Water pump

[John cruzin 40]

Hi i would like some info on 40 flathead's water pump Such as were to get new ones? Also are there ones with a inproved impella for better coolling or is it bs? Thanks John

[40fordpu]

http://www.vanpeltsales.com/FH_web/F...mps1937-46.jpg

try macs auto parts for pumps or bob drake. Joblot is a great place too...I dont know a lot about the improved impellers but someone will.

[John cruzin 40]

thanks glad to hear about job lot not far from me . i deal with them a lot thanks for the quick responce and info John

[Terry,OH]

the impellers are helix creating more area without increasing the outter diameter. They move more water and should improve cooling. If you have a overheating problem due to another cause, this may cover up the problem or lessen it but may not correct it. Suggest you get rid of the problem first and then change the pumps. These new pumps have improved seals. some still use the original style bushing for the shaft and some are all new castings with ball bearing shafts. It's your choice.

[billwill]

Originally Posted by John cruzin 40

Hi i would like some info on 40 flathead's water pump Such as were to get new ones? Also are there ones with a inproved impella for better coolling or is it bs? Thanks John

From what i have read all about money they can be bought though any vender at vering prices goodluk.

[41ford1]

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John,
You have a '40. Does it have the original crankshaft mounted fan? Is there a fan shroud? I have installed improved impeller design rebuilt pumps on my pickup. With them I did see a 15° to 20° reduction in engine temp. The temp still rises toward hot when stopped or moving under 15 MPH, typical traffic situation. So far the temp rise is not as bad with the stock pumps. You have plenty of options for replacing water pumps. PM me if you want more info on my application.
Chuck L.

[Bassman/NZ]

Do a search, this has been beaten to death in the last couple of weeks. Much info available. Personally, I've just installed a pair of Drake pumps, and water blasted the water passages, but I have yet to run it. The Drake pumps are the cheapest out there, and seem like excellent quality.

[41ford1]

Bassman,
Beaten to death more than once, hasn't it? Two factors of engine cooling: Water flow through the system and air flow through the radiator. So with a '40 what is the real problem? Lack of air flow from the crank mounted fan when going slow or stopped or water flow though the block. You got to love trying to figure out 70 year technology. It's fun isn't it?
BTW Was a shroud factory installed on '39-'40 cars or '39-'41 pickups? I haven't seen one yet.
Chuck L.

[40fordpu]

There is no way Drake is the cheapest out there. I havent seen them beat one price from my group of other suppliers. Shop around. Ask questions. Quality wise is up for negotiation. You can also get water pumps rebuild. Buy a crap pair out there and have them rebuilt. If you want I can give you the name of a great rebuilder. Just private message me.

[Bassman/NZ]

Originally Posted by 40fordpu

There is no way Drake is the cheapest out there. I havent seen them beat one price from my group of other suppliers. Shop around. Ask questions. Quality wise is up for negotiation. You can also get water pumps rebuild. Buy a crap pair out there and have them rebuilt. If you want I can give you the name of a great rebuilder. Just private message me.

Mebbe I'm wrong. My Drake pumps were $130 pair. Speedway are $180pr and dont have improved impellers. Most others I've seen around $180pr.

[Chuck Kuntz]

The Pumps my friend and I purchased from Drake are junk. The castings are not correct and when he called them about the following problems they refused to take them back as it was over 30 days from date of purchase (five pairs of pumps):
1. pump casting mounting holes do not align with the originals in the block
2. pump casting requires grinding due to interference with camshaft cover
3. water necks on pumps are tapered and hoses blew off. originals were constant diameter with no taper. As you tighten the hose clamps the hose will push off.

This is very poor service from Bob Drake. I thought he was making an effort to improve his image.

[19Fordy]

Originally Posted by 41ford1

Bassman,
Beaten to death more than once, hasn't it? Two factors of engine cooling: Water flow through the system and air flow through the radiator. So with a '40 what is the real problem? Lack of air flow from the crank mounted fan when going slow or stopped or water flow though the block. You got to love trying to figure out 70 year technology. It's fun isn't it?
BTW Was a shroud factory installed on '39-'40 cars or '39-'41 pickups? I haven't seen one yet.
Chuck L.

A factory fan shroud was not installed on OEM 39-40 Ford cars. All they had was the sheet metal panels on the interior right and left sides of the grille to funnel the air into the engine compartment. Walker radiator does make a shroud for their 40 radiators- as in the photos..

[Bassman/NZ]

Originally Posted by Chuck Kuntz

The Pumps my friend and I purchased from Drake are junk. The castings are not correct and when he called them about the following problems they refused to take them back as it was over 30 days from date of purchase (five pairs of pumps):
1. pump casting mounting holes do not align with the originals in the block
2. pump casting requires grinding due to interference with camshaft cover
3. water necks on pumps are tapered and hoses blew off. originals were constant diameter with no taper. As you tighten the hose clamps the hose will push off.

This is very poor service from Bob Drake. I thought he was making an effort to improve his image.

Wow! I'm surprised..... I just fitted mine and they are perfect. None of those problems you had.

[flatjack9]

I also put a shroud on my 39 DeLuxe and it really works great.

[allford]

I bought two rebuild kits from mac and tore my pumps apart and rebuilt them myself. Wasn't hard at all to do, you get a new shaft,impellor,spring seal, impellor, pin (to hold pulley on shaft) and thrust washer. Each kit was about $20.00 each. The only thing is the new shaft is a little smaller in dia. and the pulley will not stay on the shaft,and must pin the pulley to the shaft. This requres drilling a hole into the pullley outer hub and drive in the pin that is in the kit.

[41ford1]

19fordy,
You have a good looking setup. What are you running? 8BA with early heads? Mine is a 59A-B with the 40 crankshaft mounted fan. That configuration positions the fan lower on the radiator. It looks like I may be able to use the Walker shroud inverted on my setup. Thanks for posting your pictures.
Chuck L.

[Chuck Kuntz]

I suspect that they knew they had these problems with the first run and modified the molds to correct them. I can correct the hole and oversize casting problems, but the tapered waternecks will require machine shop service that will cost more than the pumps are worth.

[37fatfender]

19fordy,
I too, would like to know more about your engine setup. Are those the "truck pumps" that are used to put an 8ba in a 40? and the lower radiator hoses what are tjey? where / what is the fan mount you are using? I am going through this engine swap soon so I am planning in advance. thx, Ed

[G.M.]

41 I have never seen a shroud from Ford for a 39 or 40 passenger car. The P/U had them as an option and larger trucks had them. For a shroud to work at it's best it must be a little larger in diameter than the fan, cone shaped to fit the entire radiator down to the fan diameter and the fan blade slightly entered in to the shroud. More coolant in the radiator, more water movement through the radiator and more air across the fins and tubes is the answer to perfect cooling at all speeds. The picture below is my 39 P/U with a modified shroud from a larger truck installed upside down with small metal strips on each side to attach to the radiator side supports and cut out at the bottom and the metal edge rolled back for the distributor. This engine has rebuilt modified pumps that pump 110 gallons each in 5 minutes compared to stock and other pumps that pump 65 to 75 gallons. The 4 lb pressure cap allows the coolant to be filled up into the neck without any lose giving more coolant flowing. Also has a modified 6 bladed industrial fan. This engine has been demonstrated at a National Ford V/8 meet on a day that was over 95 degrees run at a fast idle for over 2 hours and never got to 180 with a laser thermometer and the dash gauge. If the engine RPMs were slightly increased the temperature came down a few degrees. All of the above improvements give maximum results but anyone of these improvements result in lower running temperatures. The only thing that is going to greatly improve idle temperatures is more air. Don't forget these engines were run all day on air compressors and other equipment but they had better pump impellers on the early engines, larger radiators, a shroud and larger fans with more blades. G.M. Picture would not upload will try to add it latter.