The Radiator Blues - Let's Pray

[53MERC]

OK Folks, I got my original 53 Monterey radiator out. I'm taking it in on Monday to see if the radiator shop can repair it. Hopefully he doesn't slam the door on me. LOL. I'm not sure why the fan would have beaten the heck out of it?
What do you think? Does it look like a goner?
Has anyone had one repaired that looks this bad?

Has anyone added a fan shroud to a 52 or 53 model?

Fingers crossed.

Here's the only new radiator that I have been able to find for my car. It's $714.
Shhhhhh, don't tell the wife.

http://www.usradiator.com/mercury-1939-1956-car-1952-53-v8-flathead-radiator.html

[RKS.PA]

See where the fan penetrated the core, but otherwise think a good shop shouldn't have too much of a problem bringing it back. My '39 was in worse shape than yours, and it came back looking like new. However, it depends on the shop you have access to. I was lucky and hope you will be, too.

[joe 1950]

do yourself a favor and don’t even bother with the radiator shop ,that core is rotted away and in rough shape ,if your not into original looks ,get the new aluminum one ,for the price you can’t go wrong

[FortyNiner]

Might want to check the motor mounts.

[JayChicago]

Originally Posted by 53MERC

Has anyone added a fan shroud to a 52 or 53 model?

Re your question about a fan shroud: Looking at your picture we can see that the fan has been pulling through the vast majority of the radiator. I think any improvement in air flow from a shroud would be negligible.

For any shroud to function as intended the fan needs to be at the outlet opening, fan blades half in/half out of the shroud. If the fan is left at its location close to the radiator, a shroud is doing nothing. Unless there is a shroud available with only about 1-1/2 inches of depth, you would need to relocate the fan back away from the radiator to the shroud's outlet. I don't know how that could be done.

[53MERC]

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Originally Posted by FortyNiner

Might want to check the motor mounts.

Thanks for the reply. I will mention that to my mechanic next week.

I am no mechanic. Are new motor mounts a costly repair?

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by JayChicago

Re your question about a fan shroud: For any shroud to function as intended the fan needs to be at the outlet opening, fan blades half in/half out of the shroud. If the fan is left at its location close to the radiator, a shroud is doing nothing. Unless there is a shroud available with only about 1-1/2 inches of depth, you would need to relocate the fan back away from the radiator to the shroud's outlet. I don't know how that could be done.

Thanks for the reply Jay. I may just drive it the way it was built without a shroud. I'm only going to be doing local driving around town.

[drolston]

Many shops will tell advise that you need a new core. That will be $700+. If the fan chopped into the tubes, that may be your only solution for an original look. If it just bent over the fins, you can straighten them yourself to open the air flow. With nothing more than a metal fingernail file and a few hours you can straighten up the fins. If the leaks are tiny, Barr's Leaks will probably do the job. If the tubes are not too badly crudded up internally, you are back in business.

And, figure out why the fan hit the radiator in the first place.

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by RKS.PA

See where the fan penetrated the core, but otherwise think a good shop shouldn't have too much of a problem bringing it back. My '39 was in worse shape than yours, and it came back looking like new. However, it depends on the shop you have access to. I was lucky and hope you will be, too.

That's what worries me. We only have one radiator shop around here. It's an older man, and his shop has been around forever. I remember bringing a radiator to him once from a 72 Olds Cutlass that was in way better shape, and he said it couldn't be fixed.

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by joe 1950

do yourself a favor and don’t even bother with the radiator shop ,that core is rotted away and in rough shape ,if your not into original looks ,get the new aluminum one ,for the price you can’t go wrong

Thanks Joe. I've only found one place so far that carries a radiator for my car.
It sounds like that may be my only option. It is $714 but looks like the original.

Here it is:

http://www.usradiator.com/mercury-1939-1956-car-1952-53-v8-flathead-radiator.html

[RKS.PA]

Guess it boils down to your budget and how "original" you want it to be. Lots of aftermarket alternatives that work well.

Since you have it out, might be worth a trip to the "old guy" for an opinion?

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by RKS.PA

Guess it boils down to your budget and how "original" you want it to be. Lots of aftermarket alternatives that work well.

Since you have it out, might be worth a trip to the "old guy" for an opinion?

Oh yeah, I'm going to stop by to see him for sure.
The new one I found from US Radiator will take a month to receive. Covid has them backed up right now.

[53MERC]

Thank you for the input.

[RalphG]

Its a long time ago but I seem to recall the motor mounts being worn out on this 52 Merc and allowing the fan to contact the radiator. I could be wrong though.
A real old time handy radiator guy did some major repairs on a rad for my 64 Chevy II. He got salvage yard parts from a newer vehicle and basically cut a core to fit my tanks. It bolted right in. looks original and works great.
On my 52 the main seam on the tank blew out when I overheated it. My own fault as I had the radiator covered for a winter drive and let it get too hot. I have not taken it to a radiator shop yet but am using the 53 radiator on the 52 for now. Good luck with yours.
http://https://youtu.be/KO6QzVe_xGY

[RalphG]

Originally Posted by 53MERC

What do you think? Does it look like a goner?
Has anyone had one repaired that looks this bad?

On further inspection of your picture I can see solder repairs on the tank seam just the same as where mine blew out on the 52. I tried a little soldering on mine but gave it up as I was never much good with solder and would not trust my work on even a low pressure system like this one. Sometimes the expensive option is the cheapest one in the long run.

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by RalphG

On further inspection of your picture I can see solder repairs on the tank seam just the same as where mine blew out on the 52. I tried a little soldering on mine but gave it up as I was never much good with solder and would not trust my work on even a low pressure system like this one. Sometimes the expensive option is the cheapest one in the long run.

Thanks Ralph. I have a feeling a brand new radiator is in my future.

Next will be a gas tank. Are you able to measure that gas tank that you have sitting in your 53' parts car?
Remember the gas tank on Ebay? Heres the measurements that he states in his ad:
Tank measures 31 1/2" x 23" x 8"

I'm wondering if those measurements match the tank you have before I consider ordering one.

Thanks for your help,
Doug

[Mike Mayer]

Check your motor mounts I had that same think happen to me in 1962

[RalphG]

Originally Posted by 53MERC

Next will be a gas tank. Are you able to measure that gas tank that you have sitting in your 53' parts car?

Doug

I'll check and measure this 53 tank later today.

[Ford Freak]

Does anyone make an aluminum one for your car ? If so , how much ?

[FlatheadTed]

Sound like you have been using it as is ,pretty beat up ! as a tampery measure lay it face down and fill it with washing soda for 2/3 days then water blast it through the top, straighten the fins as the others have said ,you can get a model A plastic Shroud that might fit ,within a 1" of the fan will do or you could cut it , Or you could make one .

[RalphG]

Originally Posted by 53MERC

Next will be a gas tank. Are you able to measure that gas tank that you have sitting in your 53' parts car?
Remember the gas tank on Ebay? Heres the measurements that he states in his ad:
Tank measures 31 1/2" x 23" x 8"

I'm wondering if those measurements match the tank you have before I consider ordering one.

Thanks for your help,
Doug

I'd say its a match. I measured this one, took a few pictures. The top of the tank is pretty near rust free but I see a couple of holes in the bottom. As well as the huge dent from the fork lift.

[53MERC]

Ralph,
Thanks so much for doing that for me. It makes me feel a lot better ordering one off of Ebay now.
-Doug-

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by Ford Freak

Does anyone make an aluminum one for your car ? If so , how much ?

I believe an aluminum one is $865.

http://www.usradiator.com/mercury-19...diator.html#HE

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by FlatheadTed

Sound like you have been using it as is ,pretty beat up ! as a tampery measure lay it face down and fill it with washing soda for 2/3 days then water blast it through the top, straighten the fins as the others have said ,you can get a model A plastic Shroud that might fit ,within a 1" of the fan will do or you could cut it , Or you could make one .

Actually, I just bought the car two weeks ago. I have never driven it yet. I bought it and had it towed right to a repair shop because the carb was leaking at the upper gasket. I have ordered a carb rebuild kit. The mechanic took me for a quick drive to show me how smooth the car runds and drives.
He loved it so much that he wanted to buy it from me. LOL.

I saw the radiator leaking when we got back from the drive, so I know that needs to be repaired or replaced.
The gas tank has loose rust in it because I see it sitting in the glass bowl filter.
Slowly but surely I wil get it back on the road again.

[FlatheadTed]

Good Nice car ,a lot of Radiator shops don't like messing with old Radiators ,a good one is best for the Flathead ,

[Merc Cruzer]

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Originally Posted by 53MERC

OK Folks, I got my original 53 Monterey radiator out. I'm taking it in on Monday to see if the radiator shop can repair it. Hopefully he doesn't slam the door on me. LOL. I'm not sure why the fan would have beaten the heck out of it?
What do you think? Does it look like a goner?
Has anyone had one repaired that looks this bad?

Has anyone added a fan shroud to a 52 or 53 model?

Fingers crossed.

Here's the only new radiator that I have been able to find for my car. It's $714.
Shhhhhh, don't tell the wife.

http://www.usradiator.com/mercury-1939-1956-car-1952-53-v8-flathead-radiator.html

Take the radiator out of the car. Since we are all locked up anyway, what you need is a good radiator comb. You could have that looking like new in a day.

[Ford Freak]

Originally Posted by 53MERC

I believe an aluminum one is $865.

http://www.usradiator.com/mercury-19...diator.html#HE

Yikes !! I guess that option is out .

[Merc Cruzer]

Time to start finding salvage yards in your area that have old cars. It can be a fun day just walking through the cars seeing what is left that you can use. It will also give you a chance to see parts of the car that you would never otherwise see.

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by Ford Freak

Yikes !! I guess that option is out .

LOL. Yeah, I thought that was the price for a GOLD one!

[tubman]

I'm wondering how much difference there can be between a $285 aluminum radiator for a "shoebox" Ford and an $865 unit for your Mercury? I know I would at least look into it.

[53MERC]

I think thats the way it will end up in the long run. I bought the car cheap enough and knew I would have to do some repairs. I thought the radiator, gas tank, and floor pans would be interchangeable with Fords, but no such luck.

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by Merc Cruzer

Time to start finding salvage yards in your area that have old cars. It can be a fun day just walking through the cars seeing what is left that you can use. It will also give you a chance to see parts of the car that you would never otherwise see.

Wow! Thats a fun looking salvage yard. Is that by you?

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by tubman

I'm wondering how much difference there can be between a $285 aluminum radiator for a "shoebox" Ford and an $865 unit for your Mercury? I know I would at least look into it.

Dumb question.....
Would I send mine in and have someone build me an aluminum one, or are you saying there may be one out there that would bolt right up?
I'm not finding anyone on line that sells one for my car except US Radiator for $713.
Anyone you could recommend for a cheaper option?

Maybe someone with a 53' Merc that has replaced their radiator can chime in?

[Merc Cruzer]

Originally Posted by 53MERC

Wow! Thats a fun looking salvage yard. Is that by you?

They (2) are about 50 miles north of here. But have to believe there are ones around you too.

[tubman]

Here's one for $209.95 and free shipping. It has dimensions so you can measure yours and see if it's close.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1948-1949-1...&hash=item2cb3

[1931 flamingo]

I would try calling...........ShoeBox Ford.........they might be able to help with interchangeability.
Paul in CT

[Merc Cruzer]

Originally Posted by tubman

Here's one for $209.95 and free shipping. It has dimensions so you can measure yours and see if it's close.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1948-1949-1...&hash=item2cb3

Factory .....................................Alum
Core width - 20" ....................... 20 7/8"
Overall width - 24" ......................24 3/4
Overall height - 26".......................28 1/2"
Top hose - 1 1/4" ..........................1 1/4"
Bottom hose - 1 3/4".....................1 3/4"



Factory 53' Merc radiator

[Cecil/WV]

Originally Posted by Merc Cruzer

Time to start finding salvage yards in your area that have old cars. It can be a fun day just walking through the cars seeing what is left that you can use. It will also give you a chance to see parts of the car that you would never otherwise see.

I bet that yard would have a pillar mounted dome light switch for my '48 Ford, but, alas, it is too far for me to drive out and see!

[RalphG]

Originally Posted by 53MERC

I think thats the way it will end up in the long run. I bought the car cheap enough and knew I would have to do some repairs. I thought the radiator, gas tank, and floor pans would be interchangeable with Fords, but no such luck.

According to this EMS Automotive video much of the floor panel patches are the same between Ford and Mercury for 52-54.
https://youtu.be/kWW0EkvgRQQ

[Merc Cruzer]

Originally Posted by Cecil/WV

I bet that yard would have a pillar mounted dome light switch for my '48 Ford, but, alas, it is too far for me to drive out and see!

It has been awhile since I have been up there:

HWY 34 Auto & Truck Sales Inc
8405 U.S. Hwy34
Windsor, CO 80550

Cell: 970-590-5478 ask for Charles
Phone 970-686-9391 ask for Charles
Fax 970 686-1202
[email protected] attention Charles

[Graeme / New Zealand]

Originally Posted by Merc Cruzer

They (2) are about 50 miles north of here. But have to believe there are ones around you too.

.

I'm drooling at all those 46/48s' especially the clubbies.

GB

[Graeme / New Zealand]

Originally Posted by Cecil/WV

I bet that yard would have a pillar mounted dome light switch for my '48 Ford, but, alas, it is too far for me to drive out and see!

Aren't those switches a bugger to find? Old originals tend to crumble too. I made one for may car by getting the sliding type from C&G and cutting it down so it would operate in the stock housing then by sheer luck one came up on Trade Me which is like E-Bay over here. I grabbed it for a song.....rare as rocking horse sh#t here. Hope you can find one.

GB

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by tubman

Here's one for $209.95 and free shipping. It has dimensions so you can measure yours and see if it's close.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1948-1949-1...&hash=item2cb3

Thanks for looking but that one measures the following according to his ad.
Overall Height: 28 1/2
Overall Width: 25
Core Height: 21 1/2

Pictured are the dimensions of my radiator.

[Ross F-1]

Originally Posted by Merc Cruzer

It has been awhile since I have been up there:

HWY 34 Auto & Truck Sales Inc
8405 U.S. Hwy34
Windsor, CO 80550

I haven't been to Martin's in probably 15 yrs, but it was like being in a candy store! I have heard the county was after them on some environmental or OSHA issue and they aren't what they used to be, would be interested to see.

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by RalphG

According to this EMS Automotive video much of the floor panel patches are the same between Ford and Mercury for 52-54.
https://youtu.be/kWW0EkvgRQQ

Ralph,
Thanks again! I was told by one of the Ford parts vendors that the front floor pans weren't the same on the Ford and Mercury.
EMS shows they ARE the same. Looking at their :
1952-54 Ford
P/N: 317
FRONT FLOOR
thats exactly what I need.
Once again, thanks for helping me get another part off of my checklist.
BTW- I'm going to be ordering that Ebay gas tank tomorrow.

[tubman]

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Originally Posted by 53MERC

Thanks for looking but that one measures the following according to his ad.
Overall Height: 28 1/2
Overall Width: 25
Core Height: 21 1/2

Pictured are the dimensions of my radiator.

I a pinch, I bet I could make that fit; the dimensions look really close. The main problem that I see is that the 'Shoebox" radiator has the mounting flange on the fan side, while the Mercury seems to have it on the grill side. Spacers are easy (and even fun) to make.

It wouldn't be "Concours Correct", but if I had that car, I'd want to get it on the road as soon as possible and worry about the rest later.

But that's just me.

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by tubman

I a pinch, I bet I could make that fit; the dimensions look really close. The main problem that I see is that the 'Shoebox" radiator has the mounting flange on the fan side, while the Mercury seems to have it on the grill side. Spacers are easy (and even fun) to make.

It wouldn't be "Concours Correct", but if I had that car, I'd want to get it on the road as soon as possible and worry about the rest later.

But that's just me.

Good catch! Thanks for the replies. I do appreciate it. Cars this old are new to me. I'm used to 60's and 70's cars that there are an abundance of parts for.
I bought and sold a 1958 Pontiac Star Chief last year. I bought it because I loved the style, and later found out parts were tough to find. That was an $11,000 purchase. This 53' was only $3000 and runds great, so I have a bit of wiggle room for buying parts before the wife says, "get back outside in your doghouse, and don't ever buy another old car!"
LOL.

[tubman]

"53MERC" - Just an off topic question. Is the "Star Chief" the model of the '58 Pontiac that had the lozenge-shaped insert in the scallop on the rear quarter? The Chieftains had nothing (as well as another lower model that I dn't remember), and the Bonnevilles had that "Rocket Nozzle" thing. I liked the lozenge better. What model is your Pontiac?

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by tubman

"53MERC" - Just an off topic question. Is the "Star Chief" the model of the '58 Pontiac that had the lozenge-shaped insert in the scallop on the rear quarter? The Chieftains had nothing (as well as another lower model that I dn't remember), and the Bonnevilles had that "Rocket Nozzle" thing. I liked the lozenge better. What model is your Pontiac?

Here's a picture of the 58' Pontiac Star Chief I owned.
Also, a picture of the 1967 Pontiac Firebird 400 I owned in California back in the late 80's. It resurfaced on Craigslist last year here in NC only 20 miles from my house!!!

[tubman]

That's the one! If I had my "druthers", I'd rather have a Star Chief 2 DR HDTP than a Bonneville any day.

I had a friend with a '68 Firebird with a 326 and a POWERGLIDE! Two weeks later, it had a Turbo-350!

[53MERC]

Ya gotta love the old cars. So much style. Some of the dashes on the 50's and 60's cars were so cool looking.

[corvette8n]

here are the instructions for 53 Ford motor mounts, see if they look like your Merc. When I jacked up the motor in my '50 Ford, I put a 2x4 under the oil pan and used a screw jack to hold the motor up while I took the bolt off the motor mounts so I could replace the water pumps.

https://static.speedwaymotors.com/pdf/910-18025.pdf

I think you can slide the old mounts out once unbolted.

[Merc Cruzer]

Originally Posted by tubman

I a pinch, I bet I could make that fit; the dimensions look really close. The main problem that I see is that the 'Shoebox" radiator has the mounting flange on the fan side, while the Mercury seems to have it on the grill side. Spacers are easy (and even fun) to make.

It wouldn't be "Concours Correct", but if I had that car, I'd want to get it on the road as soon as possible and worry about the rest later.

But that's just me.

You might make a call, or send a note, to the Shoebox radiator guy to inquire, if he might be able to make one up with the flanges on the fan side?

[53MERC]

"here are the instructions for 53 Ford motor mounts, see if they look like your Merc. When I jacked up the motor in my '50 Ford, I put a 2x4 under the oil pan and used a screw jack to hold the motor up while I took the bolt off the motor mounts so I could replace the water pumps.

https://static.speedwaymotors.com/pdf/910-18025.pdf

I think you can slide the old mounts out once unbolted."


Thank you for that link. Very much appreciated.

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by Merc Cruzer

You might make a call, or send a note, to the Shoebox radiator guy to inquire, if he might be able to make one up with the flanges on the fan side?

Sounds like a good idea. I dropped my radiator off today at the repair shop. He didn't laugh or throw me out, so that was good. I'm hoping for good news, but after looking through the receipts I got with the car from the previous owner, I see he had it repaired in the past.
I will call Shoebox tomorrow to see what they say. Anything is better than spending $750 for a new one.

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by Merc Cruzer

You might make a call, or send a note, to the Shoebox radiator guy to inquire, if he might be able to make one up with the flanges on the fan side?

Originally Posted by 1931 flamingo

I would try calling...........ShoeBox Ford.........they might be able to help with interchangeability.
Paul in CT

Thank you Paul. I will give Shoebox a call tomorrow.

[53MERC]

So the latest...........
My original radiator is at a local radiator shop. Not sure if it can be fixed yet or not?

Thanks to those that recommend that I call Shoebox. They DO carry one for my 53 Merc. It runs $699 and is an exact fit. They are booked out 6 weeks for one right now. They currently have another customer having the exact one built right now.

Thanks to member "KiWinUS" . He found one on Ebay advertised as "1949-1953 FORD CAR FLATHEAD 4 ROW HD RE-CORED COPPER RADIATOR" for $400.00.
The owner said it would fit the Merc too, but after talking with Shoebox I was told it would not.
So at this point, if my original can't be fixed I will order a new one through Shoebox and be done with it.

Some of you recommended that I have my motor mounts checked because the way my radiator had been contacted at some point by the fan blades. Thank you. I talked to my mechanic today and he will check them out once he begins work on the radiator. I may just buy new ones and have them replaced anyways. I see Kanter and Mac's carry them.
Is it recommended to replace all four at the same time or just the front two? I'm not sure how much labor is involved?
One of the parts dealers Tech dept recommended I have the fan bushings/bearings checked too.
I'm not sure why or when the fan made contact with the radiator at some point?
Again, I am no mechanic. Just a lover of classic cars, and here to learn.

I'm starting to realize now why there is a song called "Mercury Blues".
Thanks All.

[RalphG]

Originally Posted by 53MERC

So the latest...........
Is it recommended to replace all four at the same time or just the front two? I
One of the parts dealers Tech dept recommended I have the fan bushings/bearings checked too. [/COLOR][/COLOR][/U]
I'm not sure why or when the fan made contact with the radiator at some point?

I'm starting to realize now why there is a song called "Mercury Blues".
Thanks All.

The song you need to keep in your mind is "Crazy bout a Mercury". It works for me. There are only the two front motor mounts as far as I recall. Its over 50 years ago to test my memory of when my dad had the front mounts replaced on this 52. As I recall they were so loose that the motor literally rocked from side to side on acceleration and somehow that allowed the fan to contact the fins. . I don't think it is a major job to replace them.

[tubman]

There is a third mount at the rear of the transmission. Replacements are available.

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by RalphG

The song you need to keep in your mind is "Crazy bout a Mercury". It works for me. There are only the two front motor mounts as far as I recall. Its over 50 years ago to test my memory of when my dad had the front mounts replaced on this 52. As I recall they were so loose that the motor literally rocked from side to side on acceleration and somehow that allowed the fan to contact the fins. . I don't think it is a major job to replace them.

Thank you Ralph. That may be whats happening on my car too. I will get the mounts ordered.
My gas tank is supposed to arrive tomorrow. I will post the results once the shop gets to it.
Have a great week.
-Doug-

[53MERC]

Originally Posted by tubman

There is a third mount at the rear of the transmission. Replacements are available.

Yep, I saw that in Kanter's catalog.
Thanks again for all your help. This rookie needs it. LOL.

[Gene1949]

Have it re-cored
with a new 3 row big tube (5/8) replacement. Better "dwell time" (coolant flow in the tubes) and more fins per inch. AND the biggie is better airflow. Price is about the same and dimension wise [about] same thickness as a 4 row.

I started out old school (4 rows) and my radiator shop sold me on 3 row big tubes. Lot of reading out there about shedding the BTUs (airflow and coolant speed in the tubes.