The Ford Barn

Viv W · 03-24-2019, 05:12 PM

Hi All,
I'm working on the steering boxes on both my 35 Ford V8 and a freinds model A, both cars are right hand drive and both cars have damaged worm and sectors.
Last night I was going thru Mac's online catalogue and they list the RHD and LHD worms under seperate part numbers, but then they also say the RHD worm can be used also for LHD ???
This does not seem right to me and I'm wondering if Mac's actually know the difference between the 2 items. It worries me to order any of these parts, because if I do, I may ship them half way around the world, only to find they are wrong.
My other question is the Model A steering box is marked with a raised "F" on the casting, will the Gemmer parts Mac's list fit this steering housing.
Thanks for any advice.
regards
Viv.

Jembow · 03-24-2019, 05:47 PM

A friend once put a NOS worm & shaft in a RHD Thames van and found it was LHD when he drove into the shop wall as he tried to drive it away! Find Juke Joint Johnny here on the barn, he'll help on the Model A for sure

54vicky · 03-24-2019, 05:50 PM

possibly check with van pelt he may be able to help I see him mentioned a lot

DavidG · 03-24-2019, 06:54 PM

RHD and LHD worm and sector gears are absolutely, positively NOT interchangeable. Mac's is misinformed and is misleading potential customers. The angle of the teeth of the gears are a mirror image of one another, which, of course, makes sense. Save your money and hold out for the real thing. Perhaps someone from Argentina, the U.K., or down under can help you.

RKS.PA · 03-24-2019, 07:55 PM

If you have the boxes apart, often the worm gears have a number. I've been incredibly lucky that G&G Ford parts have a supply of the ones I've needed. The other part of my success story is a machine shop with a wonderful owner...Gary...who has the skill and necessary shop press to get the old one off the shaft and the new one on!!! BTW, my boxes were Gemmers.

Brian · 03-24-2019, 08:52 PM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

I bought new [repop?] RHD 37-39 worm off of James at Gotham Auto Parts..

Mart · 03-26-2019, 12:34 PM

Perhaps someone can confirm, but from memory a RHD worm has a left hand helix and a LHD worm has a right hand helix.

If you imagine the helix like a very coarse thread you might be able to envisage what I am trying to say.

The pitman shafts have the roller set at an angle so they engage the worm correctly. The angles are opposite for each hand of drive of the box.

Mart.

DavidG · 03-26-2019, 01:35 PM

Mart,

I believe that you have stated it correctly. In the pre-'37 gear boxes it would be the sector gear on the end of the sector shaft rather than the roller with differing angles to the 'teeth'.

my4dv8 · 03-26-2019, 02:07 PM

O’Neil vintage ford in the UK ,say they have worms and sectors RHD at 17 to 1 ratio for 1936.

Availability: 1 In Stock!

Viv W · 03-27-2019, 03:46 PM

Thanks guys for all the replies. My 35 steering is a 15 to 1 ratio, which my research lists as being a one year only item.
I have remains of a 36 17 to 1 steering assembly, which I stripped in the hope of making one out of the 2, but not only are the worm and sectors different, but so are the bearings and cups.
It's a while since I stripped the 2 units, but I seem to recall the housings are also different to accomodate the different bearings.
My 36 box and column are so badly corroded, that the shaft is almost rusted in half and the housings themselves internally are rusted beyond recovery.
At the moment my 35 steering column is back in the car, I figured I could probably drive it, even with a big chunk out the worm gear, but I have not driven it yet. However after seeing the similar condition of my freinds model A one, that got jammed, I will look to repair my one before even attempting a drive.
I will follow up on the leads you have given me, thanks
Best regards
Viv.

my4dv8 · 03-28-2019, 02:54 AM

Ok ,it does seem the ford gods are not looking after you. Kiwi vendors do not seem to list one ,unless Aussies do?
Had you considered fitting a 37 to 39 steering box , yes not original but nicer to steer. A little swapping the outer tube and column drop and you will hard pressed to notice at a glance. We have one in our 32 ,though markedly different to 35 ,its remarkably nice to drive with no surprises.

Viv W · 03-29-2019, 03:25 PM

Hi My4dV8, thanks for the thought.
I will ask around here in Zimbabwe and see if anyone has a 37-9 column lying around, but parts for ANY cars of the 30's here seem to have vanished off the face of the earth. I heard that during the 50's a lot of pre war 30's cars were used for stock car racing or demolition derbys as no one wanted them when they were 20 years old.
Our vintage car movement started to gain momentum in 1958, and only cars built before 1931 were deemed worthy of being saved and restored. So the 32 to 39 cars were either scrapped or shoved into the rubbish dumps here.
I was told in the 1970's that Arian carbreakers in Harare had a 36/7 Cord Sportsman driven into their yard in 1960, the owner did not want it as it gave trouble and the breaker had no use for the majority of the parts, so a few parts were removed and it was towed to the city dump, where it is now about 90ft down under big blocks of flats.
Anyway, I have had a response from one of the Barn members who may have parts, so will keep you guys posted, thanks again
Viv.

35fordtn · 03-30-2019, 08:03 PM

The 1935 LHD worm gear is the same as the RHD 33/34 15:1 set, and vice versa

Brian · 03-31-2019, 12:42 AM

The 1935 LHD worm gear is the same as the RHD 33/34 15:1 set, and vice versa

Michael, Thanks for confirming that, I actually posted that info on this thread weeks ago, but then doubted myself and edited it out.

Mart · 03-31-2019, 04:23 AM

^^ That makes sense. My RHD having a lh helix statement only applies to cross steer applications. Up to 34 would be the opposite where a lhd car would have a lh helix.

An interesting thread.

Mart.

35fordtn · 03-31-2019, 10:18 AM

With respect to them, the 1-800 big parts retailers make it confusing as pointed out in the first post, they are correct as the LHD gear can be used as a RHD, but for a totally different year.. that only applies to the worm gear not the sector.

35fordtn · 03-31-2019, 10:19 AM

PS hats off to you for undertaking this hobby in Zimbabwe! I can only imagine parts are difficult to find for you

Karl · 04-01-2019, 04:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viv W

Thanks guys for all the replies. My 35 steering is a 15 to 1 ratio, which my research lists as being a one year only item.
I have remains of a 36 17 to 1 steering assembly, which I stripped in the hope of making one out of the 2, but not only are the worm and sectors different, but so are the bearings and cups.
It's a while since I stripped the 2 units, but I seem to recall the housings are also different to accomodate the different bearings.
My 36 box and column are so badly corroded, that the shaft is almost rusted in half and the housings themselves internally are rusted beyond recovery.
At the moment my 35 steering column is back in the car, I figured I could probably drive it, even with a big chunk out the worm gear, but I have not driven it yet. However after seeing the similar condition of my freinds model A one, that got jammed, I will look to repair my one before even attempting a drive.
I will follow up on the leads you have given me, thanks
Best regards
Viv.

Viv contact Flathead Ted on this forum . He makes a 34 Steering box with later 37 internals - transforms the Steering Not sure how different a 35 is to a 34 Box - Karl

DavidG · 04-01-2019, 06:22 AM

Night and day difference, but if he can do a '32-'34 box, he should be able to do '35-'36 boxes as well.

Mart · 04-01-2019, 08:45 AM

It's probably worth reiterating that any 37-48 box could be made to work with varying amounts of ingenuity and would be considered an upgrade. The reduction in friction due to the use of the roller sector offers a real world improvement in the driving experience.

Mart.

Viv W · 04-01-2019, 10:46 AM

Hi All,
thanks for all your input. Doing some follow ups from all your info. Hope to sort the problem out soon. Viv

T Scott · 04-04-2019, 01:06 AM

These RHD issues can be confusing. I bought a RHD sector from MAC's and it was correct and was good quality. I also bought a drag link rebuild kit which included springs, cups and end screws. The end screws appear to be 1 1/16-18 for the RHD drag link and 1 1/16- 20 for the LHD or US domestic drag link. Why they would be different makes no sense but I thought this information might be useful to others.

Colin S · 04-06-2019, 06:35 AM

I rebuilt the steering box on our 1941 C11ADF (RHD) military station wagon with a worm supplied by Mac's. It seems to be of good quality and adjusted correctly.

Adam F · 04-07-2019, 06:31 PM

Yes T Scott. I am just about to undertake RHD steering end rebuild so very helpful.

Rascal · 04-10-2019, 09:45 PM

best to use a 37-40 steering box, You only have to ever so lightly slot one of the 3 mounting holes and you are in, be sure to use only the 37-40 drop arm . if the column length is an issue , have it professionally shortened,

Dave Slater · 04-11-2019, 03:29 AM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

You need to contact James at [email protected] he is the man that knows Right Hand Drive Fords back to front and has in stock all the RHD parts. I have been buying RHD stuff off him for many years. Dave

Viv W · 04-11-2019, 11:22 AM

Thanks everyone for your input and advice, I have managed to secure a 36 RHD worm and sector with its bearings from Brian in New Zealand, hopefully it will arrive and sort out my steering problems. Thanks again guys
Viv.

03-24-2019, 05:12 PM	#1
Viv W Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Harare Zimbabwe Posts: 160	Right hand drive steering worm advice needed Hi All, I'm working on the steering boxes on both my 35 Ford V8 and a freinds model A, both cars are right hand drive and both cars have damaged worm and sectors. Last night I was going thru Mac's online catalogue and they list the RHD and LHD worms under seperate part numbers, but then they also say the RHD worm can be used also for LHD ??? This does not seem right to me and I'm wondering if Mac's actually know the difference between the 2 items. It worries me to order any of these parts, because if I do, I may ship them half way around the world, only to find they are wrong. My other question is the Model A steering box is marked with a raised "F" on the casting, will the Gemmer parts Mac's list fit this steering housing. Thanks for any advice. regards Viv.

03-24-2019, 05:47 PM	#2
Jembow Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Spalding, United Kingdom Posts: 306	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed A friend once put a NOS worm & shaft in a RHD Thames van and found it was LHD when he drove into the shop wall as he tried to drive it away! Find Juke Joint Johnny here on the barn, he'll help on the Model A for sure

03-24-2019, 05:50 PM	#3
54vicky Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Oakville Ontario Posts: 586	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed possibly check with van pelt he may be able to help I see him mentioned a lot

03-24-2019, 06:54 PM	#4
DavidG Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: southeastern Michigan Posts: 10,101	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed RHD and LHD worm and sector gears are absolutely, positively NOT interchangeable. Mac's is misinformed and is misleading potential customers. The angle of the teeth of the gears are a mirror image of one another, which, of course, makes sense. Save your money and hold out for the real thing. Perhaps someone from Argentina, the U.K., or down under can help you.

03-24-2019, 07:55 PM	#5
RKS.PA Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Marana, AZ Posts: 1,194	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed If you have the boxes apart, often the worm gears have a number. I've been incredibly lucky that G&G Ford parts have a supply of the ones I've needed. The other part of my success story is a machine shop with a wonderful owner...Gary...who has the skill and necessary shop press to get the old one off the shaft and the new one on!!! BTW, my boxes were Gemmers.

03-24-2019, 08:52 PM	#6
Brian Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Masterton, New Zealand Posts: 3,832	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) I bought new [repop?] RHD 37-39 worm off of James at Gotham Auto Parts.. __________________ Unfortunately, two half wits don't make a whole wit! Last edited by Brian; 03-25-2019 at 02:41 AM.

03-26-2019, 12:34 PM	#7
Mart Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Solihull, England. Posts: 8,747	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed Perhaps someone can confirm, but from memory a RHD worm has a left hand helix and a LHD worm has a right hand helix. If you imagine the helix like a very coarse thread you might be able to envisage what I am trying to say. The pitman shafts have the roller set at an angle so they engage the worm correctly. The angles are opposite for each hand of drive of the box. Mart.

03-26-2019, 01:35 PM	#8
DavidG Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: southeastern Michigan Posts: 10,101	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed Mart, I believe that you have stated it correctly. In the pre-'37 gear boxes it would be the sector gear on the end of the sector shaft rather than the roller with differing angles to the 'teeth'. Last edited by DavidG; 03-26-2019 at 01:40 PM.

03-26-2019, 02:07 PM	#9
my4dv8 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: New Zealand Posts: 1,111	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed O’Neil vintage ford in the UK ,say they have worms and sectors RHD at 17 to 1 ratio for 1936. Availability: 1 In Stock!

03-27-2019, 03:46 PM	#10
Viv W Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Harare Zimbabwe Posts: 160	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed Thanks guys for all the replies. My 35 steering is a 15 to 1 ratio, which my research lists as being a one year only item. I have remains of a 36 17 to 1 steering assembly, which I stripped in the hope of making one out of the 2, but not only are the worm and sectors different, but so are the bearings and cups. It's a while since I stripped the 2 units, but I seem to recall the housings are also different to accomodate the different bearings. My 36 box and column are so badly corroded, that the shaft is almost rusted in half and the housings themselves internally are rusted beyond recovery. At the moment my 35 steering column is back in the car, I figured I could probably drive it, even with a big chunk out the worm gear, but I have not driven it yet. However after seeing the similar condition of my freinds model A one, that got jammed, I will look to repair my one before even attempting a drive. I will follow up on the leads you have given me, thanks Best regards Viv.

03-28-2019, 02:54 AM	#11
my4dv8 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: New Zealand Posts: 1,111	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed Ok ,it does seem the ford gods are not looking after you. Kiwi vendors do not seem to list one ,unless Aussies do? Had you considered fitting a 37 to 39 steering box , yes not original but nicer to steer. A little swapping the outer tube and column drop and you will hard pressed to notice at a glance. We have one in our 32 ,though markedly different to 35 ,its remarkably nice to drive with no surprises. Last edited by my4dv8; 03-28-2019 at 03:06 AM.

03-29-2019, 03:25 PM	#12
Viv W Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Harare Zimbabwe Posts: 160	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed Hi My4dV8, thanks for the thought. I will ask around here in Zimbabwe and see if anyone has a 37-9 column lying around, but parts for ANY cars of the 30's here seem to have vanished off the face of the earth. I heard that during the 50's a lot of pre war 30's cars were used for stock car racing or demolition derbys as no one wanted them when they were 20 years old. Our vintage car movement started to gain momentum in 1958, and only cars built before 1931 were deemed worthy of being saved and restored. So the 32 to 39 cars were either scrapped or shoved into the rubbish dumps here. I was told in the 1970's that Arian carbreakers in Harare had a 36/7 Cord Sportsman driven into their yard in 1960, the owner did not want it as it gave trouble and the breaker had no use for the majority of the parts, so a few parts were removed and it was towed to the city dump, where it is now about 90ft down under big blocks of flats. Anyway, I have had a response from one of the Barn members who may have parts, so will keep you guys posted, thanks again Viv.

03-30-2019, 08:03 PM	#13
35fordtn Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: McMinnville, TN Posts: 2,327	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed The 1935 LHD worm gear is the same as the RHD 33/34 15:1 set, and vice versa

03-31-2019, 12:42 AM	#14
Brian Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Masterton, New Zealand Posts: 3,832	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed The 1935 LHD worm gear is the same as the RHD 33/34 15:1 set, and vice versa Michael, Thanks for confirming that, I actually posted that info on this thread weeks ago, but then doubted myself and edited it out. __________________ Unfortunately, two half wits don't make a whole wit!

03-31-2019, 04:23 AM	#15
Mart Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Solihull, England. Posts: 8,747	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed ^^ That makes sense. My RHD having a lh helix statement only applies to cross steer applications. Up to 34 would be the opposite where a lhd car would have a lh helix. An interesting thread. Mart.

03-31-2019, 10:18 AM	#16
35fordtn Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: McMinnville, TN Posts: 2,327	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed With respect to them, the 1-800 big parts retailers make it confusing as pointed out in the first post, they are correct as the LHD gear can be used as a RHD, but for a totally different year.. that only applies to the worm gear not the sector.

03-31-2019, 10:19 AM	#17
35fordtn Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: McMinnville, TN Posts: 2,327	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed PS hats off to you for undertaking this hobby in Zimbabwe! I can only imagine parts are difficult to find for you

04-01-2019, 06:22 AM	#19
DavidG Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: southeastern Michigan Posts: 10,101	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed Night and day difference, but if he can do a '32-'34 box, he should be able to do '35-'36 boxes as well.

04-01-2019, 08:45 AM	#20
Mart Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Solihull, England. Posts: 8,747	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed It's probably worth reiterating that any 37-48 box could be made to work with varying amounts of ingenuity and would be considered an upgrade. The reduction in friction due to the use of the roller sector offers a real world improvement in the driving experience. Mart.

04-01-2019, 10:46 AM	#21
Viv W Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Harare Zimbabwe Posts: 160	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed Hi All, thanks for all your input. Doing some follow ups from all your info. Hope to sort the problem out soon. Viv

04-04-2019, 01:06 AM	#22
T Scott Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: East Boothbay, Maine Posts: 277	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed These RHD issues can be confusing. I bought a RHD sector from MAC's and it was correct and was good quality. I also bought a drag link rebuild kit which included springs, cups and end screws. The end screws appear to be 1 1/16-18 for the RHD drag link and 1 1/16- 20 for the LHD or US domestic drag link. Why they would be different makes no sense but I thought this information might be useful to others.

04-06-2019, 06:35 AM	#23
Colin S Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 16	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed I rebuilt the steering box on our 1941 C11ADF (RHD) military station wagon with a worm supplied by Mac's. It seems to be of good quality and adjusted correctly.

04-07-2019, 06:31 PM	#24
Adam F Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 6	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed Yes T Scott. I am just about to undertake RHD steering end rebuild so very helpful.

04-10-2019, 09:45 PM	#25
Rascal Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Sacto, Ca Posts: 85	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed best to use a 37-40 steering box, You only have to ever so lightly slot one of the 3 mounting holes and you are in, be sure to use only the 37-40 drop arm . if the column length is an issue , have it professionally shortened,

04-11-2019, 03:29 AM	#26
Dave Slater Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Country Victoria Australia Posts: 130	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) You need to contact James at [email protected] he is the man that knows Right Hand Drive Fords back to front and has in stock all the RHD parts. I have been buying RHD stuff off him for many years. Dave

04-11-2019, 11:22 AM	#27
Viv W Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Harare Zimbabwe Posts: 160	Re: Right hand drive steering worm advice needed Thanks everyone for your input and advice, I have managed to secure a 36 RHD worm and sector with its bearings from Brian in New Zealand, hopefully it will arrive and sort out my steering problems. Thanks again guys Viv.