Classtique Upholstery

[alexiskai]

The most recent nationwide review of literacy rates is being done by PIAAC and you can find their data here. The common shorthand "6th-grade level" corresponds to Level 2 on the PIAAC map, so if you search for the percentage of adults in some age range who are at or above Level 3, and take the complement, that gives you the percentage of adults at or below the 6th-grade level.

Talking about literacy rates at the national level obscures more than it clarifies. Literacy rates are much higher in cities; they tend to be lower in areas with a lot of immigrants. At the county level, literacy rates correlate closely with poverty. For example, in Carter County TN, the percentage of adults reading at or below a 6th-grade level is 69%. Step across the state line into Watauga County NC and that number drops to 46%.

Another thing to keep in mind is that declining educational metrics are muddied by the fact that over the decades more people have completed schooling who would previously have left early. Someone who graduates high school with low literacy may have achieved that level at an earlier age and then simply plateaued. In the '60s that guy might have left school to work in a factory and earn money instead of killing time in the classroom, but now he sticks it out and is likely encouraged to try for an associates' degree.

[Marshall V. Daut]

Not to continue flogging a dead horse here - although some horses NEED to be flogged post-mortem - but one well-known and oft-published indicator of the declining literacy and reading comprehension skills (and frighteningly possibly also the intelligence?) of the upcoming generations in this country during the last 40 years has been the periodic lowering of the standards for college SAT test scores in order to qualify for college entrance. Test score results continued to drop noticeably during these years, when "relevant" feel-good-about-yourself courses replaced the traditional cirriculum of science, math and English composition courses, leaving more and more students technically unqualified to be accepted by colleges. The solution? Simply lower the minimum score requirements to fit the scores so that more students would qualify. Easy-peasey, right? You know how THAT has turned out for this country! This lowering of the standards to validate the lowest common denominator reinforces the old adage that for every complicated, difficult-to-solve problem, there is a simple, easy-to-understand WRONG answer. And lowering the SAT score qualifications certainly proves that! It's like putting a Band-Aid over an open cancer sore: the problem is still there right beneath the surface.
Marshall

[ronn]

very good discussion


I am enjoying everyones input on this thread.

[Keith True]

I learned to read at a very young age,long before the first grade.It was just something I liked to do.I think it's the learning process I like,not the end result.I never got into the smart phone thing,I open my phone and talk when it rings,it doesn't have a TV screen or a typewriter on it.I was building my new house and was laying out some planks to figure some angles and a friend said give me the height,length,and a couple of other figures and I will hand you an answer.He came up with the same thing I did in a minute or two.I asked him how he arrived at that answer and he said he didn't care,he didn't have to know all that,he just wanted an answer.I want to know the process.The phone doesn't let you think for yourself.It may tell you how to put upholstery on a set of seat springs,but it doesn't tell you what is acceptable for weak springs,to make sure the rust is dealt with on them,eyt.I've seen cushions with sharp wires pokng out through the material because the phone didn't tell them to look for it beforehand.

[Hitman]

This is too far off topic for me!

It's so far off topic, it reminds me of the discussions of how the hobby is dying and our cars will never be worth anything, my kids don't want them, blah, blah, blah. That conversation has been going on for decades, so will this one. Yet everything will kind of remain the same long after we're gone.

I thought we were talking about upholstery!

[alexiskai]

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Originally Posted by Marshall V. Daut

one well-known and oft-published indicator of the declining literacy and reading comprehension skills (and frighteningly possibly also the intelligence?) of the upcoming generations in this country during the last 40 years has been the periodic lowering of the standards for college SAT test scores in order to qualify for college entrance. Test score results continued to drop noticeably during these years, when "relevant" feel-good-about-yourself courses replaced the traditional cirriculum of science, math and English composition courses, leaving more and more students technically unqualified to be accepted by colleges.

Both of these claims are factually false. The average score on the critical reading section of the SAT was 502 in 1980, 500 in 1990, 505 in 2000, and 500 in 2010. Scores on the math section actually went up during that time.

Far from replacing the core curriculum, over the past 20 years K-12 schools have doubled down on the core curriculum because they're trying to meet standards set by No Child Left Behind and other federal reform efforts. Schools have gutted arts classes, gym classes, elementary recess, and yes, shop classes, so kids can spend more time in remedial math and reading. All to little effect, I might add.

[BillCNC]

I was thinking about refreshing my interior because the seat tops and backs (parts people contact) have small holes and tears. But if it's more than a year long waiting list, I think I'll buy some cheap fabric from Joann's and practice on making my own tops and backs. Once I'm satisfied I can do straight lines, I'll buy the correct fabric from Classtique Upholstery and have a go at it.

Worst case, I'm out about $500, but at least I'll have fun trying.

Regards
Bill

[Hitman]

Originally Posted by BillCNC

I was thinking about refreshing my interior because the seat tops and backs (parts people contact) have small holes and tears. But if it's more than a year long waiting list, I think I'll buy some cheap fabric from Joann's and practice on making my own tops and backs. Once I'm satisfied I can do straight lines, I'll buy the correct fabric from Classtique Upholstery and have a go at it.

Worst case, I'm out about $500, but at least I'll have fun trying.

Regards
Bill

Let us know how it turns out! I wouldn't think it would be too difficult on Tudor seats, but I'm not an upholstery person.

[rackops]

This is a rather interesting discussion for me as I'm one of those kids who grew up with no practical mechanical skills.

My dad learned electronics in the Navy during the Korean War and started collecting and restoring toy trains in the 50s. I used to watch him and marvel at all the neat things that could be done...but I never learned how to do them. Similarly, my other brother loved working on cars and restored a couple of military jeeps in the early 80s. Again...I enjoyed being part of the process, but never learned how to do any of it myself.

I joined the Navy and they thought I'd be a perfect candidate for going into the engineering department of ships. I had zero background in anything mechanical, but, for the sake of not failing at my job, learned quite a bit. I also went into the electronics side of things as well. That experience didn't completely translate into turning wrenches at home though.

I bought my first Model A in 2008 at the ripe age of 33. It was on this car that I learned to change the oil in a car for the first time. Because Model As reproduce, I ended up buying another one that happened to be a total basketcase. I invested a ton of time and money into that car in order to get it to a place where it could be sold, and eventually parted with it. That might have been one of the best educations though...having to actually turn wrenches in order to get the car sold (I was angry at buying the car and wanted it gone...long story...) I learned a lot.

I left the Navy and (shockingly enough) ended up in the power generation business, managing a couple of power plants. I learned a ton there about mechanical and electrical work and by the time I went back on active duty after six years, had a really great handle on at least managing people who turned wrenches.

Fast forward to me retiring from the Navy and I bought another Model A...and then another. BUT, this time 15 years after my first foray into Model As, I have a much better grasp on how the cars work and turning wrenches on them. I've shocked myself at my level of interest and enjoyment working on the cars and really getting into the weeds. I've taken educated stabs at restoring speedometers, rebuilding carburetors, serving as a MARC fine point apprentice judge at the last national meet, and plan on starting a ground-up restoration on my 1928 Phaeton here in the near future.

All of this preamble to make a couple of points:

1. Although many kids now aren't interested in old cars, people change and I wouldn't be surprised if we see an influx of interest in future years as people have more disposable time, money, and the freedom to pursue interests. I am far different as a 48 year old than I was as a 21 year old, and have dramatically increased my ability and capability working on these cars, even though the hobby has aged another 27 years in the process (these cars were only in their late 70s back then!)

2. I think everyone would be surprised if they knew the number of the current young generation who are involved in and are really good at hands-on work. Yes, I'm aware it's tough to find good people for a lot of things (I'm still trying to chase down my carpenter to finish some cabinets in my own house!) but there actually are young people who are good at some of the older trades. Having spent time as an engineering officer on small ships, as the logistics and material readiness officer for an aircraft carrier strike group, as well as managing power plants, I think we'd all be impressed at the number of young people who can turn wrenches, and more importantly enjoy the trades and are skilled at them. Now, where they go and what they do after the military is a different matter, but I was confident in our ability to keep ships afloat, operating, and keeping an air wing of 75 high tech aircraft in the sky.

3. The biggest change that we will see (at least in my prediction) is the demise of in-person clubs. Throughout the centuries, people have had clubs and organizations because they allowed them to interact with others who shared the same values and interests. Fast forward to now and today's population isn't nearly as keen on being part of groups that require in-person attendance. Perhaps I'm generalizing because I'm part of that generation and the thought of trying to squeeze in a Model A club meeting between work, being a husband, and running around trying to raise four small humans...it's tough to do. Not only that, but I know I can pose a question on here, or on the facebook groups, and within minutes get an answer, or offer some bit of my experience to someone else anywhere in the world. It's a changing world as far as in-person interactions are concerned, and in my opinion, only time will tell if our former and current in-person organizations will survive.

My three cents worth.

Dave

[Synchro909]

We have been giving the young generation a hard time largely, IMO because they don't know what we were taught even though it is not relevant o their lives these many decades since. I do however believe they have a shorter attention span because they are accustomed to instant gratification.
This video is a couple of 17 year old youths trying to work out how to use a dial telephone. It is 4 minutes long. I'd love to know how many here even bother to watch it and I doubt many will watch it trough. What was that about short attention spans?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkXDEdQ7fnM

[wrndln]

I agree with Marshal and Chuck about LB. Their recent quality before they went belly up has deteriorated. I am installing an upholstery kit from them for my 29 phaeton and it has had several problems with the back rest cover and the small curved panels inside the rear wheel wells. I haven't got to the seat cushions yet, but it appears there are going to be problems with them also. I bought the kit about 12 years ago and am now at the point of installing it. I should have bought the kit from Classtique like I did for my 28 special coupe.
Rusty Nelson

[Gene F]

#44 - yes

#42 - I attained my Associates Degree at the age of 60. My Son is in high-school, and they have a program that allows for some (advanced) classes to count towards associates degrees. I am encouraging him to get a jump=start on his college. He decided he wants to go, we did not decide for him.

College is not for everyone, and there is nothing wrong with learning a skill. I learned several, and they served me and my employers well.

#51 - BTW, I have a dial telephone on my desk right now, and use it regularly. One of the neighbors' grandkids saw it and asked "what is that thing"? LOL

[rotorwrench]

The old timers that established LB way back in the day eventually wanted to retire so they sold the business. The folks the purchased it payed some pretty good coin for it so I imagine there was some business loan involved with that purchase. I noticed that they started branching further into into the reproduction parts business as well. It may have been a combination of high monetary outflow coupled with slowing monetary in flow during the 2008 economic downturn. The sources of materials also hit the skids about that time.

For whatever reason, they went insolvent and had to file bankruptcy. SMS tried to purchase what was left out of bankruptcy but was outbid by Ecklers group. Ecklers sort of followed the same path into insolvency that LB did. I'm not sure what is going on with the Ecklers group but they aren't what they used to be. That shut the doors on Cartouche as well.

[Tinbasher]

Looks like the problem is everywhere. I taught the Autobody apprenticeship programe for 12 years and the main thing that stood out was finding that student that truly had the interest or the skill. out of 1200 students I had taught, 6 had the natural skill for the trade. Others with the interest would learn it. Most of the students where heading to the collision repair side of the trade but there where a few that wanted to get into custom or restoration work. I always tried to connect them with someone running a restoration shop or a custom shop. From that point it was up to them to make it happen. It was interesting that over the three intakes for the trade we would start with 120 students at the basic level, 60-80 students at the intermediate level and 25 - 40 in the advanced level. You can see how the interest dwindled as the work become more involved. Over the 5 year apprenticeship, the last segment the student had 9 months of time in left in the training and then would write there exam for there license. Then after another 5 or 6 years they would get proficient at the repairs. All for $20.00 to $25.00 per hour. That bearly covers the rent in the Toronto Ont. area. my thought. JP

[Tinbasher]

Hi Brent:
As for the colour, can they not scan the colour and get a place to start? Or can your painter go to the supplier and tint the colour to get the match.
JP

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by Tinbasher

Hi Brent:
As for the colour, can they not scan the colour and get a place to start? Or can your painter go to the supplier and tint the colour to get the match.
JP

It very well may come to that. Our paint store is located in a neighboring state about 1 hour away.

[David in San Antonio]

The difference in behavior of young people today is a rational response to the changed environment in which they live. If they were born into our circumstances they would have our values, life experiences, attitudes and achievements.
The earliest ancient Greeks discoursed at length about how the younger generation was lazy, indifferent, lacked morals, were too weak to defend the country, unskilled and resentful of authority.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by rotorwrench

The old timers that established LB way back in the day eventually wanted to retire so they sold the business. The folks the purchased it payed some pretty good coin for it so I imagine there was some business loan involved with that purchase. I noticed that they started branching further into into the reproduction parts business as well. It may have been a combination of high monetary outflow coupled with slowing monetary in flow during the 2008 economic downturn. The sources of materials also hit the skids about that time.

For whatever reason, they went insolvent and had to file bankruptcy. SMS tried to purchase what was left out of bankruptcy but was outbid by Ecklers group. Ecklers sort of followed the same path into insolvency that LB did. I'm not sure what is going on with the Ecklers group but they aren't what they used to be. That shut the doors on Cartouche as well.

Kerby, check your PMs when you get a chance. No rush.

[rotorwrench]

Originally Posted by David in San Antonio

The difference in behavior of young people today is a rational response to the changed environment in which they live. If they were born into our circumstances they would have our values, life experiences, attitudes and achievements.
The earliest ancient Greeks discoursed at length about how the younger generation was lazy, indifferent, lacked morals, were too weak to defend the country, unskilled and resentful of authority.

You have that history pretty well down. Young people need good mentors to help them out of the post puberty condition. I was fortunate to have good mentors when I went on from high school into the real world. I wouldn't have made it this far without each one of them. My Pop was a good man and a heroic survivor of WWII but he loved farming and I wanted to be an aircraft mechanic so I gravitated towards people that could help me get there.

I always try to instill this in young folks so they can get where they want to go. Just trying to pass it on.

[BillCNC]

Us Boomers began our skill development in a time were everything was repairable. The kids are learning their skills in a time were everything is replaceable.

What they do, I don't know, but show one a wrench or screwdriver, and it's as if they have seen a ghost.

Regards
Bill