The Ford Barn

petehoovie · 05-30-2023, 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deuce lover

Regarding the vented gas cap.Here is an original '40 gas cap,back side.You see the hole for the vent.There also might be a vent tube in the filler neck.

Bill OH · 05-30-2023, 02:43 PM

I have had the identical trouble with the coil mounted on the engine. Moved coil to a cool location - problem solved

BUBBAS IGNITION · 05-31-2023, 03:43 PM

Doil doil doil doil low resistance mellory coil over loads the module and causes shut down miss fire coi coil

SoCalCoupe · 05-31-2023, 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcsmith23

Thanks for all the input. I’ll try some of these suggestions this week starting with the coil. I’m pretty sure the gas cap is not vented. Not sure about the tank. I’ll have to ask dad about that. Been raining all weekend so I haven’t got it out. I’ll post when I get to the bottom of it.

Great looking car! You've come to the right place. It's not quite as bad as a needle in a haystack. You've probably heard before, it's likely either fuel or spark. Sounds like a majority are leaning towards a spark problem. Looking forward to hearing how a different coil works out.

Lanny · 05-31-2023, 11:36 PM

JC, welcome to the Ford Barn, and as TJ & Zax40 mention in their posts just above,
that those adjustable fuel pressure regulator's do NOT have a good reputation at all.

As well as Not regulating pressure very good, they also are known to have the
diaphragm spring a leak inside the regulator and they spray fuel all over heck,
out from under the dial. Ask me how I know, it happened to me, and I was
lucky to have had quick access to my fire extinguisher. Scarred crap outta me.

Get yourself a Holley fuel regulator (pic below) as they have a small weep hole
incase the diaphragm does leak, it DON'T spray fuel all over the place. And the
diaphragm in the Holley 12-804 is also replaceable, and 1-4 lb.

petehoovie · 06-01-2023, 01:26 AM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanny

Get yourself a Holley fuel regulator (pic below) as they have a small weep hole
In case the diaphragm does leak, it doesn't spray fuel all over the place. And the diaphragm in the Holley 12-804 is also replaceable, and 1-4 lb.

jcsmith23 · 06-13-2023, 12:34 PM

Sorry it’s been a while but I haven’t had time to mess with the car until yesterday. The more I read, the more I’m confused. I want to replace my coil. I have a Mallory Unilite distributor and a ballast resistor. What coil should I switch to and do I need to leave the BR or not?

34fordy · 06-13-2023, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill OH

I have had the identical trouble with the coil mounted on the engine. Moved coil to a cool location - problem solved

I have always wondered what happens in the coil or condenser when it gets hot and shuts down. Then when cool it will start again. Is there something that disconnects when hot that re-connects after cooling down?

aussie merc · 06-13-2023, 05:23 PM

question ? i see a generator ? electronics don't like gennys and mechanical regs [they micro spike and will eventually destroy them] is the unilite a genuine mallory [old type] or a msd mallory.? If you dig into the background paperwork from mallory they list 2 filters [ 1 at the coil and 1 inline at the distributor]that they say are mandatory for generators and recommended for alternators , as for which coil follow mallorys recomendation [no warranty dramas ] and recheck the wiring instalation is critical [i have run my ignition directly from the battery via a relay in an attempt to get the smoothest voltage i can AGAIN Electronics dont like spikes .

34fordy · 06-13-2023, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aussie merc

question ? i see a generator ? electronics don't like gennys and mechanical regs [they micro spike and will eventually destroy them] is the unilite a genuine mallory [old type] or a msd mallory.? If you dig into the background paperwork from mallory they list 2 filters [ 1 at the coil and 1 inline at the distributor]that they say are mandatory for generators and recommended for alternators , as for which coil follow mallorys recomendation [no warranty dramas ] and recheck the wiring instalation is critical [i have run my ignition directly from the battery via a relay in an attempt to get the smoothest voltage i can AGAIN Electronics dont like spikes .

Would you diagram that?

Flathead Fever · 06-13-2023, 05:45 PM

I offer advice not to guarantee a fix, just tests you can pefrom that are free to help keep from buying unnecessary parts.

It all depends on what "skips" means. I did this for a living and had to look at repair tickets written by other people that left out a lot of the details. I worked nights and the driver's days, so I rarely got to talk to them. "If" I could duplicate the problem. I could almost always feel if it was ignition or fuel. The two problems feel completely different.

If you step on the gas further during the problem, does it fall of its face and run out of gas unless you back off the pedal. Does it backfire through the carburetor at all when you give it more throttle. Both of those are signs it's running out of gas. Does the misfire get worse with more throttle than it's probably ignition but if the engine acts like it running out of gas and not misfiring its fuel. When the issue is happening will it idle without the misfire and then when you raise the idle the problem starts again. Once the problem starts does it gradually get worse in a short driving distance or does it stay the same the further you drive. How much fuel is in the tank when it happens. What's the temperature outside. What happens if you give it a little choke when the problem happens. Does it have the neoprene tipped needle and seats on the carb floats or all metal ones. The new neoprene ones are sticking shut after driving them for a while, at least it did on my friend's roadster. You can lightly tap on top of the carb above the needle and seat and see if the open up. Those twist fuel regulators are junk. I had one on a 1966 Mini Cooper S and after a while of driving it would shut the fuel off completely. I would get out twist the regulator and reset it and I was good again for a while. I tried a couple brand new ones and they both did it. Try resetting the regulator when the problem happens. Regardless of it is the problem or not I would get rid of it and get the pump with the correct pressure as checked with a gauge at the carbs. That fuel filter belongs before the pump, back by the tank. It is not protecting the fuel pump from getting junk into it. It's not large enough either. Those were used on Volkswagens and small engines. These old Fords usually have a lot of junk in the gas tanks and will plug those filters up in a hurry. What if that glass filter breaks in the engine compartment or the hose comes off with the electric fuel pump still pumping, the car will burn to the ground. You want the least number of things that can leak fuel near that hot engine and plug wires.

Do you think it's just one Cylinder misfiring or are they all doing it. If it misfires at idle and you have a timing mark, can you put a timing light on it to see if the timing mark is jumping around. That would be a sign of a bad coil or ignition module. How bad is this misfire, is it a little annoying or do you fear you won't make it a block. You can try jumping a wire directly to the coils external resistor (these chrome Mallory's do use them) and bypass the ignition switch. That's probably not a very old Mallory coil on there so it should be good, but you never can tell. The resistors are either good or burned out, I've never seen one have an intermittent problem. We had the same type on the Dodges at work. When they did fail the engine would start while the engine was still cranking bypassing the resistor and then die when the switch returned to the run position You could check the resistance of the coil hot when it's not having the problem and then when it is. Honestly, I hear so many problems with these aftermarket electronic ignitions on flatheads that I don't trust them. I'll just stick to points. I never saw a set of points keep my dad or me from getting where we were going and back home during the points era. You carried spare ignition parts just in case and the tools to install them on the daily drivers like the Mustangs. On the Early Fords my dad always had a spare distributer with him he could swap out, but he never had to.

I have extra electric fuel pumps and I will stick a five gallon can of fuel on the passenger floor with another fuel pump and go for a ride, If the problem goes away, I know it's in the tank, filter, pump or lines. I also have a ignition scope so I can look at the ignition to spot a bad coil or condenser, module, wires... You are at a disadvantage without a scope.

ronn · 06-14-2023, 04:32 AM

agree with all of the comments on moving the coil. bad location.

also, drive the car 30 minutes and remove the gas cap. what does the car say then?

Anteek29 · 06-14-2023, 09:42 AM

I've had the same problem on several cars over the years. Two had defective coils, another was bad condenser.

AnthonyG · 06-14-2023, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcsmith23

Sorry it’s been a while but I haven’t had time to mess with the car until yesterday. The more I read, the more I’m confused. I want to replace my coil. I have a Mallory Unilite distributor and a ballast resistor. What coil should I switch to and do I need to leave the BR or not?

Probly a good time to reiterate, as I said in my earlier reply. Don’t randomly think or act on all u’ve read in this great thread. It is easy to get confused. U must look @ the suggestions, try to make a list of all in order of simplest to do first. Go thru the list trying each & making notes like changed or not, better, same, worse. Take ur time don’t get discouraged or overwhelmed, this should eliminate the confusion! One or more of these suggestions will lead to resolve.

34fordy · 06-14-2023, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aussie merc

from past experience i would change the coil and move it from the engine to the inner guard dont know where you are higher or lower states but im guessing it could be cooking the coil had very similar problems moved the coil and all good coil was that hot you couldn't touch it

With respect: I would have thought that to be a good place for the coil in that it is in front of the engine with fresh air from the fan blowing on it. Nearly the same place as the original Ford coil. Just a bit higher.
Also, I thought Bubba indicated that the Mallory coil was not right for his system. His advice is like little "gold nuggets".

jcsmith23 · 06-14-2023, 07:32 PM

Thanks for all of the suggestions and help so far. It has finally got to where it won’t even start now. I have put a new flamethrower coil on. I’m getting plenty of fuel and fire on all cylinders. Im thinking it’s this electronic ignition. I’m about ready to snatch this distributor off and go back to the original one.

tubman · 06-14-2023, 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcsmith23

Thanks for all of the suggestions and help so far. It has finally got to where it won’t even start now. I have put a new flamethrower coil on. I’m getting plenty of fuel and fire on all cylinders. I'm thinking it’s this electronic ignition. I’m about ready to snatch this distributor off and go back to the original one.

I think this is a good idea.

"aussie merc" asked if this is a generator (it sure looks like one). I don't see an answer. As he stated "electronics don't like gennys and mechanical regs" and I agree.

Let's get back to basics.

drolston · 06-14-2023, 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcsmith23

Thanks for all of the suggestions and help so far. It has finally got to where it won’t even start now. I have put a new flamethrower coil on. I’m getting plenty of fuel and fire on all cylinders. Im thinking it’s this electronic ignition. I’m about ready to snatch this distributor off and go back to the original one.

I ran Pertronix electronic ignition on my '41 for several years with no problems, except for the darned 7mm spiral wound ignition wires that pertronix requires gave me fits, particularly is wet humid conditions. The more recent 9mm wires are probably okay, but will not go through the flathead wire looms. So I went back to a points distributor and Packard 440 solid core ignition wires (except for a one foot length of spiral wound from the coil to distributor to suppress ignition interference with the radio). Been running fine with points ever since, but with a Tubman condenser to counter the famously unreliable condensers being sold. And, I keep a spare distributor and coil in the trunk as insurance.

aussie merc · 06-17-2023, 04:43 AM

cant argue with the original dissy but if you want electronics then you must upgrade the electrics to suit and its all about a smooth constant supply and absolutely as near as perfect earths .Your cars wiring system was designed 30years before transistors and now you want to enter the space age . It can be done and is often quite successful ; Dig deep into all the installation paperwork you can find, for whatever system you choose [IE not listed with but required by mallory a 611 power cell and the inline power filter ]. Most failures can be traced to ether wear in a related component [dissy cam lobes] or incorrect install .Even something as simple as connecting an earth or power in the wrong spot can reek havoc ,read the directions 3 times/ think and then reread then if any doubts contact the manufacturer most are more than willing to help

05-30-2023, 02:43 PM	#22
Bill OH Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 426	Re: Help… engine skips after driving 30 minutes. I have had the identical trouble with the coil mounted on the engine. Moved coil to a cool location - problem solved

05-31-2023, 03:43 PM	#23
BUBBAS IGNITION Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: SPEEDWAY INDIANA Posts: 4,148	Re: Help… engine skips after driving 30 minutes. Doil doil doil doil low resistance mellory coil over loads the module and causes shut down miss fire coi coil __________________ If it Makes Spark, we do it !!!! www.bubbasignition.com [email protected]

06-13-2023, 12:34 PM	#27
jcsmith23 Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2022 Posts: 8	Re: Help… engine skips after driving 30 minutes. Sorry it’s been a while but I haven’t had time to mess with the car until yesterday. The more I read, the more I’m confused. I want to replace my coil. I have a Mallory Unilite distributor and a ballast resistor. What coil should I switch to and do I need to leave the BR or not?

06-13-2023, 05:23 PM	#29
aussie merc Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: sydney australia Posts: 1,034	Re: Help… engine skips after driving 30 minutes. question ? i see a generator ? electronics don't like gennys and mechanical regs [they micro spike and will eventually destroy them] is the unilite a genuine mallory [old type] or a msd mallory.? If you dig into the background paperwork from mallory they list 2 filters [ 1 at the coil and 1 inline at the distributor]that they say are mandatory for generators and recommended for alternators , as for which coil follow mallorys recomendation [no warranty dramas ] and recheck the wiring instalation is critical [i have run my ignition directly from the battery via a relay in an attempt to get the smoothest voltage i can AGAIN Electronics dont like spikes .

06-13-2023, 05:45 PM	#31
Flathead Fever Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Yucaipa, CA Posts: 1,095	Re: Help… engine skips after driving 30 minutes. I offer advice not to guarantee a fix, just tests you can pefrom that are free to help keep from buying unnecessary parts. It all depends on what "skips" means. I did this for a living and had to look at repair tickets written by other people that left out a lot of the details. I worked nights and the driver's days, so I rarely got to talk to them. "If" I could duplicate the problem. I could almost always feel if it was ignition or fuel. The two problems feel completely different. If you step on the gas further during the problem, does it fall of its face and run out of gas unless you back off the pedal. Does it backfire through the carburetor at all when you give it more throttle. Both of those are signs it's running out of gas. Does the misfire get worse with more throttle than it's probably ignition but if the engine acts like it running out of gas and not misfiring its fuel. When the issue is happening will it idle without the misfire and then when you raise the idle the problem starts again. Once the problem starts does it gradually get worse in a short driving distance or does it stay the same the further you drive. How much fuel is in the tank when it happens. What's the temperature outside. What happens if you give it a little choke when the problem happens. Does it have the neoprene tipped needle and seats on the carb floats or all metal ones. The new neoprene ones are sticking shut after driving them for a while, at least it did on my friend's roadster. You can lightly tap on top of the carb above the needle and seat and see if the open up. Those twist fuel regulators are junk. I had one on a 1966 Mini Cooper S and after a while of driving it would shut the fuel off completely. I would get out twist the regulator and reset it and I was good again for a while. I tried a couple brand new ones and they both did it. Try resetting the regulator when the problem happens. Regardless of it is the problem or not I would get rid of it and get the pump with the correct pressure as checked with a gauge at the carbs. That fuel filter belongs before the pump, back by the tank. It is not protecting the fuel pump from getting junk into it. It's not large enough either. Those were used on Volkswagens and small engines. These old Fords usually have a lot of junk in the gas tanks and will plug those filters up in a hurry. What if that glass filter breaks in the engine compartment or the hose comes off with the electric fuel pump still pumping, the car will burn to the ground. You want the least number of things that can leak fuel near that hot engine and plug wires. Do you think it's just one Cylinder misfiring or are they all doing it. If it misfires at idle and you have a timing mark, can you put a timing light on it to see if the timing mark is jumping around. That would be a sign of a bad coil or ignition module. How bad is this misfire, is it a little annoying or do you fear you won't make it a block. You can try jumping a wire directly to the coils external resistor (these chrome Mallory's do use them) and bypass the ignition switch. That's probably not a very old Mallory coil on there so it should be good, but you never can tell. The resistors are either good or burned out, I've never seen one have an intermittent problem. We had the same type on the Dodges at work. When they did fail the engine would start while the engine was still cranking bypassing the resistor and then die when the switch returned to the run position You could check the resistance of the coil hot when it's not having the problem and then when it is. Honestly, I hear so many problems with these aftermarket electronic ignitions on flatheads that I don't trust them. I'll just stick to points. I never saw a set of points keep my dad or me from getting where we were going and back home during the points era. You carried spare ignition parts just in case and the tools to install them on the daily drivers like the Mustangs. On the Early Fords my dad always had a spare distributer with him he could swap out, but he never had to. I have extra electric fuel pumps and I will stick a five gallon can of fuel on the passenger floor with another fuel pump and go for a ride, If the problem goes away, I know it's in the tank, filter, pump or lines. I also have a ignition scope so I can look at the ignition to spot a bad coil or condenser, module, wires... You are at a disadvantage without a scope.

06-14-2023, 04:32 AM	#32
ronn Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: NNNNNNNNJJJJJJJJJJ Posts: 6,791	Re: Help… engine skips after driving 30 minutes. agree with all of the comments on moving the coil. bad location. also, drive the car 30 minutes and remove the gas cap. what does the car say then?

06-14-2023, 09:42 AM	#33
Anteek29 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Santa Maria, CA Posts: 985	Re: Help… engine skips after driving 30 minutes. I've had the same problem on several cars over the years. Two had defective coils, another was bad condenser. __________________ Alan 1929 Special Coupe 1941 Pick-Up 1955 Victoria

06-14-2023, 07:32 PM	#36
jcsmith23 Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2022 Posts: 8	Re: Help… engine skips after driving 30 minutes. Thanks for all of the suggestions and help so far. It has finally got to where it won’t even start now. I have put a new flamethrower coil on. I’m getting plenty of fuel and fire on all cylinders. Im thinking it’s this electronic ignition. I’m about ready to snatch this distributor off and go back to the original one.

06-17-2023, 04:43 AM	#39
aussie merc Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: sydney australia Posts: 1,034	Re: Help… engine skips after driving 30 minutes. cant argue with the original dissy but if you want electronics then you must upgrade the electrics to suit and its all about a smooth constant supply and absolutely as near as perfect earths .Your cars wiring system was designed 30years before transistors and now you want to enter the space age . It can be done and is often quite successful ; Dig deep into all the installation paperwork you can find, for whatever system you choose [IE not listed with but required by mallory a 611 power cell and the inline power filter ]. Most failures can be traced to ether wear in a related component [dissy cam lobes] or incorrect install .Even something as simple as connecting an earth or power in the wrong spot can reek havoc ,read the directions 3 times/ think and then reread then if any doubts contact the manufacturer most are more than willing to help