The Ford Barn

dave in australia · 09-22-2022, 02:30 AM

When did Ford swap from the machined input/output main bearing stops in casing to the snap ring stop?

When did Ford swap from the reverse idler shaft with the cup for lubrication to the idler with a drilled hole in the actual gear?

nkaminar · 09-22-2022, 09:59 AM

The Service Bulletins has all that information in it. I don't have my copy with me and I am 3,000 miles from home, or I could looks up the dates for you.

https://www.snydersantiqueauto.com/p...0048&cat=41621

ursus · 09-22-2022, 11:11 AM

The reverse idler gear shaft change was detailed in the November 1929 Service Bulletin. The change to a snap ring for the input bearing retainer was detailed in the September 1929 Bulletin.

Now I have a question: why did FORD make the change to a snap ring? It seems like it would be more costly to machine the bore, then cut an annular groove, then place a snap ring. Also, does it matter where the gap in the snap ring is placed? Many I have seen have the gap on the lower side which seems like a more likely position for oil to leak past.

Joe K · 09-22-2022, 07:15 PM

Also, does it matter where the gap in the snap ring is placed?

Snap ring on the "inside" of the bearing. In Ford's day the bearings did not have "shields" hence the baffle with the hole for the shaft. Today some vendors have removed the shield on the "inside" of the bearing so that it gets lubrication from the transmission. (Technically bearings "double shielded" are lubricated for life and one transmission rebuilder claims that infiltration of transmission lubricant can "contaminate" the lifetime lubrication with sand/metal.)

So perhaps the gap in the snap doesn't matter? And placed "down" might allow the oil to drain "in" easier?

Joe K

Tom Endy · 09-22-2022, 08:35 PM

Attached is an article about the overhaul of a transmission a few years ago. Should answer a lot of questions.

https://www.santaanitaas.org/wp-cont...ugust-2018.pdf

Tom Endy

dave in australia · 09-23-2022, 07:25 AM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Thanks Tom for the article.

rotorwrench · 09-23-2022, 07:33 PM

The way we had to handle sealed bearings on the Hughes models of helicopters was to take the machine apart every 24-months and remove the seals to service the bearings. The idea was that the bearings were designed to last about 4-years between service so for safety sake they reduced that interval by 50%. When they came up with this schedule back in the early 80s, I serviced some that had been in service for over 10 years since they were done at 1200 hour intervals instead of by date. Many were shot and had to be replaced. The grease was hard or non existent after that many years.

I would take the inner seals out and save them for replacements. The gear oil will keep them from rusting if the car sets up for a year or two. The old dried out grease won't.

katy · 09-24-2022, 10:01 AM

I once worked in a carton manufacturing plant for a few years. If a bearing became noisy, overly warm or a little loose, the standard procedure was to punch a hole in one of the seals, pump in some grease and keep an eye on it. The bearings usually lasted for a long time after that.

09-22-2022, 02:30 AM	#1
dave in australia Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Victoria, Australia Posts: 1,178	Two gearbox questions When did Ford swap from the machined input/output main bearing stops in casing to the snap ring stop? When did Ford swap from the reverse idler shaft with the cup for lubrication to the idler with a drilled hole in the actual gear?

09-22-2022, 09:59 AM	#2
nkaminar Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Western North Carolina Posts: 3,960	Re: Two gearbox questions The Service Bulletins has all that information in it. I don't have my copy with me and I am 3,000 miles from home, or I could looks up the dates for you. https://www.snydersantiqueauto.com/p...0048&cat=41621 __________________ A is for apple, green as the sky. Step on the gas, for tomorrow I die. Forget the brakes, they really don't work. The clutch always sticks, and starts with a jerk. My car grows red hair, and flies through the air. Driving's a blast, a blast from the past.

09-22-2022, 11:11 AM	#3
ursus Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Oregon Posts: 1,377	Re: Two gearbox questions The reverse idler gear shaft change was detailed in the November 1929 Service Bulletin. The change to a snap ring for the input bearing retainer was detailed in the September 1929 Bulletin. Now I have a question: why did FORD make the change to a snap ring? It seems like it would be more costly to machine the bore, then cut an annular groove, then place a snap ring. Also, does it matter where the gap in the snap ring is placed? Many I have seen have the gap on the lower side which seems like a more likely position for oil to leak past.

09-22-2022, 07:15 PM	#4
Joe K Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Cow Hampshire Posts: 4,188	Re: Two gearbox questions Also, does it matter where the gap in the snap ring is placed? Snap ring on the "inside" of the bearing. In Ford's day the bearings did not have "shields" hence the baffle with the hole for the shaft. Today some vendors have removed the shield on the "inside" of the bearing so that it gets lubrication from the transmission. (Technically bearings "double shielded" are lubricated for life and one transmission rebuilder claims that infiltration of transmission lubricant can "contaminate" the lifetime lubrication with sand/metal.) So perhaps the gap in the snap doesn't matter? And placed "down" might allow the oil to drain "in" easier? Joe K __________________ Shudda kept the horse.

09-22-2022, 08:35 PM	#5
Tom Endy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Southern California Posts: 3,134	Re: Two gearbox questions Attached is an article about the overhaul of a transmission a few years ago. Should answer a lot of questions. https://www.santaanitaas.org/wp-cont...ugust-2018.pdf Tom Endy

09-23-2022, 07:25 AM	#6
dave in australia Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Victoria, Australia Posts: 1,178	Re: Two gearbox questions Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Thanks Tom for the article.

09-23-2022, 07:33 PM	#7
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,476	Re: Two gearbox questions The way we had to handle sealed bearings on the Hughes models of helicopters was to take the machine apart every 24-months and remove the seals to service the bearings. The idea was that the bearings were designed to last about 4-years between service so for safety sake they reduced that interval by 50%. When they came up with this schedule back in the early 80s, I serviced some that had been in service for over 10 years since they were done at 1200 hour intervals instead of by date. Many were shot and had to be replaced. The grease was hard or non existent after that many years. I would take the inner seals out and save them for replacements. The gear oil will keep them from rusting if the car sets up for a year or two. The old dried out grease won't.

09-24-2022, 10:01 AM	#8
katy Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Red Deer, Alberta Posts: 5,060	Re: Two gearbox questions I once worked in a carton manufacturing plant for a few years. If a bearing became noisy, overly warm or a little loose, the standard procedure was to punch a hole in one of the seals, pump in some grease and keep an eye on it. The bearings usually lasted for a long time after that. __________________ If you don't hear a rumor by 10 AM, start one!. Got my education out behind the barn!