Question on retorquing heads after a head gasket replacement.

[Jemelton#]

The instructions for my new Premium Head Gasket replacement states that, “the cylinder head must be retorqued after the first 500 miles of operation to 55 ft. lbs. using the correct head bolt torquing sequence.”



However I don’t anticipate driving more than 100 or so miles this year.
What would be an acceptable time frame to retorque my heads?
Thanks for any information offered.

[Mitch//pa]

Those gaskets are very picky... I would retorque after first heat cycle, 2nd heat cycle and third heat cycle and so on till you feel it's sufficient...then hit it at 250 and 500
Don't wait till 500 miles for the first retorque... As far as hot or cold on the retorque I'm not saying here (very sensitive topic people yell and scream, posts get deleted. individuals get banned over it) but u can pm me if u want just don't tell anyone what I reccomend

[Chuck Sea/Tac]

Originally Posted by Mitch//pa

Those gaskets are very picky... I would retorque after first heat cycle, 2nd heat cycle and third heat cycle and so on till you feel it's sufficient...then hit it at 250 and 500
Don't wait till 500 miles for the first retorque... As far as hot or cold on the retorque I'm not saying here (very sensitive topic and people yell and scream, posts get deleted and individuals get banned over it) but u can pm me if u want just don't tell anyone what I reccomend

I don't care which you recommend Mitch, it's the other way!!!

[Brian T]

If its the Premium gasket I believe you have, and you haven't installed it yet, I would send it back, for the most part they are trouble.

[tbirdtbird]

it will be a long time before I respond to anything to do with torquing or retorquing heads. All I know for sure is that in 60 yrs I have never had a head gasket leak, on any marque car, no matter what terminology you wish to use. Neither have any of the people who taught me. I challenge others to post their record. The snipers here choose to criticize only and not yield any information that anyone can actually use. One wonders why they even come to the forum

[glenn in camino]

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I always use a copper clad head gasket and a liberal spray of Copper-coat. Torque it to 50#, drive it around my neighborhood to warm it up, then torque t0 55#. Good to go.

[Flathead]

I don't think you will get in trouble if you check sooner than suggested. The problems start when you don't check often enough or soon enough. I am using one of those gaskets and it took several re-torques before it settled in. Basically I re-torqued early and often, also I did it when engine was cool.

[larrys40]

Agree with Mitch, Vince,Tbird, and Glen.... retorque several times, hot or cold, your choice.
I know from Rich Faluca's seminar last year (AER - Antique Engine Rebuilding) he says it doesn't matter hot or cold, just do it.

I have used a BEST brand gasket once I bought at a swap meet. I really liked it and it didn't seem like a retorque was as necessary. I'd like to find where to obtain them. Not a big deal to check and retorque. Do it once or twice and with copper I use a spray of copper coat on each side before install only on the copper gasket as Glen mentioned. I recommend surfacing the water neck and using a skim of RTV and no gasket.

Larry Shepard

[H. L. Chauvin]

Hi Jemelton#,

FWIW: Just one (1) vintage over (50) year old experience.

I watched my Uncle, a professional mechanic, born 1905, who never owned a torque wrench install my Model A head gasket over 50 years ago in the 1950's.

Even though his method may cause severe loose bowels by our today's Model A Forum head gasket experts, he started out with his 2" wide large blacksmith's file leveling both the head and block.

He next applied Permatex No. 2 to gasket, head and block and torqued all bolts by "feel", started engine, allowed engine to reach operating temperature an checked each bolt by "feel" ....... some bolts tightened, others not.

That was it ............... & nothing never leaked.

In my opinion, if your head is warped ......and/or your block is not dead flat ...... this needs to be corrected "first".

Unless one corrects this problem, one can try every one of the millions of suggestions ever mentioned on any Model A Forum ...... and every suggestion by any head gasket manufacturer ............ or even try blessing your head gasket with Vatican Holy Water ........ or singing Dixie to your head gasket in Russian ...... just remember the words .... "Dead Flat First".

[Mike V. Florida]

Here is where the problem lies;

From Federal Mogul document 1425;

" If the
gasket design requires retorquing, run the engine to a normal operating temperature (usually 10 to 15 minutes) and shut off the engine. Carefully retorque the cylinder head bolts for a second time. Retorquing can be done while the engine is still warm if the engine is cast iron. If the head or block is aluminum, allow the engine to cool to room temperature. Follow the torque sequence to the specified amount in the torque tables. Retorque-type cylinder head gaskets may need to be tightened a third time after a longer time or certain mileage; follow OEM recommendations. "

Ford Model A service bulletins states a warm engine.

Larry Brumfield states, " if you want accurate torque, you better torque and re-torque COLD. By cold I don't mean pack the engine in dry ice, just cooled off. "

Like Mitch, I will not say which is best or even how I do it. I will say that I follow the manufacturer on the heads instructions.

[Bob Johnson]

Those instructions are bad. If you follow them you WILL have a gasket failure. I installed one of those and after a 5 minute warm up the torque when from 55 to 20 on most nuts. If you are going to use that gasket torque, re-torque, re-torque ...... until the torque stays at 55.

Just my experiences
Bob

[Mike V. Florida]

This is from the instruction sheet;

NOTE: Engine block must be cold before retorquing.

CAUTION!

BEFORE DRIVING VEHICLE
1. Warm engine up slowly for 15-20 minutes.
2. Let engine cool overnight, or until stone cold (6 hours minimum).
3. Retorque cylinder head to 55 foot pounds using correct torqueing sequence.
4. Repeat after 500 miles.

The first 3 above corresponds with what Bob has seen.

[Mitch//pa]

Originally Posted by larrys40

Agree with Mitch, Vince,Tbird, and Glen.... retorque several times, hot or cold, your choice.
I know from Rich Faluca's seminar last year (AER - Antique Engine Rebuilding) he says it doesn't matter hot or cold, just do it.

I have used a BEST brand gasket once I bought at a swap meet. I really liked it and it didn't seem like a retorque was as necessary. I'd like to find where to obtain them. Not a big deal to check and retorque. Do it once or twice and with copper I use a spray of copper coat on each side before install only on the copper gasket as Glen mentioned. I recommend surfacing the water neck and using a skim of RTV and no gasket.

Larry Shepard

Larry you can buy the best type gasket here
http://secretsofspeed.com/gaskets.htm
I have also had great success with them....

Since you attended AER's seminar did he mention why he uses the modern style gasket? I am also curious why he uses the fiber cam gear?
Thanks

[brokenspoke]

Originally Posted by Bob Johnson

Those instructions are bad. If you follow them you WILL have a gasket failure. I installed one of those and after a 5 minute warm up the torque when from 55 to 20 on most nuts. If you are going to use that gasket torque, re-torque, re-torque ...... until the torque stays at 55.

Just my experiences
Bob

X2 (until the torque stays at 55)

[captndan]

Premium gasket yes or no. Need to know.

[larrys40]

If I were placing a standard head on the block I would use a copper head gasket. High compression as recommended by the head supplier.

Thanks Mitch for the link on the BEST gasket. I appreciate it!

Larry

[katy]

In the Ford Garage link that forever4 posted Larry Brumfield says "Starting at nut #1, loosen it 1/8th of a turn and then in one uninterrupted motion, torque the nut back to the final torque amount. Do this one at a time in sequence on all the nuts."
Iv'e never heard of "loosening nuts off before retorquing" before, just put the wrench on and go. Does anybody/everybody do that?
Comments?

[Mitch//pa]

Originally Posted by katy

In the Ford Garage link that forever4 posted Larry Brumfield says "Starting at nut #1, loosen it 1/8th of a turn and then in one uninterrupted motion, torque the nut back to the final torque amount. Do this one at a time in sequence on all the nuts."
Iv'e never heard of "loosening nuts off before retorquing" before, just put the wrench on and go. Does anybody/everybody do that?
Comments?

I do both

[tbirdtbird]

if what you are doing works for you, you may not need to change what you do........

[Jemelton#]

Originally Posted by Mike V. Florida

This is from the instruction sheet;

NOTE: Engine block must be cold before retorquing.

CAUTION!

BEFORE DRIVING VEHICLE
1. Warm engine up slowly for 15-20 minutes.
2. Let engine cool overnight, or until stone cold (6 hours minimum).
3. Retorque cylinder head to 55 foot pounds using correct torqueing sequence.
4. Repeat after 500 miles.

The first 3 above corresponds with what Bob has seen.

This is the procedure that I used with the premium replacement gasket, ( the one which has the silicon sealer already applied.) I just needed advice on when to retorque as I won't be driving 500 miles for quite some time. Thanks for the advice. I checked the head today (cold), and all of the nuts were at the proper torque value. I will be driving it in a 4th of July parade tomorrow and will recheck it when I get home.