1932 Fender, Running Board and Frame Horn Cover Sequence?

[glennpm]

Hi,

Just wondering if anyone has recommendations on the best sequence for mounting the fenders, running boards and frame horn covers? This is for a 32 roadster with original fenders and body.

Glenn

[DavidG]

Assuming that your gas tank in already in place, you should attach the rear spare tire carrier or luggage rack brackets along with the tail lamp bracket(s) and rumble step pad bracket with the rear frame horn covers, but only loosely. Then the rear fenders (again loosely) followed by the running boards loosely and those followed by the front fenders.

You'll find that the alignment with holes in the chassis frame most critical at the front fenders. Accordingly, it is important to attach everything on both sides of the car and fit the head lamp bar to the front fenders and front fender support brackets. Once the head lamp bar fasteners are in place, start to tighten the bolts that attach the front fender support brackets to the sides of the chassis frame. Do that progressively so as to center the head lamp bar. (Do not be alarmed if you have a V8 and the emblem on the head lamp bar does not line up exactly with the center bar of your grill as they were off center to the left when facing the grill by about an 1/8" when new.)

Once all of the other fasteners are loosely in place for every attachment point front to rear, I've found that the running boards offer the least wiggle room so I start tightening the fasteners there followed by gradually tightening (progressively) the fasteners for the front fenders. Lastly, progressively tighten the rear fender fasteners starting at the top of the fender and alternating down from the top, front and rear. The inside edge of the front of the rear fenders should be up against the side of the chassis frame rail as a result of the rear fenders being attached to the running boards, but don't tighten those four fasteners (two each side) until all of the other rear fender bolts are tightened. Last, but not least, tighten the fasteners that attach the frame horn covers (etc.) to the chassis frame and then the fasteners between the rear frame horn covers and the rear fenders.

[glennpm]

Fantastic instructions David and very much appreciated!! This post gets saved in my reference folder.

Glenn

[DavidG]

Glenn,

To be fair and forewarned, listing the steps is a heck of a lot easier than actually doing it. Even if nothing has been replaced of that which you removed, it's a process that requires a lot of patience (and perseverance). If anything has been replaced, such as one or more of the fenders, you may well end up gnashing your teeth from time to time even if the replacements are NOS. You may find that a rat tail file is your best friend.

[glennpm]

Hi David,

I know well what you're saying. I just went through the reassembly of my 40 last Summer. It was the third time I had refurbished it and the last the most extensive. I mumbled at "Ford" for some of the very difficult connections and assembly sequences, wondering how I had done some of the same so much easier when I was younger!

Thanks again for your help!

Glenn

[rbullockv8]

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My bruises are almost gone from mounting my front fenders, headlight bar, spare tire mounts on my 32 pickup. They are a challenge.

[glennpm]

Hi Rich!

Yes, when I put my 40 doors back together, I did the stainless strips last. thinking I had done it that way before. Well this time I had bruised and cut forearms for a few weeks after I managed to get the threaded stud end clips on!

Glenn

[DavidG]

Rich,

Yes, the side mounts add a whole new and nasty complexity to the project.

[glennpm]

Hi David and all,

I have the "rear" parts loosely mounted now. The right side with an optional tail light and rumble step bracket was a challenge.

I'm about to mount the running boards now and am wondering whether welting is used at the connection to the fenders? Is there any other webbing used to mount the running boards. I couldn't find mention of these details in chapter 7 of "The 1932 Ford Book".

Thanks,

[glennpm]

Another question:

Are the three bolts that bolt up the rear apron to the bottom of the rear fender 5/16" diameter? It is looking like 1/4" would be easier due to hole misalignment.

Glenn

Answer my own question on the bolts, 1/4" slots in my excellent original fenders.

[DavidG]

Originally, there was no welting or any other insulating material between the running boards and the frame. The vulcanized rubber on the boards extends inward to the inner edge of the board and serves as an insulator.

[Karl Wescott]

As usual, Davids advise is 100% correct for a 100% correct car.

If you are using reproduction front fender brackets though they usually do not have the correct shape. If there is an issue with the front fenders try fitting the fenders and headlight bar without the brackets, if you can get everything to align then bend the brackets to fit.

If using reproduction running boards do not be afraid to open up the mount holes slightly to give room for adjustment.

The rear fenders/frame horn covers often drift off a little at the back, while sacrificing authenticity a trick is to drill an extra hole in the frame for a piece of all thread double nutted both to the frame and to the middle bolt hole on the rear apron. By adjusting the inner and outer nuts you can control and firm up the rear fender fit.

[glennpm]

Thank you David and Karl!

My fit at the rear aprons to fenders is very good on the right side. On the left side the bottom hole is a little off. It wants to over lap the fender bead by a little bit. I'm pretty sure I can get it pulled in with the bolts. The all thread rod is a good trick. I also appreciate the front fender fitting suggestions. I have original fenders all around and also original front fender brackets.

What I'm dealing with at the moment is too large a gap between the front lower edges of the rear fenders where they bolt to the frame. The original fenders and body match well but the gap between the inside edge of the fenders is too large.

I have reproduction running boards made by the V8 shop which I bought from you Karl decades ago. I did a trial fit to the frame and brackets and drilled and slotted the holes as required years ago. The front fender and rear fender mount holes haven't been drilled yet into the running board flanges. I think I can get the right side pretty good but the left side I'm worrying about. The fender bolts other than rear apron and these holes are all in loosely tightened. It is today's project. Any suggestions there will be very welcome! I've even thought about putting a hydraulic jack in between the inside of the lower frame at this point to give it a twist outward, last resort though. Just not sure I can get the outside step in the boards over the flange of the fenders.

[DavidG]

I've used several pairs of V8 Shop boards with excellent results, but they do require a certain amount of modification in all instances. I've had to enlarge some of the holes where they attach to the frame consistent with Karl's experience, but none of them were missing holes. I would probe with an awl on the ends of the boards as the holes may already be there in the steel and are covered over by the vulcanized rubber.

Judging from your photo, you will need to trim the rubber on the back of your left side board (and perhaps the right one as well) down to the edge of the steel to get a good fit with the lip on the lower front edge of the rear fender. You can cover the exposed steel edge that will result from your trimming with liquid black rubber that comes in a tube from your local hardware store to prevent it from rusting.

It is highly unlikely that your rear fender fit is the result of deformation of your frame. (I am assuming that your frame is original as I have no experience with reproduction frames.) My experience is that the gap that you are experiencing looks worse than it is in fact. With all of the fender to body bolts thoroughly loose try attaching the fender to the frame with longer bolts than you would otherwise use (and flat washers to avoid deforming the lip on the fender where it attaches to the frame) and carefully draw the fender into the frame. I have yet to enlarge a hole in an original fender where it is attached to the body in order to draw that part of a rear fender flush with the frame and I hope that will be your experience. Once that lip on the rear fenders is flush with the frame you can go back and replace the long bolts with those of the normal length (one at a time).

Good luck!

[glennpm]

Hi David,

I just got back from the hardware store where I bought some 1" OD flat washers and both 1 1/4 and 1 1/2" long 5/16" bolts thinking along the lines of your suggestions. I made some rubber washers yesterday out of an old inner tube.I'll probe with an awl for the flange holes.

Regarding the rubber trimming, just in the lip as I've noted in the picture below?

Thank you very much for your help.

[DavidG]

No, not the lip as that falls outside of the ledge on the fender, but rather inboard of there over the entire edge. Actually, if your objective isn't 100% originality you may not have to trim them on the edge at all. On original boards, the bottom of the lip on the board does not rest on the ledge of the rear fender. If you can't find the holes under the rubber remember that your objective is to align the horizontal bead on the outside of the boards with the end of the bead on the rear fenders. It may turn out that the excess rubber on the lower rear edge of the boards ends up resting on the ledge of the fender, which while not 100% original may look better.

[glennpm]

Okay a few more pics. I have it pulled in as far as it will go. The fender is sticking out about 7/16" now.

The running board bead to frame is flush front to back with a bolt to the frame on front and back ends of the board. The outside fender hole is out too far to get a bolt and nut in as you can see in one of my pictures below, DSCN6011. I will probably have to either slot or drill a new hole in the fender flange to make it work. Looks like this is as good as I can get it.

I'm going to keep the rubber edge and not trim other than a small bit as in my post #15 above. I have a clamp holding the fender flange to the running board. Hole drilling is next I guess.

Glenn

[Karl Wescott]

An issue that crops up from time to time is if the front area of the wheelwell had been repaired an excess of body filler may cause the fender to not move in far enough.

I would also check the frame width and for square just to rule out a frame issue.

[DavidG]

It would seem that what Karl suggests as a root cause is likely (lack of clearance in the wheel house due to repairs). A less likely cause could be repairs to the fender that have changed the contour of it where it inserts into wheel house at the front. Should you do another one, we've found that fitting all the fenders to the body and frame prior to painting avoids a lot of final assembly setbacks.

[glennpm]

There is no excess filler in the wheelhouse but it could be that the lower portion of the body assembly is too wide at this point due to the major work done with the floor etc.

I did check the frame for squareness and the various width dimensions from the drawings that has been available for a long time. The inside edges of the fender now makes good contact with the frame but bows out a bit in the elbow area.

I had mounted the fenders and the running boards early on during reconstruction but not the two together which I should have.

I'm trying a combination of pulling the fender into the running board hole from the V8 Shop and prying the assembly to make up to the frame to board holes. Doesn't look now that it is going to be an improvement so looks like I may be stuck with the fender sticking out a bit. I'd rather have this than move the running board out away from the frame which would also affect the front fender fit up.

Thanks to both of you for your help.

[mike in tucson]

We read stories of post war hot rodders driving their 32 roadsters to the dry lakes, removing the fenders/running boards, racing, then putting the fenders/running boards back on to drive home......their cars must have looked pretty sloppy after a quickie fender install????

[Bubsyouruncle]

DavidG
Are you immortal?
Hope so, otherwise what will we do without you?
I am dealing with an original 5-window, with all original fenders and runningboards and frame and all the rest. Including some bolts, nuts and washers.

BTW, an associate of mine, many years ago, told me that the only real difference between and a Ford and a Merc was that Merc used washers.

[materguru]

Originally Posted by DavidG

It would seem that what Karl suggests as a root cause is likely (lack of clearance in the wheel house due to repairs). A less likely cause could be repairs to the fender that have changed the contour of it where it inserts into wheel house at the front. Should you do another one, we've found that fitting all the fenders to the body and frame prior to painting avoids a lot of final assembly setbacks.

Mr Dave
what hardware is used to mount the running boards braces. I know or think its frame to body hardware but the hardware for holes rear of the pan is missing. what actually goes in each hole for the brace to body.. thanks for your time

Don

[DavidG]

The outer upper bolt for each running board bracket, which also doubles as a body-to-frame attachment was originally a 3/8-24 x 1 3/8" carriage head bolt (S7-cadmium plated). The inner upper bolt for each bracket was originally a 5/16-24 x 1 3/8" carriage bolt (also S7 finish). The two hex head bolts at the bottom of each bracket that attach to the running board were originally 5/16-24 x 1" (S2-black oxide finish). This information is on pages A-12-18 and A-12-20 of "The 1932 Ford Book".

Depending on whether the car is very early or not and therefore where the bracket for the clamp between the muffler and tailpipe is attached to the rear running board bracket on the right side (at the top - very early, all others at the bottom), the 5/16-24 x 1" inner hex head bolt may prove to be too short and a ! 1/8" long bolt may be required instead.