The Ford Barn

FrankWest · 07-23-2014, 10:59 AM

spinning 4cyl motor without starter?How

Richard in NC · 07-23-2014, 11:03 AM

Handcrank??? Pull car down road in gear ??? Jack up back wheel and belt to a steam engine ???

Patrick L. · 07-23-2014, 11:35 AM

The generator may spin a tired engine after the sparklers are removed.

Brian T · 07-23-2014, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrankWest

spinning 4cyl motor without starter?How

It would help if you told us what you are trying to do and why, engine seized ? or what.

tbirdtbird · 07-23-2014, 01:46 PM

"The generator may spin a tired engine after the sparklers are removed." and overheat and burn out in the process since it was not wound for this kind of load

FrankWest · 07-23-2014, 02:13 PM

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The car was stored for 20 years and I am trying to get it started. I was told that the motor turns with the jand crank. I will have a hand crank next week so I will wait.

johnbuckley · 07-23-2014, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrankWest

The car was stored for 20 years and I am trying to get it started. I was told that the motor turns with the jand crank. I will have a hand crank next week so I will wait.

Try hand cranking over it with the spark plugs removed first of all before you try winding it under compression

tbirdtbird · 07-23-2014, 02:22 PM

not clear
so the starter will not turn it over? If the starter won't the hand crank prolly won't either
if that is the case better get a few oz of MMO down the plug holes and let it soak in

FrankWest · 07-23-2014, 02:39 PM

I didn't want to use the starter until I see that the engine is not seized

Bob/Kansas City · 07-23-2014, 04:11 PM

It would be best to start pouring some oil down the cylinders as tbirdtbird said otherwise when you do turn it over after sitting for 20 years you will run the risk of scoring those dry cylinder walls or worse.
My roadster sat for almost 30 years without being started and I oiled it with ATF and MMO and let it sit for a week then cranked it just a little and reoiled and let it sit again. Finally after repeating this for a couple of weeks I could turn the engine freely.
After more oiling and cranking I finally began to feel some compression as the valves loosened up.
Go slow and be gentle to avoid damage.
Once it will turn over with the starter it would be best to drop the oil pan and take the valve cover off and clean out the inevitable sludge that has accumulated over the years so that it doesn't clog oil passages once it is started.

FrankWest · 07-23-2014, 04:20 PM

Great idea! But how did you turn the engine slightly? Did you use the crank starter through the grill hole??

Bob/Kansas City · 07-23-2014, 04:25 PM

Yup. With the crank. Just bring the crank handle up a little at a time after oiling and sitting just so you begin to slowly get everything freed up.

Purdy Swoft · 07-23-2014, 04:35 PM

Truth be known, the generator wouldn't turn the engine even if the pistons and valves were removed. I could hold back a generator with two fingers. Generators will motor and will burn up if held back long enough and the battery is strong enough but are very weak. I would pour oil down the hole where the distributor fits in the head and in the spark plug holes and let it sit for a while. I would try the starter while the spark plugs were out. A 12 volt jump start with the negative cable connected to the starter terminal and the positive cable grounded to a head nut would be my first choice. The starter is very strong and will pull the car like a golf cart in high gear. If you push the starter pedal and nothing happens, either the cable connections are not good or the engine would be stuck. I've cranked engines that had sit for 40 years with the starter with no problem.

Charlie Stephens · 07-23-2014, 04:40 PM

Dumb question but have you checked under the seat for a crank?

Charlie Stephens

Tom Wesenberg · 07-23-2014, 08:10 PM

Loosen the 4 spark plugs one turn, then blow away all the loose dirt, so it doesn't drop into the cylinders. Pour in lots of oil or use a spray can of fogging oil. I like to use a syphon sprayer to blow an oil mist into the cylinders.

Purdy Swoft · 07-23-2014, 10:29 PM

By removing the distributor and pouring oil through the hole in the head where the distributor was removed will send oil to the main bearings and cam. Pour in at least a quart or more , you can drain and change the oil later, right now, it is important to get some oil to the dry mains and cam. The distributor will only go back in one way because of the offset slot in the distributor shaft and you can't get it out of time unless you loosen and move the points cam. Good luck, it may not be all that difficult to get it turning. Twelve volts wont harm the starter, it will just give it more power. I have run unmodified model A starters on 12 volts for years. This will only be for a short time, anyway. I did this to unstick a stuck engine in a AA truck thjat I have.

07-23-2014, 10:59 AM	#1
FrankWest Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 3,005	spinning 4cyl motor without starter? spinning 4cyl motor without starter?How

07-23-2014, 11:03 AM	#2
Richard in NC Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 89	Re: spinning 4cyl motor without starter? Handcrank??? Pull car down road in gear ??? Jack up back wheel and belt to a steam engine ???

07-23-2014, 11:35 AM	#3
Patrick L. Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Largo Florida Posts: 7,225	Re: spinning 4cyl motor without starter? The generator may spin a tired engine after the sparklers are removed.

07-23-2014, 01:46 PM	#5
tbirdtbird BANNED Join Date: May 2012 Location: inside your RAM Posts: 3,134	Re: spinning 4cyl motor without starter? "The generator may spin a tired engine after the sparklers are removed." and overheat and burn out in the process since it was not wound for this kind of load __________________ '31 180A

07-23-2014, 02:13 PM	#6
FrankWest Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 3,005	Re: spinning 4cyl motor without starter? Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) The car was stored for 20 years and I am trying to get it started. I was told that the motor turns with the jand crank. I will have a hand crank next week so I will wait.

07-23-2014, 02:22 PM	#8
tbirdtbird BANNED Join Date: May 2012 Location: inside your RAM Posts: 3,134	Re: spinning 4cyl motor without starter? not clear so the starter will not turn it over? If the starter won't the hand crank prolly won't either if that is the case better get a few oz of MMO down the plug holes and let it soak in __________________ '31 180A

07-23-2014, 02:39 PM	#9
FrankWest Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 3,005	Re: spinning 4cyl motor without starter? I didn't want to use the starter until I see that the engine is not seized

07-23-2014, 04:11 PM	#10
Bob/Kansas City Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Lees Summit, MO Posts: 340	Re: spinning 4cyl motor without starter? It would be best to start pouring some oil down the cylinders as tbirdtbird said otherwise when you do turn it over after sitting for 20 years you will run the risk of scoring those dry cylinder walls or worse. My roadster sat for almost 30 years without being started and I oiled it with ATF and MMO and let it sit for a week then cranked it just a little and reoiled and let it sit again. Finally after repeating this for a couple of weeks I could turn the engine freely. After more oiling and cranking I finally began to feel some compression as the valves loosened up. Go slow and be gentle to avoid damage. Once it will turn over with the starter it would be best to drop the oil pan and take the valve cover off and clean out the inevitable sludge that has accumulated over the years so that it doesn't clog oil passages once it is started.

07-23-2014, 04:20 PM	#11
FrankWest Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 3,005	Re: spinning 4cyl motor without starter? Great idea! But how did you turn the engine slightly? Did you use the crank starter through the grill hole??

07-23-2014, 04:25 PM	#12
Bob/Kansas City Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Lees Summit, MO Posts: 340	Re: spinning 4cyl motor without starter? Yup. With the crank. Just bring the crank handle up a little at a time after oiling and sitting just so you begin to slowly get everything freed up.

07-23-2014, 04:35 PM	#13
Purdy Swoft Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Alabama Posts: 8,099	Re: spinning 4cyl motor without starter? Truth be known, the generator wouldn't turn the engine even if the pistons and valves were removed. I could hold back a generator with two fingers. Generators will motor and will burn up if held back long enough and the battery is strong enough but are very weak. I would pour oil down the hole where the distributor fits in the head and in the spark plug holes and let it sit for a while. I would try the starter while the spark plugs were out. A 12 volt jump start with the negative cable connected to the starter terminal and the positive cable grounded to a head nut would be my first choice. The starter is very strong and will pull the car like a golf cart in high gear. If you push the starter pedal and nothing happens, either the cable connections are not good or the engine would be stuck. I've cranked engines that had sit for 40 years with the starter with no problem.

07-23-2014, 04:40 PM	#14
Charlie Stephens Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Southern California Posts: 7,033	Re: spinning 4cyl motor without starter? Dumb question but have you checked under the seat for a crank? Charlie Stephens

07-23-2014, 08:10 PM	#15
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: spinning 4cyl motor without starter? Loosen the 4 spark plugs one turn, then blow away all the loose dirt, so it doesn't drop into the cylinders. Pour in lots of oil or use a spray can of fogging oil. I like to use a syphon sprayer to blow an oil mist into the cylinders.

07-23-2014, 10:29 PM	#16
Purdy Swoft Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Alabama Posts: 8,099	Re: spinning 4cyl motor without starter? By removing the distributor and pouring oil through the hole in the head where the distributor was removed will send oil to the main bearings and cam. Pour in at least a quart or more , you can drain and change the oil later, right now, it is important to get some oil to the dry mains and cam. The distributor will only go back in one way because of the offset slot in the distributor shaft and you can't get it out of time unless you loosen and move the points cam. Good luck, it may not be all that difficult to get it turning. Twelve volts wont harm the starter, it will just give it more power. I have run unmodified model A starters on 12 volts for years. This will only be for a short time, anyway. I did this to unstick a stuck engine in a AA truck thjat I have.