this internal venting, the pressure on the gasoline is also restricted. Consequently, the pressure in the air horn and the pressure in the float chamber are balanced.

[Purdy Swoft]

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An air balanced carburetor may be better than an unbalanced carburetor but still restricts air flow through the carburetor. The underpowered model A needs all the power that it can get . Modern carbureted engines with balanced air tubes get restricted air flow but have more power than the model A in the first place . Ford didn't think that the updraft setup on the model A needed an air filter and I don't either. I've run model A's for over fifty years with no filter and no problems as a result .

[H. L. Chauvin]

Hi TDO,

For your question: "Has any one used this Air filter on there model A . That's on E-Bay for $67.80. And what is your opinion of it."

FWIW, Just one (1) Humble Opinion:

1. I bought one of these Hi-Boys directly from the manufacturer several years ago on E-bay with a attachments for an A & a B carburetor.

2. I next bought a slightly taller K&N filter from K&N to insure maximum air passage which meant it can be cleaned less often.

3. To answer your question, I have had no problems at all:

A. If one knows how to tighten a hose clamp with a screw driver, it stays in place & fixed when hitting bumps & crossing railroad tracks.

B. If one knows how to read a tachometer, one can verify that the engine runs at the same RPM'S with the filter or without it.

C. If one knows how to accurately calculate MPG's, the mileage is the same with or without it.

D. If one knows how to read black sooty plugs, the plugs stay the same color with & without this filter with an original A or B Zenith carburetor.

4. The key to "any" filter, whether it be an air-conditioner filter or a carburetor filter, is to insure that it has been designed with a large enough intake area such that it can allow sufficient air passage.

5. Many air filters formerly offered were so small & restricted that they were like burying one's head in a pillow & trying to breath enough air to run a 20 mile marathon race; hence, in my opinion, a new Model A Religion was formed & still exists today, like: "Get rid of the pillow."

6. As parochial as this may seem, on the other hand, just think for a moment:

A. John Doe goes to the bank & borrows an enormous wad of money to buy a fleet of 20, brand new taxi's.

B. The taxi's arrive, & the next day & John's maintenance mechanic, (who owns several Model A's), tells John he just saved John lots of money over the next 5 years -- rather than having to pay for 20 new replacement air filters every now & then, he removed all 20 new air filters & placed them in the garbage.

C. John's wife, a mechanical engineer, with a Master's Degree, who works for K & N in the technical testing laboratory, fires the mechanic.

D. Now, was it because she did not like the type of shoes the mechanic was wearing? .... or did she not like his color of socks?

E. Hmmmmmmm ...I think it could possibly be because of an ancient vintage Model A Religion: He told her his next move was to try changing to non-detergent oil; then draining the "Prestone" out of all of the radiators & substituting pure water; & next, getting rid of all of the whitewall tires.

F. I am sure others definitely have different opinions on air filters "today"; and/or why she fired him -- respect them all -- in America, the "last" choice is always for you to decide what to do -- & it is your $67.80.

[JOES31]

H.L

All I can say is very well said. I think it depends on how much the car is driven and the conditions of the driving. I am using the large K&N above the carb. Below the carb to me is too dangerous with the leaky Zenith carbs. There is no restriction because the filter has a much higher CFM capacity than the engine is drawing. So no balanced carb is needed.

There is something to add however. We filter the air that goes into our engines but we breath the air without a filter. I guess I love my cars more than myself. For car guys I think that's normal. What's everyone else's excuse?

[160B]

I ran my own calculations 12 years ago using the formulas at the K&N see link below, and 200.5 cubic engine running at 2100 rpm and selected a K&N E-3050. To date I have over 30,000 miles using a K&N E-3050 and have never had any fouling of my spark plugs.

http://www.knfilters.com/filter_facts.aspx?pkid=1448282&rw=2#SELECT

Here is a link to the same calculation on Model -A.org. The calculations on the below web site are at an engine running 2800 rpm, and the conclusion is that any of the three filters below are adequately sized.

◦K&N offers several filters that can be used with the Air Maze housing.

◾Part # E-3050 is 3.5 inches long.

◾Part # E-9257 is 5.5 inches long.

◾Part # E-2040 is 6.625 inches long.

But the site makes this recommendation.

“◦To provide some margin for the filter getting dirty, before you get around to cleaning it, I would recommend the 5.5 inch long length. I know it is an over kill, but I am currently using the 6.625 inch long one to allow for driving on dusty gravel roads and to extend my time between filter cleaning / re-oiling cycles.”

http://www.model-a.org/filtering_air_into_carb.html

[H. L. Chauvin]

Hi Joe 31 & 160B,

In reply #27 above, I only tried, used, & tested the K&N #2040 i.e., 6.625 " long.

I think John Doe's wife, (mentioned in reply #27 above), was at the least fully aware of the very helpful K&N filter tests shown in reply #29.

Because "all" twenty (20) of John Doe's taxi's were going to be used on a "daily" basis as opposed to now & then, I think his wife caught the very sincere old Model A mechanic in time.

He was just about to order:

a. The 100 quarts of non-detergent oil; &,

b. The 80 black wall tires; &,

c. Then, there was a possibility of John Doe & his wife getting sued by the EPA for his dumping the "Prestone" in the storm drain on the side of the front street; plus,

d. All of the town's cats & dogs could have gotten sick on the "Prestone";

e. And, thus generating a large non-intended Vet Fee for John Doe & his wife.

e. Anybody care to guess at the moral of the story?

f. I am somewhat confused at this point !!!

[160B]

E-3050 fits the Airmaze housing, you need to drill a hole in the closed end of the air filter and make your own bolt to match the thread form on the pot metal housing.

Website for K&N E-3050 FILTER

http://www.knfilters.com/search/product.aspx?prod=E-3050&pkid=1448669&rw=1

K&N price $35.99 with free shipping on any order over $10.00

Website for K&N filter cleaning kit

http://www.knfilters.com/search/product.aspx?prod=99-5000

K&N price $13.99 with free shipping on any order over $10.00

[Pinstripe]

Very excellent posts all!!

[Duffy1]

I have the high boy filter and works great om car.

[Wrenchy61]

Check the filtration efficiency of a K&N filter vs. that of any other pleated paper air filter for an engine application. You will be surprised that the efficiency of the K&N is very low. You can even see through it on a bright sunny day.

The only time a K&N has an advantage is at maximum engine speed. All paper filters are sized for twice the normal air flow to allow for proper flow after the filter loads with particulate.

Any one that operates an engine without out an air filter certainly doesn't know any thing about engines! The same goes for anyone using a K&N filter. Henry Ford knew that no filter on his Fords was certainly going to sell cars down the road.

I spent all my years as an engineer with Diesel, gas, and gas turbine engines for all kinds of applications. Don't tell me about filters!

[JOES31]

ISO5011 protocol is what K & N as most filter manufacturers use for testing. Coarse particle testing using 5 to 150 micron particles will produce a filtration between 90 to 99% for a standard paper element. The same test, if memory serves me, K&N will filter between 95 to 99% with 200 to 300 percent more air flow. That is why they were developed and used for racing engines. Now that is what I remember to be the case but it's been a while.

So you can get the same efficiency with less restriction with a K&N. So as the above post correctly stated they were mainly made for engines operating most of the time at its maximum rpm range which demands the maximum CFM flow rate of the specific engines.

Being the filtration rate is the same or better with less restriction, that is the reason I feel it is a good choice.

[Jdubwikk]

The origional "Air-Maze" filter was used more as a flame arrestor in case of a backfire through the carb instead of as an air filter. If you think about the road conditions today compared to the conditions of the Model A era our air is much cleaner than then. Ford didn't deliver the car with an air filter and they ran fine. One of our club members had several problems with his car running rich and poorly. Once were were on the side of the road because the car stalled we took the filter off and it ran great the rest of the day and he hasn't put it back on since. I would save the money for the K&N and buy an original Air Maze if you want a "filter". Just an opinion is all. Good luck with your research on this one.

[Tom Wesenberg]

If you wet the air maze with oil it will trap more dirt.

[H. L. Chauvin]

FWIW:

When I first got my Model A Coupe in 1958 from a renowned mechanic, it had a tin can with punched 16d nail holes in it which was wired to the throat of the carburetor.

Inside the tin can was a copper/bronze Brillo pad soaked in oil whereby the former owner, told me to wash it in kerosene every now & then.

Every time I washed it, it was very dirty & loaded with dirt.

The engine had so little compression it would rotate several revolutions after turning the switch off.

In about 1960, many local rural & small town mechanics I knew over 50 years old, (born around 1910), related, when questioned, their same experiences about air filters for vintage cars traveling on rural gravel roads, i.e.,

a. With no air filters, all vintage cars averaged about 8,000 miles prior to having a smoking engine requiring a ring job;

b. About 40,000 miles was averaged after the oil bath filters were provided on cars;

c. But it wasn't until the pleated paper air filter was provided that cars attained over 100,000 miles without smoking & requiring a ring job.

However, all agreed on later having more paved roads with less dust, engines lasted somewhat longer before they began smoking.

1. Some people eat what is scientifically known today as healthier food, they exercise some, & stay healthy doing things they did when young way into their 80's; &,

2. Others choose & eat cheaper junk food, don't exercise, get lazy & become couch potatoes, & later resort to riding in battery operated shopping carts with hanging pot bellies at Wal-Mart.

3. I respect both types of people who make their own choices because we are all blessed with free wills in a free country to do whatever "we" want; &,

4. In my opinion, there is not too much difference between "vehicle" maintenance & "human body" maintenance -- both maintenances are a little more expensive, require a little more time, & in the end are just individual choices that we all make for better engine health & human health. LOL

[DougVieyra]

FrankWest, post #20: "Out of the showroom I thought these 4 cylinder fords had no air filters. "
__________________________________________________ _______

Yes, Ford did design his new 'Improved Ford' with an engine 'air filter', to help keep out road dust and debris from getting into the carburetor. He had one on each side of the engine. Not sure what he called them back then, but today's 'A' Parts Supplier catalogs still carry them. Bratton's is part number 9960 (page 45 in their 2014 catalog); Snyder's carries these important dust filters as part number A-116, as listed on their page A 127 in their 2014 catalog; Bert's part number is A-6775-A. The cost is in line with the Ebay filter that was the subject of this (TDO's) original post (#1).

Ford's original design, besides helping to keep out road dust and debris out of the carburetor, also helped the engine run cooler. You really need to check out the original Ford-Designed dust filter / engine cooler, and if you don't have this item on your car you are really missing an important component that should be on your car.

I have used these original dust filters on all the Model A's I have driven over the last 50 years, and I can tell you - they really DO WORK ! However, I do recognize that IF you drive a lot on dirt / gravel roads, that an additional screening device for your carburetor would be advisable. I do use the Air-Maze 'add on' when driving the dirt roads on my ranch, for example, and too, I used a jury-rigged carb. filter hanging up high and attached to my rad. support rods, when I spent a month driving the dirt / gravel roads of Alaska thirty years ago; but for everyday driving on today's paved roads, I find that the Air-Maze is primarily just another 'dress-up' item to embellish the car.

I LIKE embellishments, so don't have a problem with using one - but I know that it really adds very little to actual function to the car. If you have the original designed Ford 'Dust Filter' as mentioned above on your car, most of today's drivers won't need an Air-Maze.

But many of the things we do with and to our cars is not about 'need' - but rather about 'want'. And I am the leader of the parade on that score ! So by all means , enjoy the Air-Maze.

[Veger]

I just LOVE the sound of my engine running with no filter on it at all its SO Model A!

Keep On Truckin'

[Wrenchy61]

Car owners throw away the highly efficient pleated paper filter which is sized for twice the air flow requirement of the engine to allow for particle loading and replace it with a K&N low efficiency filter. Stupid is as stupid does!

The only benefit of a K&N is at the maximum rpm of an engine when the pumping loss of the engine is lowered. If anyone thinks this filter will benefit a Model A is sadly mistaken. A K&N filter application on a Model A tells me the owner knows nothing about engines.

Take a K&N filter without the screen, hold it up at eye level, peer through the filter, and watch white cars go by! If you don't believe me, compare the filtration efficiencies!

My Model A has an Air Maze with pleated paper. This filter offers protection against lubricating oil particulate which is extremely important because the standard Model A has no full flow or by pass filtration system for the lube oil.

[Dick Carne]

I personally don't care for them, and unless you are running on a good number of dirt roads, I see no real benefit. We installed one on my nephew's roadster pickup when he first finished it - within three months we removed it because the engine would not idle well, and equally did not run well at low speeds. Removing the filter alone (with no other adjustments) made all the difference in the world. I do think that they make interesting paperweights though.

[Del in NE Ohio]

I'll answer your question directly. I bought one two years ago and have used it on my "A" for approx 7-8000 miles. No problems. Even with my unbalanced Zenith carb.

[160B]

[QUOTE=Wrenchy61;922003]...Take a K&N filter without the screen, hold it up at eye level, peer through the filter, and watch white cars go by! If you don't believe me, compare the filtration efficiencies!..../QUOTE]

Could you help me understand your terminology, what is "the screen" on a K&N filter?

Thank you

[Purdy Swoft]

People that have never owned a model A automatically figure that they know more about my cars than I do. They always go on and on about how I should install some sort of air filter, even on my cars with dual updraft B carbs. I always try and be nice and humor them. First I try to tell them that there is simply no room. That never works and I tell them how they restrict air flow and cause rich operation. I then tell how the engine pans prevent dirt entering the carbs and how Henry didn't think that an air filter was needed . tring to explain why I don't use filters is never understood..I usually have to promise to install filters to get them to drop the subject.

[H. L. Chauvin]

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Hi Purdy,

Or you could tell them you only use your filters when the mosquitoes get plentiful -- that should draw a blank look & allow time for you to change the subject. LOL

[GrandpasA]

I want a air maze on my A, they look cool with the k&n filter on them.. Just my opinion..

[Purdy Swoft]

If you chose to use an air maze, it is best to use a lock nut on the screw that holds the air maze to the carb. The air maze is famous for the screw backing out and the air maze falling off .

[Purdy Swoft]

Originally Posted by H. L. Chauvin

Hi Purdy,

Or you could tell them you only use your filters when the mosquitoes get plentiful -- that should draw a blank look & allow time for you to change the subject. LOL

Hi Henry,
Thats a good one , I'll have to try it.

[mrraford]

My what reactions to the simple air filter issue!
I have run one of these "above the carburetor" air filters on my pickup for several years. It works properly with no carburetion problems because the filter restricts airflow much less than the old paper filters sold for the other type.
It is pricey but it works very well. I would purchase another if my 68C was ready for the road.

[H. L. Chauvin]

Maybe Model A air filters could be compared to the later introduction of cigarette filters -- some people liked them & some did not -- anyway after 100,000 Model A miles, like with the old vintage cigarette ads, would it be appropriate to ask a Model A owner:

"Are you smoking more & enjoying it less." LOL

[Purdy Swoft]

As far as smoking goes, I'm glad that Deb kept on at me untill I quit nineteen years ago. As for my thoughts on air filters on the model A , no harm meant. If running a filter makes a person feel better and they feel that its the right thing to do, they should use one.

[steve s]

If balancing the air pressures in carburetors doesn't matter and if using an air filter isn't a good idea, I wonder why all modern (post mid-1930's) have been balanced and air filtered?

[Purdy Swoft]

An air balanced carburetor will help to some extent. Air passing through the air horn of the carb will have no effect on the gas in the bowl of an air balanced carburetor. Any air filter will have some effect on the amount of air that can flow through the air horn of any carburetor. From a performance stand point, an engine is an air pump. The more air that an engine can pump the more power it can produce. Back in the day some would remove the air cleaner from the carburetor to get more power and it worked and the carburetors were all air balanced. When you look into the air horn of a modern carburetor, that little tube sticking up with an angled tip is the balance tube. The balance tube helped but didn't remove all of the air flow restriction caused by an air filter. I run engine pans and don't run mine on dirt roads where dust levels could be a problem. Thats not to say that I would never drive on a dirt road. If its dry and dusty I would use a different vehicle. Mine are just fun cars and are not used for primary transportation. I don't necessarily feel that air balancing the carburetor is a bad idea. I just don't feel that air balancing the model A carburetor or an air filter is necessary unless they will have to be driven in extreme dusty conditions. I feel that under the right conditions the model A will give better performance and gas milage with no restriction of air flow through the air horn of the carburetor.

[GrandpasA]

so anyone got a air maze for sale? I know I can probally look in the classifieds, I'm just being lazy..

[tiger.1000]

If you have the time on your hands.....

[GrandpasA]

not much time left on these hands, but I got Ben franklen to help me out..lol

[Purdy Swoft]

Originally Posted by GrandpasA

so anyone got a air maze for sale? I know I can probally look in the classifieds, I'm just being lazy..

Most any of the model a parts houses carry them and would be your best bet for a nice clean one . Snyders lists them on page A-143 The plain Air Maze with mesh filter lists for only 25.95 . They list the high volume Air Maze with elbow connection for $33.95 andthe high boy air filter for $69.95 . This sould give you an idea of price and selection of filter setups that are offered. They also offer replacement filters.

[Jerry in Shasta]

If model A's do not need filters, why do all modern cars have them? Don't we all use the same dirty air?

As for running rich I set the fuel level about 1/16" lower.

JB

[steve s]

Originally Posted by Jerry in Shasta

If model A's do not need filters, why do all modern cars have them? Don't we all use the same dirty air? ... JB

I guess engineers and accountants in Detroit (and Japan and Germany and Great Britain and Italy) must have determined early on that air-balancing carbs and using air filters is cheaper than a good set of engine pans!

[JJASON]

I copied like the one one Ebay,use it on my Tillotson carb. Works good,I want clean air no matter what,going into my engine. Beats rebuilding engine again.Driveing down the street, car naturally kicks up road dirt,that goes into engine,its simple.

[Purdy Swoft]

Originally Posted by Jerry in Shasta

If model A's do not need filters, why do all modern cars have them? Don't we all use the same dirty air?

As for running rich I set the fuel level about 1/16" lower.

JB

If filters were so necessary for the model A, Why didn't Henry install them when they rolled off the assembly line and how have so many model A's survived over eighty years without them??? Model A's can't be compared to modern cars. What is very well necessary for modern cars isn't always necessary for the model A. Nobody said that you copuldn't use one if you choose.

Setting the float 1/16 lower is good to prevent stalling when coming to a stop but has nothing to do with actually running rich or lean.

[Purdy Swoft]

Originally Posted by JJASON

I copied like the one one Ebay,use it on my Tillotson carb. Works good,I want clean air no matter what,going into my engine. Beats rebuilding engine again.Driveing down the street, car naturally kicks up road dirt,that goes into engine,its simple.

.

Todays paved roads are nothing like the roads of yesteryear. Engine pans have worked pretty well for the model A. Most have survived even without them. Some filters are really not that bad if maximum performance isn't a persons main goal , just not a necessity unless conditions are dustier than usual. The model A is very under powered as compared to modern cars and needs all of the help that they can get to keep out of the way of fast moving traffic . I don't take my model A out in severe dusty conditions. Heavy dust would be uncomfortable for me as well. In such conditions I prefer the air conditioned comfort of our Cadillac and leave the model A at home. Restricted air flow that some filters can cause will result in dilution of the crankcase oil which is as bad or worse than dust. We all still have the right to make our own choices in regard to the use of air filters. Smiley Face.

[Karl]

Originally Posted by Purdy Swoft

If filters were so necessary for the model A, Why didn't Henry install them when they rolled off the assembly line and how have so many model A's survived over eighty years without them??? Model A's can't be compared to modern cars. What is very well necessary for modern cars isn't always necessary for the model A. Nobody said that you copuldn't use one if you choose.

Setting the float 1/16 lower is good to prevent stalling when coming to a stop but has nothing to do with actually running rich or lean.

Henry did and didn't do a lot of things. He was a genius but he wasn't always right. He did accept (slowly) that with progress there is a better way to do things hence the model T made way for the Model A and he did install air filters on the V8's. Yes there are a lot of 80 year old model A's that is indisputable. Most have been run without filters but the question is how many have never had the engine done . I suspect not many and precious few that have been driven extensively on dirt roads. Karl

[Purdy Swoft]

Neither the A or T was fitted with an air filter and most were driven on dirt roads in the day, some terrible rutted dirt roads at that. I wouldn't expect any automobile to survive over 80 years without a few overhauls. I've still got my first september 29 that I got in the spring of 1960 when I was 13 years old. I turned 14 in late november of that year. The car was already 31 years old when I got it . It has never run a air filter till this day. It still has the original standard pistons and hard original babbitt. I've overhauled it twice in all of these years. I honed the cylinders twice ,installed new rings, oversize the last time and piston expanders to quiet piston slap. Its got an easy life now but has been run hard and fast in the past. I first removed shims. The second overhaul, I filed the rod and main caps to maintain .002 clearance and installed new valves. It still runs like a top and I figure that it will last the rest of my life . Model A's are tough and in my opinion need no stinking air filters. No harm meant, I'm just talking model A. Model A's have been a large part of my life for the past 54 going on 55 years. Purdy.

[JOES31]

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[QUOTE=Wrenchy61;922003]Car owners throw away the highly efficient pleated paper filter which is sized for twice the air flow requirement of the engine to allow for particle loading and replace it with a K&N low efficiency filter. Stupid is as stupid does!

Take a K&N filter without the screen, hold it up at eye level, peer through the filter, and watch white cars go by! If you don't believe me, compare the filtration efficiencies!
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What the H???

If you can't see through the filter that means it's good?????

Compare the efficiency. Do it. 50 to 200 micron large particle test 90 to. 95% for a K&N filter. Any smaller than 50 microns is a non issue.

Obviously never worked on performance engines. A K&N is ideal for an A where you want as little restriction as possible.

[PepeLoco]

I am amazed at how dirty my air filters get on my A. That would be dirt getting in the engine. Just my two bits.

[GrandpasA]

Originally Posted by Jerry in Shasta

If model A's do not need filters, why do all modern cars have them? Don't we all use the same dirty air?

As for running rich I set the fuel level about 1/16" lower.

JB

I'll try that on mine...

[Wrenchy61]

For your own information and a basis for your comments about automotive air filters, I would suggest Googling "K&N air filter myths." Google will list several websites with a broad range of comments most of which are hilarious.

The website by the Nissan Infinity Car Owners Club, NICO has the results of the ISO 5011 particle filtration test on several different brands of filters including the K&N filter. Maybe these test results will be convincing or will you wear out your Model A engine by not applying a filter or by applying an inefficient filter! The choice is yours.


Henry Ford wanted to sell cars and keep them priced real low during the Great Depression. What better way than to cut corners than to eliminate the air filter and allow the engine to wear out before its time?

My 1931 Model A pickup that my Dad bought new in May of 1931 was not equipped with an air filter. Despite the fact the pickup was driven on paved roads, an overhaul was required at 60,000 miles. New rings, valves. and knurling of the pistons was necessary. Knurling of the piston skirts was implemented to carry an oil film that would prevent piston slap in a worn cylinder bore and a worn skirt.

My '31 pickup has a conventional Air Maze paper filter fastened to the inlet of the carburetor. I am not worried about restriction, running rich, or having a fire. All these can be compromised with by a skilled mechanic.

Remember, poor air filtration allows particulate to contaminate the oil since the A engine has no filtration.

I watched an experienced auto mechanic who must have done a sloppy job on overhauling a Blue Flame Chevrolet six cylinder take a a tablespoon of BonAmi and slowly feed it in through the carburetor while the engine was running at about quarter throttle. In no time at all, the engine quit smoking as the piston rings were "seated" to the cylinder walls. Shocking? This same action occurs when driving a vehicle with poor filtration or no filtration of the combustion air of an engine. BonAmi is advertised as a no scratch cleaner.

If you don't believe any of this, conduct your own test. Run your Model A with and without an air filter for 5000 miles. Take an oil sample of each to your local Detroit Engine Dealer and have them do an oil analysis. You should be a believer!

If you still aren't a believer of all of the above, watch the film. "The Air You Breath". Then you Will be a believer.

[JOES31]

Ahhh. Ok. Now you really have me confused. Pouring Bonami into a running carb would be a really stupid thing to do. It would also give all the more reason to run an air filter. Because something is on the Internet and for that matter Google, doesn't mean it's true. If I wanted to waste my time I could find as many articles that would say the filters are better. I prefer to rely on my experience. By the way if you would read this website you will find comments about fires started with using filter or maze run below the carb. I would hate to hear yours caught fire. From my experience of mechanics and engines in general, running a filter below the carb with the way the Zenith was engineered is dangerous period.

I have used K&N's on all my vehicles. Presently I have one on my 2008 Lexus GX470. It has 144,000 miles on it and does not burn a drop of oil. That's LA miles with a lot of standing in traffic. I do oil changes every 5,000 miles. I installed the K&N when I bought it new. I had one on a 1992 940T Volvo. I traded it in with 250,000 miles on it. It did not burn any oil. I also run one on my 86 560 SL, G35 Infinity, and when I get the Hellcat Challenger that will be the first change I'll make on it. Oh yea wait it comes with a cold intake with one on it.

I've used K&N' before they were available for sale at the parts stores and have never had a problem. I think maybe what your not understanding about the filter is that it uses an oil bath to catch the particulate matter. The element is just a medium for the host oil that catches the finer particulate. Take away the oil and it would be less effective.

Trying not to be argumentative but my long experience with them speaks for itself. I'll tell you what. I'll contact K&N and get the current tests and information on the filtration. It's been a long time since I've reviewed it. Hope they remember me.

[Wrenchy61]

I am not here to argue with JOES31 posted comments and his discrediting with what I have commented on.

All I would like to add is that I was a project engineer in a Fortune 500 Company for mostly engine driven generator sets, pump units, and compressor units. During these 26 years of my career, I engineered projects with gas, Diesel, dual-fuel engines,and aero-derivative gas turbines. Every time you flip the switch, fill up the tank, or sleep peacefully, at least one of my projects have touched the lives of every single American. These projects included Nike X, Peterson Air Force Base, Prudhoe Bay, Diseneyworld, Valdez Terminal, the Bay of Campeche, and numberous others.

Prior to this career, I was a tech rep for GM locomotives and mobile power units throughout the world. And prior to this, I was a high school auto mechanics teacher.

I can assure anyone, that the application of engine air filters and other accessories was my responsibility from a small engine to a LM6000 $6,000,000 GE gas turbine. I have dealt with all types of filters and could write a dissertation on these. Maybe I should conduct a seminar for those without a technical education.

I never had to listen to a filter salesman trying to sell me his brand based on his beliefs or his experiences or their profitability. I had all the facts and always will. There is nothing better than a pleated paper air filter to promote the long service life of any engine.

For some people, air filter selection is kind of like the gasoline station patron who asked me, "Do you think I should continue filling up with the best premium fuel available? (I didn't have time to waste on educating him about why various grades of fuel are offered.) I just asked him, "Does this make you feel good!" His reply was, "Yes!". All I said was, "If it makes you feel good, just continue filling up with premium!"

Amen.

[JOES31]

Wrenchy here is what K&N suggested I read to answer my questions.
They gave me the location on their Internet site for the information I requested.

Seems pretty straight forward to me.


Some air filter companies tout their high filtration levels in the 99th percentile. Doesn't higher filtration mean a better air filter?

No. The quality of an air filter can only be judged by reviewing all four important characteristics. 1) Restriction while loading with dust; 2) Filtration efficiency as a percentage; 3) Dust holding capacity before the filter needs cleaning or replacement ; and 4) filter life. Any company designing an air filter must make choices about these four characteristics and how their filter will perform in each area. Generally speaking, each characteristic of an air filter has an inverse relationship to at least one of the others, meaning, as filtration efficiency goes up, restriction increases and capacity or service life decreases. So an air filter manufacturer can design an air filter to have ultra high filtration efficiency by compromising the filters restriction, capacity, and/or service life. We judge the quality of an air filter based upon the proper balance of these four essential criteria. Maximizing one at the expense of others sounds more like a marketing goal rather than an engineering goal. So the basic answer to the original question is that higher filtration is not necessarily a good thing when it comes at the expense of restriction, reusability and/or capacity. While the benefits of a filter with 99.9% filtration are unknown, the benefits of low restriction are measurable and clear. Low restriction helps an engine perform more efficiently generating more power and torque.

That would lead a reasonable person to ask what then is a safe level of filtration. This question is literally unanswered. Minimum air filter specifications are generally not called out in vehicle owners' manuals, nor will you find much published information on air filtration requirements from vehicle manufacturers. We have never seen a scientific study concluding what levels of filtration efficiency correspond to various levels of engine wear. Some large air filter companies do not even publish information on the efficiencies of the air filters they manufacture. It is K&N's opinion that both the Fine and Coarse Test Dust mixtures used in air filter testing contain such a high concentration of small particles that even filtration efficiency numbers as low as 90% may provide adequate engine protection. Remember that almost 11% of COARSE test dust is smaller than 5.5 microns (the size of a red blood cell). For a detailed explanation of our testing protocol, click here.

The fact is that an engine is not a pristine environment. Fuel enters after passing through a fuel filter, combines with air which is ignited to explode in a pressurized chamber. The combustion is not 100% efficient and leaves residues behind that must be flushed from the engine. Engines have tolerances or measured gaps between surface areas. While there are few if any studies on engine wear, it would seem reasonable to speculate that particles less than 5.5 microns create little engine wear unless ingested at very high levels of concentration. As support for this theory, consider the filtration levels provided by fuel filters and oil filters that sometimes tout their ability to filter particles above 10 or 20 microns.

If you really want to compare two air filters, you need to know all four characteristics mentioned above. Consumers can then choose what matters most to them. But comparing two air filters with only one piece of information is like saying a bicycle is better than a car based solely on a comparison of mileage. Yes the mileage is better, but a car has a few other benefits (speed, comfort, keeps you dry in wet weather) that just may offset the mileage disadvantage.

We design air filters to provide low restriction throughout the filter's service interval. We seek the best balance between airflow and filtration recognizing they are inversely related. After nearly 40 years in business with millions of air filters sold, we have a track record you can trust and the experience that can only be earned through years of focusing on just one thing. But even our experience is not enough. We operate a fully staffed air filtration lab that operates on a year round basis with two test stands. The lab was designed by Southwest Research and is calibrated regularly to ensure our test results are reliable. This testing is an essential ingredient in verifying our air filters meet our own high standards of excellence. Making a great air filter is no accident and we are confident our air filters provide outstanding engine protection with huge air flow advantages throughout the air filter's service interval. That's why we back up our replacement air filters with both a Million Mile Warranty and our Consumer Protection Pledge.

K&N's air filtration lab tests air filters according to ISO5011 test protocol. The ISO (International Organization for Standardization) is an international organization which establishes standards used by different industries worldwide. The ISO does not establish any standards for an air filter's effectiveness; they establish standards for the testing procedures used to find air filters' capacities and efficiencies only under the fixed and chosen parameters of the test being conducted. In the case of engine air filters, the ISO5011 test ensures consistency in the procedure used to test a filter's initial restriction, initial efficiency, cumulative (full-life) efficiency, and dust holding capacity. Using a standardized test procedure and disclosing the user selected variables ensures the same test can be run anywhere around the world. Some of the requirements of the ISO5011 test procedure are that the temperature of the test lab must be maintained at 23 degrees Celsius +/- 5 degrees Celsius, and the relative humidity of the test lab must be maintained at 55% +/- 15%, for the entire duration of the test. During the test at each weighing stage (when the mass of the filter is found) the humidity can only vary +/- 2%. Also, all test dust which is fed into the air filter must be "found" after the test is completed. That means if 10 grams of test dust is fed to the filter during the test, but only 8 grams of dust is found trapped in the filter after the test, part of the ISO5011 test procedure requires that the remaining 2 grams of dust must be found. The dust could be in the air filter housing, the air duct, or the absolute filter which traps any dust that passes through the air filter, but wherever it is it must be accounted for. If any of the requirements of the ISO test procedure are not met, the test is not valid. A company's participation in testing using ISO5011 test procedures is strictly voluntary. Conducting an ISO5011 test requires a considerable investment in both time and equipment, and many air filter companies simply do not have the resources to complete an ISO test in-house. K&N views this test procedure as a valuable part of our research and development process.

[160B]

Originally Posted by JOES31

................................If you really want to compare two air filters, you need to know all four characteristics mentioned above. Consumers can then choose what matters most to them. But comparing two air filters with only one piece of information is like saying a bicycle is better than a car based solely on a comparison of mileage. Yes the mileage is better, but a car has a few other benefits (speed, comfort, keeps you dry in wet weather) that just may offset the mileage disadvantage. .............

Well stated, I have read on this thread several references to pleated paper is superior to anything else. The problem is the pleated paper filters sold by some Model A Ford parts suppliers do not have the flow capacity for a Model A 200.5 cubic inch displacement running at operational RPM. The result is the vehicle runs rich. So the statement by itself that pleated paper is superior has no merit unless it is qualified with additional information such as size, manufacturer etc.

[goodoldvic]

No air filter used, used to, my cars runs better w/o

[Purdy Swoft]

Same here !!! I don't wear a dust mask either. A filter is as uncomfortable to my model A as a dust mask is to me. Most won't ever put 60.000 miles on their model A. We don't use ours for primary transportation and wouldn't want to.

[Wrenchy61]

Yawwwwwwwwnnnnnnn!

[Purdy Swoft]

Ain't it the truth !!!!!!!

[Y-Blockhead]

I see it mentioned several times in this thread about engines running rich. Which brings up a question. Are the jets changable and/or available for the Zenith Carbs.

I don't have an opinion on using an air filter or not. My car came with a Air Maze and I was told it was a spark arrestor. I can't see how it wound filter much out the screen is so coarse. maybe gravel small birds??

[Paul from Maine]

Originally Posted by Purdy Swoft

I'm not a believer in air filters on model A's with updraft carbs. They mostly cause rich operation and cause more problems than they solve. Thats just me though. If you like it, go for it

I agree! Unless you are driving in a sandstorm, what use is the air filter on an updraft carb? Any type of debris that would be substantial enough to damage the engine would be too heavy to be sucked UP past the throttle plate, UP through the vertical part of the intake and then UP through the valve chamber into the cylinder! With the modern fuels and oils now in use, gooey carbon deposits which trapped airborne dust are rare compared to the old days! I am a firm believer in air filters for downdraft carbs! Airborne sand and dirt that would be too dense to enter an updraft carb would be easily ingested by a downdraft carb! I just don't think a Model A needs an air filter unless you are driving in extremely severe conditions! Henry didn't think they were required when most of the roads were gravel and today most roads are paved!

[JOES31]

Henry also didn't want to change from the Model T to the Model A. He just wanted to keep on making T's until his son Edsel explained how Ford was losing market share and would be gone if they did not change. Hence Edsel won the argument and the A was produced. Basically we have Edsel to thank for the A, and acquiring Mercury and Lincoln. I wonder what Ford would be like today if Edsel would not have died at such an early age.

Paul in my experience ingestion of particulate matter is always going to be worse on an updraft. Dust and dirt comes from the road and a carb is basically a vacuum cleaner and as we know the A updraft is closer to the road than most downdrafts where the dirt and grit would have a much harder time making its way into the carb. Just think about it for a moment. Would more dust be lifted with a vacuum cleaner facing down a foot from the ground or facing up 3 feet from the ground. The large stuff that could do immediate mechanical damage is not the problem. You're right. It can't get past the carb. It's the fine particulate matter that is the problem. It's not going to happen right away and lets face it not many put that many miles on our A's so not running a filter for most of us will not be a problem. Take the filter off your modern car that you drive every day and not only will you wear the engine prematurely you will void your warranty. But we are talking about A's.

From experience I cannot run an engine without a decent filter. My problem.

[Werner]

Hello carburetor men!

I have read these many posts because I do not know if my Zenith-2 has this balance passage or not. If I see the picture of pargeter correctly, then my carburettor is without balance, because the upper of the three holes goes only out in the air?

[Werner]

Because my carburetor makes irregularities (idle air jet completely screwed in, GAV 1/2 turn left, 7 gal. per 100 mls) I would like to repeat the previous question again.

[Jw]

my opinion, don't need an air filter

[Synchro909]

Originally Posted by Jw

my opinion, don't need an air filter

But you will need to rebuild the engine more often. You'll go a long way without a filter but further with one
Obviously, I use one but fitting it is not so easy on a RHD car, especially if one uses one of those oil filters on the side cover. I use both oil and air filters.

[Y-Blockhead]

Originally Posted by Werner

Hello carburetor men!

I have read these many posts because I do not know if my Zenith-2 has this balance passage or not. If I see the picture of pargeter correctly, then my carburettor is without balance, because the upper of the three holes goes only out in the air?

Originally Posted by Werner

Because my carburetor makes irregularities (idle air jet completely screwed in, GAV 1/2 turn left, 7 gal. per 100 mls) I would like to repeat the previous question again.

That's correct. The air vent at the top in your picture would be sealed. The float bowl would be vented thru the carb throat. Thus it is vent to the inside of the air filter.

[Jerry in Shasta]

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If filters are not needed why are they on modern cars??

[PalAl]

Contact
https://www.redquailearlyfordparts.com/

[Synchro909]

Originally Posted by PalAl

Contact
https://www.redquailearlyfordparts.com/

NO good on a RHD car!

[Werner]

Hallo!

Tom Wesenberg wrote in the past

If I wanted to add a balance tube, I'd buy a thin brass tube from the hobby shop or hardware store that fits tight into the air vent hole. It only needs to be about 3/4" long. Then slip a piece of tubing over the brass pipe and have it enter anywhere between the choke plate and air filer. This way you can have a balanced carb for an air filter without doing any cutting or drilling to the carb.

I imitated that today. I notice during the test drive no difference to the previous version.

[PalAl]

For Right Hand drive go to

https://www.redquailearlyfordparts.com/

scroll down for right hand drive air cleaner

[Synchro909]

Originally Posted by PalAl

For Right Hand drive go to

https://www.redquailearlyfordparts.com/

scroll down for right hand drive air cleaner

THanks PalAl but as I said in post # 184, they can't be used if you have an oil filter as well. I wouldn't drive like and where I do without both.

[Y-Blockhead]

Originally Posted by Werner

Hallo!

Tom Wesenberg wrote in the past I imitated that today. I notice during the test drive no difference to the previous version.

Is your float bowl completely blocked off from the atmosphere?

See picture of 'Air Balance' Zenith below. Notice the air vent is closed off and the body and venturi are machined to route venting to throat of carb.

I think you need a larger vent tube also.

[Werner]

Blockhead, yes, the only air-vent of the bowl chamber is now the tube to the air filter tube. The brass conecting tube's diameter is about 1/5 inch outside.

[burner31]

Hold filter firmly in hand...throw as far as possible...drive car

[Werner]

Where does the air passage end in air-ballanced carburettor housing? (I mean the long bore-channel from the float chamber to the air intake.)

Thanks in advance!


Note without debate: I would never run a combustion engine without an air filter!

[Werner]

Hallo, I would like to ask again about the air-ballanced carburettor.

I suppose I've misunderstood that so far. I thought an air-balance carburetor would have a different underbody with an internal channel from the float chamber bore forward to the air intake (yellow). I think now that's wrong.

Is that niw in the following right:
1) I close the hole (red) in the float chamber.
2) I file a 2/10 inch wide open channel between float chamber and venturi.

Then this is right for air-ballancing?

Thank you in advance.

[katy]

Quote: Originally Posted by PalAl View Post Contact https://www.redquailearlyfordparts.com/
NO good on a RHD car!
__________________

Would it work with one of these?

[Y-Blockhead]

Werner, look closely at the modified venturi in post #92. The top vent to atmosphere in your picture also needs to be completely blocked off. The vent in my picture is filled with JB weld.

I will add a picture of my carb throat when I get a chance. I is vented just in front of the venturi. (towards the air filter).

3/16" hole in carb throat.

Renner's Corner balances carbs if you feel the need to get outside help. http://rennerscorner.com/index.html

[Y-Blockhead]

With the air balanced Zenith and this K&N filter on an Air Maze adaptor.https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Not trying to convert members to running a filter, that is your choice. But why does my air filter have to be cleaned all the time? And I run engine pans??

[Werner]

Hallo Blockhead,
thank you for your effort. But I do not understand that correctly. On the picture # 92 it looks different. There, an open channel runs from the float chamber direct into the venturi tube (with negative pressure).

[Y-Blockhead]

And the groove machined into the outside of the venturi routes the vent to the 3/16" hole to the carb throat. The "channel" from the float bowl does not go into the venturi, it goes around the outside of the venturi to the throat of the carb. I don't know how to better explain it.

[Werner]

Blockhead, I try it again. Please see picture. Sorry for my bad understanding.

[Werner]

I would like to ask if somebody can explain something to me about the milling between the float chamber and the venturi hole.

[Synchro909]

Originally Posted by Werner

I would like to ask if somebody can explain something to me about the milling between the float chamber and the venturi hole.

I didn't get too worked up about doing this. I don't have a milling machine and there is no need for great precision. I used a die grinder there asnd on the lip under the venturi.

[Synchro909]

Originally Posted by katy

Would it work with one of these?

Katy, just back from yet another rally. Sorry for the delay replying.
I haven't seen either one of those air filters or one of those oil filter mounts on a car, let alone both at once. Your suggestion might work.
Has anybody tried it???

[Werner]

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Hallo again,
I changed the Zenith-2 again on air-ballance today. From the float chamber directly above the choke flap shaft's front. Instead of brass, I used this time 1/5 inch copper tube, which can bend broken fracture-free and therefore build in one piece from hole to hole.

[Werner]

Now I have to ask again: I have just noticed today that there is in the upper carburetor housing an additional hole for venting. Above the hole in the under housing. (I do not understand the reason because 1 is enough.)

I think now that I have to close this hole too?

[Werner]

Addition:
Here in the book picture the channel is drawn. Unfortunately, he is not mentioned in the text.

[duke36]

Originally Posted by darrylkmc

The last thing that I would want is Gasoline drenched ABS plastic that close to my exhaust.

Darryl in Fairbanks

The ebay seller says it's 2 copper elbows.

[Synchro909]

Originally Posted by Werner

Now I have to ask again: I have just noticed today that there is in the upper carburetor housing an additional hole for venting. Above the hole in the under housing. (I do not understand the reason because 1 is enough.)

I think now that I have to close this hole too?

That is not an original hole. I'd seal it too as you suggest.

[Tom Wesenberg]

If you modify the carb for an internal vent to the front of the choke, to use an air filter, then you also need to block off the original external vent.

[Y-Blockhead]

Why do you need to run the vent all the way to in front of the choke? My air balanced Zenith is vented to the carb throat just before the venturi. See photo in post #98.

[Synchro909]

Originally Posted by Y-Blockhead

Why do you need to run the vent all the way to in front of the choke? My air balanced Zenith is vented to the carb throat just before the venturi. See photo in post #98.

So long as the vent is between the air filter and the venturi, it doesn't matter. The pressure will be the same anywhere in that piece of the intake.

[Ed in Maine]

I think Charlie summed it up perfectly. Why not have your Model A run as Henry wanted it to during your life time! You don't need the air filter. Just my take, Ed

[SkimmerBob]

Originally Posted by burner31

Hold filter firmly in hand...throw as far as possible...drive car

That’s funny!

[Werner]

Error. With the sealed hole the engine was not adjustable and too rich. The ventilation hole in the upper housing is necessary to get air into the channel for the idle needle!

Blockhead: Meanwhile, I have the hose line as shown by you in the area of ​​the choke flap. Thank you!

Synchro: Your comment is correct. Nevertheless I have now the tube pipe layed to a short distance before the choke flap achsle to get a shorter pipe.

Thanks to the helpers! Now my engine sucks in dust-free air and the carburetor does not mix too rich.

[Y-Blockhead]

Originally Posted by Synchro909

So long as the vent is between the air filter and the venturi, it doesn't matter. The pressure will be the same anywhere in that piece of the intake.

Yes, you and I know that. I was asking Werner.

Originally Posted by Ed in Maine

I think Charlie summed it up perfectly. Why not have your Model A run as Henry wanted it to during your life time! You don't need the air filter. Just my take, Ed

Please tell me why my air cleaner gets dirty. And I run engine pans.