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06-10-2017, 11:10 PM | #1 |
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Location: Venice, FL
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Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
I'm getting ready to replace the front axle so during the process I want to update the spring. I plan to check for excessive ware at the ends of each leaf, replace the shackle bushings and then re-finish, lube and re-assemble.
What is the recommend finish and lube for the assemble? My first time doing spring maintenance so I'd appreciate your thoughts. Thank you all, Al |
06-11-2017, 04:48 AM | #2 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
Prep springs with phosphoric acid to remove rust.
A light coat of extreme pressure (EP) on the underside of each leaf before assembly. Paint with any good quality rattle can. Consider investing in spring covers for longer service.
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06-11-2017, 06:43 AM | #3 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
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06-11-2017, 08:00 AM | #4 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
I use "slip plate" which can be bought in a quart can at any John Deere dealer, or some tractor supplies. Apply under each leaf except the main leaf, and when assembled, paint with your favorite chassis black.
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06-11-2017, 08:11 AM | #5 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
If you have no experience with this type of spring, have someone take a look at it before you reassemble. Some old parts are just shoot, or close to being not serviceable. After all your work, you want the handling and ride to be right.
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06-11-2017, 08:23 AM | #6 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
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Marshall |
06-11-2017, 08:36 AM | #7 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
I'm adding two mores photos that show the tops of spring leaves before and after repair. The deep gouging is typical and is caused by the leaf above digging into an unlubricated lower leaf. Unless the gouges are really deep, they can be ground down. Teamed up with beveled edges, this is about as good as it gets for an 85 year-old spring.
Marshall |
06-11-2017, 12:04 PM | #8 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
Thank you guys.
This is just what I needed. |
06-11-2017, 06:14 PM | #9 |
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Location: Southern Upstate New York
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
Has anyone tried adding plastic/nylon spring spacers between the ends of the leaf springs, similar to what was done on the 70's Mopar leaf springs?
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06-11-2017, 07:38 PM | #10 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
Yes. In the 1990's I used the plastic leaf liners that had edges on the sides to keep the strips in place. They seemed to work well, but their number per spring added height to the spring, making it necessary to fabricate longer spring clamps. The liners seemed to add unwanted extra spring and bounce, so I went back to Slip Plate type of graphite coatings.
Don't bother messing with the thin Teflon rolls that you cut to length in strips and place between the leaves. It will drive you crazy trying to keep them in place while you put the spring together. They also tear easily and wear out too soon. Marshall |
06-11-2017, 08:27 PM | #11 |
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Join Date: Aug 2014
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
Tractor Supply Ez-Slide works great, just use gloves, it's hard to wash off.
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06-11-2017, 09:38 PM | #12 |
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Location: Shreveport,La.
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
If you bought a new spring set from one of the top model A parts houses would you need to disassemble that and put slip plate between the springs before using?
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06-11-2017, 10:14 PM | #13 | |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
Quote:
Here is an article that I published in a trade journal about 30 years ago. It isn't the last word, just another way to do it if you want quality. Reconditioning a model A spring. First, inspect the top of all the leaves for grooving. If grooved, grind and taper the tops of all the leaves for the last 3 inches. The number of leaves you use will depend on the final weight of the car and the "ride" you want. On a typical model A it is possible to get a 100 lb. per inch spring rate which will give a very comfortable "touring ride". Have the shocks disconnected when checking spring rates. The easiest way to check spring rate is measure the height of a point on the front bumper. Apply a known weight to the front bumper such as a 200 lb. person. Measure the same point again. Say it went down 2 inches. You have roughly a 100 lb per inch spring rate on the front. DO NOT USE GREASE BETWEEN THE LEAVES. It will only attract dirt and then you have grinding compound. I Parkerize the leaves (optional) and then spray them all over with SlipPlate (trade name) which is a graphite spray or Moly Kote (trade name) which is a molybdenem disulfide base spray. DO NOT PAINT ANY PART OF A SPRING. (Unless you are restoring for judging) The graphite or Moly spray will stop rust. Slip Plate can be had at John Deere dealers. Moly Kote can be had at auto parts dealers. I use 1/16 UHMW plastic between the leaves.This has similar characteristics to Teflon but about 1/3 the price. This is optional but really decreases friction and prolongs spring life. After determining the final configuration of the spring I wrap it with black electrical tape from the eyes to the U bolts. This keeps dirt out. There are commercial spring covers available also. If you use a reversed eye main leaf, be sure the second leaf is short enough that there is no way it can bottom on the eye when at full compression. Sometimes the original spring clips will not reach over the spring after the UHMW is added. It is a simple matter to fabricate ones that will. The inside top of the cross member where the spring seats, usually has a radius. BE SURE the top leaf of the spring has a radius to match. A sharp corner on the spring leaf can cause a cracked cross member. I use moly filled Delrin shackle bushings because they have almost no friction and they never wear out. Anyone with a lathe can make these. They should be drilled so they lube the ID and OD both. They should drop in the spring eye with .003 to .005 clearance. They should have the same clearance on the shackle pin. By making them loose in the spring it DOUBLES the bearing area. Commercial urethane bushings are also available. While they last about as long as the Delrin, they tend to squeak sometimes. |
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06-12-2017, 06:48 AM | #14 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
Do you have working shocks?
If you make the spring springy then the car will not feel so good over 20MPH without properly functioning shocks. |
06-12-2017, 06:49 AM | #15 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
I normally use new quality springs along with a new set of correct shocks, completely rebuilt front end. If you can afford the costs, the ride and handling are great. I have never taken a new spring apart before installing. Our 29 Sport Coupe was done 40 years ago, when other Model A owners drive it I usually hear how well it drives compared to theirs. Once you get it back together put it up in the air and grease it regularly. It's worth the cost to me to make sure everything is hit properly. You also get a good chance to check things out. At my age it is not as easy as it was to get underneath.
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06-12-2017, 08:56 AM | #16 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
The springs we get from the place back east, yes you need to take apart, clean, prep and paint. I am going out on a limb and say I don't think the new springs come ready to install, at least I would want to make sure what is between the leafs. I make my own slip plate paint.
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06-12-2017, 11:50 AM | #17 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
If your using leafs springs made with SAE 5160 steel, no grease, or potroleum products, they will effect the steel. Quality leaf springs made since the late 50's are made differently than the ones made in the 20's.
Depending on where you get you new spring. Taking it apart might be a good idea. It never hurts to check things out before installing. Measure twice, cut once. |
06-12-2017, 08:31 PM | #18 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
I just bought a new rear spring for my Tudor from Bert's and I asked Steve about the lube part and he said yes lube it. So I thought I'd use the dry graphite in the first picture and then I found a tube of the moly with graphite on another shelf in my garage. I think I'll use both.
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06-12-2017, 10:09 PM | #19 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
Bought my whole new leaf spring bundle from Snyders. Do you think I need to disassemble it and use the slip plate?
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06-12-2017, 10:48 PM | #20 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
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06-13-2017, 11:10 AM | #21 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
dennisklieson, I will do. I bet they are just bolted together though with no lubrication.
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06-13-2017, 01:37 PM | #22 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
Mine had no lubrication. So I beveled the end of each leaf before the lube and reassemble. I found a piece of 3/8" round stock cold roll that I had in my scrap metal pile, helped a lot when I compressed the pack as the center bolt dropped right in.
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06-13-2017, 07:06 PM | #23 |
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Re: Leaf Springs Finish/Treatment
Last year I purchased both front and rear "show quality" leaf springs and a can of Slip-Plate from John Deere. For health reasons, it took me three months to prep and paint the springs to my liking and another eight to nine months to do the install with the aid of a dear friend and master mechanic on the back spring. I checked and noted the spring load for later reference.
The install of my new Stipe shocks only required a little over an hour and I was off for a test drive. OMG!! What a HUGE DIFFERENCE! Now mind you my car is a 1930 roadster, a light weight vehicle, but somewhere in it's history somebody had installed a 10 leaf rear spring! I can tell you this much, make sure your car has the right springs installed and a working/adjusted set of shocks and you'll be good to go. Have fun with your Model A!
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