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Old 05-07-2021, 01:15 PM   #1
1966f250
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Default Borg Warner overdrive cable throw position

i recently installed a late 1950s era borg warner overdrive on my 1966 Ford F250. its a 3 speed on the column. i am trying to set the contact position correctly for the cable that engages/disengages the overdrive. the mechanical switch on the OD tranny body is a spring loaded forward throw. pull the cable out and the BW is in manual mode and no overdrive functions occur. when you push the cable handle (on the dash) in, it throws the OD into its default position which is overdrive on. The length of the path of travel for the throw on the tranny body is long. so long in fact that when at its furthest point, the cable handle is nearly 6+ inches out from the dash and wobbling all over the place. i would like to shorten that just a touch.

does anyone know if the BW mechanical switch on the body of the tranny has to be at rest at its furthest rear point in the motion to successfully disengage the OD functions or is it that as soon as the spring loaded element trips, it disengages the OD functionality?
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Old 05-07-2021, 02:24 PM   #2
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Default Re: Borg Warner overdrive cable throw position

I have a 55 Ford 3 speed with the R10 BW overdrive... you can read all about my escapades here:https://www.hotrodreverend.com/blog/...s/transmission

6 inches sounds like quite a bit! I would say it is time to reset the travel. Loosen the nut/bolt that secures the cable wire to the lever on the body of the tail shaft. Next, pus your handle all the way in at the dash. After that, make sure that your bracket which holds the cable to the transmission is secure. This should be attached to one of the bolts on the side cover, or to a bolt that holds the top of the solenoid to the body of the transmission. Not sure on truck transmissions and the 60s - could be a tick different there.

Once all this is loose and your handle is all the way in, re-tighten your cable wire to the lever on the tail shaft. Next, re-tighten your cable bracket to the transmission ensuring there is no slack between this position and your lever on the tail shaft. The key to "travel" is that this bracket be both positioned properly and the cable secured. The handle can then be pulled out under the dash and the only travel you will have is the lever on the OD tail shaft.

One item to think about if that does not work - your lever on the tail shaft "could" be too long. A shorter lever would decrease the distance -- geometry and all that lol.
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Old 05-07-2021, 02:46 PM   #3
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Default Re: Borg Warner overdrive cable throw position

Also when adjusting the cable, the o.d, lever must be pushed all the way back while cable is tightened. When I adj. mine I have the lever pulled out about a 1/4 " so that when I push it in I can be sure the lever is bottomed all the way back.
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Old 05-07-2021, 03:06 PM   #4
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Default Re: Borg Warner overdrive cable throw position

thanks guys for those tips. since i am installing everything for the first time (its a full frame off resto), i can easily adjust how much my cable allows the lever on the tranny to move. because this lever is spring loaded when you push the cable handle in toward the dash, my thought is that the OD becomes fully engaged as soon as the spring in the lever is fully tripped. after the spring lets go, the lever on the tranny still has a good 30-40 degrees of movement left before it comes to full stop. i want to shorten where the lever comes to full stop and not allow it to rest at the far rear end position. my newly attached cable would be what keeps it from going all the way back towards the rear of the vehicle. my concern is this - if i shorten the distance that this lever can travel, am i somehow messing with the gears inside the OD unit by not allowing everything to fully engage? i have heard horror stories of people mis-using their Borg Warners and crushing needles and sun gears inside. i am scared of doing that. i think that your tips are saying what i am saying here so that tells me that i do have some flexibility in how i set up this cable attachment. i just don't want to do something very wrong and then find out on my inaugural drive that i have burnt out my precious Borg Warner.
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Old 05-07-2021, 05:32 PM   #5
Dobie Gillis
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Default Re: Borg Warner overdrive cable throw position

The spring load is a safety feature to prevent engaging reverse when the OD is enabled (cable under dash pushed IN). Engaging reverse moves the planetary cage out of the OD position; when selecting a forward gear the spring load moves it back to the OD position. This is to prevent damage to the overrunning clutch as it cannot transmit reverse drive. Most people who lunch their OD likely were trying to lock the OD out on the fly without first kicking it down to direct. It MUST be kicked down and held in kick down until the cable is fully pulled out.
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Old 05-08-2021, 06:02 AM   #6
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Default Re: Borg Warner overdrive cable throw position

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The lockout lever on the side of the OD housing MUST rest against the stop on the tail housing. Set it there and then slide the inner cable into the locking hardware before tightening it up. As suggested in one of the earlier posts, set it so that the handle under the dash is close to, but not bottomed out in the handle bracket. Clamp the outer cable housing in the usual spots and proceed to test the system. The lockout lever has special swiveling hardware that allows the lever to move through an arc without bending the cable. We have this hardware if you need it.

You seem to be a little confused on the operation of the cable lockout control. This doesn’t shift the system into overdrive.....it either enables the transmission to shift into OD or locks it out of OD mode. The electric solenoid does the actual shifting into overdrive.
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Old 05-08-2021, 10:41 AM   #7
1966f250
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Default Re: Borg Warner overdrive cable throw position

Mac,

i think you have hit upon what my problem is. i don't have the special swiveling hardware you are talking about. i made something work by buying a Lokar kickdown cable that is used for accelerator pedal connections to carbuerators. my home made set up does that i think yours does - allowing the cable to rotate freely in 2 planes and 2 directions as that lockout lever moves through its rotation. I am also attaching a photo of the position that my cab dash cable handle is in when the OD lockout lever is disengaged. besides the obvious visual problem, i just can't see driving around in normal operation (i.e. no OD use) with that lever flapping around like that. this is why i wanted to shorten the path that the lockout lever travels upon. You are saying that the lever must rest in the rear position (rear meaning thrown toward the rear of the truck). See my sketch of what i want to do to solve my path of travel problem. My lokar swivel cable is also adjustable and i can feed as much as another 1.5" of cable into that fitting to bottom it out. i don't know how that solves anything. i clearly must be doing something wrong or i am just not understanding things properly. the last attachment is a sketch showing what it is that i was proposing to do in my original post. can you send me a photo of the swivel attachment you say you have? I can't imagine how any of these companies can sell you the OD cable but not the fitting that connects the OD cable to the lockout lever.20210508_112451_resized.jpg

20210508_112528_resized.jpg

20210508_112718_resized.jpg

20210508_112900_resized.jpg

borg warner cable position sketch.jpg
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Old 05-08-2021, 12:12 PM   #8
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Default Re: Borg Warner overdrive cable throw position

I can tell from the photo that a piece was fabricated to fit the cable attach but it has increased the throw distance due to the additional length from the center of movement.

The T85 R11 is a bit different than the earlier Ford and Mercury transmissions I'm more used to. They have more positive stops on the lock out arm movement since many had an electric lock out switch that was activated when the system was locked out. They did away with the switch in 1951 as redundant so later units didn't have them.

You can fabricate a swivel bolt using a bushing that fits the arm but thicker than the arm so it won't bind. Then use a bolt that fits through the bushing. I drill a hole in the bolt shank so it can clamp the cable as the nut is tightened but the bushing can still turn to maintain movement so the cable won't try to twist. The bolt & nut don't have to be tightened all that much to get a positive clamp up on the cable core. The bushing should be a hat type but larger area washers can be used so that the bushing will stay in the arm.

Your idea has merit but added too much length to the arm. Generally the arm only has to move about 90 degrees to go into lockout. You may be able to feel this if you put the car in reverse gear and rotate the arm with your hand to see where is engages the lock out rod inside but I don't know on the T85. It's a bit different than the older Ford & Mercury units. The T85 was used on the Lincoln cars in those years.
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Old 05-08-2021, 12:29 PM   #9
1966f250
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Default Re: Borg Warner overdrive cable throw position

Rotor - I don't follow what you are saying with the bushing and the bolt. Can you sketch something out so I can follow you?
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Old 05-08-2021, 12:33 PM   #10
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Default Re: Borg Warner overdrive cable throw position

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Old 05-08-2021, 04:55 PM   #11
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Thumbs up Re: Borg Warner overdrive cable throw position

Do you know what model trans you have?
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Old 05-09-2021, 07:06 AM   #12
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Default Re: Borg Warner overdrive cable throw position

Here’s the hardware kit. It also appears that the lever you created is pretty short in length. Is your transmission a T-85 with the R-11 overdrive?
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Old 05-09-2021, 10:29 AM   #13
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Thumbs up Re: Borg Warner overdrive cable throw position

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac VP View Post

Here’s the hardware kit. It also appears that the lever you created is pretty short in length. Is your transmission a T-85 with the R-11 overdrive?
You guys are good!

http://www.vanpeltsales.com/FH_web/t...BW-ODparts.htm

THANX! for that info.
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Old 05-09-2021, 10:47 AM   #14
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Default Re: Borg Warner overdrive cable throw position

I'll see if this link comes through for Mac:
http://www.vanpeltsales.com/FH_web/F...outboltkit.jpg

It would be what you want. Part number VP-7689K.
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Old 08-27-2023, 03:49 PM   #15
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Default Re: Borg Warner overdrive cable throw position

This thread goes back a few years, but it never stops giving help to those in need. Thanks for the question from 1966f250, I also had, and all the great answers. A special thanks to rotorwrench.
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