Put front Disc Brakes on my 56 T-Bird

[Old Redneck]

I got the Brake Disc. Kit from Hill's and what a nice kit to install. All the brake lines you will need came with it. It was a lot easier them I though. Even the rear Wheel Cylinders came with the kit. Can't wait to drive it. The kit is complete. Only thing I had to buy was Brake Clean and Brake fluid.

[Gene F]

Proportioning valve too?

[Old Redneck]

Yes it came with the kit

[miker98038]

Hill’s has always had a great reputation, and your experience seems to bear that out. Good to know in todays world. Enjoy the car, you’ve done a ton of work and it looks great.

[bobss396]

Who sells those? Just looked them up with no results. The caliper with the cross-over tube is intriguing.

[flatrod]

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It looks like a 65 to 67 Mustang 4 piston caliper to me.

[KULTULZ]

The kit(s) are actually 1965-67 KH 4-PISTON style disc brakes.

The kit comes with adapters to allow you to mount them directly to your spindle (no GRANADA SWAP routine).

Here is a description. Take their valving theory with a grain of salt -

https://www.ctci.org/thunderbird-par...hunderbirds-1/

[dmsfrr]

Originally Posted by bobss396

Who sells those? Just looked them up with no results. The caliper with the cross-over tube is intriguing.

Here's a link to Hill's...
https://hillsresto.com/

Virtually all the '55/'57 Thunderbird suppliers sell a front disc brake conversion kit of some kind.
Some of the kits are more complete than others, and some do not fit the original '57 (or newer?) 14 inch wheels. Confirm with phone calls to your preferred supplier.

[KULTULZ]

The kits offered by the several vendors are sourced from -

EDIT - (I think as CTCI uses this as their source.)

There seem to be several versions and confusion regarding what valving is included and the the function(s) of valving -

There is no way a UNIVERSAL COMBINATION VALVE (PPV) (GM SOURCED) can function correctly on an early BIRD (Refer To Disclaimer Below).

You have to determine if the UNIVERSAL COMBINATION VALVE includes a METERING VALVE also. It will make a difference.

Read These Two Articles -

1) - https://www.ctci.org/disc-brake-conversion/

2) - https://www.ctci.org/disc-brake-performance/

Please make sure you fully understand brake system plumbing/valving before driving the car.

Some of the kits are more complete than others, and some do not fit the original '57 (or newer?) 14 inch wheels. Confirm with a phone call.

Usually, a DISC BRAKE WHEEL will have a different offset that an earlier DRUM BRAKE WHEEL. This is to allow the wheel to not contact the caliper. Like valving, all of this needs to be taken into consideration.

Considering the 57 BIRD OEM WHEEL is only 5" wide, The caliper may fit (depending on style) or one may have to use a wheel spacer to gain more offset.

[bobss396]

Thanks, the calipers do look like the Kelsey Hayes I had on my old Mustang.

[Old Redneck]

I understand what you are saying in good faith. I have gone this far and will let you know how the brakes work out. Thank you for the information. All I want is a better brake.You guys are the best and I love hearing from you. Thanks for the information. My T-Bird is 56 with 15 inch wheels. One thing for sure I will let you know how the brakes work out. It will be next week before I can get back on the Bird because taking my wife to the Doctors plus me also. My right eye has swell shut so I can only see from my left eye. I guess getting old not for sissy. I will get back on the Bird when I can.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by Old Redneck

I understand what you are saying in good faith. I have gone this far and will let you know how the brakes work out. Thank you for the information. All I want is a better brake.

Please don't understand ... ... mis-understand (where the hell did you go to school?) what I am trying to get across. I am not beating on you. The basic kit you bought is No.1 in my opinion. It is the valving theory that some of these kit vendors advise that gives me a bubble.

When all is said and done, maybe consider finding an empty WALLY WORLD parking lot on a rainy SUN and giving it a skid test and see how the back end reacts. Be damn careful and stay away from light poles. How she comes down without the tail trying to come around will tell you how the one-fits-all COMB VLV (PPV) is working on the application.

It is a lot easier than sliding under a traffic light in panic mode on wet road and finding out it isn't compatible with the application.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by bobss396

Thanks, the calipers do look like the Kelsey Hayes I had on my old Mustang.

I do like this design over sliding or floating calipers. WILWOOD offers an upgraded kit but $$$.

[KULTULZ]

If you read the TECH ARTICLES I posted, you will find that most likely the MC is CHI-COM and has no RESIDUAL PRESSURE VALVE for the rear drum brakes included. You will see a free-standing valve plumbed in.

I have also seen two styles of the COMB VLV offered, one without a FRONT DISC METERING VALVE and one with -

[Old Redneck]

Maybe It would have been a lot more simple to go to a power brake instead. A lot cheaper. Another question would a power brake be a lot more help with disc brake? You raise a good question about brakes. What the best way to go to improve the brakes.

[Old Redneck]

I did not have a good brake and did not know the problem until I remove the master cylinder. Only to bolts holding it on. Should have 4, one missing ,one just stuck in the thread no nut on it and two others finger tight. When I put the brake on the master cylinder would give and push out not giving me a proper brake. When you buy a old car,Antique car you never know what was done to it.If the Master Cylinder was installed proper I might not even installing a Disc brake. The brake shoes look brand new that I took off. The more I think about it a power brake would have been fine with a new Master Cylinder.The brake fluid was very dark almost black. I am going to Synthetic brake fluid this time. I am washing all the old brake fluid out. This will be the first time I have tried it.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by Old Redneck

Maybe It would have been a lot more simple to go to a power brake instead. A lot cheaper.

Well, not really. To use a later diaphram booster, the battery needs to be relocated. To use the OEM MIDLAND BOOSTER, finding a take-off or kit is $$$.

Another question would a power brake be a lot more help with disc brake? You raise a good question about brakes. What the best way to go to improve the brakes.

A disc/drum setup does perform better with power assist, the calipers needing more line pressure. Use what you have and see how the pedal feels and how she stops. If not satisfied, a booster will help.

In the olden days of MUSCLE CARS, if one ordered a front disc setup, it was usually manual due to the cam. Four wheel drum brakes had less drag on the vehicle.

I am sorry that I rained on your parade ...

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by Old Redneck

I did not have a good brake and did not know the problem until I remove the master cylinder. Only to bolts holding it on. Should have 4, one missing ,one just stuck in the thread no nut on it and two others finger tight. When I put the brake on the master cylinder would give and push out not giving me a proper brake. When you buy a old car,Antique car you never know what was done to it.If the Master Cylinder was installed proper I might not even installing a Disc brake. The brake shoes look brand new that I took off. The more I think about it a power brake would have been fine with a new Master Cylinder.

The brake fluid was very dark almost black. I am going to Synthetic brake fluid this time. I am washing all the old brake fluid out. This will be the first time I have tried it.

The car came through with 11" brakes. If serviced and adjusted properly, the car should stop fine. The problem is finding quality service parts now.

Brake fluid needs to be flushed and replaced at the minimum of every two years, whether driven or not. The stuff sucks water out of the atmosphere.

I would stay away from DOT 5 fluid. If you want performance fluid, look at DOT 5.1.

[miker98038]

I think your brakes will be fine. Hill’s doesn’t just sell parts, they do restorations. So they should be familiar with the actually performance under real world conditions. I can say the same thing about Prestige Thunderbird. There are probably others. But many “brake kits” are sold by companies that are mostly just packaging parts. They work most of the time, but how well they work out at the edge is probably a crap shoot. People like Hills have probably done and driven a hundred birds for every kit the typical bird kit sold by some of the others.

My first kit was power front disc with the OEM booster. Used that way on the front disc only it worked fine, but not at the level of power assist in more modern cars, or like what Chrysler was doing in those days. Today, the price of that booster is $400, with a $250 core charge if your core has the logo on it.

I’d drive the car and check it in different circumstances as suggested above. If you need the boost, talk to Hill’s because they know their stuff. It’s interesting in their catalog, the combination valve is only available with the disc brake kit. So they don’t want it out there with mismatched parts.

[1930artdeco]

I wonder will their kit work on my 57 wagon?

Mike