1929 Pickup interior

[alexiskai]

Here's a Hemmings article about a purportedly unrestored '29 mail truck that includes a shot of the interior with uncovered doors.
https://www.hemmings.com/stories/202...r-leaving-town

[Bill Cilker]

Here is what the MARC / MAFCA Restoration Guidelines show for the interior of a 1928 to mid 1930 A Pickup.

[LeonardS]

Originally Posted by Bill Cilker

Here is what the MARC / MAFCA Restoration Guidelines show for the interior of a 1928 to mid 1930 A Pickup.

It looks like EOG’s interior and my interior may be correct, based on this information.

[31Tudor]

Originally Posted by LeonardS

How about posting a photo of a correct interior? Do you have any?

That would be extremely helpful to this post. I know Lebaron Bonney kits had slightly padded door panels. It would be great to see one as it is supposed to be. Brent, I would think you would have done a CC pickup?

[31Tudor]

Originally Posted by LeonardS

It looks like EOG’s interior and my interior may be correct, based on this information.

Except the standards say the door panels would be carboard. You can see there is some padding in the panels, covered by material.

[31Tudor]

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Originally Posted by alexiskai

Here's a Hemmings article about a purportedly unrestored '29 mail truck that includes a shot of the interior with uncovered doors.
https://www.hemmings.com/stories/202...r-leaving-town

I find it hard to believe that this unrestored truck would have had pleated seats?

[Keith True]

As a mail truck it would have nothing in common with the body of a pickup.Also,as a mail truck I would guess it's had a dozen different seats over the years.The local mail carriers here get about 10 months out of a seat cover.Plus the bolsters break down,and a couple of the side coils always seem to be broken.That truck was kept running as needed,not restored.It's going to have lots of replaced parts on it.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by Eccentric Old Guy

Point taken, Brent......but, at this point, do we know for sure that our photos are of incorrect interiors? I can't answer that question, and the OP should take whatever help we can offer, under advisement...

eog

Yes, I can definitely tell you for sure that the interiors with pictures above are incorrect.

Originally Posted by LeonardS

How about posting a photo of a correct interior? Do you have any?

Yes I do, and I will reach out to the OP.

[Ryan]

Hey fellas... Lets not argue. If there is a copyright problem, the owner of said copyright can contact me.

[31Tudor]

Yes I do, and I will reach out to the OP.[/QUOTE]

Brent,
If you would want to PM me with the pictures as well, that would be awesome! I am refurbishing a 28 CC pickup and I would love to see how the original type cardboards look vs. my old L&B kit.

Thanks

[Neil Wilson]

Some photos of original upholstery panels are shown at https://aafords.com/cabs/82-a-closed...cab-details/#u.


The cardboard panels are not available today (as far as I know). The kit vendors simulate the panels by covering plain cardboard with seat material.

[rotorwrench]

Ford used a lot of embossed paper based materials is the more utilitarian applications of the products they made. Some folks just label it as card board but that would only be similar in nature. The embossed material used is similar to some forms of chip board or panel board to make it more resistant to moisture and it also had some color to it which would suggest that it was treated with resins and colorants during the manufacture of it.

According to "The Ford Model A, As Henry Built It" Spanish brown colonial grain panel board was used in the 1928 Commercials. In January of 1929 the color was changed to black Arabian grain panel board with brown only remaining in the Panel Delivery type models. In 1930 & 31 a change was made to black cobra cross grain panel board. They may have sewn on fabric borders to the edges as indicated in the photos from the link but the edge looks to be only around a quarter inch of overlap if that material is in fact original. My old walking foot machine can easily sew through most types of panel board.

The use in basic open cabs was limited to the door, cowl, and quarter areas. In 1928/29 closed cabs it is listed as door, cowl, quarter, windshield header, and lock pillar. In 1930/31 the roof side rail covering is added. There is only mention of roof covering in the larger panel delivery models and it's listed as masonite along with the covering for the rear door or doors. The book also mentions a cardboard covering that was reinforced with galvanized steel mesh and was referred to as steel craft but its use seems to be confined to the Deluxe Delivery model, according to the book, which resembles the Tudor Sedan. This stuff may have also been used in other panel delivery type models for rear quarter coverings but I don't know that with any certainty. Masonite may have also been used. A person would have to research stuff like this further at the Henry Ford to have any certainty. Ford Commercial vehicles were pretty spartan in nature due to their use as utility vehicles. They only made a few fancy models such as the Town Car Delivery and a person had to pay a lot more for them.

I'm all for folks fixing there vehicles up the way they want them but fine point judging generally catches any non-authentic items.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by rotorwrench

Ford used a lot of embossed paper based materials is the more utilitarian applications of the products they made. Some folks just label it as card board but that would only be similar in nature. The embossed material used is similar to some forms of chip board or panel board to make it more resistant to moisture and it also had some color to it which would suggest that it was treated with resins and colorants during the manufacture of it.

According to "The Ford Model A, As Henry Built It" Spanish brown colonial grain panel board was used in the 1928 Commercials. In January of 1929 the color was changed to black Arabian grain panel board with brown only remaining in the Panel Delivery type models. In 1930 & 31 a change was made to black cobra cross grain panel board.



I'm all for folks fixing there vehicles up the way they want them but fine point judging generally catches any non-authentic items.

While I have not verified that in that particular book, it does counter what the RG&JS and the prints show. If someone chose to go with that combination as the book suggests, they likely would receive a huge deduction in Area 12 adjudication.


As far as the material used. I have not found that Masonite was used on the 82A cabs. I have some samples of the original material. It is definitely a layered group of thicker-type Black paper sheets with a color sheet printed for the exterior ...and all the sheets glued together. It was then embossed (-possible when initially glued together(??).

I have been experimenting using regular water-resistant panel board, wetting the outside layers and then embossing using a leather press with dies used to make wallets. I have also used the same dies to emboss it dry. It seems to be working well holding its shape with either however I have not tried to manufacture the dies with small grained embossing that would be necessary for the kick panels. I have attached 3 photos showing my experiment results.

FWIW, I would likely never make the financial investment in a die to do the doors on a closed-cab pick-up as the expense for the kick panels alone will be huge. My plan is to draw the reverse image of the grain in CAD, and then use a CNC Router to carve the grain pattern into a billet of 6061 alloy. Then build a mechanical press to emboss the material and leave it under pressure while it dries. Again, attached below is a few pix of what I have embossed into scrap cardboard panel board. This has just been an experiment to see what is possible and noting the smaller graining in the horse's mane. The next three pix show an original kick panel with a portion of the top layer torn away revealing the black paper, and then the next two clearly showing the pattern.

.

.

[Incognito-A]

Originally Posted by Bill Cilker

Here is what the MARC / MAFCA Restoration Guidelines show for the interior of a 1928 to mid 1930 A Pickup.

It is a shame that people here are so cavalier about posting information from the JS & RG.

It truly takes away from the volunteer efforts of so many dedicated people.

Maybe that is why people like Marco stay away from this site. You all lose in the end when those with the “real” knowledge and skill leave.

Moderator, just ban me if you think this is sooooo inflammatory.

[Incognito-A]

Originally Posted by Ryan

Hey fellas... Lets not argue. If there is a copyright problem, the owner of said copyright can contact me.

And you know that is not going to happen but maybe it should!

Brent certainly does it the right way, by quoting or putting the information in his own words and crediting the source! Of course this takes more time and effort than snapping a picture.

Good for you Brent!!!

[Ryan]

Originally Posted by Incognito-A

And you know that is not going to happen but maybe it should!

Brent certainly does it the right way, by quoting or putting the information in his own words and crediting the source! Of course this takes more time and effort than snapping a picture.

Good for you Brent!!!

You are welcomed to your opinion. However, typically in the media business it's perfectly legal and acceptable to source information so long as the source is listed and contributed.

Honest question - what's the point of arguing over this? I feel like I must be missing something. And if I am, I'm 100% open to hearing about it... not at all interested in arguing like a politician on twitter though...

Gonna send an email to MAFCA right now and see what they think... To me, it should be their call...

[Eccentric Old Guy]

Originally Posted by Ryan

You are welcomed to your opinion. However, typically in the media business it's perfectly legal and acceptable to source information so long as the source is listed and contributed.

Honest question - what's the point of arguing over this? I feel like I must be missing something. And if I am, I'm 100% open to hearing about it... not at all interested in arguing like a politician on twitter though...

Gonna send an email to MAFCA right now and see what they think... To me, it should be their call...

Let us know what the MAFCA says about it......

Isn't this forum pretty much the same as a bunch of guys discussing model A's at a club meeting?

It's hard for me to say, but once the content of published works is committed to memory, then it can be discussed openly elsewhere.....but, when it's quoted, then the source should be accredited..?

eog

[Incognito-A]

Originally Posted by Ryan

You are welcomed to your opinion. However, typically in the media business it's perfectly legal and acceptable to source information so long as the source is listed and contributed.

Honest question - what's the point of arguing over this? I feel like I must be missing something. And if I am, I'm 100% open to hearing about it... not at all interested in arguing like a politician on twitter though...

Gonna send an email to MAFCA right now and see what they think... To me, it should be their call...

For me it’s not really a legal issue as a moral one. If you WANT the information go out and buy the damn book yourself.

It’s akin to pirating music or photocopying liturature and passing it out for free. Someone spent the time and effort to produce the work and it likely wasn’t YOU.

It takes away from the effort of others and takes income away from MARC/MAFCA!

[Ryan]

Originally Posted by Eccentric Old Guy

Let us know what the MAFCA says about it......

Isn't this forum pretty much the same as a bunch of guys discussing model A's at a club meeting?

It's hard for me to say, but once the content of published works is committed to memory, then it can be discussed openly elsewhere.....but, when it's quoted, then the source should be accredited..?

eog

That's why I feel like I must be missing something... A couple of guys have gotten so up in arms about it that it seems irrational... But what do I know? I've never been involved in judging points, etc...

Regardless, I've sent them an email... I think that's probably a better way to handle it than to argue...

[Incognito-A]

If both MARC and MAFCA don’t care then I will stand down despite my own opinions.