Banjo question

[oj]

I'm rebuilding a late 40's open drive rear and I have a question about the pinion bearings. Shouldn't there be a crush sleeve or something between the bearings in that double bearing race? When I tighten to 25ish inch lbs its; just like tightening a front wheel bearing and something don't feel right at all about it.
Am I doing something wrong?
Thanks, OJ

[Andy]

Are you reusing the bearings? I did not go that tight with my used bearings. There is no crush sleeve. The cone bearings are tight on the shaft.

[rotorwrench]

They kept it simple and just used the pre-load to set up the opposing tapered bearings same as wheel bearings do. They double nut the retainer so it won't back off. It worked good enough for Granddad. The 1949 Ford vehicles with Ford & Dana designs made the change to shimming for bearing pre-load.

[Angledrive]

Nope, no crush sleeve. Install the bearings and race on the gear. Put the gear in a vise, actually hold the race and tighten the nut to 15 inch pounds. It will change when you tighten the jamb nut. It will take a few tries so be patient. Sometimes after installing in banjo housing pre-load will change so check it before installing ring gear.

[Mart]

Make sure you are using the right terminology. You tighten the nut until the torque to turn the pinion is the correct number of inch pounds to turn. The hard thing then is to effectively fit the lock washer and second nut, tighten them really tight against each other and end up with the correct pinion torque to turn value.

I'd like to say 15 lbs inch for the pinion torque to turn value but I'm not sure. it depends on whether the bearings are new or used. it should be done with the bearing housing in the casing (I think). Please check the value.

I did an axle recently but can't remember the number I was shooting for. I do know it was difficult to get a torque wrench that read so low.

The only other hint I can give is to make sure you use two big spanners (wrenches) to tighten the nuts together. One needs to be a thin one. Only by doing that was I able to get the nuts gudentight.

Mart.

[Ken/Alabama]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

I always use Timken bearings. The original bearings that were used had a "P" stamped on the one that went against the pinion. The outer one should be a slip fit and not a press fit "like the outer nut on front wheel bearings " .New bearings don't come that way anymore so I always polish the ID of the outer bearing and the shaft till it will slip on. I then stand the banjo assembly in the vise and clamp the pinion . With both hands spin the banjo housing ,Hard . Tighten it till it will make only one round then lock it down.

[37 Cab]

I have never done a banjo but have done a ton of modern ford differentials. With new bearings Ford recommends 30 in lbs. turning drag and 15 with used bearings. I use a dial type in. lb. to get an accurate reading so I can watch the needle as the pinion turns.

[philipswanson]

Originally Posted by Ken/Alabama

I always use Timken bearings.

You know Timken moved to China several years back.

[tubman]

Originally Posted by philipswanson

You know Timken moved to China several years back.

Anybody blaming the Chinese for our current troubles should look into the details of how and why this happened. It's quite enlightening.

[Brian]

I do it the same as Ken, with the pinion held vertically up in the vice, spin the banjo as hard and fast as you can with both hands. It should only spin between 1/2 to one whole revolution.

[jrvariel48]

I bought a tool from someone a long time ago which I still have for banjo's. Here's the instructions that were sent with it.

Joe, The axle housing bearing race remover works by hooking it under the race and placing a metal bar with a hole in the center across the bell end of the housing. Run the threaded rod thru the hole and thread into the flat end of the tool. tighten the threaded rod and it will draw the race out very nicely with no damage. I did not include the metal bar because it is heavy and any scrap will do. The tool for setting the pinion backlash goes on the end of the pinion shaft. attach your beam type inch pound torque wrench on the other end of tool and you can read the preload. I set new bearings at 20 to 25 inch pounds and used bearings at around 17. If you have it this far apart, use new ones. The three pinion races welded together is used to press the pinion assembly into the housing without any damage. Ford recommended that you heat the housing. I warm it up a little bit with a propane torch but I don’t know if it is really needed. The thin wrench is used to hold the inner pinion shaft bolt while you tighten the outer one. The races with enlarged holes can be used to drive the new races in. The smaller one can be used when setting the pinion preload. Sometimes the bearing can be pressed on too far and bind up the bearings. If you use his one, you can get it set up where you want and then remove it and install the new one. This will probably not be needed if you use a Ford pinion gear. Some of the aftermarket ones have a tighter press fit for the bearing and it is easy to tighten the nut to tight and it will give you too much preload and it will be hard to back it off. I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any more questions. Ford rears are not hard to do, just a little different than newer rears. K D tools makes a great inch pound beam type torque wrench. If you can’t find one, I can give you a part number. Don’t try to use a click type because it takes more torque to make it click than you are measuring. You will also need a spring scale to measure the preload on the differential bearings.

[Talkwrench]

Did the same a as Ken too, one turn, but a good firm spin not hard as you can.. been driving years in it now..

[oj]

Thanks guys, I guess I'm there. I checked inch pounds with a snap-on torque meter that has a dial.
Now I got to make a skinny wrench for the inner nut, I bought the set from ebay to remove the pinion where you get two wrenches and a plate to pull the race but they don't work on my jam nuts.
I'm doing the 'dry assembly' today to see if I have all the right stuff etc.
Thanks again, Oj

[Flathead Fever]

There is a Manzel pinion preload tester on eBay. Its very similar to the Kr Wilson one. It actually looks like it might even be made better. You could take a driveshaft coupler and weld a 1/4"-drive socket to it and use a regular inch pound torque wrench and it would do the same thing.


https://www.ebay.com/itm/Antique-Man...53.m1438.l2649