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Old 11-08-2013, 10:24 PM   #1
40 Deluxe
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Default Make your ethanol-free gas!

You can make ethanol-free fuel at home using only water! Simple, too! The secret is in the fact that water and gasoline do not mix, while water and ethanol have a great affinity for each other. What you do is get a clear container like those square 5 gallon jugs popular with motorcycle racers. Put in 4 gallons of ethanol-containing gas and add 1 gallon of water Cap it and shake vigorously to mix the gas and water, then let it sit for a few hours. The ethanol combines with the water and the water, being heavier than gas, will settle to the bottom of the jug. What is now floating on top of the water is pure gasoline. You can siphon the gas off or go to the bottom of the jug and siphon the water/ethanol out. Or get fancy and add a spigot to the jug to drain the water junk out.
One caution: 87 octane gasohol (10% ethanol) is made from about 81 octane gasoline, and the ethanol brings the final octane up to 87. To end up with 87 octane pure gasoline, you have to buy 92 octane premium and remove the ethanol from it because they add ethanol to 87 octane regular to end up with 92 octane premium. This is according to a friend who works for a fuel distributor who buys direct from a refinery nearby in New Mexico.
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Old 11-08-2013, 10:30 PM   #2
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

Thanks for the information. Will give it a try on a small scale for my mower and small motors.
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Old 11-09-2013, 06:27 AM   #3
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

Good to know, thanks
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Old 11-09-2013, 07:08 AM   #4
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

Hmmm... I will also try it in my lawn mower and small engines first
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Old 11-09-2013, 07:22 AM   #5
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

I think I will try it in a clear container / to try to get a measurement of Gas vrs. ethonal at the end.
HEY if I use the left over water/ethonal over several batches then I can through the gas away and have some migthy fine sipping Hooch left behind. no LOL here !!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 11-09-2013, 08:12 AM   #6
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

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Don't drink that stuff Bill!! We need to keep our Shock Man healthy.
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Old 11-09-2013, 08:21 AM   #7
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

So, ya don't think gas absorbs water? yes it does. That's why they sell "drygas" as an additive. Guess what it is? Ethanol or Methanol. Without the alcohol, temperature changes can cause the water to "drop out" to the bottom of the tank.

Something about a "circle jerk".

Go to your local airport - buy 100 LL, that's 100 octane with a "low" percentage of lead. Expensive, you bet.
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Old 11-09-2013, 09:13 AM   #8
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

If you try this don't dump the byproduct on the ground, it don't go away. If anyone wants to know the problems I would be glad to explain. G.M.
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Old 11-09-2013, 09:17 AM   #9
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

G.M. All though I am not the worlds biggest tree hugger I was Taught to try to leave this world a better place then we found it.
Yes Please explain !!

Last edited by BILL WZOREK; 11-09-2013 at 09:48 AM. Reason: Boy I can't spell !!!!!
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Old 11-09-2013, 09:44 AM   #10
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

I buy ethanol-free 87 octane for about 20 cents/gallon more than the ethanol stuff. If you loose 10% volume to remove ethanol, I'll save time and money to buy the good stuff.
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Old 11-09-2013, 09:45 AM   #11
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

What do you do with the water you drain off?
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Old 11-09-2013, 10:02 AM   #12
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

If you test the drained off water you will find more than water and ethanol. This is not good science. You will be removing more than just alcohol and leaving behind more crap that you don't want. Water will make what's left even more unstable and render the octane rating to a diminished unknown.
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Old 11-09-2013, 10:03 AM   #13
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Morookian View Post
So, ya don't think gas absorbs water? yes it does. That's why they sell "drygas" as an additive. Guess what it is? Ethanol or Methanol. Without the alcohol, temperature changes can cause the water to "drop out" to the bottom of the tank.

Something about a "circle jerk".

Go to your local airport - buy 100 LL, that's 100 octane with a "low" percentage of lead. Expensive, you bet.
Yes, I don't think that gas absorbs water.
That is why you add 'drygas', to allow the water to be dispersed into the gas and eliminated in the normal combustion process.
Otherwise the water would just sit on the bottom of the tank.
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Old 11-09-2013, 10:54 AM   #14
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

Around here you dump leftover fuels and whatever on mesquite trees. They are a bigger problem than polluting the soil. If you knew that the ethanol burnt at a lower temp. You could cook it out in a still. A guy I know that makes his own diesel. Can hear the diesel and get gas out of it.
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Old 11-09-2013, 11:20 AM   #15
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

There are a fair amount of complex hydrocarbons that go into the final batch of fuel that you buy from the pump. Some are very light distillates and some are gasses then there are the complex processes that make the naphtha more efficient in the burn. Some of these processes use catalysts in the conversion and none of the mix gets along well with water. Internal combustion engines don't run well on water contaminated fuel. If you want to take your already less than spectacular fuel and contaminate it further then be my guest but you may notice that the vehicle doesn't run as well as it should and it will likely get unstable even faster than it already does by normal absorption of moisture from natural condensation in the tank.
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Old 11-09-2013, 11:25 AM   #16
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

Plenty of stations in my area (one 2 miles away) that sell non ethanol gas.
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Old 11-09-2013, 08:00 PM   #17
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

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Originally Posted by BILL WZOREK View Post
G.M. All though I am not the worlds biggest tree hugger I was Taught to try to leave this world a better place then we found it.
Yes Please explain !!
I own 2 commercial properties that were gas stations 30 or 40 years ago. The State of Florida had several clean up types of programs the stations were in. One the owner pays 25% of the clean up and the other the responsible party pays 100%. I have one in both of the programs. The responsible party is Conoco/Philips on one. I bought the other one and assumed the 25% position. This is only on the clean up. Both properties have an area of about 8' X 8' about 6 feet deep. Over the past 25 years the State has done 3 engineering evaluations on both properties on both at a cost to them at about $15,000.00 each. These tests and results are all in binders 1/2" thick on each test These consisted of dry well soil samples and ground water wells for water samples. Both properties the contamination is under the concrete. To define the spot you core drill the concrete with about a 3" concrete drill in a circle around the know problem area. Take soil samples at every foot in depth and sniff the soil with a calibrated sniffer. You keep moving the drill circle in from the outside diameter of the area until you get into the contaminated soil. I have been involved with enough sample holes and can tell if they are just above the minimum allowed or bad petroleum contamination by the smell. Water is pumped from the ground water wells through a 5/16" plastic tube with a aquarium type pump for a certain time then pumped into test tubes, put in a cooler and taken directly to a testing lab. Same with the soil samples. These samples are tested for the amount of various petroleum products. The State is and has been out of money for years for clean up. They get a little influx of money once in a while and go through this testing. Every contaminated site has a site number. My sites continue to be just on the bottom line of the clean up projects. So I get tested and postponed. Instead of coming in and removing 2 truck loads of dirt and replacing the concrete I stay at the bottom of the list. The readings are getting a little lower every time they test. The ground water moves underground usually towards a body of water very slowly. The contaminated area is called a plume and is like a cloud in the sky moving very slowly. Over the past 25 years these have moved a few feet, weakened slightly but are still there. I doubt there was over 3 or 4 gallons of leakage on either site. If the state eliminates all of these sites they wouldn't need the thousands of employee's so my number remains. Knowing exactly where the contamination is and the strength of it and the confined size it really doesn't bother me to much. If it did I would just go in and remove it. On the property that I have to pay 25%. I may do this in the end anyway because it would be cheaper then 25% of what it will cost them. The removed dirt is taken to an incinerator and cooked, this dirt is then sterile and nothing will grow in it for a while. You can also "farm" it. You have to spread plastic and spread the dirt on it and the sun and wind will remove the petroleum. The problem with this is you could contaminate the ground in this area if it rained. It looks like they may just leave this property alone when it gets down to end. So you want to be careful on what you dump and if dumped into the same area it can accumulate. I know most of us dumped small amounts years ago before the problems became aware to us. Over the years I have stopped at any clean up site I ran across and asked questions and looked the various removal procedures. It has been interesting. G.M.
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Old 11-09-2013, 08:53 PM   #18
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

I wish non-ethanol gas were only $.20 higher. In central Fl we are paying 4.95 a gallon vs 3.10 for "corn gas"!
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Old 11-09-2013, 08:57 PM   #19
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

So what are you guys going to do with the water/ethanol mix? Dump it on the ground? Further contaminate the soil and groundwater?

You guy are making mountains out of molehills regarding ethanol. Sure, it may not be the best of fuels, but for the near future you will have it and you should deal with it by fixing your cars so it won't hurt them. This means new gaskets in the carb, new hoses and changing any other rubber parts that are subject to the fuel.

If a new tank is required because you used a liner material that the ethanol eats it, its time for a new tank.
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Old 11-09-2013, 09:23 PM   #20
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

Just today I saw station in south Ga that had a banner that said " non ethanol gas pump #15
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Old 11-09-2013, 09:30 PM   #21
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

Has anyone tried the new Gibbs brand Carb Defender yet - it is an additive to counter ethanol . It seems pricey at $10 per 8oz bottle - though 1 bottle is supposed to treat 10 gal
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Old 11-09-2013, 09:43 PM   #22
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

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Originally Posted by 1963turnerjohn View Post
Has anyone tried the new Gibbs brand Carb Defender yet - it is an additive to counter ethanol . It seems pricey at $10 per 8oz bottle - though 1 bottle is supposed to treat 10 gal
Wow. That product should be an excellent treatment to prevent that ugly swelling and stretching you see happen to otherwise good leather wallets.
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Old 11-10-2013, 12:02 AM   #23
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

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Originally Posted by rotorwrench View Post
There are a fair amount of complex hydrocarbons that go into the final batch of fuel that you buy from the pump. Some are very light distillates and some are gasses then there are the complex processes that make the naphtha more efficient in the burn. Some of these processes use catalysts in the conversion and none of the mix gets along well with water. Internal combustion engines don't run well on water contaminated fuel. If you want to take your already less than spectacular fuel and contaminate it further then be my guest but you may notice that the vehicle doesn't run as well as it should and it will likely get unstable even faster than it already does by normal absorption of moisture from natural condensation in the tank.
Don't worry about "water contaminated fuel" If this were a problem, it would begin when the fuel is shipped through a pipeline. These underground pipelines always have some water in them but it's not a big deal. The oil companies let the water settle out, then you buy this very same gas at the local station without worrying about any of the problems you mention.
However fuel containing ethanol cannot be shipped through pipelines as the ethanol will absorb any water in the pipeline and now you will have contaminated fuel.
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Old 11-10-2013, 07:24 AM   #24
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

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So what are you guys going to do with the water/ethanol mix? Dump it on the ground? Further contaminate the soil and groundwater?

You guy are making mountains out of molehills regarding ethanol. Sure, it may not be the best of fuels, but for the near future you will have it and you should deal with it by fixing your cars so it won't hurt them. This means new gaskets in the carb, new hoses and changing any other rubber parts that are subject to the fuel.

If a new tank is required because you used a liner material that the ethanol eats it, its time for a new tank.
Hear. Hear. And/or just use an ethanol treatment like Lucas or Sta-Bil. Tell the oil importers to eat their oil and we'll burn our corn. Seems like a great solution to more than one problem. I just love the thought of an Ayatolla (sp?) drinking a big stein or petroleum. Toast.
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Old 11-10-2013, 07:42 AM   #25
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

G.M.
Through the years I have worked on polluted sites hauling away dirty dirt to a asphalt
plant where like you said it was rum through the Blast furnace Then we took it to a landfill to use for cover.

The real shame is that & it happen in several cases.the site becommes clean the moment the $$$$ drys up.

One job in particular I left with my load the area reeked of raw gas. Two Hr. round trip, got back and although the smell was still there the site was given a clean bill of health.And with that they sent us home with only a part day's work.

So to solve the problem they built low income houses on top of it, GO FIGURE!!!!!!!
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Old 11-10-2013, 09:56 AM   #26
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Boy, sounds like a can of worms! I don't know about other states but here in N.Y. State, ( land of taxes and regulations ) I've gone to my local Marinas to purchase non ethanol, Nope, NYS has now forced the Marinas to pump only ethanol gas. Tried local Airports, no success! However went to local "Speed store in Riverhead, N.Y. and they sell a 5 gal can for slightly over $60.00 a can. About $12.00 per gal. I know, I know, but how many miles do you drive your "baby" a year. Oh, yes I did try many service stations within a 50 mile radius of my home. No dice!!
"THEY" just want to line their pockets and take us off of the roads! OMO!

Rich O.
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Old 11-10-2013, 10:23 AM   #27
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

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Originally Posted by 1963turnerjohn View Post
Has anyone tried the new Gibbs brand Carb Defender yet - it is an additive to counter ethanol . It seems pricey at $10 per 8oz bottle - though 1 bottle is supposed to treat 10 gal
This adds $1.50 per gallon to a tank of gas. G.M.
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Old 11-10-2013, 10:35 AM   #28
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

Quote:
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Boy, sounds like a can of worms! I don't know about other states but here in N.Y. State, ( land of taxes and regulations ) I've gone to my local Marinas to purchase non ethanol, Nope, NYS has now forced the Marinas to pump only ethanol gas. Tried local Airports, no success! However went to local "Speed store in Riverhead, N.Y. and they sell a 5 gal can for slightly over $60.00 a can. About $12.00 per gal. I know, I know, but how many miles do you drive your "baby" a year. Oh, yes I did try many service stations within a 50 mile radius of my home. No dice!!
"THEY" just want to line their pockets and take us off of the roads! OMO!

Rich O.
Rich I just Googled non ethanol gas NY and found 150 stations in NY that sell it. G.M.
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Old 11-10-2013, 10:39 AM   #29
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

Sounds like killing a mouse with a sledgehammer.

Is anyone prepared to do this experiment with 15 or more gallons for a tankful?

Last edited by Mike51Merc; 11-10-2013 at 11:00 AM.
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Old 12-16-2013, 11:04 PM   #30
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

Here is a list of non-oxygenated gas stations...

http://pure-gas.org/index.jsp

Need some lead additive?

www.OctaneSupreme.com
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Old 12-17-2013, 08:25 AM   #31
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

I had problems with the gas in my boat filter. The ethanol was mixing with water in the gas and settling at the bottom of the fuel filter like a melted wax consistency and sounding the alarms causing me to change 15.00 fuel filters periodically. It cause Hell in the boating world. JMO.
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Old 12-17-2013, 08:59 AM   #32
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

Quote:
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Around here you dump leftover fuels and whatever on mesquite trees. They are a bigger problem than polluting the soil.
Mesquite Trees are a nuisance for you folks down in the southwest because you're trying to inhabit land that can't really support it, but they aren't polluting the soil.

Dumping an ethanol (and whatever) mixture on the ground is straight up polluting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by paul2748 View Post
...You guy are making mountains out of molehills regarding ethanol. Sure, it may not be the best of fuels, but for the near future you will have it and you should deal with it by fixing your cars so it won't hurt them. This means new gaskets in the carb, new hoses and changing any other rubber parts that are subject to the fuel.

If a new tank is required because you used a liner material that the ethanol eats it, its time for a new tank.
Bingo.

Ethanol is not the Anti-Christ. Update the materials in your fuel system accordingly, tweak your engine's carb and ignition settings, and live a happy life.

Sure, it may burn a negligible amount of additional fuel, but given the number of miles the average Ford Barner drives his/her car, that's really a moot point. You'll wind up saving money by not having to deal with the outrageously expensive additives, aviation or "racing" fuels, or hokey ethanol removal practices.
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Old 12-17-2013, 01:15 PM   #33
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

If it hasn't already been said, check this website. you may find an alcohol-free station near you http://pure-gas.org/
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Old 12-17-2013, 02:54 PM   #34
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

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Originally Posted by 40 Deluxe View Post
Don't worry about "water contaminated fuel" If this were a problem, it would begin when the fuel is shipped through a pipeline. These underground pipelines always have some water in them but it's not a big deal. The oil companies let the water settle out, then you buy this very same gas at the local station without worrying about any of the problems you mention.
However fuel containing ethanol cannot be shipped through pipelines as the ethanol will absorb any water in the pipeline and now you will have contaminated fuel.
They ship the fuel thru the pipeline and then add the ethanol at the terminal.
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Old 12-17-2013, 05:09 PM   #35
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1963turnerjohn>>>$10 per 8oz bottle - though 1 bottle is supposed to treat 10 gal >>>

GM>>>This adds $1.50 per gallon to a tank of gas.>>>

GM

I think you showed remarkable restraint in explaining yourself to Bill. However, I'm afraid all those pent-up emotions seem to have affected your arithmetic prowess. So, don't hold back. tell us how you really feel. 8^)

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Old 12-17-2013, 08:11 PM   #36
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

I seem to remember a politician saying "If you like your gas you can keep your gas - ."
or maybe that was my wife......
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Old 12-17-2013, 10:21 PM   #37
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If it hasn't already been said, check this website. you may find an alcohol-free station near you http://pure-gas.org/
I just check mine here in WV. Just my luck all of them a long ways off
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Old 12-17-2013, 10:40 PM   #38
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Ooops


Wrong reply
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Old 12-18-2013, 09:03 AM   #39
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If it hasn't already been said, check this website. you may find an alcohol-free station near you http://pure-gas.org/
Quote:
Originally Posted by TDO View Post
I just check mine here in WV. Just my luck all of them a long ways off
That website is not all-inclusive. It's wholly dependent upon regular folks adding/updating station information.

For example nearly every, if not all, stations in Iowa will have pumps serving non-ethanol 87. There are a LOT of stations that don't show up on the website.
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Old 12-18-2013, 12:14 PM   #40
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I think I will try it...then I can throw the gas away and have some mighty fine sipping Hooch left behind. no LOL here !!!!!!!!!!!!!
So, would that be called etho-jack? Sounds similar to how we used to let cider freeze in a keg with the cork or plug down, then ciphon off what remained liquid - aka APPLEJACK - some might potent sippin' stuff indeed. Don't think I'd want to try it with gasoline though. . .
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Old 12-18-2013, 01:14 PM   #41
FlatheadTed
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Default Re: Make your ethanol-free gas!

Why don't we go Hydrogen /water to run our cars , I have done some experimenting might post something up .
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