Temperarute gauge!

[Harylufa]

Hi all!

I have a doubt. Can an electronic gauge being installed in my Ford 1946 12volt???

It is called Dragon gauge. It is from China. It is digital and the electrician told me that the ignition coil interference with the gauge when engine start.

Is this true? Do you have any experience with those gauges?

It is important for me your comments.

Hary

[66miles]

Seems like most everything from China is called a "Dragon" something. I've never tried such a thing but if I did, I'd be sure to put that guage somewhere only you can see it!
Goog luck,
Miles.

[51 MERC-CT]

Although they are not the same brand, I am running dual digital temp gages on mine on 12 volts with no problems.

[Old Henry]

Harylufa, Has your car been converted to 12 volt? If not, the gauge would not work.

[Harylufa]

Hi!

Yes my car is 12volts, I have just tested and when I turned the key on the gauge work but when the engine starts it turnes off.
I know that my car has a resistor to the dashboard to work with all the original gauges at 6 volts. But the coil is 12volts and the electrician say the gauge does not work because it spark plug interfere like a radio.

Sorry but i do not understand much about electricity.

thanks for comments and helps

Hary

[fordor41]

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Are you running the new gauge off 6 V or 12V? Maybe you picked the power from the wrong spot and have 6V .

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by Harylufa

Hi!

Yes my car is 12volts, I have just tested and when I turned the key on the gauge work but when the engine starts it turnes off.
I know that my car has a resistor to the dashboard to work with all the original gauges at 6 volts. But the coil is 12volts and the electrician say the gauge does not work because it spark plug interfere like a radio.

Sorry but i do not understand much about electricity.

thanks for comments and helps

Hary

There is a possibility that if you have solid core spark plug wires that they may be the problem. I know that solid core spark plug wires have caused malfunctions in electronic ignition systems due to radio emissions. The fix is to install spiro-wound resistor plug wires. Don't know if this will fix your problem, but it's one possibility.

[Harylufa]

Originally Posted by 51 MERC-CT

There is a possibility that if you have solid core spark plug wires that they may be the problem. I know that solid core spark plug wires have caused malfunctions in electronic ignition systems due to radio emissions. The fix is to install spiro-wound resistor plug wires. Don't know if this will fix your problem, but it's one possibility.

Hi!

I have an standard two points distributor with 12v coil, it is not electronic ignition system.
Concerning spark plug wire it is a wire with many multiple small wires.

Engine starts at 12volts.

Hary

[Old Henry]

Or, you could install a mechanical gauge that would have no such problems. Here's how I did mine: http://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=88541

[Harylufa]

Originally Posted by fordor41

Are you running the new gauge off 6 V or 12V? Maybe you picked the power from the wrong spot and have 6V .

This electricians did the conversion from 6v to 12v some years ago. So, I do not think he did a mistake, when he saw the electronic gauge he immediately said that spark plug would interferer, then he installed all the way and happened what he thought.

Hary

[Harylufa]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

Or, you could install a mechanical gauge that would have no such problems. Here's how I did mine: http://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=88541

Henry!

Thanks for you post,I have read it all before and someone recommended me to do the same like you to avoid problems. Orlan Rover is an option.

But i would like understand why it dos not work...

Hary

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by Harylufa

Hi!

I have an standard two points distributor with 12v coil, it is not electronic ignition system.
Concerning spark plug wire it is a wire with many multiple small wires.

Engine starts at 12volts.

Hary

"Many multiple small wires" are considered to be 'solid' wires.
I understand that you don't have an electronic ignition system but the temp. gage is electronic and the R.F.I. (radio frequency int.) from the plug wires may effect the gage the same way.
Perhaps as Old Henry says a better option would be a mechanical gage.

[Harylufa]

Originally Posted by 51 MERC-CT

"Many multiple small wires" are considered to be 'solid' wires.
I understand that you don't have an electronic ignition system but the temp. gage is electronic and the R.F.I. (radio frequency int.) from the plug wires may effect the gage the same way.
Perhaps as Old Henry says a better option would be a mechanical gage.

Hi 51-Merc

Ah..ok. it is very clear what you explain. It is the first time I hear that my wires are solid....now, i am understanding the problem.

So, as you wrote above "spiral-wound resistor plug wires. Don't know if this will fix your problem, but it's one possibility."

So the electrician was right, was he? must I change the spark plug wire???

Here in my Country have Orlan Rober as better gauges. So, i will isntall them.

What do you think?

Thanks for your good helps

Hary

[Ross F-1]

It soounds like your car uses 12v for starting, but is otherwise 6v? If so, the gauge isn't going to work.

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by Harylufa

Hi 51-Merc

Ah..ok. it is very clear what you explain. It is the first time I hear that my wires are solid....now, i am understanding the problem.

So, as you wrote above "spiral-wound resistor plug wires. Don't know if this will fix your problem, but it's one possibility."

So the electrician was right, was he? must I change the spark plug wire???

Here in my Country have Orlan Rober as better gauges. So, i will isntall them.

What do you think?

Thanks for your good helps

Hary

As I said the wires may be a possibility and if they are the problem then if the Orlan Rober of which you speak are electronic, then they may have the same problems.
Not saying that changing the wires will solve the problem but it is a direction to go.
This is what Spiro-wound wires look like.

[Harylufa]

Originally Posted by Ross F-1

It soounds like your car uses 12v for starting, but is otherwise 6v? If so, the gauge isn't going to work.

Ross F-1

Only dashboard work in 6v, in this way can work all original gauge.

thanks

[Harylufa]

Originally Posted by 51 MERC-CT

As I said the wires may be a possibility and if they are the problem then if the Orlan Rober of which you speak are electronic, then they may have the same problems.
Not saying that changing the wires will solve the problem but it is a direction to go.
This is what Spiro-wound wires look like.

51-Merc

I understand what you say.I am going to install an mechanical Orlan Rober gauge. concerning wires the pic you attach is not like the wire I have.

Tomorrow I will attach a spark plug wire pic

Thank for your time

Hary

[koates]

Hi there, Your copper wire spark plug wires transmit a Radio frequency (RF) through the air just like a radio transmitter station or a two way radio set when your engine is running. This is normal so nothing wrong. Don't change your spark plug wires. Your electronic digital temp gauge is receiving these radio signals from the plug wires (just like a radio receiver in your home) and the gauge internal circuit is interrupted . Don't use that digital gauge anymore. Use the mechanical temp gauge as already suggested OR use a normal 12 volt electric temp gauge which has a pointer on the dial. It operates using a sender unit in your cylinder head with a single sender wire connecting to the gauge. It will work OK as it is ELECTRIC not ELECTRONIC. Hope this is a more clear explanation for you. Regards, Kevin.

[Harylufa]

Originally Posted by koates

Hi there, Your copper wire spark plug wires transmit a Radio frequency (RF) through the air just like a radio transmitter station or a two way radio set when your engine is running. This is normal so nothing wrong. Don't change your spark plug wires. Your electronic digital temp gauge is receiving these radio signals from the plug wires (just like a radio receiver in your home) and the gauge internal circuit is interrupted . Don't use that digital gauge anymore. Use the mechanical temp gauge as already suggested OR use a normal 12 volt electric temp gauge which has a pointer on the dial. It operates using a sender unit in your cylinder head with a single sender wire connecting to the gauge. It will work OK as it is ELECTRIC not ELECTRONIC. Hope this is a more clear explanation for you. Regards, Kevin.

Hi!

Ok, very clear...today I bought two mechanical gauge Orlan Rober, I will install them.

I really did not know about RF could cause problem with those Electronic Digital Gauge. I bought those gauge to have more precision in temperature.

Every day I am learning something thank I meet in FordBarn.

I really appreciate your explanation and help.

Hary

[Harylufa]

Hi all¡

Finally mechanical temperature gauge installed.

What do you think?

Hary

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by Harylufa

Hi all¡

Finally mechanical temperature gauge installed.

What do you think?

Hary

Looking good. (I probably would have trouble trying to drive and convert temps at the same time--Let's see 78°c=about 172°f )

[Harylufa]

Originally Posted by 51 MERC-CT

Looking good. (I probably would have trouble trying to drive and convert temps at the same time--Let's see 78°c=about 172°f )

Hi 51 Merc!

For me is much easier to read in ºC than in ºF now let see what happens with temperature on each head.

Thanks for your helps

Hary

[Mart]

I do know that when trying to use my voltmeter near the engine, the readings are erratic due to interference from the ignition.
It's best not to use resistive wires or caps, it puts too much load on the HT side of the ignition. Purely my experience, your results may vary.
Mart.

[Old Henry]

Originally Posted by Harylufa

Hi all¡

Finally mechanical temperature gauge installed.

What do you think?

Hary

Have you driven with them long enough to warm up the engine and see what they show? I'd be interested to know what you see.

[Joe AZ]

I think both heads are reading pretty much the same. Good job!
Joe

[51 MERC-CT]

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Originally Posted by Old Henry

Have you driven with them long enough to warm up the engine and see what they show? I'd be interested to know what you see.

Funny, you made the same observation that I made when I first looked at the gages. Until I realized that the engine is up to operating temp.
They read appox. 78° Celsius which is appox. 173° Fahrenheit.

[koates]

Hi Harry, You have done good using two mechanical gauges, that's the best way to go for sure. Stay away from electronic crap on vintage cars. Regards, Kevin.

[Harylufa]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

Have you driven with them long enough to warm up the engine and see what they show? I'd be interested to know what you see.

Old Henry!

I am interested too, i will be back with news

Hary

[Harylufa]

Originally Posted by koates

Hi Harry, You have done good using two mechanical gauges, that's the best way to go for sure. Stay away from electronic crap on vintage cars. Regards, Kevin.

Koates!

Yes, many people told me to install this mechanical gauge. With electronic gauge I pretended to read exactly the temperature but It could not be possible.

Hary

[Harylufa]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

Have you driven with them long enough to warm up the engine and see what they show? I'd be interested to know what you see.

Hi Old Henry!

Here I attach some pics how temp gauge works running for a while. It shows 72º-161Fº. Perhaps a bit low.

Other question oil mar les 30 after a while running, Is this normal?

Tanks for comments

Hary

[Old Henry]

Originally Posted by Harylufa

Hi Old Henry!

Here I attach some pics how temp gauge works running for a while. It shows 72º-161Fº. Perhaps a bit low.

Other question oil mar les 30 after a while running, Is this normal?

Tanks for comments

Hary

Your temperature is fine. Better a little low than high.
Oil pressure less than 30 after warmed up is normal. The engine is lubricated by oil flow, which you have at any pressure, not oil pressure. It also depends on the oil you use. In the summer when it's always over 60° F engine starting temperature I use S.A.E. 40. It gives a little higher oil pressure. Between 32° F and 60°F starting temperatures S.A.E. 30. We get colder than that in the winter here so I'm trying 20W-50 this winter. Still seems like the pressure is low. But, as I say. I don't think pressure is critical.

[Tinker]

I'll add to the great info given. Temp is good at removing any moisture in the oil. If your car never reaches a good hot temp, water will remain in the engine. Typically a good running temp is over 180, till it goes to 210, Thats why they say you need to drive them not just idle them in the garage. Flatheads dont need a lot of oil pressue at hot idle, if you hit 20s hot idle you are doing very well on a stock motor.

I good infrared temp sensor is a nice addition to the toolbox too. Many uses, from testing (my interpatation of a quote from bruce lancaster) your ham sandwich , dog, to detecting blocked raditors.





.

[Harylufa]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

Your temperature is fine. Better a little low than high.
Oil pressure less than 30 after warmed up is normal. The engine is lubricated by oil flow, which you have at any pressure, not oil pressure. It also depends on the oil you use. In the summer when it's always over 60° F engine starting temperature I use S.A.E. 40. It gives a little higher oil pressure. Between 32° F and 60°F starting temperatures S.A.E. 30. We get colder than that in the winter here so I'm trying 20W-50 this winter. Still seems like the pressure is low. But, as I say. I don't think pressure is critical.

Originally Posted by Tinker

I'll add to the great info given. Temp is good at removing any moisture in the oil. If your car never reaches a good hot temp, water will remain in the engine. Typically a good running temp is over 180, till it goes to 210, Thats why they say you need to drive them not just idle them in the garage. Flatheads dont need a lot of oil pressue at hot idle, if you hit 20s hot idle you are doing very well on a stock motor.

I good infrared temp sensor is a nice addition to the toolbox too. Many uses, from testing your ham sandwich to detecting blocked raditors.

Dear Friends!

today my engine has been running during 40 min. So I took pics when I arrived home, I tested with infrared temp sensor too that is according with mechanical gauge.
I installed SAE 15w-50 we are in summer now.

tomorrow i will run my engine for more time in order to have more info.

I will be back with news.

Thanks

Hary