600w oil

[stewgee]

I stopped by O'Reilly the other day and asked the guys if they had any 600 weight oil. They asked me what I had been smoking. Crazy huh?

[Ruth]

Well ya see, 600w oil isn't 600 weight. Some use SAE 140. I use SAE 250 as I believe it is closer to 600W.

You been smokin' fan belts again?

[stewgee]

Yeah Ruth being a newbie to the Mod A world I just never crossed this. Always worked with the 10w`s and so forth. Thanks for the lesson.

[redmodelt]

If you really want to mess with them ask for steam cylinder oil! LOL

[stewgee]

😁🤣🤣

[Terry, NJ]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Don't ignore homegrown variations of STP. I won't use it straight, but as a concoction with other thick gear oils. The rear end does not need 600. The transmission does! Why? you ask.
To slow the gears down quickly when shifting and to prevent leaking. The rear doest need to slow down because there is constant mesh. On your steering box, you'll note two bolts, one is a pipe threaded filler plug. The other is an adjustment for the bearings in your steering box. Do n't tighten this one too much, just snug it. No tightening it! It snugs a race up against a bearing and too tight cracks it and you'll have a click in your steering wheel as you turn it. Remove the drain plug and check the fluid. Normally, this also takes 600. However some of us have found that John Deere , Cornhead Grease works very well. It's cheap ($3-4 a tube) and it's pretty available and it doesn't leak out. So there, you have plenty to work with. Good Luck!
Terry

[Ruth]

Originally Posted by Terry, NJ

On your steering box, you'll note two bolts, one is a pipe threaded filler plug. The other is an adjustment for the bearings in your steering box. Do n't tighten this one too much, just snug it. No tightening it! It snugs a race up against a bearing and too tight cracks it and you'll have a click in your steering wheel as you turn it. Remove the drain plug and check the fluid. Normally, this also takes 600.
Terry

Drain Plug? On the steering box? I wasn't aware it had one.

[RonC]

https://www.kellerheartt.com/product...19399813070959

[PalAl]

http://penriteoil.com.au/

Very good steering gearbox oil/grease

[Kurt in NJ]

600W is steam cylinder oil,for steam engine use, also listed for use in worm drive gearboxes
Then there is the 600 series of gear oils, listed for use with spur gears, and bevel gears.
I got a pail of Shell omala 680 for my car

[springerpete]

Just yesterday I got a gallon of MOBIL 600 W. From a guy here in Maine. He bought a 5 gallon pail from the distributor for $135. $6.75/qt, pretty nice.

[Patrick L.]

600W is in the 180-240 weight range. Either 140 or 250 work just fine.

STP is not a lubricant, many use it though.

The transmission oil is also used in the rear end and steering box.

[ryanheacox]

I also think it's important for the transmission oil to be tacky and cling to the gears. I've got an old bottle of 600W from the company that eventually became Macs (Specialty Auto Products I think). Anyway, it is very dark, very thick and it STICKS to everything.



The last 600W I got from Macs a few years ago had the same label explaining what 600W was on the bottle but this stuff is just SAE140 gear oil, thick and slick but no cling whatsoever. I use it in the rear end, works well there.



I like the 600W from Brattons, it is also dark, not as tacky as the old stuff but not bad.

[WHN]

Originally Posted by Terry, NJ

Don't ignore homegrown variations of STP. I won't use it straight, but as a concoction with other thick gear oils. The rear end does not need 600. The transmission does! Why? you ask.
To slow the gears down quickly when shifting and to prevent leaking. The rear doest need to slow down because there is constant mesh. On your steering box, you'll note two bolts, one is a pipe threaded filler plug. The other is an adjustment for the bearings in your steering box. Do n't tighten this one too much, just snug it. No tightening it! It snugs a race up against a bearing and too tight cracks it and you'll have a click in your steering wheel as you turn it. Remove the drain plug and check the fluid. Normally, this also takes 600. However some of us have found that John Deere , Cornhead Grease works very well. It's cheap ($3-4 a tube) and it's pretty available and it doesn't leak out. So there, you have plenty to work with. Good Luck!
Terry

I could have written the above. We use 50/50 mix STP and 600w oil from MAC’S in transmission and rear end. Cornhead grease In steering box and u-joint.

Enjoy.

[Licensed to kill]

The "W" in oil designations is for "winter" not "Weight". I use Chevron Maropa 680 in my gear boxes, corn head grease in steering boxes.

[Patrick L.]

Originally Posted by Licensed to kill

The "W" in oil designations is for "winter" not "Weight". I use Chevron Maropa 680 in my gear boxes, corn head grease in steering boxes.

Thats kinda misleading. W stands for weight, but, the W meaning winter means that the number before the W such as a 10 means the oil flows like a 10 weight oil when cold. The number after the W such as 30 means the oil has the film strength of a 30 weight.
Its the same oil viscosity.

[Patrick L.]

Its been mentioned several times here that the 600W from some of the vendors is 140 or 250 with STP added. I don't know if its true or not.

There are other oil suppliers that sell 140 and 250. Either will work fine. I see little difference between them.

[Dick M]

I have been using a 680 oil (CHEVRON OR MOBIL) in my steering box, transmission, and differential for many years. I find it to be outstanding........

[Patrick L.]

If I remember correctly Mobil/Chevron 680 is an SAE 140 viscosity oil.

[marc hildebrant]

Best to buy the correct product from the Model A suppliers. Mine came from Berts.

I would not want to mix up something and hope that its correct when the suppliers have the correct stuff.

Marc

[stewgee]

Thanks everyone. Awesome comments. Just didn't know you could use the 600 in everything in the old A.

[stewgee]

Marc the 600w that I bought I got from Macs. I wasn't sure if I could buy it locally from a auto parts store so as not to pay shipping. Every day is a new learning experience with these old cars

[Terry, NJ]

Originally Posted by stewgee

Thanks everyone. Awesome comments. Just didn't know you could use the 600 in everything in the old A.

Or put another way, today's lubricants are higher quality and better suited to the job than anything from 1930. Steam Cylinder oil?
Terry

[Jim/GA]

Originally Posted by Patrick L.

If I remember correctly Mobil/Chevron 680 is an SAE 140 viscosity oil.

I have attached a simple chart that allows you to convert from the 680 (which is an ISO grade) to an SAE Gear Oil number. One of the things that you will notice is that an SAE 140 oil spans a very large range of oil viscosity. Anything in that range, thinner or thicker, can be labeled SAE 140. Same with 250. The ISO grades are more narrow, so you know better what you are getting.

I think when you mix 50-50 SAE 140 gear oil and STP you are creating a thicker SAE 140 that is closer to ISO 680. I'm guessing.

You can buy today from Shell, Mobil or Chevron an oil that is similar to the old 600 W Cylinder Oil (which was a Mobil trademark, by the way -- not a viscosity) in 4 different ISO grades: 375, 460, 680 and 1000.

Here is a link to the Mobil Oil site that describes it:
https://www.mobil.com/en-us/industri...-cylinder-oils

I have not yet gone to the Benson Ford archives to look up what Ford's original spec was for this oil, so I can't suggest which of the above to use.

[Jim/GA]

Originally Posted by Terry, NJ

Or put another way, today's lubricants are higher quality and better suited to the job than anything from 1930. Steam Cylinder oil?
Terry

The oil Ford used in transmission and differential was dictated by the gear tooth cut design. These are flat face spur gears (unlike modern helical or hypoid cut gears).

Flat face spur gears have direct flat metal to metal gear face pressure when under load. To lubricate them you need a thick, sticky oil so that an oil film forms to keep a pad between the two metal surfaces. Steam cylinder oil is thick and sticky.

Modern gear oils are good for modern gear cuts.

See:
https://khkgears.net/new/gear_knowle..._of_gears.html

[Patrick L.]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

https://www.mobil.com/en/lubricants/...l-shc-gear-680

[Werner]

My note about cylinder oil:

Cylinder oils are the most viscous lubricating oils that are available. Due to the very high toughness, the gear shaft brakes quickly when the clutch released.

But you have to know that these oils have no additives!

Regarding wear protection, it does not matter, since the gearbox hase only a small load.

However, it is not a good thing that there is no corrosion protection. Condensation will form in the transmission over the time.

Therefore, the cylinder oil should be mixed with additized 680 gear oil. It also makes sense to change this oil every 2 to 3 years.

I drive 1500 cylinder oil + 680 gear oil (AISE / US-Steel 224 [= Deutsch T3 CLP]) in the ratio 2: 1.

[Ak Sourdough]

I keep waiting for the guy to show up and post again, whoever he was. This subject seems to come up every few weeks and the same things are said by mostly the same people. Sometime last winter someone posted that a factory service bulletin from early 1932 changed Ford's gear box oil recommendation for all Model A's and current production cars to 140 instead of 600.


I have searched several times, but not found the post. I've been using Chevron 140 gear oil in both my Model A's for more than 10 years and am completely satisfied.

[Werner]

Ak, I don't think it's not talking about about the lubricity of the gear oils. Any thin gear oil is also suitable too.

The focus is on a very highly viscous oil so that the unsynchronized transmission can be shifted faster when the oil is very hot.

[Patrick L.]

When I was young we always had a barrel of 140 which was used in pretty much everything back then until things changed to 90.

Since we sold Studebaker and Ford I assume it was the correct oil.

Ford might have made the 1932 change in oil due to their new attempt to circumsize, errr, synchronize, the transmissions of that year.

[Jim/GA]

Originally Posted by Werner

Ak, I don't think it's not talking about about the lubricity of the gear oils. Any thin gear oil is also suitable too.

The focus is on a very highly viscous oil so that the unsynchronized transmission can be shifted faster when the oil is very hot.

I agree, Werner.

And when Model A owners complain to me that they cannot shift gears from 1st to 2nd and 2nd to 3rd gear without the gears grinding, unless they double-clutch, I tell them that their gear oil is too thin.

Few people believe me and I don't argue with them.

One gentleman contacted me to say that his gears would grind only when cold and he shifted (as I recommend) without double-clutching. Once the engine warmed up, no grinding when shifting.

I told him to shift more quickly to the next gear, not to pause when cold. He reported back the next day that I was correct and that fixed the problem. His thick, cold gear oil was slowing the spin of the cluster gear very quickly and he needed to shift quickly to match it.

When you understand the design of the transmission, it all falls into place.

[Patrick L.]

'it all falls into place.'

So to speak. [smiley face]