points coil 272 y

[cudaboy]

hello, finally got a post 57 dizzy to rid myself of the loadamatic now need new coil as loadamatic had a pertronix conversion and 40k flamethrower coil, <never saw any flames > what coil should i be usinbg please? there 12v going up to the old one, should it be ballasted cheers

[oldave57]

The original ignition circuit had a ballast resistor (no longer needed with Pertronix system & Pertronix coil). If you go back to points, you will need a ballast resistor in the ignition circuit. There are two wires feeding the coil with the points system:

1) one red wire coming from the ignition circuit (key "on" position) which goes to one end of the resistor with the other end of the resistor wire going to the coil + terminal

2) one brown wire going directly to the coil + terminal along with the resisted wire from the ballast resistor in # 1 above. This brown wire comes from the starting circuit to provide adequate voltage during cranking (which is reduced to around 8-9 volts due to starter motor current draw. This circuit cuts out when the cranking position is released and the key goes back to the "on" position.

The original coil can be found at Rockauto among other places:
http://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/f...tion+coil,7060

The ballast resistor can be found at Autozone among other places:
http://www.autozone.com/batteries-st...eVehicle=false

Good luck with your distributor installation. I personally like the Pertronix system (have had it in my 57 Ford for about 3 years with no problems) but some prefer to have the original points system and have had good luck with that also.
Dave

[cudaboy]

many thanks for that, appreciate! yes the perteonix great just shame was attached to loadamatic lol oddly enough the red 12v ign has a black wire taped to it < unused and cut back> im guessing that was from the original points?

[oldave57]

It's possible that the black wire with your ignition harness was the feed from the cranking circuit. The best way to tell would be to check the voltage on that wire when you have someone hold the key in the "start" position. If it pops up to full battery voltage, you should have the correct wire. It should have no voltage with the key in the run position, while the red wire should have voltage only in the run position.

The only wire that goes to the distributor is the black wire from the negative or "distributor" terminal on the coil. I have attached a photo of my ignition wiring with the original coil and resistor in place for reference.

[cudaboy]

many thanks i was wrong, i have a red and a brown <the brown was taped up and unused with petronix> these are taped together and go back through the bulkhead, im guessing red on + coil and brown with single black from dizzy to coil -? off the same group of 4 wires is one to temp sender im thinking because its all still like that its original dont now if the ballast was after or before as said getting 12v on red ign is this too

[dmsfrr]

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A (new) coil you're looking for would be labeled... *12v, use with external resistor*.
Do not get one marked as *internal resistor*.

As oldave57 already mentioned, your brown wire taped up along-side the red ignition wire to the ballast resistor is most likely the one from the "I" terminal of the starter solenoid.
It provides a full 12v to the "+" terminal of the coil during cranking, and will make for easier starting.

Image below.
.

[oldave57]

The wiring to the coil and distributor can be a bit confusing. The red wire from the harness feed will need to attach to one end of the ballast resistor. The wire from the other end of the ballast resistor will then go to the + terminal of the coil. The brown wire from the start circuit will also need to attach to the + terminal of the coil (so you will have two wires attached to the + terminal of the coil, one from the ballast resistor and the other the brown wire from the harness). The negative or "distributor" terminal of the coil will attach directly to the distributor and connect to the points. I'm not sure what wire color was used (on my car, the original wire from the distributor to the negative terminal on the coil was black).

Just to be sure of the circuits after all this time with the Pertronix, I would still recommend that you check the voltage at the brown wire with the key in the start position to be sure the wire hasn't been disconnected anywhere in the circuit.

Dave

[Daves55Sedan]

Has anyone mentioned............
The original style EBU carburetor that they had on the 272 engines will not work properly with a '57 & later mechanical advance distributor.
You need to get a '57 or later intake manifold with the modern flat style carburetor and then if your car has Forde-O-Matic, you also need to get the passing gear bellcrank & bracket as the original 272 bracket will not fit on the '57 & later intake manifold.

[cudaboy]

hello thanks all i am going out shortly for a play, i had a surgery on bicep so been frustrating as buying bits and just looking at them! i had the loadamatic now have a 57 on distributor, i modified my original 2 hole inlet with a phelonic spacer and ali plate to accept a holley 4 barrel, it ran ok even with loadamatic not brilliant but been like that last 12 months plus, in the meantime i have bagged a nice inlet from us, not cheep but that will be going on one i get this up and running hopfully today, i have starter issues where it works then just "whirrs up" so first thing is to drop that and hopfully just a case of a sticky inertia and a bit of lube! i also had the firing order anti clockwise doh so have to re do that. think the medication to blame there eh.... hee hee, ps i am looking at my starter read some horrors about it being diffuclt to remove, im thinking as now have ram horns and a mustang 11 conversion be easier, finers crossed

[dmsfrr]

just curious....
What is the first letter/number in the date code on your intake manifold?
It looks like it might be an 8 ???
.

[cudaboy]

UP FOR SALE IS THIS ORIGINAL NICE 1957 FORD AND T-BIRD SINGLE 4 BARREL V8 INTAKE MANIFOLD NUMBER ECZ-9510-B. NO DAMAGE OR REPAIRS-JUST NEEDS A GOOD CLEANING/ACCEPTS A 4160 SERIES FORD HOLLEY OF THE PERIOD. SHPG/INS $35 IN THE CONTINENTAL US copy n pasted from original ad, please dont say it wont fit already found out my ring gear stuffed after removing starter motor today

[cudaboy]

whats your thoughts dmsfrr

[dmsfrr]

Originally Posted by cudaboy

whats your thoughts dmsfrr

My first guess is that it's an 8 ('58), with the first 'A' being for 'January',
an approx mid model yr part for 57's.
I was just curious because of the placement of the choke heat tube thru the exh crossover.
There were several heat tube variations in the '57 manifolds and I'm thinking of trying to figure out if they were a running production change/upgrade that could be tracked by the date code, or if there were different styles for the different models of Y-block Ford

[cudaboy]

many thanks, doesthat make any difference as running ram horn headers as removed the original x over plus not use a choke on carb i have

[dmsfrr]

The ram's horn exhaust manifolds may or may not have fittings for choke heat, not a problem.
As long as any extra holes in the intake manifold are plugged you should be fine, and you could still use an electric choke thermostat if needed.

"removed the original x over"
The exhaust pipe that went across the top front of the engine? That's a good plan.
Just watch for and allow enough exhaust pipe clearance to steering and clutch linkage moving parts.

FYI, When you replace the intake manifold gaskets you may want to use the type with smaller holes for the exhaust crossover under the carburetor.

[cudaboy]

many thanks hoping to do next week ordered ballast resistor earlier, those x over pipes wee junk was lucky to find the ram horns, not many folk tune the y block parts so expensive its all chevy my pal bought a lexus 400 for the engine and box for his f100

[dmsfrr]

Originally Posted by cudaboy

... i also had the firing order anti clockwise doh so have to re do that.

Looking down at the distributor, the correct Y-block firing order is counter-clockwise.
.

[cudaboy]

many thanks for that great pic, tried it briefly today but my starter goes into "whiiir" mode so ordered new one as was getting no where fast, when you fit dizzy you get tdc on no 1 now do you fit dizzy with pointer pointing to #1 spark plug or do you do it to point to #1 on cap <cap has a 1 on> i put white tape on bulkhead with mark on inline with #1 on cap then with cap off and no1 at tdc fitted dizzy with rotor arm pointing to mark on bulkhead

[dmsfrr]

When the distributor is installed, with #1 piston at TDC of the firing stroke, the tip of the rotor should be pointing at the #1 position on the cap. There may a small line in the upper lip of the distributor housing at this position.
The hose fitting of the vacuum canister will be pointing toward cyl's 7 & 8, and the cap will be in the same position as shown in the diagram above.

(edit)
Make sure the dist housing is pressed firmly down into the block, metal to metal with NO gasket.

With the passenger side valve cover off you can confirm the #1 TDC position of the engine by turning the crankshaft clockwise (when looking at the front of the engine) with a large socket wrench on the crank pulley bolt until the cyl #1 intake valve opens and closes then turn slightly more until the "0" timing mark on the crank pulley and timing pointer line up.
The engine is easier to turn with the spark plugs out. White chalk or a couple dots of paint makes the timing marks easier to see.

.

[cudaboy]

thankyou thats just what i did, here is the "so called " little use distributor i bought, has no spark at all so need condensor, have done id on it even tho fits saying 289 mustang!